Groups > sci.physics.relativity > #581909

Re: Annotated version of SRT

From	Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de>
Newsgroups	sci.physics.relativity
Subject	Re: Annotated version of SRT
Date	2022-04-05 08:25 +0200
Message-ID	<jb25m5FkfU1@mid.individual.net> (permalink)
References	(13 earlier) <b11d446a-ede8-41a7-bb31-c435e9acc4fen@googlegroups.com> <jasrs0FtnirU1@mid.individual.net> <t2c4fc$n1$1@gioia.aioe.org> <javd58Fe4prU1@mid.individual.net> <t2etbm$h0v$2@gioia.aioe.org>

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Am 04.04.2022 um 15:55 schrieb Odd Bodkin:
> Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> wrote:
>> Am 03.04.2022 um 14:38 schrieb Odd Bodkin:
>>> Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> wrote:
>>>> Am 01.04.2022 um 09:39 schrieb JanPB:
>>>>> On Thursday, March 31, 2022 at 10:37:59 PM UTC-7, Thomas Heger wrote:
>>>>>> Am 31.03.2022 um 09:14 schrieb JanPB:
>>>>>>> On Wednesday, March 30, 2022 at 11:04:11 PM UTC-7, Thomas Heger wrote:
>>>>>>>> Am 30.03.2022 um 20:08 schrieb JanPB:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> But I have not dealt with these equations, because I disliked Einstein's
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> subtraction of magnetic field strength from electric field strength, anyhow.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> It's nothing peculiar to Einstein, it's the Gaussian system of units.
>>>>>>>>>>>> I have actually problems with subtracting electric field strength from
>>>>>>>>>>>> magnetic field strength.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> This is like subtracting 1 V from 1 A.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> To me this doesn't make any sense at all.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> That's your problem then. If you want to resolve this, you must
>>>>>>>>>>> learn how various systems of units work.
>>>>>>>>>> No.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> In the cgs system electric field strength and magnetic field strength
>>>>>>>>>> have the same unit of force, because the fields were equated with the
>>>>>>>>>> process of measuring them.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> These measuring devices contained deformable springs, which measure a force.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Such springs are contained in many analog measuring devices, like a
>>>>>>>>>> pressure gauge, a cithen balance or a volt-meter.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> All of them measure something by a reference to a deformable spring.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> But you cannot subtract Volts from psi, just because both were measured
>>>>>>>>>> with a deformable spring.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> To do so would require a physical justification, which was entirely
>>>>>>>>>> missing in Einstein's text.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> No, this is how units of systems work (Gaussian, in this case).
>>>>>>>> I have given you already the example, that many anolg measuring devices
>>>>>>>> work with deformable springs, which emasure ultimatively a force.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> But still you must not add or subtract different units,
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> They are not different units in the Gaussian system.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> like pressure
>>>>>>>> and weigth,
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> N/A. Learn about X if you want to discuss X (esp. if you want to
>>>>>>> criticise X).
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> for instance, even if a pressure gauge and a kitchen scale
>>>>>>>> work with a spring.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> It is fantastically stupid nonsese to even advocate such use of values.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> No. You simply don't understand how this works. Some people, when
>>>>>>> they don't understand something, tend to blame everyone but themselves
>>>>>>> for this. I cannot fix this problem for you.
>>>>>> I understand, that magnetic field and electric field have different
>>>>>> effects, hence are different things, even if related.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> So: I cannot subtract 1 amp from 1 Volt, because that does not make much
>>>>>> more sense then subtraction weigth from pressure.
>>>>>
>>>>> You don't subtract 1 A from 1 V.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Electric field strength (commonly called 'E') was subtracted from
>>>> magnetic field strength (commonly called 'H') by Einstein.
>>>>
>>>> E has [V/m] as units and H has [A/m].
>>>
>>> How about in cgs units? You know about those?
>>
>> Do you really want to defend the same idocities as Einstein?
>
> I don’t think systems of units are idiocies.

Not the system of units, of course, but the use of these units.

The cgs system boild the fields down to 'force', which is measured in 
'dyne'.

This force was meant as real mechanical force like with what we measure 
weight, for instance.

This was justified by measuring a force inside the measuring device, 
which ultimately was a mechanical force.

(Einstein actually wrote so, when he wrote about the connection of an 
electron to a spring balance).

Now the same units 'dyne' are not appropriate for electrical fields of 
different kind, because the dyne is 'not electric'.

The units simply ignore this different origins of the fields and their 
different nature.

But the differences are real, hence the same untis do not allow 
algebraic operations between them just because the units are similar.



...


