Groups > comp.lang.java.programmer > #11980

Re: Agile Project Management

Date	2012-02-12 07:08 -0800
From	Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org>
Newsgroups	comp.lang.java.programmer
Subject	Re: Agile Project Management
References	<b709e52d-16d6-43a8-ab89-7bcf11abf0e2@bs8g2000vbb.googlegroups.com> <8b9e9575-e454-4d1b-80aa-f89a4a39b511@t24g2000yqj.googlegroups.com> <4f36f42a$0$281$14726298@news.sunsite.dk> <92d0e832-6c70-4dc6-9c9f-71f588920d36@vv9g2000pbc.googlegroups.com> <4f37ca65$0$281$14726298@news.sunsite.dk>
Message-ID	<562dna94O9Z-SKrSnZ2dnUVZ_i2dnZ2d@earthlink.com> (permalink)

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Arne Vajhøj wrote:
> On 2/12/2012 1:43 AM, simplicity wrote:
>> On Feb 11, 4:05 pm, Arne Vajhøj<a...@vajhoej.dk>  wrote:
>>> On 2/10/2012 11:26 AM, simplicity wrote:
>>>> On Feb 8, 11:51 pm, Iqra Educational Portal
>>>> <iqraeducationalpor...@gmail.com>    wrote:
>>>>> Agile software development is an iterative, incremental approach to
>>>>> developing and releasing software. A range of agile methodologies have
>>>>> emerged and they are based frequent releases, ongoing testing,
>>>>> customer and stakeholder participation throughout the development
>>>>> process, co-ownership of code and pair-programming.
>>>>> iQRA’s Agile Exam will test your knowledge about Agile Development
>>>>> including XP, and SCRUM techniques in the light of Agile Manifesto
>>>
>>>>> http://iqra.org.pk/certification-startup.aspx?CertID=11&type=
>>>
>>>> Agile is garbage. Code before thinking.
>>>
>>>> All at the expense of quality but creates lots of "overhead" positions
>>>> for largely worthless project managers of all kinds.
>>>
>>> Most agile processes does not specify overhead positions
>>> and quite a few does not even include project managers.
>>>
>>> I think you have completely misunderstood agile.
>>
>> Misunderstood? I am judging from my personal experience. I was part of
>> agile development in 3 environments: small organization (<  40 people)
>> which was trying to implement it, mid-size and large - by large I mean
>>> 800 employees. Each was a failure in one aspect or another. And in
>> each, the common themes were (1) a blotted overhead, (2) questionable
>> quality, (3) lack of architectural consistency and (4) reoccuring
>> breaks of the old and often obscure features.
>>
>> Interesting that when I raised these issues (with examples) during one
>> of the internal seminars on agile, the presented, some "big kahoona"
>> consultant on agile, quickly diverted into a different topic
> 
> The fact that 3 agile projects had large overhead is not
> really an indication that large overhead is a given result
> of agile.

I've also seen non-Agile projects with large overhead.

That said, for an 800 person project I would want strong architectural
control to ensure clean interfaces. It is very easy for a program that
big to get out of control and become unmaintainable.

