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Groups > comp.lang.forth > #23103
| From | Bernd Paysan <bernd.paysan@gmx.de> |
|---|---|
| Newsgroups | comp.lang.forth |
| Subject | Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? |
| Date | 2013-05-31 22:01 +0200 |
| Organization | 1&1 Internet AG |
| Message-ID | <koavi8$1cg$1@online.de> (permalink) |
| References | (6 earlier) <ko5249$690$1@online.de> <ko5a9g$9ip$1@dont-email.me> <a72e9d39-3d11-42ed-bd80-79e5702445a0@googlegroups.com> <ko7on1$ctk$1@online.de> <810f1d6a-c265-4f9c-bcfc-8f66d2b5e3ce@googlegroups.com> |
hughaguilar96@yahoo.com wrote: > On Thursday, May 30, 2013 7:45:52 AM UTC-7, Bernd Paysan wrote: >> the different things in memory. This is so 1980s. The world moved on, >> and concluded that instruction decoding is more expensive than memory >> address decoding, and annoys the programmer, especially of lower-level >> programming languages above assembler. > > I consider Forth to be a macro-assembler. I think that anybody who has > written micro-controller software, also does. No. I understand that you worked mostly with a cross compiler, where this attribution is somewhat correct. > You can't abstract out > important details like the difference between code and data --- especially > in a Harvard-Architecture processor --- that is not the way things are > done in the real world. > >> RAM, ROM, flash, EEPROM, IO are all different things. They all happily >> live together in one address space, if you allow them to. > > It is always a bad idea to do work at run-time that could be done at > compile-time. In "Thinking Forth" it was said: "Let the dictionary do the > deciding." You don't understand, as usual. The address mapping for RAM, ROM, flash, EEPROM, etc., are a few gates. A few ten transistors. On a common bus. If you decide to go Harward, you add several busses, and have several instructions to access these. The costs are about an order of magnitude higher than mapping them all into one address space. > The whole idea of treating RAM, ROM, flash, EEPROM, etc. as the same > thing, is utter nonsense. Not at all. Separated address spaces are utter nonsense. > Is your heap going to overflow into the part of > memory which is actually ROM? That is not going to work very well! No, of course not. If you heap overflows, it's not gonna work. Whether it overflows into ROM or into unmapped space or cycles around and overwrites already allocated memory doesn't really matter. > Also, in the 1980s, everything was in the same memory space on the 65c02. > That was the problem --- there was only a single 64K memory space, and > everything had to be mapped in there. Yes, and that was fine. The only problem was that 64k are not enough for everybody. > We were always running out of > memory, and trying to fix the problem with hokey bank-switching schemes. Ah, come on, if your program is too large for a 16 bit address space, *add more bits*. E.g. use a 32 bit processor. Early in the 80s, we had many crazy ideas how to increase the address space without going to wider addresses: several address spaces, segmented address spaces, etc. These things did cost considerably more than just expanding the register width. Parts of that were for backwards compatibility, but parts (like the 286 memory modell) was pure incompetence, and later pretty much abandoned. The 386 still could have all that segmenting nonsense in its 32 bit mode, but nobody used it. Because it was madness. > It was only later on that processors came out in which data and code were > in separate memory spaces, effectively doubling the amount of memory > available to a 16-bit processor. Yes, but a 16 bit processor is *not* the right tool to address more than 64k. > The 8051 had its faults, but one thing that it did right, was to make use > of different memory spaces. It had 64K code and 64K data. Also, it had > absolute-addressed memory and indirect-addressed memory both use the same > addresses [0x80,0x100). Also, absolute-addressed memory and I/O both use > the same addresses [0x00,0x80). This was similar to the 65c02's zero-page, > except that it was twice as large while yet still using 8-bit addresses > for everything --- pretty clever! Well, YMMV. IMHO the 8051 works well if you have a small program which doesn't even scratch all those memory boundaries. If you really fill 128k of combined code and data with an 8051 program, you very likely should have selected a more powerful CPU. The programs I've written for my b16 are all in the range of 2k, data+code combined. Some slightly exceed the 2k, so make that 4k. That's about the right size of a project for an embedded controller; in the case of the b16, it's a 16 bit controller, because IMHO, the 8 bit ALU idea is pretty stupid. You need 16 bit addresses, and the few hundred transistors you save in the ALU and registers are paid back a 100 times by decreasing code density. > Your idea of putting everything in a single memory space, reminds me of > how PolyForth for MS-DOS put *everything* in a single 64K segment. This > included the application code, the application data, the stacks, the > dictionary, the compiler, the editor --- everything! By your standards, > this would be absolute genius! --- they have managed to have a single > memory space! --- the only tiny flaw is that their single memory space is > limited to 64K, whereas the computer has 640K. BTW: calling it a "tiny > flaw" was a pun, in case you didn't get it. PolyForth 386 pretty soon had 32 bit addresses for everything. That was enough. I didn't see PolyForth in the 16 bit incarnation, PCs didn't really become interesting until the 386 was available; before that time, they were overpriced and underpowered. > The whole business of abstracting all of these memory spaces into a single > big memory space, is just foolish. For one