Groups > sci.physics.relativity > #364275

Re: SR is just another name for LET

From	wugi <brol@brol.be>
Newsgroups	sci.physics.relativity
Subject	Re: SR is just another name for LET
Date	2015-09-16 16:10 +0200
Organization	Aioe.org NNTP Server
Message-ID	<mtbtam$kb1$1@speranza.aioe.org> (permalink)
References	(5 earlier) <330a6ad2-a6e3-473e-91fd-c6f8063b6a53@googlegroups.com> <mt1f5d$ki2$1@speranza.aioe.org> <3b430d9a-2956-441e-8e16-3967f9024778@googlegroups.com> <mt9hqc$hbe$1@speranza.aioe.org> <6948c78d-9f61-440e-86f2-b1c5b0a202fa@googlegroups.com>

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rotchm schreef op 15/09/2015 om 20:46:
> On Tuesday, September 15, 2015 at 12:42:58 PM UTC-4, wugi wrote:
>> rotchm schreef op 12/09/2015 om 23:03:
>
>>> No. In SR, Length contraction and time dilation are 'obsevables'.
>>> SR says that if you *measure* the length it will be lessened by the
>>> gamma factor. Similar claim for clocks. The parameters x,x',t,t' etc
>>> in SR represent the result obtained by a measurement.
>>
>> Yes. And I even agree with Tom
>
> You better.
>
>> But I maintain that they do reflect the physical manifestation of an
>> object
>
> Perhaps, but irrelevant: What will that change for SR's predictions?
> Will such concerns change the LT's ?

No, but would you call the physical aspect behind coordinates 
irrelevant? And ditto for thinking about the limits of a theory?
Neither SRT nor GRT seem to have been concerned much with extended rigid 
(non-inertial) motion, confining themselves mostly to local/point matter 
acceleration. A pity meseems.

>> And, as already said, and commented in the Bell's spaceship thread:
>> one cannot and could not swap, or map, a 'non-moving' object instantly
>> on to an identical 'moving' object just passing by...
>
>>
>> -----O------------L---------
>> -----O---------L'-----L"---->

See for example a scheme of mine
http://home.scarlet.be/~pin12499/giffls/tiik7.htm
(acceleration by an extremity, internal reaction forces elsewhere, 
retarded by light velocity).
Or also this:
http://www.av8n.com/physics/hyperbolic-motion.htm
(advocating what I understood to be Born acceleration, ie 
well-synchronised through the rigid object)

>> Whereas with their Galilean counterparts this is instantly do-able :
>>
>> -----O------------L---------
>> -----O------------L--------->
>
> Galilean is doable mathematically but not practically; it does not permit
a way to measure. This is because there are no ways  to define 'time'
operationally. The only way is e-synch (and a few others) which is what 
SR uses.

It's doable anyway without bothering to measure, by making sure that at 
any moment the acceleration is constant throughout the object.

