Groups > sci.physics.relativity > #644774

Re: New version of my annotations to SRT

From	Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de>
Newsgroups	sci.physics.relativity
Subject	Re: New version of my annotations to SRT
Date	2024-02-15 06:58 +0100
Message-ID	<l35n6mFtaejU1@mid.individual.net> (permalink)
References	(9 earlier) <l2rjtaF3nv3U1@mid.individual.net> <l30h62F1bj2U1@mid.individual.net> <asKyN.8433176$ee1.2101575@fx16.ams4> <l337g9Fg6jcU1@mid.individual.net> <uqitvj$2odni$1@dont-email.me>

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Am 14.02.2024 um 18:41 schrieb Python:
> Thomas Heger wrote:
> [snip]
>> But even if there where a gigantic watch (maintained by the
>> Man-in-the-Moon), that clock would show Moon-time in Moon-time-units.
>>
>> That watch would be very hard to interpret, because it is certainly
>> not synchronized with the birth of Christ and will most likely use
>> different units.
>>
>> But supposed we could actually read the values, we certainly would not
>> want to subtract such values from an Earth-based time-values.
>>
>> Therefore, the value t_B MUST be based on Earth-time and measured in
>> Earth-time-units.
> [snip]
>> A clock on the Moon cannot show t_B, because the man-in-the-Moon is
>> not baptised and the birth of Christ unknown there.
>
> *facepalm* Is there any limit to your craziness? This is
> not even remotely related to anything Einstein wrote.
>
> Clock A and B are clocks involved in a physic apparatus
> it is absolutely stupid to assume that clock B would be
> operated by unknown aliens on Alpha Centaury (as you
> ever did) or the Moon, with unknowns units or origins.

If you try to communicate over cosmological distances and attempt to 
synchronize clocks at both ends, you could certainly face the problem, 
that at the other end of such communications are 'aliens'.

Actually all other assumptions are rather strange and in my view far 
stranger than the assumption of aliens.

But WHO sits at the far end of a long distance communication is patently 
irrelevant in the context of SRT, anyhow.

SRT uses a certain 'backdrop', which is a starless void without gravity.

Through this dark space spaceships drift 'inertially'.

This not really real, but a possible assumption for 'thought experiments'.

If so, you could also assume aliens (at not additional cost).

But if you prefer Earth-based aliens, you could also assume, that all 
spaceships mentioned are owned by NASA and have all exactly similar 
clocks onboard of their ships.

But in any case:

you need to make measurements of the delay, if you like to synchronize 
clocks.

(In case of alien aliens, you need to negotiate time units, too.)

This is easy, if both ships involved would not move in respect to each 
other.

In this case (and only in this case !) Einstein's equation is true and 
you could cut the two-way travel in half and get time t_B by deviding 
t'_A-t_A by two.

The problem is here, that t'_A is later than t_B, hence the aliens at 
the far end cannot possibly know it. Therefore, YOU need to calculate 
t_B and send a signal with a coded time value back to B.

This signal (the one from here at A to point B with the time-value t_B), 
needs to be corrected by subtracting the delay from t_B and coding the 
result into the signal.

That is another reason why you should know the delay.

But Einstein didn't even mention the delay-problem with a single word.

TH

...