thing, your single big memory > space is likely to be more than 64K, which means that addresses have to be > bigger than 16-bit, which is going to be cumbersome on a processor with > 16-bit registers. That's non-conclusive. The biggest single memory block I've used on the b16 was 4k. EEPROMs are often used for some configuration values only, and maybe 128 or 256 bytes large. I fully agree that having more than 64k bytes is cumbersome on a processor with 16 bit registers. My advice is: Don't do that. Use more bits in the registers if you go past the 64k boundary. A 64k flash block is more than 10 times larger than the b16. If I just double the register width, and make a b32, it is twice as large, it is still a dwarf compared to the memory. One problem of the 32 bit processors in the early 80s was that many were ultra-complex CISC nightmares, suffering the "second system syndrome" Brook writes about. They added all the things they couldn't add back in the 8/16 bit times, but doing so made the CPU too large and too slow to be competitive. So people were left with the 8 bit CPUs and added crazy bank switching schemes. That was nonsense, born from desperation. > This is all just nonsense --- an idea concocted in > school as an exercise in abstraction --- not something that anybody who > actually writes programs would do. Actually, IMHO the thing you propose is just nonsense, despite the fact that many people did it that way - but most of them stopped doing that nonsense nearly 30 year ago. It's not about abstraction, it's about doing the decoding of the addresses at the right place: where you hook the memory blocks to the single bus. A single bus is the most compact, most reasonable way to address memory and IO on a small CPU. And a flat, uniform address space is the most reasonable way to do it on a big CPU, either. Even when you have multiple busses on the big CPU, and caches dedicated to different purposes. And if you start to run out of bits on a 16 bit CPU, don't start thinking about adding *one* bit to the address bus by separating data and code. This is very likely an uneven division; many controller programs are dominated by code, not by data (and the exceptions are often dominated by data, not code). The b16 program running our robot has less than 128 bytes of data that needs to be in a RAM, yet more 2k bytes of code (and some constant data), which can go into flash or ROM. If you do that separation on such a program, you gain almost nothing, but you lose the ability to generate some code on the flight. > Anyway, what is up with the extremely insulting response? Are you > channeling Passaniti now? I'm making a technical argument, but you're > taking personal shots. Your technical arguments are full of personal shots, and I just respond to you the way you write. -- Bernd Paysan "If you want it done right, you have to do it yourself" http://bernd-paysan.de/
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OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Howerd <howerdo@yahoo.co.uk> - 2013-05-26 10:45 -0700
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2013-05-26 12:47 -0700
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Howerd <howerdo@yahoo.co.uk> - 2013-05-26 14:07 -0700
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? oh2aun@gmail.com - 2013-05-26 13:05 -0700
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Howerd <howerdo@yahoo.co.uk> - 2013-05-26 14:09 -0700
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? oh2aun@gmail.com - 2013-05-26 20:37 -0700
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2013-05-27 05:21 -0500
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? oh2aun@gmail.com - 2013-05-27 08:05 -0700
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Coos Haak <chforth@hccnet.nl> - 2013-05-27 17:45 +0200
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2013-05-27 08:58 -0700
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2013-05-27 15:57 +0000
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Coos Haak <chforth@hccnet.nl> - 2013-05-27 18:00 +0200
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? oh2aun@gmail.com - 2013-05-27 09:54 -0700
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2013-05-27 12:19 -0500
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? oh2aun@gmail.com - 2013-05-27 10:55 -0700
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2013-05-27 14:26 -0400
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? oh2aun@gmail.com - 2013-05-27 12:19 -0700
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2013-05-27 15:22 -0500
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2013-05-27 17:49 -0400
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2013-05-27 15:00 -0700
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2013-05-27 18:08 -0400
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2013-05-27 12:52 -1000
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? oh2aun@gmail.com - 2013-05-27 21:36 -0700
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl (Albert van der Horst) - 2013-05-28 00:46 +0000
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2013-05-28 10:42 -0400
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2013-05-28 05:11 -0500
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2013-05-28 10:40 -0400
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2013-05-28 10:28 -0500
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2013-05-28 15:30 +0000
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2013-05-28 10:48 -0500
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Alex McDonald <blog@rivadpm.com> - 2013-05-28 09:30 -0700
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2013-05-28 19:02 -0400
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2013-05-28 16:33 +0000