-- 
guido

Thread

SR is just another name for LET kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2015-09-06 09:18 -0700
  Re: SR is just another name for LET rotchm <rotchm@gmail.com> - 2015-09-06 09:26 -0700
    Re: SR is just another name for LET kefischer <emoneyjoe@iglou.com> - 2015-09-06 12:53 -0400
    Re: SR is just another name for LET kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2015-09-06 11:38 -0700
      Re: SR is just another name for LET rotchm <rotchm@gmail.com> - 2015-09-06 15:25 -0700
      Re: SR is just another name for LET "Dono," <sa_ge@comcast.net> - 2015-09-06 17:16 -0700
        Re: SR is just another name for LET kenseto <set...@att.net> - 2015-09-07 01:39 +0000
        Re: SR is just another name for LET moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com (Michael Moroney) - 2015-09-07 02:44 +0000
          Re: SR is just another name for LET rotchm <rotchm@gmail.com> - 2015-09-06 19:56 -0700
  Re: SR is just another name for LET alsor@interia.pl - 2015-09-06 10:00 -0700
    Re: SR is just another name for LET kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2015-09-06 11:50 -0700
      Re: SR is just another name for LET kefischer <emoneyjoe@iglou.com> - 2015-09-06 15:24 -0400
        Re: SR is just another name for LET kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2015-09-06 12:47 -0700
      Re: SR is just another name for LET alsor@interia.pl - 2015-09-06 13:25 -0700
  Re: SR is just another name for LET Tom Roberts <tjroberts137@sbcglobal.net> - 2015-09-06 18:33 -0500
    Re: SR is just another name for LET Mike Fontenot <mlfasf@comcast.net> - 2015-09-06 17:52 -0600
      Re: SR is just another name for LET kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2015-09-06 17:55 -0700
        Re: SR is just another name for LET alsor@interia.pl - 2015-09-06 18:47 -0700
      Re: SR is just another name for LET Tom Roberts <tjroberts137@sbcglobal.net> - 2015-09-06 22:19 -0500
        Re: SR is just another name for LET Mike Fontenot <mlfasf@comcast.net> - 2015-09-07 09:18 -0600
          Re: SR is just another name for LET rotchm <rotchm@gmail.com> - 2015-09-07 08:39 -0700
            Re: SR is just another name for LET Mike Fontenot <mlfasf@comcast.net> - 2015-09-07 10:05 -0600
              Re: SR is just another name for LET rotchm <rotchm@gmail.com> - 2015-09-07 09:34 -0700
                Pretender Stephane Baune strikes again. "Dono," <sa_ge@comcast.net> - 2015-09-07 12:10 -0700
              Re: SR is just another name for LET Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2015-09-07 21:48 +0200
            Re: SR is just another name for LET kefischer <emoneyjoe@iglou.com> - 2015-09-07 12:37 -0400
              Re: SR is just another name for LET rotchm <rotchm@gmail.com> - 2015-09-07 09:53 -0700
                Re: SR is just another name for LET kefischer <emoneyjoe@iglou.com> - 2015-09-07 13:13 -0400
                Re: SR is just another name for LET rotchm <rotchm@gmail.com> - 2015-09-07 10:24 -0700
                Re: SR is just another name for LET kefischer <emoneyjoe@iglou.com> - 2015-09-07 14:42 -0400
                Re: SR is just another name for LET rotchm <rotchm@gmail.com> - 2015-09-07 13:06 -0700
                Re: SR is just another name for LET kefischer <emoneyjoe@iglou.com> - 2015-09-07 16:50 -0400
                Re: SR is just another name for LET rotchm <rotchm@gmail.com> - 2015-09-07 14:23 -0700
            Re: SR is just another name for LET wugi <brol@brol.be> - 2015-09-12 17:07 +0200
              Re: SR is just another name for LET Tom Roberts <tjroberts137@sbcglobal.net> - 2015-09-12 14:08 -0500
                Re: SR is just another name for LET Frances Espinosa <franesp@portio.org> - 2015-09-12 20:07 +0000
                Re: SR is just another name for LET JanPB <filmart@gmail.com> - 2015-09-12 13:50 -0700
                Re: SR is just another name for LET Frances Espinosa <franesp@portio.org> - 2015-09-12 21:25 +0000
                Re: SR is just another name for LET Maciej Woźniak <mlwozniak@wp.pl> - 2015-09-13 10:21 +0200
                Re: SR is just another name for LET Tom Roberts <tjroberts137@sbcglobal.net> - 2015-09-12 19:45 -0500
                Re: SR is just another name for LET kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2015-09-13 06:00 -0700
                Re: SR is just another name for LET Tom Roberts <tjroberts137@sbcglobal.net> - 2015-09-13 09:14 -0500
                Re: SR is just another name for LET kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2015-09-13 09:12 -0700
                Re: SR is just another name for LET kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2015-09-13 16:34 -0700
                Re: SR is just another name for LET Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2015-09-14 12:50 -0500
                Re: SR is just another name for LET Tom Roberts <tjroberts137@sbcglobal.net> - 2015-09-14 16:20 -0500
                Re: SR is just another name for LET Maciej Woźniak <mlwozniak@wp.pl> - 2015-09-14 23:26 +0200
                Re: SR is just another name for LET Frances Espinosa <franesp@portio.org> - 2015-09-14 22:36 +0000
                Re: SR is just another name for LET kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2015-09-15 07:01 -0700
                Re: SR is just another name for LET Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2015-09-15 09:11 -0500
                Re: SR is just another name for LET kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2015-09-15 08:00 -0700