Thread

Re: New version of my annotations to SRT Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2024-02-11 11:00 +0100
  Re: New version of my annotations to SRT Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2024-02-13 07:44 +0100
    Re: New version of my annotations to SRT "Paul B. Andersen" <relativity@paulba.no> - 2024-02-13 14:50 +0100
      Re: New version of my annotations to SRT Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2024-02-14 08:17 +0100
        Re: New version of my annotations to SRT "Paul B. Andersen" <relativity@paulba.no> - 2024-02-14 11:05 +0100
        Re: New version of my annotations to SRT Mikko <mikko.levanto@iki.fi> - 2024-02-14 19:05 +0200
        Re: New version of my annotations to SRT Python <python@invalid.org> - 2024-02-14 18:41 +0100
          Re: New version of my annotations to SRT Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2024-02-15 06:58 +0100
            Re: New version of my annotations to SRT Volney <volney@invalid.invalid> - 2024-02-15 01:21 -0500
              Re: New version of my annotations to SRT mlwozniak@wp.pl (MaciejWozniak) - 2024-02-15 11:19 +0000
                Re: New version of my annotations to SRT Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2024-02-16 06:56 +0100
                Re: New version of my annotations to SRT Volney <volney@invalid.invalid> - 2024-02-16 13:50 -0500
                Re: New version of my annotations to SRT Josey Forakis Stamatelos <ks@osfisek.gr> - 2024-02-16 20:19 +0000
                Re: New version of my annotations to SRT Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2024-02-17 10:28 +0100
        Re: New version of my annotations to SRT Volney <volney@invalid.invalid> - 2024-02-14 13:47 -0500
          Re: New version of my annotations to SRT Volney <volney@invalid.invalid> - 2024-02-14 13:59 -0500
            Re: New version of my annotations to SRT Richard Hachel <pourquoi-pas@tiscali.fr> - 2024-02-14 19:12 +0000
            Re: New version of my annotations to SRT mlwozniak@wp.pl (MaciejWozniak) - 2024-02-15 06:16 +0000
  Re: New version of my annotations to SRT "Paul B. Andersen" <relativity@paulba.no> - 2024-02-13 13:40 +0100
    Re: New version of my annotations to SRT Python <python@invalid.org> - 2024-02-13 18:18 +0100
      Re: New version of my annotations to SRT Richard Hachel <pourquoi-pas@tiscali.fr> - 2024-02-14 01:46 +0000
        Re: New version of my annotations to SRT Python <python@invalid.org> - 2024-02-14 18:12 +0100
          Re: New version of my annotations to SRT Richard Hachel <pourquoi-pas@tiscali.fr> - 2024-02-14 18:59 +0000
            Re: New version of my annotations to SRT Python <python@invalid.org> - 2024-02-14 20:07 +0100
              Re: New version of my annotations to SRT Python <python@invalid.org> - 2024-02-14 20:09 +0100
              Re: New version of my annotations to SRT Richard Hachel <pourquoi-pas@tiscali.fr> - 2024-02-14 19:21 +0000
                Re: New version of my annotations to SRT Python <python@invalid.org> - 2024-02-14 20:26 +0100
                Re: New version of my annotations to SRT Richard Hachel <pourquoi-pas@tiscali.fr> - 2024-02-14 20:23 +0000
                Re: New version of my annotations to SRT Python <python@invalid.org> - 2024-02-14 21:26 +0100
  Re: New version of my annotations to SRT film.art@gmail.com (JanPB) - 2024-02-13 16:25 +0000
    Re: New version of my annotations to SRT Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2024-02-14 08:34 +0100
      Re: New version of my annotations to SRT "Paul B. Andersen" <relativity@paulba.no> - 2024-02-14 21:28 +0100
        Re: New version of my annotations to SRT Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2024-02-15 07:10 +0100
          Re: New version of my annotations to SRT "Paul B. Andersen" <relativity@paulba.no> - 2024-02-15 11:32 +0100
            Re: New version of my annotations to SRT Athel Cornish-Bowden <me@yahoo.com> - 2024-02-15 19:04 +0100
            Re: New version of my annotations to SRT Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2024-02-16 07:20 +0100
              Re: New version of my annotations to SRT "Paul B. Andersen" <relativity@paulba.no> - 2024-02-16 09:43 +0100
              Re: New version of my annotations to SRT Athel Cornish-Bowden <me@yahoo.com> - 2024-02-16 09:46 +0100
                Re: New version of my annotations to SRT Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2024-02-17 10:36 +0100