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2013-05-28 11:51 -0500
Re: OT (slightly) What is the 'best' processor for a new project? mhx@iae.nl (Marcel Hendrix) - 2013-05-28 19:45 +0200
Re: OT (slightly) What is the 'best' processor for a new project? albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl (Albert van der Horst) - 2013-05-29 03:41 +0000
Re: OT (slightly) What is the 'best' processor for a new project? Howerd <howerdo@yahoo.co.uk> - 2013-05-28 23:57 -0700
Re: OT (slightly) What is the 'best' processor for a new project? rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2013-05-29 12:37 -0400
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Bernd Paysan <bernd.paysan@gmx.de> - 2013-05-29 16:28 +0200
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Bernd Paysan <bernd.paysan@gmx.de> - 2013-05-29 16:08 +0200
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Mikael Nordman <oh2aun@invalid.com> - 2013-05-29 19:31 +0200
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Bernd Paysan <bernd.paysan@gmx.de> - 2013-05-29 19:42 +0200
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2013-05-29 12:55 -0500
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl (Albert van der Horst) - 2013-05-29 18:06 +0000
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Mikael Nordman <oh2aun@invalid.com> - 2013-05-29 22:13 +0200
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Brad Eckert <hwfwguy@gmail.com> - 2013-05-29 14:35 -0700
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? hughaguilar96@yahoo.com - 2013-05-29 21:34 -0700
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Mikael Nordman <oh2aun@invalid.com> - 2013-05-30 08:31 +0200
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Bernd Paysan <bernd.paysan@gmx.de> - 2013-05-30 16:45 +0200
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? hughaguilar96@yahoo.com - 2013-05-30 17:07 -0700
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Bernd Paysan <bernd.paysan@gmx.de> - 2013-05-31 22:01 +0200
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Hugh Aguilar <hughaguilar96@yahoo.com> - 2013-06-01 23:26 -0700
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Bernd Paysan <bernd.paysan@gmx.de> - 2013-06-03 01:42 +0200
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Hugh Aguilar <hughaguilar96@yahoo.com> - 2013-06-02 18:26 -0700
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Hugh Aguilar <hughaguilar96@yahoo.com> - 2013-06-03 21:35 -0700
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Hugh Aguilar <hughaguilar96@yahoo.com> - 2013-06-04 21:51 -0700
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Bernd Paysan <bernd.paysan@gmx.de> - 2013-06-06 03:45 +0200
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Hugh Aguilar <hughaguilar96@yahoo.com> - 2013-06-05 22:25 -0700
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Brad Eckert <hwfwguy@gmail.com> - 2013-06-06 16:17 -0700
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2013-06-06 21:25 -0500
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Hugh Aguilar <hughaguilar96@yahoo.com> - 2013-06-06 20:41 -0700
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2013-06-07 08:26 -0500
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Jecel <jecel@merlintec.com> - 2013-06-07 15:49 -0700
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2013-06-07 21:43 -0500
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Steve <nospam275@gmail.com> - 2013-06-09 01:15 +1000
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Hugh Aguilar <hughaguilar96@yahoo.com> - 2013-06-08 22:20 -0700
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2013-06-09 08:33 -0500
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Alex McDonald <blog@rivadpm.com> - 2013-06-09 08:17 -0700
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl (Albert van der Horst) - 2013-06-07 15:07 +0000
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Mark Wills <markrobertwills@yahoo.co.uk> - 2013-06-07 00:59 -0700
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2013-06-07 01:11 -0700
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2013-06-07 09:48 +0000
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2013-06-07 08:25 -0700
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2013-06-11 15:33 +0000
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2013-06-07 08:28 -0500
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Bernd Paysan <bernd.paysan@gmx.de> - 2013-06-08 00:46 +0200
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2013-06-07 21:58 -0500
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Bernd Paysan <bernd.paysan@gmx.de> - 2013-06-09 00:49 +0200
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Hugh Aguilar <hughaguilar96@yahoo.com> - 2013-06-08 22:24 -0700
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2013-05-27 12:08 -0400
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2013-05-27 09:40 -0700
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2013-05-27 13:13 -0400
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? stephenXXX@mpeforth.com (Stephen Pelc) - 2013-05-27 17:18 +0000
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Howerd <howerdo@yahoo.co.uk> - 2013-05-27 22:24 -0700
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2013-05-27 22:59 -0700
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Howerd <howerdo@yahoo.co.uk> - 2013-05-29 00:01 -0700
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2013-05-29 00:12 -0700
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? m.a.m.hendrix@tue.nl - 2013-05-29 01:46 -0700
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2013-05-29 12:54 -0400
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2013-05-29 11:05 -0700
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2013-05-29 15:36 -0400
