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Groups > comp.arch.embedded > #12698
| From | Joerg <invalid@invalid.invalid> |
|---|---|
| Newsgroups | sci.electronics.design, comp.arch.embedded |
| Subject | Re: Cutting panels |
| Date | 2013-07-24 13:09 -0700 |
| Organization | Consultant |
| Message-ID | <b5aqkhFq6uqU1@mid.individual.net> (permalink) |
| References | (4 earlier) <ksk0ck$je7$1@speranza.aioe.org> <b55sruFoba5U1@mid.individual.net> <ksknl5$c7c$1@speranza.aioe.org> <b57h5gF4ahrU1@mid.individual.net> <ksn1jb$gda$1@speranza.aioe.org> |
Cross-posted to 2 groups.
Don Y wrote: > Hi Joerg, > > On 7/23/2013 7:09 AM, Joerg wrote: >> Don Y wrote: >>> You probably *don't* have an equipment rack anywhere in your >>> home. And, probably don't want to see a mess of cables and >>> equipment. Or *hear* them (fans, etc.). Instead, you want to >>> tuck it all into some corner where it is just barely accessible. >>> "Make it fit". >> >> We do, in a utility closet. > > As in "tuck it all into some corner"! > No, it is a wiring panel with enough space. It even has a large box for the WLAN patch connections in case some electronics have to be added later. Such as PoE. The only downside is that I have to scoot the freezer out of the way when I want to work on the TV amp stuff without too much contortion (because the lower back isn't that great anymore). The room itself is so spacious that I could even fit a small desk and chair in there. But that would not be legit (only one path of egress). >> Phone, LAN, TV distribution, vidoe modulator >> feedback lines, central sprinkler circuit control, things like that. > > I have these things all scattered around the house as befits > their roles. E.g., the CATV distribution amp is located in the > "space" above the front door (what would be an "attic" in a > normal house but, here, is just a foot or so "tall"). Barely > accessible but rarely *needing* access! > I don't like such things scattered. > The irrigation controller is located in the garage near the > garage door as it's easy to get out through the wall to the > valves (well, actually, the valves are distributed all around > the yard -- front/back/sides -- but this is where I chose to > bring them all through the wall since it is close to the > rest of the "water" stuff (future flow meter, valve, master > irrigation valve, softener, filtration, etc.) -- things that > are handled by the "water" controller! (i.e., a home may > or may not have an irrigation system -- but *should* have > "water"!) > All in the same utility room here. If anything needs fixing everyone knows where the stuff is. > The HVAC controller is located in with the furnace (d'uh!) > as that's a convenient place to get at the wiring for the > swamp cooler, furnace, ac compressor and "thermostat" > (temperature sensor). Since every home needs one *and* > every home needs a doorbell (?), that controller also > monitors the various doorbell (buttons) and drives a pair > of speakers in the ceiling in two different parts of the > house. Since AC power is readily available, there, I > can spend a fair bit of power "making noise" when someone > comes to one of the doors (front/side/back/garage/driveway). > > Media gets served from a set of processors in a closet > off the kitchen (since I need rotating media, there, and > places like "in the ceiling" or "in the garage" would not > be appropriate. > Over here media gets played where the media gear is, from the living room. But you don't have to watch the movie there, it gets transmitted over coax back to the utility closet and then into the main distribution. Of course with an iso amp so things won't pipe out of the antenna. > All of these are integral parts of the automation system > so none of them has a user interface, etc. I.e., no silly > thermostats, doorbells, etc. hanging off walls in hallways, etc. > I want the thermostat or control where the action is. In our case both the swamp cooler and the central HVAC are controlled from the living room. >>> E.g., here, I have the various processors, switches, UPS, etc. >>> hiding in the bottom of a "closet" off the kitchen. Space that >>> isn't easily used for anything that we would want to get at >>> often (because it's too low to the ground). >>> >>> I can imagine others wanting to put it all in a big box and hide >>> it in a bedroom closet. (I'm not sure I would recommend locating >>> it in "non-living" space -- reliability! :< ) My goal is to >>> shrink things to about 10U -- I'm about double that, currently >>> (because I have lots of COTS components in the current implementation) >> >> I would recommend locating it in non-living space. It is best to have a >> utility closet in a house but unfortunately many builders skimp or want >> to boast the highest living square-footage possible. That's how stuff >> ends in garages where it cooks all summer long and gets dirty. > > Closet is considered "living space". I.e., heated/cooled. You *could* > survive in a closet whereas you couldn't in a garage. > If there's a decent size fridge with beer in the garage I could :-) > Here, garage is a death sentence for all things electronic. Even > with our insulated door it still gets pretty warm in there! > (before the new door, it would easily hit 140) > Then the electronics isn't designed right. After all, garage door openers are full of electronics and they have to live in the nastiest area of a garage, under the ceiling. The cars also have to reside in the garage and nowadays they are chockfull of elecrtronic gizmos, most of them highly unnecessary. > I keep debating running "air" into the store room in the > garage and moving the doorway to open into the interior of > the house (instead of into the garage). That's a fairly > large space that would be a great home for the freezer > (currently in the garage!), my larger printers, plotter, > etc. But... <shrug> > Freezer in the garage? That is tough on its compressor. So yeah, it would make sense to change that. But it's probably as high as on the priority list as painting the pool house is here. >>> I'd like to come up with a "solution" that lets folks figure out >>> how best to package/deploy their own version instead of imposing >>> a solution. You want to use an equipment rack? Fine! *You* >>> figure out where to put it... (I have a friend with one of these >>> 5,000sq ft palaces that *likes* making his toys visible. He'd >>> probably set it in a 42U rack with glass doors sitting in a >>> corner of his living room! "Conversation Piece" :-/ Sheesh!) >> >> With smoked glass doors and mood lighting :-) > > I have another friend with a small rack in his *bedroom*! > Dunno what the appeal of that is supposed to be... <frown> > Strange. It's usually considered uncool to show so much nerdiness. It turns off potential girlfriends. Unless he is already married :-) > [Though, having said that, I've thought of replacing the > library card catalog I have ... What is a library card catalog? > ... with a pair of short racks > and put much of this rack-mountable kit in them instead > of treating them all as free-standing devices. Problem is > finding racks that are the right height (I want to use the top > of the racks as a "standing" work surface) *and* not too > deep (front to back).] > >>> The idea of "custom panels" IN GENERAL makes perfect sense (e.g., >>> the examples you cite). I just don't think many would pursue it >>> for *this* project (which would already be hard to get past your >>> S.O. -- regardless of how many shoes she has!! :> ) >>> >> >> Mine was real happy after I installed the system, when I showed her how >> we can now watch a movie anywhere, including outside. > > Mine is getting more and more nervous as the "controls" are > disappearing. "Why can't I just use change (radio) stations > like I used to? What do you mean, there soon will be *no* > remote for the TV??" ... Oh yeah, that would not go over too well with my wife either. > ... As a concession, I had to install three > "control panels" so she can interact with the system in a more > "traditional" manner. I've rationalized this to myself by > locating them in the three places where you would typically want > a quick summary of system status and presenting this visually > would be most efficient: the two primary doors by which we > enter/exit the house and the hallway to the bedrooms (where you > "say good night/morning" to the house). > > [There's also a panel located in the closet that houses the media > servers but that's more of a convenience for *me*... so I can > do maintenance work without having to boot up a PC to "talk" > to the system.] > But one needs a remote, nowadays. Having to get out of a chair to changes stations is so 1950's, and one could pull a muscle :-) [...] > I have two sorts of "connection points" in the house. One type > is dedicated for specific needs. E.g., the drop for the > irrigation controller is *just* a network drop FOR THE IRRIGATION > CONTROLLER. > > The "uncommitted" points in the house (24 of them) each have > a network drop, CATV drop and a POTS drop. So, you can plug in > a laptop, phone or "conventional" (i.e., non-IP) TV in any of > those locations. > > All the POTS drops terminate at a pair of punchdown blocks > mounted on the wall alongside the furnace. > To be honest, I haven't completed the 66 blocks. While installing our trusty old Cincinnatti Microwave phone quit and I went to buy a new one. They stopped making these, so I ended up with a large "system pack" full of cordless phones. Made the POTS network I just completed almost irrelevant, nothing much plugs into it. [...] >>> Ah. Perhaps that's why I thought you lived further out (east)! >>> [I've had an image of a spot near Lake Tahoe in my mind -- even >>> though I know you don't live in Tahoe!] >> >> Between Placerville and Folsom. There might be a crafts store in Folsom, >> somewhere. Placerville has the oldest hardware store west of the >> Mississippi. > > Ah, OK. I knew a guy from (?) placerville. *Small* town (?) > Yes, and with quite a history: http://www.beachcalifornia.com/hangmans-tree-placerville.html >>> E.g., we've dropped about a kilobuck into *just* the irrigation >>> system -- with none of that spent on "labor" or "profit". We >>> could never have justified what it would have cost to *contract* >>> that job out! If I'd *tried* to contract *this* project out, >>> neither of us would *ever* retire (to enjoy it!) :> >> >> Same here. We just painted the house. It would have cost us around 7k. >> This way it cost about $400 in paint and several Saturdays. > > Yup. Though it's not just "saving money". I find these sorts > of "puzzles" to help keep my thinking "pliable" since the > sorts of constraints that you face are very different than > the "9 to 5" sorts. > It also keeps one appreciative of folks doing non-engineering jobs. > E.g., deciding how to plumb the pressure regulator/master valve/ > anti-siphon device/main shutoff assembly required a fair bit of > 3 dimensional thinking: "Yeah, I can envision all these parts > *assembled*. But, will I be able to *disassemble* them once > they are positioned in this particular location? Will I be > able to unscrew this fitting? Do I need to