TH

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Re: Annotated version of SRT JanPB <filmart@gmail.com> - 2022-03-30 11:08 -0700
  Re: Annotated version of SRT Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2022-03-31 08:04 +0200
    Re: Annotated version of SRT JanPB <filmart@gmail.com> - 2022-03-31 00:14 -0700
      Re: Annotated version of SRT Maciej Wozniak <maluwozniak@gmail.com> - 2022-03-31 00:26 -0700
        Re: Annotated version of SRT Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2022-04-01 07:05 +0200
          Re: Annotated version of SRT JanPB <filmart@gmail.com> - 2022-04-01 00:25 -0700
            Re: Annotated version of SRT Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2022-04-02 08:18 +0200
      Re: Annotated version of SRT Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2022-04-01 07:37 +0200
        Re: Annotated version of SRT JanPB <filmart@gmail.com> - 2022-04-01 00:39 -0700
          Re: Annotated version of SRT Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2022-04-02 08:38 +0200
          Re: Annotated version of SRT Richie Cruze <rcru@bstntap.jp> - 2022-04-02 18:17 +0000
            Re: Annotated version of SRT Michael Moroney <moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com> - 2022-04-02 14:57 -0400
              Re: Annotated version of SRT Richie Cruze <rcru@bstntap.jp> - 2022-04-02 19:07 +0000
                Re: Annotated version of SRT Michael Moroney <moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com> - 2022-04-02 15:22 -0400
                Re: Annotated version of SRT Richie Cruze <rcru@bstntap.jp> - 2022-04-02 19:33 +0000
                Re: Annotated version of SRT JanPB <filmart@gmail.com> - 2022-04-02 12:30 -0700
                Re: Annotated version of SRT Richie Cruze <rcru@bstntap.jp> - 2022-04-02 19:53 +0000
                Re: Annotated version of SRT JanPB <filmart@gmail.com> - 2022-04-03 00:38 -0700
                Re: Annotated version of SRT Elmer Joss <josl@nntdca.mx> - 2022-04-03 08:50 +0000
                Re: Annotated version of SRT JanPB <filmart@gmail.com> - 2022-04-03 13:07 -0700
                Re: Annotated version of SRT Vance Rera <rerv@trscnat.ag> - 2022-04-03 20:24 +0000
                Re: Annotated version of SRT JanPB <filmart@gmail.com> - 2022-04-03 15:34 -0700
                Re: Annotated version of SRT Vance Rera <rerv@trscnat.ag> - 2022-04-04 00:25 +0000
                Re: Annotated version of SRT JanPB <filmart@gmail.com> - 2022-04-03 19:33 -0700
                Re: Annotated nazi excrement JanPB failed the eugenicist IQ-test Hagan Koon <koh@nisnaha.mx> - 2022-04-04 12:30 +0000
                Re: Annotated nazi excrement JanPB failed the eugenicist IQ-test JanPB <filmart@gmail.com> - 2022-04-04 12:23 -0700
                Re: Annotated nazi excrement JanPB failed the eugenicist IQ-test Lamar Main <lana@rtcpans.in> - 2022-04-04 21:04 +0000
                Re: Annotated nazi excrement JanPB failed the eugenicist IQ-test Paul Alsing <pnalsing@gmail.com> - 2022-04-04 17:41 -0700
                Re: Annotated nazi excrement JanPB failed the eugenicist IQ-test Michael Moroney <moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com> - 2022-04-04 21:09 -0400
                Re: Annotated nazi excrement JanPB failed the eugenicist IQ-test whodat <whodaat@void.nowgre.com> - 2022-04-05 00:17 -0500
                Re: Annotated nazi excrement JanPB failed the eugenicist IQ-test JanPB <filmart@gmail.com> - 2022-04-04 23:03 -0700
                Re: Annotated nazi excrement JanPB failed the eugenicist IQ-test Michael Moroney <moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com> - 2022-04-05 02:10 -0400
                Re: Annotated nazi excrement JanPB failed the eugenicist IQ-test Lamar Main <lana@rtcpans.in> - 2022-04-05 09:35 +0000
                Re: Annotated nazi excrement JanPB failed the eugenicist IQ-test JanPB <filmart@gmail.com> - 2022-04-05 03:13 -0700
                Re: Annotated nazi excrement JanPB failed the eugenicist IQ-test Lamar Main <lana@rtcpans.in> - 2022-04-05 09:33 +0000
                Re: Annotated nazi excrement JanPB failed the eugenicist IQ-test JanPB <filmart@gmail.com> - 2022-04-04 16:00 -0700
                Re: Annotated nazi excrement JanPB failed the eugenicist IQ-test Lamar Main <lana@rtcpans.in> - 2022-04-05 09:54 +0000
                Re: Annotated version of SRT Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2022-04-05 08:09 +0200
          Re: Annotated version of SRT Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2022-04-03 08:07 +0200
            Re: Annotated version of SRT JanPB <filmart@gmail.com> - 2022-04-03 00:43 -0700
            Re: Annotated version of SRT Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2022-04-03 12:38 +0000
              Re: Annotated version of SRT Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2022-04-04 07:14 +0200
                Re: Annotated version of SRT JanPB <filmart@gmail.com> - 2022-04-04 01:44 -0700
                Re: Annotated version of SRT Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2022-04-05 08:16 +0200
                Re: Annotated version of SRT Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2022-04-04 13:55 +0000
                Re: Annotated version of SRT Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2022-04-05 08:25 +0200
                Re: Annotated version of SRT Michael Moroney <moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com> - 2022-04-05 02:46 -0400
                Re: Annotated version of SRT Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2022-04-06 07:40 +0200
                Re: Annotated version of SRT Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2022-04-05 14:56 +0000