Patricia

Thread

Agile Project Management Iqra Educational Portal <iqraeducationalportal@gmail.com> - 2012-02-08 22:51 -0800
  Re: Agile Project Management Lionel <lionelv@none.com> - 2012-02-09 21:53 +1000
    Re: Agile Project Management markspace <-@.> - 2012-02-09 09:45 -0800
      Re: Agile Project Management Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2012-02-09 14:09 -0800
        Re: Agile Project Management Arved Sandstrom <asandstrom3minus1@eastlink.ca> - 2012-02-09 20:24 -0400
          Re: Agile Project Management Arne Vajhøj <arne@vajhoej.dk> - 2012-02-11 18:09 -0500
        Re: Agile Project Management Lew <lewbloch@gmail.com> - 2012-02-10 09:03 -0800
        Re: Agile Project Management Tom Anderson <twic@urchin.earth.li> - 2012-02-11 00:25 +0000
          Re: Agile Project Management Arved Sandstrom <asandstrom3minus1@eastlink.ca> - 2012-02-10 22:32 -0400
            Re: Agile Project Management Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2012-02-10 18:35 -0800
  Re: Agile Project Management Lew <lewbloch@gmail.com> - 2012-02-09 09:45 -0800
  Re: Agile Project Management simplicity <stella_pigeon@live.ca> - 2012-02-10 08:26 -0800
    Re: Agile Project Management Robert Klemme <shortcutter@googlemail.com> - 2012-02-10 23:28 +0100
      Re: Agile Project Management Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2012-02-10 15:40 -0800
        Re: Agile Project Management Lew <lewbloch@gmail.com> - 2012-02-10 16:22 -0800
          Re: Agile Project Management Leif Roar Moldskred <leifm@dimnakorr.com> - 2012-02-11 01:04 -0600
            Re: Agile Project Management Lew <lewbloch@gmail.com> - 2012-02-11 12:23 -0800
            Re: Agile Project Management eric@invalid.com (EricF) - 2012-02-12 05:17 +0000
          Re: Agile Project Management Robert Klemme <shortcutter@googlemail.com> - 2012-02-12 14:52 +0100
          Re: Agile Project Management Gene Wirchenko <genew@ocis.net> - 2012-02-13 11:33 -0800
    Re: Agile Project Management Arne Vajhøj <arne@vajhoej.dk> - 2012-02-11 18:05 -0500
      Re: Agile Project Management Martin Gregorie <martin@address-in-sig.invalid> - 2012-02-11 23:46 +0000
        Re: Agile Project Management Arne Vajhøj <arne@vajhoej.dk> - 2012-02-11 18:58 -0500
          Re: Agile Project Management Martin Gregorie <martin@address-in-sig.invalid> - 2012-02-12 15:46 +0000
            Re: Agile Project Management Arne Vajhøj <arne@vajhoej.dk> - 2012-02-12 10:58 -0500
      Re: Agile Project Management simplicity <stella_pigeon@live.ca> - 2012-02-11 22:43 -0800
        Re: Agile Project Management Arne Vajhøj <arne@vajhoej.dk> - 2012-02-12 09:19 -0500
          Re: Agile Project Management Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2012-02-12 07:08 -0800
            Re: Agile Project Management Arne Vajhøj <arne@vajhoej.dk> - 2012-02-12 11:11 -0500
            Re: Agile Project Management Arved Sandstrom <asandstrom3minus1@eastlink.ca> - 2012-02-12 12:12 -0400
              Re: Agile Project Management Lew <lewbloch@gmail.com> - 2012-02-12 09:00 -0800
                Re: Agile Project Management Arne Vajhøj <arne@vajhoej.dk> - 2012-02-12 12:06 -0500
                Re: Agile Project Management Arne Vajhøj <arne@vajhoej.dk> - 2012-02-12 13:13 -0500
                Re: Agile Project Management Lew <lewbloch@gmail.com> - 2012-02-12 12:55 -0800
                Re: Agile Project Management Arne Vajhøj <arne@vajhoej.dk> - 2012-02-12 16:29 -0500
                Re: Agile Project Management Arne Vajhøj <arne@vajhoej.dk> - 2012-02-12 16:35 -0500
                Re: Agile Project Management Lew <lewbloch@gmail.com> - 2012-02-12 17:04 -0800
                Re: Agile Project Management Arne Vajhøj <arne@vajhoej.dk> - 2012-02-16 21:28 -0500
                Re: Agile Project Management Lew <lewbloch@gmail.com> - 2012-02-17 02:15 -0800
          Re: Agile Project Management Arved Sandstrom <asandstrom3minus1@eastlink.ca> - 2012-02-12 11:43 -0400
            Re: Agile Project Management Arne Vajhøj <arne@vajhoej.dk> - 2012-02-12 11:03 -0500
              Re: Agile Project Management Arved Sandstrom <asandstrom3minus1@eastlink.ca> - 2012-02-12 13:25 -0400
                Re: Agile Project Management Arne Vajhøj <arne@vajhoej.dk> - 2012-02-12 13:34 -0500
            Re: Agile Project Management Leif Roar Moldskred <leifm@dimnakorr.com> - 2012-02-12 11:55 -0600
        Re: Agile Project Management eric@invalid.com (EricF) - 2012-02-13 04:38 +0000
          Re: Agile Project Management simplicity <stella_pigeon@live.ca> - 2012-02-14 08:04 -0800
            Re: Agile Project Management Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2012-02-14 08:50 -0800
              Re: Agile Project Management Leif Roar Moldskred <leifm@dimnakorr.com> - 2012-02-14 11:11 -0600
                Re: Agile Project Management Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2012-02-14 09:17 -0800
            Re: Agile Project Management Arne Vajhøj <arne@vajhoej.dk> - 2012-02-16 21:26 -0500

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