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Re: Why Johnny can?t code

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In article <c6rcv2F5ve4U1@mid.individual.net>,
Huge  <usenet@huge.org.uk> wrote:
>On 2014-09-02, Rich <rich@example.invalid> wrote:
>> Tim Streater <timstreater@greenbee.net> wrote:
>>> In article <jCWo060GWCUx8svQg454q6sz@dont-email.me>, Rich
>>> <rich@example.invalid> wrote:
>>
>>> > http://www.salon.com/2006/09/14/basic_2/
>>> > 
>>> >    For three years - ever since my son Ben was in fifth grade - he and I
>>> >    have engaged in a quixotic but determined quest: We've searched for a
>>> >    simple and straightforward way to get the introductory programming
>>> >    language BASIC to run on either my Mac or my PC.
>>
>>> Open a Terminal window on your Mac and type:
>>
>>>   PHP -a
>>
>>> at the prompt. You can then enter PHP statements, a good way to get
>>> started as PHP is a simple enough language.
>>
>>> BASIC is rubbish: AVOID.
>>
>> Some of us classify PHP into that rubbish bin as well.
>
>Hear, hear.

I learned with BASIC. Many many others in the late 70's and early 80's
did the same. I even (relatively) recently wrote my own interpertation
of a BASIC interpreter - just because I wanted to.

I have also written thousands and thousands of lines of PHP.

And C and a fair few C++ - even some FORTRAN and Pascal, although that
was never in a working environment..

What I have found and seen over the years is that it's more about the
attitude and abilities of the teacher than the actual programming
language that's important for people learning to write programs -
and I think I got lucky - although I started on BASIC at school in
'78, my teachers were good enough to discourage spagetti code - GOTO,
etc. were unavoidable then, but with comments and putting subroutines
into well defiend blocks it made something slightly more readable, when
when I moved to other languages those lessons did we well.

Modern BASICs are a far-cry from the 8-bit versions I started on -
structured syntax, no line-numbers, named procedures, recursion and so on,
and I do think being introduced to it as a text-based language (after 
the now compulsory Scratch in the UK primary schools) is a good and
gentle step before taking the plunge into C/Python/Ruby/Java/etc.

What I've also noticed is that young peopel respond much better to
something physical happening than the boring number crunching I started
with - light up an LED rather than calculate compund interest. Then
there's (turtle) graphics. Much fun to be had there too!