                Re: SR is just another name for LET Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2015-09-15 10:15 -0500
                Re: SR is just another name for LET kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2015-09-15 13:40 -0700
                Re: SR is just another name for LET Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2015-09-15 16:21 -0500
                Re: SR is just another name for LET kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2015-09-16 06:28 -0700
                Re: SR is just another name for LET Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2015-09-16 11:15 -0500
                Re: SR is just another name for LET rotchm <rotchm@gmail.com> - 2015-09-16 11:36 -0700
                Re: SR is just another name for LET kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2015-09-16 16:22 -0700
                Re: SR is just another name for LET Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2015-09-16 19:03 -0500
                Re: SR is just another name for LET kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2015-09-17 08:18 -0700
                Re: SR is just another name for LET Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2015-09-17 10:32 -0500
                Re: SR is just another name for LET kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2015-09-17 08:43 -0700
                Re: SR is just another name for LET Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2015-09-17 12:16 -0500
                Re: SR is just another name for LET rotchm <rotchm@gmail.com> - 2015-09-16 19:04 -0700
                Re: SR is just another name for LET kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2015-09-17 08:20 -0700
                Re: SR is just another name for LET alsor@interia.pl - 2015-09-17 07:09 -0700
                Re: SR is just another name for LET kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2015-09-16 16:21 -0700
                Re: SR is just another name for LET rotchm <rotchm@gmail.com> - 2015-09-15 08:30 -0700
                Re: SR is just another name for LET alsor@interia.pl - 2015-09-15 14:43 -0700
                Re: SR is just another name for LET kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2015-09-15 06:51 -0700
                Re: SR is just another name for LET Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2015-09-15 09:10 -0500
                Re: SR is just another name for LET Maciej Woźniak <mlwozniak@wp.pl> - 2015-09-13 20:49 +0200
                Re: SR is just another name for LET Koobee Wublee <koobee.wublee@gmail.com> - 2015-09-14 00:20 -0700
                Re: SR is just another name for LET Frances Espinosa <franesp@portio.org> - 2015-09-13 14:37 +0000
                Re: SR is just another name for LET alsor@interia.pl - 2015-09-13 11:17 -0700
                Re: SR is just another name for LET wugi <brol@brol.be> - 2015-09-13 21:15 +0200
                Re: SR is just another name for LET Tom Roberts <tjroberts137@sbcglobal.net> - 2015-09-13 15:46 -0500
                Re: SR is just another name for LET alsor@interia.pl - 2015-09-14 09:17 -0700
                Re: SR is just another name for LET Koobee Wublee <koobee.wublee@gmail.com> - 2015-09-14 00:16 -0700
                Re: SR is just another name for LET kefischer <emoneyjoe@iglou.com> - 2015-09-14 03:53 -0400
                Re: SR is just another name for LET kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2015-09-14 07:15 -0700
                Re: SR is just another name for LET kefischer <emoneyjoe@iglou.com> - 2015-09-14 11:12 -0400
                Re: SR is just another name for LET kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2015-09-14 10:18 -0700
                Re: SR is just another name for LET kefischer <emoneyjoe@iglou.com> - 2015-09-14 16:37 -0400
                Re: SR is just another name for LET Tom Roberts <tjroberts137@sbcglobal.net> - 2015-09-14 12:55 -0500
                Re: SR is just another name for LET alsor@interia.pl - 2015-09-14 11:13 -0700
                Re: SR is just another name for LET Maciej Woźniak <mlwozniak@wp.pl> - 2015-09-14 22:08 +0200
                Re: SR is just another name for LET Koobee Wublee <koobee.wublee@gmail.com> - 2015-09-14 23:25 -0700
              Re: SR is just another name for LET rotchm <rotchm@gmail.com> - 2015-09-12 14:03 -0700
                Re: SR is just another name for LET wugi <brol@brol.be> - 2015-09-15 18:42 +0200
                Re: SR is just another name for LET rotchm <rotchm@gmail.com> - 2015-09-15 11:46 -0700
                Re: SR is just another name for LET wugi <brol@brol.be> - 2015-09-16 16:10 +0200
                Re: SR is just another name for LET rotchm <rotchm@gmail.com> - 2015-09-16 08:15 -0700
          Re: SR is just another name for LET kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2015-09-07 10:38 -0700
            Re: SR is just another name for LET rotchm <rotchm@gmail.com> - 2015-09-07 12:55 -0700
          Re: SR is just another name for LET Tom Roberts <tjroberts137@sbcglobal.net> - 2015-09-08 10:23 -0500
            Re: SR is just another name for LET rotchm <rotchm@gmail.com> - 2015-09-08 09:29 -0700
            Re: SR is just another name for LET Mike Fontenot <mlfasf@comcast.net> - 2015-09-08 10:44 -0600
              Re: SR is just another name for LET rotchm <rotchm@gmail.com> - 2015-09-08 10:11 -0700
                Stephane Baune poser strikes again "Dono," <sa_ge@comcast.net> - 2015-09-08 11:30 -0700
                Re: SR is just another name for LET Mike Fontenot <mlfasf@comcast.net> - 2015-09-08 12:50 -0600
