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Re: Can a Machine become self-aware?

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Jan Panteltje wrote:
> 
> >Jan Panteltje wrote:
> >>
> >> >Jan Panteltje wrote:
> >> >>
> >> >> >anthk <anthk@openbsd.home> wrote or quoted:
> >> >> >>On 2025-06-14, The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> wrote:
> >> >> >>>Can a Machine become self-aware?
> >> >> >>We are part of the universe, and we are self-aware.
> >> >> >
> >> >> >  Self-wareness is an experience that depends on being the
> >> >> >  entity that experiences it, so it cannot be observed from
> >> >> >  the outside and therefore also not be expressed in words.
> >> >> >
> >> >> >  If you are self-aware, you probably know that you are self-
> >> >> >  aware, but you cannot know for sure whether something else
> >> >> >  is self-aware.
> >> >>
> >> >> Keep it simple.
> >> >> In all the 'neurons' or nerve cells, some monitor what other cells do as system to keep life moving.
> >> >> Its purpose is likely communication.
> >> >>
> >> >> When a new born baby is hungry, or feels pain it will scream.
> >> >> The monitor cells issue a trigger to the voice.
> >> >> Almost the same as the reaction to pain reflex when you burn your finger etc.
> >> >> Those monitoring calls are the 'I' as in 'I am'.
> >> >> We TEACH the kinds who they are, YOU are 'Peter'
> >> >> and the monitoring system then repeats ,
> >> >> this 'knowledge' ever grows (memory).
> >> >> IIRC it is build mostly in the frontal cortex, part of our 'world view'.
> >> >> You can make it 'learn' with a few lines of code in the sunscreen example I gave.
> >> >> Voice (word) recognition libraries plenty for for example Linux.
> >> >> After telling it his name is 'Peter' ask it who it is.
> >> >> Who are you?
> >> >> I am peter .
> >> >>
> >> >> Add a bit more stuff and it will fool many here :-)
> >> >>
> >> >> But basically it is just a monitoring circuit for the cells.
> >> >> Add a camera, object recognition..
> >> >> Ask Peter 'Who am I?'
> >> >> The answer will be  you name.
> >> >>
> >> >> Who are you?
> >> >>  I am Peter.
> >> >> Peter How's you battery level?
> >> >>  20% and falling.
> >> >>   I need  recharge
> >> >>
> >> >> beep
> >> >
> >> >Monkies
> >> >gorrilas
> >> >chimpanzees
> >> >dogs
> >> >cats
> >> >elephants
> >> >ants
> >> >insects
> >> >birds
> >> >fishes
> >> >have absolutely no self-awareness.
> >>
> >> That is not correct!
> >> I watched several programs about animals and their behavior here on German TV.
> >> There is also stuff on youtube.
> >> No only are these animals self-ware, they are also aware about what we want, our 'desires'
> >> There is a video on youtube about a girl hat feeds crows every day, the crows started bringing her pieces of shiny jewels
> >> (that they likely steal elsewhere) when the crows figured she liked that, as 'reward' for the food!
> >
> >
> >Pattern Recognition is not self-awarness...
> 
> True, self aWARness is what precedent trumpy is into


I see, JAN! You're a DemocRAT...and have trump derange syndrome (TDS)
poor thing...there is no hope for you.


> 
> >https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BGPGknpq3e0
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >any bird brain can tell you dat...Jan!
> 
> Here a bit about the meaning of the word self-awareness:
>  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Self-awareness


WIKIPEDIA???? Anyone can edit Wikipedia! It's the confimation bias
website for scientists.

It's a website for frauds.

Try editing Webster's dictionary...


So, using your fruadalent wiki website...
a gorilla sees a red dot in the mirror, in a place
he never saw a red dot..

thats? self-awareness????