-Gordon

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Thread

Why Johnny can?t code Rich <rich@example.invalid> - 2014-09-02 10:02 +0000
  Re: Why Johnny can?t code Tim Streater <timstreater@greenbee.net> - 2014-09-02 12:23 +0100
    Re: Why Johnny can?t code Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2014-09-02 14:43 +0100
      Re: Why Johnny can?t code Paul Sture <nospam@sture.ch> - 2014-09-02 16:40 +0200
        Re: Why Johnny can?t code Sylvia Else <sylvia@not.at.this.address> - 2014-09-03 12:43 +1000
      Re: Why Johnny can?t code scott@alfter.diespammersdie.us (Scott Alfter) - 2014-09-02 15:17 +0000
        Re: Why Johnny can?t code RS Wood <rsw@therandymon.com> - 2014-09-02 18:24 +0000
          Re: Why Johnny can?t code Rich <rich@example.invalid> - 2014-09-02 21:01 +0000
          Re: Why Johnny can?t code greymaus <greymausg@mail.com> - 2014-09-03 14:55 +0000
            Re: Why Johnny can?t code Tim Streater <timstreater@greenbee.net> - 2014-09-03 18:04 +0100
            Re: Why Johnny can?t code Michael Black <et472@ncf.ca> - 2014-09-03 14:38 -0400
              Re: Why Johnny can?t code Rich <rich@example.invalid> - 2014-09-03 19:55 +0000
                Re: Why Johnny can?t code Michael Black <et472@ncf.ca> - 2014-09-03 17:33 -0400
                Re: Why Johnny can?t code Rich <rich@example.invalid> - 2014-09-03 21:35 +0000
                Re: Why Johnny can?t code scott@alfter.diespammersdie.us (Scott Alfter) - 2014-09-04 15:24 +0000
                Re: Why Johnny can?t code Rich <rich@example.invalid> - 2014-09-04 20:17 +0000
        Re: Why Johnny can?t code Rich <rich@example.invalid> - 2014-09-02 18:56 +0000
        Re: Why Johnny can?t code Paul Sture <nospam@sture.ch> - 2014-09-03 20:59 +0200
      Re: Why Johnny can?t code Rich <rich@example.invalid> - 2014-09-02 18:45 +0000
        Re: Why Johnny can?t code Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2014-09-02 20:50 +0100
          Re: Why Johnny can?t code Paul Sture <nospam@sture.ch> - 2014-09-03 21:05 +0200
    Re: Why Johnny can?t code Paul Sture <nospam@sture.ch> - 2014-09-02 16:56 +0200
      Re: Why Johnny can?t code Tim Streater <timstreater@greenbee.net> - 2014-09-02 16:09 +0100
    Re: Why Johnny can?t code Huge <Huge@nowhere.much.invalid> - 2014-09-04 14:57 +0000
      Re: Why Johnny can?t code Gordon Henderson <gordon+usenet@drogon.net> - 2014-09-04 15:24 +0000
        Re: Why Johnny can't code Mike Spencer <mds@bogus.nodomain.nowhere> - 2014-09-05 02:33 -0300
  Re: Why Johnny can?t code Will Honea <whonea@whonea.net> - 2014-09-02 14:08 -0600
    Re: Why Johnny can?t code Rich <rich@example.invalid> - 2014-09-02 20:55 +0000
    Re: Why Johnny can?t code Bob Eager <news0002@eager.cx> - 2014-09-02 21:02 +0000
      Re: Why Johnny can?t code Will Honea <whonea@whonea.net> - 2014-09-02 23:07 -0600
        Re: Why Johnny can?t code Bob Eager <news0002@eager.cx> - 2014-09-04 10:58 +0000
          Re: Why Johnny can?t code Rich <rich@example.invalid> - 2014-09-04 11:09 +0000
            Re: Why Johnny can?t code Bob Eager <news0002@eager.cx> - 2014-09-04 11:17 +0000
              Re: Why Johnny can?t code Will Honea <whonea@whonea.net> - 2014-09-04 22:58 -0600
                Re: Why Johnny can?t code Bob Eager <news0002@eager.cx> - 2014-09-05 11:38 +0000
                Re: Why Johnny can?t code Will Honea <whonea@whonea.net> - 2014-09-05 13:55 -0600
                Re: Why Johnny can?t code Bob Eager <news0002@eager.cx> - 2014-09-05 20:02 +0000
          Re: Why Johnny can?t code Marko Rauhamaa <marko@pacujo.net> - 2014-09-04 14:28 +0300
          Re: Why Johnny can?t code RJH <patchmoney@gmx.com> - 2014-09-04 20:27 +0100
            Re: Why Johnny can?t code Bob Eager <news0002@eager.cx> - 2014-09-04 19:55 +0000
              Re: Why Johnny can?t code Will Honea <whonea@whonea.net> - 2014-09-04 22:50 -0600
                Re: Why Johnny can?t code Bob Eager <news0002@eager.cx> - 2014-09-05 11:37 +0000
                Re: Why Johnny can?t code Tim Streater <timstreater@greenbee.net> - 2014-09-05 13:05 +0100
                Re: Why Johnny can?t code Bob Eager <news0002@eager.cx> - 2014-09-05 15:22 +0000
                Re: Why Johnny can?t code Will Honea <whonea@whonea.net> - 2014-09-05 13:48 -0600
                Re: Why Johnny can?t code Bob Eager <news0002@eager.cx> - 2014-09-05 20:09 +0000
  Re: Why Johnny can?t code Sylvia Else <sylvia@not.at.this.address> - 2014-09-03 12:26 +1000
  Re: Why Johnny can?t code Bruce Horrocks <07.013@scorecrow.com> - 2014-09-04 00:34 +0100
  Re: Why Johnny can?t code Huge <Huge@nowhere.much.invalid> - 2014-09-04 15:01 +0000

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