                Re: SR is just another name for LET rotchm <rotchm@gmail.com> - 2015-09-08 12:23 -0700
                Re: SR is just another name for LET Mike Fontenot <mlfasf@comcast.net> - 2015-09-08 13:46 -0600
                Re: SR is just another name for LET rotchm <rotchm@gmail.com> - 2015-09-08 13:02 -0700
                Re: SR is just another name for LET Mike Fontenot <mlfasf@comcast.net> - 2015-09-08 15:27 -0600
                Re: SR is just another name for LET Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2015-09-09 09:10 -0500
                Re: SR is just another name for LET alsor@interia.pl - 2015-09-09 08:05 -0700
                Re: SR is just another name for LET Tom Roberts <tjroberts137@sbcglobal.net> - 2015-09-10 23:52 -0500
                Re: SR is just another name for LET alsor@interia.pl - 2015-09-11 08:33 -0700
                Re: SR is just another name for LET Tom Roberts <tjroberts137@sbcglobal.net> - 2015-09-11 13:53 -0500
                Re: SR is just another name for LET alsor@interia.pl - 2015-09-11 14:11 -0700
                Re: SR is just another name for LET Tom Roberts <tjroberts137@sbcglobal.net> - 2015-09-10 23:50 -0500
                Re: SR is just another name for LET Mike Fontenot <mlfasf@comcast.net> - 2015-09-11 11:02 -0600
                Re: SR is just another name for LET alsor@interia.pl - 2015-09-08 13:26 -0700
                Re: SR is just another name for LET Tom Roberts <tjroberts137@sbcglobal.net> - 2015-09-10 23:39 -0500
                Re: SR is just another name for LET JanPB <filmart@gmail.com> - 2015-09-10 23:00 -0700
              Re: SR is just another name for LET Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2015-09-08 20:47 +0200
                Re: SR is just another name for LET Tom Roberts <tjroberts137@sbcglobal.net> - 2015-09-08 14:23 -0500
                Re: SR is just another name for LET Mike Fontenot <mlfasf@comcast.net> - 2015-09-08 15:36 -0600
          Re: SR is just another name for LET Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2015-09-08 13:55 -0500
        Re: SR is just another name for LET alsor@interia.pl - 2015-09-07 10:58 -0700
          Re: SR is just another name for LET kefischer <emoneyjoe@iglou.com> - 2015-09-07 14:56 -0400
            Re: SR is just another name for LET alsor@interia.pl - 2015-09-07 12:29 -0700
              Re: SR is just another name for LET kefischer <emoneyjoe@iglou.com> - 2015-09-07 16:39 -0400
                Re: SR is just another name for LET alsor@interia.pl - 2015-09-08 10:05 -0700
    Re: SR is just another name for LET kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2015-09-06 17:35 -0700
      Re: SR is just another name for LET Tom Roberts <tjroberts137@sbcglobal.net> - 2015-09-06 22:22 -0500
        Re: SR is just another name for LET kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2015-09-07 06:21 -0700
          Re: SR is just another name for LET kefischer <emoneyjoe@iglou.com> - 2015-09-07 09:35 -0400
            Re: SR is just another name for LET rotchm <rotchm@gmail.com> - 2015-09-07 06:42 -0700
          Re: SR is just another name for LET Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2015-09-08 13:38 -0500
          Re: SR is just another name for LET Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2015-09-08 13:39 -0500
            Re: SR is just another name for LET kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2015-09-09 08:36 -0700
              Re: SR is just another name for LET Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2015-09-09 10:50 -0500
                Re: SR is just another name for LET kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2015-09-09 20:23 -0700
                Re: SR is just another name for LET rotchm <rotchm@gmail.com> - 2015-09-09 20:30 -0700
                Re: SR is just another name for LET Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2015-09-10 08:01 -0500
                Re: SR is just another name for LET kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2015-09-11 09:53 -0700
                Re: SR is just another name for LET Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2015-09-11 12:07 -0500
                Re: SR is just another name for LET rotchm <rotchm@gmail.com> - 2015-09-11 10:54 -0700
                Re: SR is just another name for LET kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2015-09-11 14:24 -0700
                Re: SR is just another name for LET alsor@interia.pl - 2015-09-11 14:48 -0700
                Re: SR is just another name for LET Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2015-09-11 16:48 -0500
                Re: SR is just another name for LET kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2015-09-12 06:10 -0700
                Re: SR is just another name for LET Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2015-09-13 22:13 -0500
                Re: SR is just another name for LET rotchm <rotchm@gmail.com> - 2015-09-11 10:45 -0700
      Re: SR is just another name for LET Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2015-09-08 13:35 -0500
        Re: SR is just another name for LET kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2015-09-09 08:41 -0700
  SR is just another name for LET fuller.david@hotmail.com - 2015-09-16 06:50 -0700
    Re: SR is just another name for LET kefischer <emoneyjoe@iglou.com> - 2015-09-16 10:59 -0400
      Re: SR is just another name for LET fuller.david@hotmail.com - 2015-09-16 11:24 -0700

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