add a union? > Or it goes like "Oh dang! I should have put a union in there because now ..." > You also learn things like: galvanized pipe sucks! > > (e.g., I've replaced everything with copper pipe and brass > fittings -- *threaded* fittings instead of slip fittings > so it's easier for *me* to service in the future!) > In this area they all happily mixed galvanized and brass and copper. Disgusting. > And, you can control the *quality* of the workmanship. > E.g., the *hired* plumber initially installed some of this > kit -- and didn't seem to know what "vertical" meant! > (No, 80 degrees isn't vertical... it might be considered > "upright" by some but it sure isn't vertical!) > > Finally, it avoids the "Olde Farte" syndrome -- folks > who rationalize hiring people to do things because they > are too lazy/unambitious to do/learn for themselves! > Sooner or later, the body will limit what I can do. Until > then, I'd like to "try" as much as I can! :> > Same here. > [12 tons of rock coming this fall... at least I was smart > enough to schedule it when its COOLER!] > > Having said all that (rant!), I may change my tune after > I replace the roof next year... <frown> I guess a lot will > depend on how much heavy stuff I have to carry up there! > (so far, I've only dealt with 80 pound felt -- heavy but > manageable!) > Ok, there I'd rent a lift. Costs less than the doctor visit for the prescription pills and cortizone shots, followed by several days in bed because you can't move. Happened last time I helped roofing abhouse as a volunteer. -- Regards, Joerg http://www.analogconsultants.com/
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Cutting panels Don Y <this@isnotme.com> - 2013-07-21 02:47 -0700
Re: Cutting panels John Fields <jfields@austininstruments.com> - 2013-07-21 08:05 -0500
Re: Cutting panels Roberto Waltman <usenet@rwaltman.com> - 2013-07-21 10:38 -0400
Re: Cutting panels "Carl Ijames" <carl.ijames@nonono.verizon.net> - 2013-07-21 12:36 -0400
Re: Cutting panels Joerg <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2013-07-21 09:48 -0700
Re: Cutting panels Don Y <this@isnotme.com> - 2013-07-21 13:29 -0700
Re: Cutting panels Joerg <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2013-07-21 14:10 -0700
Re: Cutting panels Don Y <this@isnotme.com> - 2013-07-23 16:23 -0700
Re: Cutting panels Grant Edwards <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2013-07-21 21:04 +0000
Re: Cutting panels Joerg <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2013-07-21 15:07 -0700
Re: Cutting panels Don Y <this@isnotme.com> - 2013-07-21 16:35 -0700
Re: Cutting panels Joerg <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2013-07-21 17:11 -0700
Re: Cutting panels Don Y <this@isnotme.com> - 2013-07-23 16:27 -0700
Re: Cutting panels Robert Wessel <robertwessel2@yahoo.com> - 2013-07-23 21:50 -0500
Re: Cutting panels Don Y <this@isnotme.com> - 2013-07-23 21:24 -0700
Re: Cutting panels Jasen Betts <jasen@xnet.co.nz> - 2013-07-24 09:09 +0000
Re: Cutting panels Don Y <this@isnotme.com> - 2013-07-24 16:02 -0700
Re: Cutting panels hamilton <hamilton@nothere.com> - 2013-07-21 16:52 -0600
Re: Cutting panels Joerg <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2013-07-21 17:13 -0700
Re: Cutting panels Don Y <this@isnotme.com> - 2013-07-21 12:35 -0700
Re: Cutting panels amdx <nojunk@knology.net> - 2013-07-21 09:54 -0500
Re: Cutting panels Joerg <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2013-07-21 09:32 -0700
Re: Cutting panels Don Y <this@isnotme.com> - 2013-07-21 13:36 -0700
Re: Cutting panels Joerg <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2013-07-21 14:04 -0700
Re: Cutting panels [solved?] Don Y <this@isnotme.com> - 2013-07-21 13:14 -0700