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2013-05-30 00:07 -0700
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Howerd <howerdo@yahoo.co.uk> - 2013-05-30 00:43 -0700
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2013-05-30 01:22 -0700
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2013-05-30 07:49 -0500
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2013-05-30 07:43 -0700
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2013-05-30 10:50 -0500
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2013-05-30 10:18 -0700
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2013-05-30 08:08 -1000
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2013-05-31 00:03 -0700
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Elizabeth D Rather <erather@forth.com> - 2013-05-30 21:21 -1000
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2013-05-31 11:09 -0700
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2013-05-31 08:28 -1000
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2013-06-01 16:03 -0700
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Hugh Aguilar <hughaguilar96@yahoo.com> - 2013-06-02 00:05 -0700
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Elizabeth D Rather <erather@forth.com> - 2013-06-03 21:21 -1000
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Mark Wills <markrobertwills@yahoo.co.uk> - 2013-05-31 00:37 -0700
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2013-05-31 01:14 -0700
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? stephenXXX@mpeforth.com (Stephen Pelc) - 2013-05-31 09:50 +0000
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2013-05-31 09:35 -0700
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2013-05-31 11:47 -0500
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2013-05-31 10:09 -0700
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2013-05-31 12:12 -0500
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2013-05-31 10:22 -0700
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2013-05-31 10:25 -1000
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2013-06-01 12:11 -0700
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2013-06-01 16:12 -1000
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2013-06-01 21:43 -0700
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2013-05-31 06:41 -0500
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2013-05-31 12:03 +0000
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2013-05-31 10:01 -0700
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2013-05-31 12:06 -0500
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Bernd Paysan <bernd.paysan@gmx.de> - 2013-05-31 00:23 +0200
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2013-05-31 01:05 -0700
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl (Albert van der Horst) - 2013-05-31 11:23 +0000
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2013-05-31 11:15 -0700
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Gerry Jackson <gerry@jackson9000.fsnet.co.uk> - 2013-05-31 18:37 +0100
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2013-05-31 10:43 -0700
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Bernd Paysan <bernd.paysan@gmx.de> - 2013-05-31 23:21 +0200
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? mhx@iae.nl - 2013-05-31 15:07 -0700
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Lars Brinkhoff <lars.spam@nocrew.org> - 2013-06-01 08:55 +0200
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2013-06-01 00:41 -0700
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2013-06-01 13:52 +0000
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2013-06-03 16:07 +0000
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2013-06-03 07:56 -1000
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2013-06-03 11:20 -0700
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2013-06-04 12:30 +0000
Re: OT (slightly) What is the 'best' processor for a new project? mhx@iae.nl (Marcel Hendrix) - 2013-06-04 21:47 +0200
Re: OT (slightly) What is the 'best' processor for a new project? Bernd Paysan <bernd.paysan@gmx.de> - 2013-06-05 00:58 +0200
Re: OT (slightly) What is the 'best' processor for a new project? mhx@iae.nl (Marcel Hendrix) - 2013-06-05 21:09 +0200
Re: OT (slightly) What is the 'best' processor for a new project? anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2013-06-05 15:50 +0000
Re: OT (slightly) What is the 'best' processor for a new project? mhx@iae.nl (Marcel Hendrix) - 2013-06-05 22:06 +0200
Re: OT (slightly) What is the 'best' processor for a new project? Alex McDonald <blog@rivadpm.com> - 2013-06-05 15:26 -0700
Re: OT (slightly) What is the 'best' processor for a new project? anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2013-06-12 16:41 +0000
Re: OT (slightly) What is the 'best' processor for a new project? Hugh Aguilar <hughaguilar96@yahoo.com> - 2013-06-12 16:46 -0700
Re: OT (slightly) What is the 'best' processor for a new project? Bernd Paysan <bernd.paysan@gmx.de> - 2013-06-13 22:44 +0200
Re: OT (slightly) What is the 'best' processor for a new project? Hugh Aguilar <hughaguilar96@yahoo.com> - 2013-06-13 20:54 -0700
Re: OT (slightly) What is the 'best' processor for a new project? Mark Wills <markrobertwills@yahoo.co.uk> - 2013-06-14 03:03 -0700
Re: OT (slightly) What is the 'best' processor for a new project? Bernd Paysan <bernd.paysan@gmx.de> - 2013-06-14 14:21 +0200
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Lars Brinkhoff <lars.spam@nocrew.org> - 2013-06-04 16:06 +0200
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2013-06-01 02:20 -0500
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Bernd Paysan <bernd.paysan@gmx.de> - 2013-06-01 17:32 +0200
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl (Albert van der Horst) - 2013-06-01 19:26 +0000