                Re: Annotated version of SRT Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2022-04-06 07:53 +0200
                Re: Annotated version of SRT Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2022-04-06 13:50 +0000
                Re: Annotated version of SRT Maciej Wozniak <maluwozniak@gmail.com> - 2022-04-06 07:01 -0700
                Re: Annotated version of SRT Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2022-04-06 14:18 +0000
                Re: Annotated version of SRT Maciej Wozniak <maluwozniak@gmail.com> - 2022-04-06 08:45 -0700
                Re: Annotated version of SRT Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2022-04-07 07:08 +0200
                Re: Annotated version of SRT Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2022-04-07 13:25 +0000
                Re: Annotated version of SRT Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2022-04-08 07:53 +0200
            Re: Annotated version of SRT Michael Moroney <moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com> - 2022-04-03 15:42 -0400
              Re: Annotated version of SRT Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2022-04-04 07:20 +0200
                Re: Annotated version of SRT nospam@de-ster.demon.nl (J. J. Lodder) - 2022-04-04 13:10 +0200
                Re: Annotated version of SRT Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2022-04-04 13:55 +0000
                Re: Annotated version of SRT Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2022-04-05 08:35 +0200
                Re: Annotated version of SRT nospam@de-ster.demon.nl (J. J. Lodder) - 2022-04-05 10:28 +0200
                Re: Annotated version of SRT Maciej Wozniak <maluwozniak@gmail.com> - 2022-04-05 03:15 -0700
                Re: Annotated version of SRT Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2022-04-06 08:01 +0200
                Re: Annotated version of SRT Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2022-04-05 14:56 +0000
                Re: Annotated version of SRT Michael Moroney <moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com> - 2022-04-05 14:03 -0400
                Re: Annotated version of SRT Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2022-04-05 18:06 +0000
                Re: Annotated version of SRT Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2022-04-07 07:48 +0200
                Re: Annotated version of SRT Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2022-04-07 13:25 +0000
                Re: Annotated version of SRT Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2022-04-08 07:59 +0200
                Re: Annotated version of SRT Mitch Yamaguchi <sdvw@aozrihai.wg> - 2022-04-07 19:23 +0000
                Re: Annotated version of SRT thor stoneman <consequently7990662@gmail.com> - 2022-04-07 14:10 -0700
                Re: Annotated version of SRT Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2022-04-08 07:56 +0200
                Re: Annotated version of SRT Michael Moroney <moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com> - 2022-04-05 13:58 -0400
                Re: Annotated version of SRT Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2022-04-06 08:22 +0200
                Re: Annotated version of SRT Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2022-04-07 07:45 +0200
                Re: Annotated version of SRT JanPB <filmart@gmail.com> - 2022-04-07 01:20 -0700
                Re: Annotated version of SRT Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2022-04-08 08:14 +0200
                Re: Annotated version of SRT JanPB <filmart@gmail.com> - 2022-04-07 23:47 -0700
                Re: Annotated version of SRT JanPB <filmart@gmail.com> - 2022-04-07 01:06 -0700
                Re: Annotated version of SRT Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2022-04-08 08:40 +0200
                Re: Annotated version of SRT JanPB <filmart@gmail.com> - 2022-04-07 23:56 -0700
                Re: Annotated version of SRT Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2022-04-08 20:50 +0200
                Re: Annotated version of SRT Michael Moroney <moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com> - 2022-04-08 19:05 -0400
                Re: Annotated version of SRT Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2022-04-09 08:08 +0200
                Re: Annotated version of SRT JanPB <filmart@gmail.com> - 2022-04-08 23:51 -0700
                Re: Annotated version of SRT Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2022-04-09 13:02 +0000
                Re: Annotated version of SRT Coke Hishikawa <uhva@blseummh.nm> - 2022-04-09 13:21 +0000
                Re: Annotated version of SRT Michael Moroney <moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com> - 2022-04-09 12:18 -0400
                Re: Annotated version of SRT Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2022-04-09 07:48 +0200
                Re: Annotated version of SRT Python <python@example.invalid> - 2022-04-09 14:36 +0200
                Re: Annotated version of SRT Maciej Wozniak <maluwozniak@gmail.com> - 2022-04-09 06:18 -0700
                Re: Annotated version of SRT Coke Hishikawa <uhva@blseummh.nm> - 2022-04-09 11:33 +0000
                Re: Annotated version of SRT JanPB <filmart@gmail.com> - 2022-04-09 13:08 -0700
                Re: Annotated version of SRT Michael Moroney <moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com> - 2022-04-04 21:02 -0400
            Re: Annotated version of SRT "Paul B. Andersen" <paul.b.andersen@paulba.no> - 2022-04-03 22:31 +0200
            Re: Annotated version of SRT nospam@de-ster.demon.nl (J. J. Lodder) - 2022-04-04 13:10 +0200

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