Re: Cutting panels [solved?] Don Y <this@isnotme.com> - 2013-07-21 13:26 -0700
Re: Cutting panels [solved?] Joerg <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2013-07-21 14:06 -0700
Re: Cutting panels [solved?] Don Y <this@isnotme.com> - 2013-07-21 16:08 -0700
Re: Cutting panels [solved?] Rich Webb <webb.ra@example.net> - 2013-07-21 19:42 -0400
Re: Cutting panels [solved?] Don Y <this@isnotme.com> - 2013-07-23 21:45 -0700
Re: Cutting panels [solved?] Jan Panteltje <pNaonStpealmtje@yahoo.com> - 2013-07-22 07:51 +0000
Re: Cutting panels [solved?] Charlie E. <edmondson@ieee.org> - 2013-07-23 05:57 -0700
Re: Cutting panels [solved?] Don Y <this@isnotme.com> - 2013-07-23 14:46 -0700
Re: Cutting panels [solved?] Don Lancaster <don@tinaja.com> - 2013-07-23 16:41 -0700
Re: Cutting panels [solved?] Charlie E. <edmondson@ieee.org> - 2013-07-23 17:21 -0700
Re: Cutting panels [solved?] Jasen Betts <jasen@xnet.co.nz> - 2013-07-24 09:26 +0000
Re: Cutting panels [solved?] Don Y <this@isnotme.com> - 2013-07-25 12:11 -0700
Re: Cutting panels [solved?] Spehro Pefhany <speffSNIP@interlogDOTyou.knowwhat> - 2013-07-25 16:04 -0400
Re: Cutting panels [solved?] Don Y <this@isnotme.com> - 2013-07-25 13:03 -0700
Re: Cutting panels [solved?] Jasen Betts <jasen@xnet.co.nz> - 2013-07-23 13:40 +0000
Re: Cutting panels [solved?] Joerg <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2013-07-23 07:38 -0700
Re: Cutting panels [solved?]/summary Don Y <this@isnotme.com> - 2013-07-29 15:18 -0700
Re: Cutting panels andrews@sdf.lonestar.org - 2013-07-21 12:45 -0700
Re: Cutting panels Don Y <this@isnotme.com> - 2013-07-22 19:17 -0700
Re: Cutting panels Spehro Pefhany <speffSNIP@interlogDOTyou.knowwhat> - 2013-07-21 19:45 -0400
Re: Cutting panels Don Y <this@isnotme.com> - 2013-07-21 17:07 -0700
Re: Cutting panels Peter Bennett <peterbb@somewhere.invalid> - 2013-07-21 16:57 -0700
Re: Cutting panels Don Y <this@isnotme.com> - 2013-07-21 20:58 -0700
Re: Cutting panels Don Y <this@isnotme.com> - 2013-07-21 21:02 -0700
Re: Cutting panels Joerg <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2013-07-22 09:20 -0700
Re: Cutting panels Don Y <this@isnotme.com> - 2013-07-22 12:15 -0700
Re: Cutting panels Joerg <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2013-07-22 16:17 -0700
Re: Cutting panels Don Y <this@isnotme.com> - 2013-07-22 18:52 -0700
Re: Cutting panels Jasen Betts <jasen@xnet.co.nz> - 2013-07-23 14:00 +0000
Re: Cutting panels Don Y <this@isnotme.com> - 2013-07-23 15:13 -0700
Re: Cutting panels Joerg <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2013-07-23 07:09 -0700
Re: Cutting panels Charlie E. <edmondson@ieee.org> - 2013-07-23 10:03 -0700
Re: Cutting panels Don Y <this@isnotme.com> - 2013-07-23 21:59 -0700
Re: Cutting panels Don Y <this@isnotme.com> - 2013-07-23 15:54 -0700
Re: Cutting panels Joerg <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2013-07-24 13:09 -0700
Re: Cutting panels Don Y <this@isnotme.com> - 2013-07-24 15:51 -0700
Re: Cutting panels Joerg <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2013-07-26 09:13 -0700
Re: Cutting panels Don Y <this@isnotme.com> - 2013-07-26 11:35 -0700
Re: Cutting panels Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2013-07-26 12:06 -0700
Re: Cutting panels Jan Panteltje <panteltje@yahoo.com> - 2013-07-26 19:44 +0000
Re: Cutting panels Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2013-07-26 22:21 -0700
Re: Cutting panels Jan Panteltje <pNaonStpealmtje@yahoo.com> - 2013-07-27 08:12 +0000
Re: Cutting panels Don Y <this@isnotme.com> - 2013-07-26 13:42 -0700
Re: Cutting panels Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2013-07-26 18:50 -0700
Re: Cutting panels Don Y <this@isnotme.com> - 2013-07-26 22:49 -0700