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Bernd Paysan <bernd.paysan@gmx.de> - 2013-06-02 01:13 +0200
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2013-06-01 00:39 -0700
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Bernd Paysan <bernd.paysan@gmx.de> - 2013-06-01 18:05 +0200
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2013-06-02 00:45 -0700
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2013-06-02 08:34 -1000
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Bernd Paysan <bernd.paysan@gmx.de> - 2013-06-03 01:57 +0200
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2013-06-03 19:37 -0700
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2013-06-03 17:37 -1000
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Lars Brinkhoff <lars.spam@nocrew.org> - 2013-06-04 08:03 +0200
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Elizabeth D Rather <erather@forth.com> - 2013-06-03 21:22 -1000
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2013-06-04 01:18 -0700
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2013-06-04 08:41 -1000
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Lars Brinkhoff <lars.spam@nocrew.org> - 2013-06-04 10:46 +0200
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2013-06-04 05:43 -0500
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2013-06-04 08:49 -1000
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Bernd Paysan <bernd.paysan@gmx.de> - 2013-06-05 00:48 +0200
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2013-05-31 09:27 +0000
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl (Albert van der Horst) - 2013-05-31 11:27 +0000
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2013-05-31 06:16 -0500
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl (Albert van der Horst) - 2013-05-31 11:36 +0000
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2013-05-31 09:52 -0700
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2013-05-31 12:10 -0500
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2013-05-31 10:30 -1000
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Bernd Paysan <bernd.paysan@gmx.de> - 2013-06-01 00:06 +0200
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2013-06-04 10:07 -0400
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2013-06-01 16:01 -0700
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2013-05-30 13:20 -0400
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Howerd <howerdo@yahoo.co.uk> - 2013-05-30 09:32 -0700
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Howerd <howerdo@yahoo.co.uk> - 2013-05-30 09:30 -0700
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Brad Eckert <hwfwguy@gmail.com> - 2013-05-31 09:38 -0700
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Howerd <howerdo@yahoo.co.uk> - 2013-06-01 01:40 -0700
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2013-06-01 22:50 -0700
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2013-05-30 13:11 -0400
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2013-05-30 13:08 -0400
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2013-06-01 16:24 -0700
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2013-06-04 10:49 -0400
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2013-05-28 10:54 -0400
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2013-05-28 15:27 +0000
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2013-05-28 09:31 -0700
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2013-05-28 19:08 -0400
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl (Albert van der Horst) - 2013-05-29 03:51 +0000
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2013-05-29 13:04 -0400
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Pavel Klinkovsky <pavel.klinkovsky@gmail.com> - 2013-05-29 00:12 -0700
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2013-05-29 13:05 -0400
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2013-05-28 09:32 -0700
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2013-05-28 19:05 -0400
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Howerd <howerdo@yahoo.co.uk> - 2013-05-29 00:16 -0700
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2013-05-29 00:22 -0700
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Howerd <howerdo@yahoo.co.uk> - 2013-05-29 01:23 -0700
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? stephenXXX@mpeforth.com (Stephen Pelc) - 2013-05-29 09:35 +0000
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2013-05-29 05:37 -0500
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Howerd <howerdo@yahoo.co.uk> - 2013-05-29 04:53 -0700
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2013-05-29 08:39 -0500
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2013-05-29 15:25 -0400
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2013-06-01 23:05 -0700
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2013-06-04 10:57 -0400
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2013-05-29 15:16 -0400
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2013-05-29 13:15 -0400
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? daveyrotten <danw8804@gmail.com> - 2013-05-28 09:21 -0700
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2013-05-28 19:10 -0400
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? daveyrotten <danw8804@gmail.com> - 2013-05-28 18:40 -0700
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2013-05-28 19:33 -0700
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? daveyrotten <danw8804@gmail.com> - 2013-05-29 04:31 -0700
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2013-05-29 16:12 -0400
Re: OT (slightly) What is the "best" processor for a new project? the_gavino_himself <visphatesjava@gmail.com> - 2013-06-11 16:29 -0700
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