                Re: New version of my annotations to SRT Mikko <mikko.levanto@iki.fi> - 2024-02-17 12:47 +0200
                Re: New version of my annotations to SRT Python <python@invalid.org> - 2024-02-17 14:33 +0100
                Re: New version of my annotations to SRT Mikko <mikko.levanto@iki.fi> - 2024-02-17 16:40 +0200
                Re: New version of my annotations to SRT Athel Cornish-Bowden <me@yahoo.com> - 2024-02-17 15:55 +0100
                Re: New version of my annotations to SRT Python <python@invalid.org> - 2024-02-17 17:16 +0100
                Re: New version of my annotations to SRT Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2024-02-18 06:48 +0100
                Re: New version of my annotations to SRT Athel Cornish-Bowden <me@yahoo.com> - 2024-02-18 10:21 +0100
                Re: New version of my annotations to SRT Mikko <mikko.levanto@iki.fi> - 2024-02-18 13:00 +0200
                Re: New version of my annotations to SRT mlwozniak@wp.pl (MaciejWozniak) - 2024-02-17 15:13 +0000
                Re: New version of my annotations to SRT Python <python@invalid.org> - 2024-02-17 17:15 +0100
                Re: New version of my annotations to SRT mlwozniak@wp.pl (MaciejWozniak) - 2024-02-17 17:17 +0000
                Re: New version of my annotations to SRT Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2024-02-18 06:25 +0100
                Re: New version of my annotations to SRT Mikko <mikko.levanto@iki.fi> - 2024-02-18 13:05 +0200
                Re: New version of my annotations to SRT Python <python@invalid.org> - 2024-02-18 12:56 +0100
                Re: New version of my annotations to SRT "Paul B. Andersen" <relativity@paulba.no> - 2024-02-18 22:05 +0100
                Re: New version of my annotations to SRT mlwozniak@wp.pl (MaciejWozniak) - 2024-02-18 21:36 +0000
                Re: New version of my annotations to SRT Python <python@invalid.org> - 2024-02-18 22:59 +0100
                Re: New version of my annotations to SRT Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2024-02-18 05:47 +0100
                Re: New version of my annotations to SRT Volney <volney@invalid.invalid> - 2024-02-18 01:07 -0500
                Re: New version of my annotations to SRT mlwozniak@wp.pl (MaciejWozniak) - 2024-02-18 08:15 +0000
                Re: New version of my annotations to SRT Preston Voß von Grimmelshausen <rsqt@osonevnpv.de> - 2024-02-18 12:35 +0000
                Re: New version of my annotations to SRT Mikko <mikko.levanto@iki.fi> - 2024-02-18 13:08 +0200
                Re: New version of my annotations to SRT Royal Iñíguez Ortega <ygerr@oratoytra.es> - 2024-02-18 12:10 +0000
                Re: New version of my annotations to SRT "Paul B. Andersen" <relativity@paulba.no> - 2024-02-18 13:28 +0100
                Re: New version of my annotations to SRT Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2024-02-19 06:56 +0100
                Re: New version of my annotations to SRT Mikko <mikko.levanto@iki.fi> - 2024-02-19 11:35 +0200
                Re: New version of my annotations to SRT "Paul B. Andersen" <relativity@paulba.no> - 2024-02-19 21:47 +0100
                Re: New version of my annotations to SRT Cheng Huang Zhong <sksn@nnoghz.cn> - 2024-02-19 21:59 +0000
                Re: New version of my annotations to SRT Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2024-02-20 09:01 +0100
                Re: New version of my annotations to SRT Volney <volney@invalid.invalid> - 2024-02-18 11:30 -0500
                Re: New version of my annotations to SRT Wilbert Oláh Barabás <rfbml@otrb.hu> - 2024-02-18 19:39 +0000
                Re: New version of my annotations to SRT Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2024-02-19 07:02 +0100
                Re: New version of my annotations to SRT Volney <volney@invalid.invalid> - 2024-02-19 13:31 -0500
                Re: New version of my annotations to SRT Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2024-02-20 09:11 +0100
                Re: New version of my annotations to SRT Mikko <mikko.levanto@iki.fi> - 2024-02-21 11:52 +0200
              Re: New version of my annotations to SRT Mikko <mikko.levanto@iki.fi> - 2024-02-16 11:53 +0200
              Re: New version of my annotations to SRT "Paul B. Andersen" <relativity@paulba.no> - 2024-02-16 13:59 +0100
    Re: New version of my annotations to SRT Maciej Wozniak <maluwozniak@gmail.com> - 2024-02-14 00:11 -0800

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