Re: Cutting panels Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2013-07-27 00:53 -0700
Re: Cutting panels Don Y <this@isnotme.com> - 2013-07-27 10:16 -0700
Re: Cutting panels Joerg <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2013-07-26 23:52 -0700
Re: Cutting panels Don Y <this@isnotme.com> - 2013-07-27 17:36 -0700
Re: Cutting panels Joerg <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2013-07-28 09:22 -0700
Re: Cutting panels Don Y <this@isnotme.com> - 2013-07-28 12:31 -0700
Re: Cutting panels Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2013-07-28 13:48 -0700
Re: Cutting panels Joerg <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2013-07-28 14:20 -0700
Re: Cutting panels Don Y <this@isnotme.com> - 2013-07-28 16:35 -0700
Re: Cutting panels Joerg <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2013-07-28 17:39 -0700
Re: Cutting panels Don Y <this@isnotme.com> - 2013-07-28 19:38 -0700
Re: Cutting panels Joerg <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2013-07-29 11:15 -0700
Re: Cutting panels Don Y <this@isnotme.com> - 2013-07-29 16:30 -0700
Re: Cutting panels Joerg <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2013-07-29 17:38 -0700
Re: Cutting panels Don Y <this@isnotme.com> - 2013-07-29 21:45 -0700
Re: Cutting panels Joerg <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2013-07-30 12:20 -0700
Re: Cutting panels Jeff Liebermann <jeffl@cruzio.com> - 2013-07-21 21:38 -0700
Re: Cutting panels Robert Wessel <robertwessel2@yahoo.com> - 2013-07-22 00:39 -0500
Re: Cutting panels Don Y <this@isnotme.com> - 2013-07-22 01:39 -0700
Re: Cutting panels Robert Wessel <robertwessel2@yahoo.com> - 2013-07-22 19:09 -0500
Re: Cutting panels Don Y <this@isnotme.com> - 2013-07-22 20:10 -0700
Re: Cutting panels Jasen Betts <jasen@xnet.co.nz> - 2013-07-23 14:07 +0000
Re: Cutting panels Theo Markettos <theom+news@chiark.greenend.org.uk> - 2013-07-22 18:33 +0100
Re: Cutting panels Spehro Pefhany <speffSNIP@interlogDOTyou.knowwhat> - 2013-07-22 13:44 -0400
Re: Cutting panels Don Y <this@isnotme.com> - 2013-07-22 19:00 -0700
Re: Cutting panels Jan Panteltje <pNaonStpealmtje@yahoo.com> - 2013-07-23 10:09 +0000
Re: Cutting panels Theo Markettos <theom+news@chiark.greenend.org.uk> - 2013-07-23 11:45 +0100
Re: Cutting panels Theo Markettos <theom+news@chiark.greenend.org.uk> - 2013-07-23 13:46 +0100
Re: Cutting panels 0bama <0B@nocontrast.org> - 2013-07-23 13:06 +0000
Re: Cutting panels Theo Markettos <theom+news@chiark.greenend.org.uk> - 2013-07-23 22:19 +0100
Re: Cutting panels 0bama <0B@nocontrast.org> - 2013-07-24 08:05 +0000
Re: Cutting panels Spehro Pefhany <speffSNIP@interlogDOTyou.knowwhat> - 2013-07-23 10:07 -0400
Re: Cutting panels Don Y <this@isnotme.com> - 2013-07-25 01:26 -0700
Re: Cutting panels Jasen Betts <jasen@xnet.co.nz> - 2013-07-23 14:18 +0000
Re: Cutting panels Spehro Pefhany <speffSNIP@interlogDOTyou.knowwhat> - 2013-07-23 11:38 -0400
Re: Cutting panels Theo Markettos <theom+news@chiark.greenend.org.uk> - 2013-07-23 22:32 +0100
Re: Cutting panels Frank Miles <fpm@u.washington.edu> - 2013-07-23 21:37 +0000
Re: Cutting panels Don Y <this@isnotme.com> - 2013-07-23 16:16 -0700
Re: Cutting panels Theo Markettos <theom+news@chiark.greenend.org.uk> - 2013-07-24 10:37 +0100
Re: Cutting panels Don Y <this@isnotme.com> - 2013-07-25 01:27 -0700
Re: Cutting panels Gonadicus <gonadicus@no_spam.com> - 2013-07-23 12:46 +0800
Re: Cutting panels sms <scharf.steven@geemail.com> - 2013-07-23 04:58 -0700
Re: Cutting panels Don Y <this@isnotme.com> - 2013-07-23 16:13 -0700
Re: Cutting panels Jasen Betts <jasen@xnet.co.nz> - 2013-07-23 13:25 +0000
Re: Cutting panels Don Y <this@isnotme.com> - 2013-07-23 21:42 -0700
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