> 
> >> There are many more cases
> >>
> >> As to the simplicity of what the 'brain circuit' does, AI (as is sold today as the greatest thing),
> >> has a LOT to learn as far as construct of the brain goes (how our systems mimicry it)
> >> Today I was reading this in sciencedaily.com:
> >>   Affordances in the brain: The human superpower AI hasn’t mastered
> >>  Date:
> >>   June 23, 2025
> >>  Source:
> >>   Universiteit van Amsterdam
> >>  Summary:
> >>   Scientists at the University of Amsterdam discovered that our brains automatically understand how we can move through
> >>   different environments
> >>   —whether it's swimming in a lake or walking a path—without conscious thought.
> >>   These "action possibilities," or affordances, light up specific brain regions independently of what’s visually present.
> >>   In contrast, AI models like ChatGPT still struggle with these intuitive judgments, missing the physical context that humans
> >>   naturally grasp.
> >>    https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2025/06/250622225921.htm
> >>
> >> It confirms some what I wrote before.. Simplicity.
> >>
> >> Human behavior is not so different from a simple feedback system
> >> An anecdote:
> >> in he sixties I got hold of an old American Scientific article about a toy car moving towards a light source..
> >> Being active in electronics I build a small electric driven car and some photo cell to try it out.
> >> In my room, with electric lights on, and light reflecting from the white wallpaper,
> >> the car would drive towards the light wallpaper, get in its own shadow, then reverse, and the thing got into a loop.
> >> It reminded me how we, humans, are 'looking for the light' and get in our own way (our concepts perhaps).
> >> Its all so simple.
> >> Its all too beautiful :-)
> >>  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-e__TbhQGJU
> >> Neural nets, drugs, light, religion, music, logic,
> >> No I am not on drugs, not even alcohol, but I tried some in the seventies.
> >> Me, a neural net.
> >> And crows?
> >> I still feed those.
> 
> Just some other cells monitoring more basics ones and the memories build up in those.
> 
> Maybe you think in english ?
> Birdies think in pictures and sounds, use memories too, no difference.
> 
> It is an interesting subject, how long before we have small bots that are smarter than us?
> And then one big EMP kills all?
> 
> Life and life forms is an interesting subject too:
>  Mojave lichen defies death rays—could life thrive on distant exoplanets?
>  Lichen from the Mojave Desert can survive, and replicate, under levels of extreme solar radiation found on Earth-like planets in other solar systems.
>  Date:
>  June 24, 2025
>  Source:
>   Desert Research Institute
>  Summary:
>   Lichen from the Mojave Desert has stunned scientists by surviving months of lethal UVC radiation,
>   suggesting life could exist on distant planets orbiting volatile stars.
>   The secret? A microscopic “sunscreen” layer that protects their vital cells—even though Earth’s atmosphere already filters out such rays.
>    https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2025/06/250624224813.htm


That which you believe is "self-awarness"...
according to Albert Einstein is simply a...optical delusion.

In other words, 'self-awarness' is a delusion.

A machine cannot be self-aware because humans have no self-awarness!
It's only an illusion.


A Jan by any other name...

is a machine
with a very 
strong dellusion of
self...awareness.


Your warm  :-) is a mockery.


I just looked 
in mirror
and there is
a red dot
on my forehead...
therefore I am.





-- 
The Starmaker -- To question the unquestionable, ask the unaskable,
to think the unthinkable, mention the unmentionable, say the unsayable, 
and challenge the unchallengeable.

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Thread

Can a Machine become self-aware? The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2025-06-14 12:37 -0700
  Re: Can a Machine become self-aware? Jan Panteltje <alien@comet.invalid> - 2025-06-15 07:02 +0000
    Re: Can a Machine become self-aware? Julio Di Egidio <julio@diegidio.name> - 2025-06-15 09:43 +0200
    Re: Can a Machine become self-aware? bertietaylor@myyahoo.com (Bertitaylor) - 2025-06-15 07:59 +0000
      Re: Can a Machine become self-aware? Jan Panteltje <alien@comet.invalid> - 2025-06-15 13:10 +0000
        Re: Can a Machine become self-aware? bertietaylor@myyahoo.com (Bertitaylor) - 2025-06-15 14:18 +0000
  Re: Can a Machine become self-aware? anthk <anthk@openbsd.home> - 2025-06-21 16:28 +0000
    Re: Can a Machine become self-aware? ram@zedat.fu-berlin.de (Stefan Ram) - 2025-06-21 18:19 +0000
      Re: Can a Machine become self-aware? Jan Panteltje <alien@comet.invalid> - 2025-06-22 07:16 +0000
        Re: Can a Machine become self-aware? The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2025-06-22 11:48 -0700
          Re: Can a Machine become self-aware? Jan Panteltje <alien@comet.invalid> - 2025-06-24 07:20 +0000
            Re: Can a Machine become self-aware? The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2025-06-24 13:11 -0700
              Re: Can a Machine become self-aware? Jan Panteltje <alien@comet.invalid> - 2025-06-25 06:24 +0000
                Re: Can a Machine become self-aware? The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2025-06-25 12:01 -0700
                Re: Can a Machine become self-aware? Jan Panteltje <alien@comet.invalid> - 2025-06-26 08:11 +0000
                Re: Can a Machine become self-aware? The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2025-06-26 10:34 -0700
                Re: Can a Machine become self-aware? Jan Panteltje <alien@comet.invalid> - 2025-06-27 05:18 +0000
                Re: Can a Machine become self-aware? The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2025-06-26 22:39 -0700
                Re: Can a Machine become self-aware? The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2025-06-26 22:45 -0700
                Re: Can a Machine become self-aware? Jan Panteltje <alien@comet.invalid> - 2025-06-28 07:47 +0000
                Re: Can a Machine become self-aware? The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2025-07-01 07:51 -0700
                Re: Can a Machine become self-aware? Jan Panteltje <alien@comet.invalid> - 2025-07-02 06:41 +0000
                Re: Can a Machine become self-aware? The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2025-07-02 10:56 -0700
                Re: Can a Machine become self-aware? squalk <sq@net.inv> - 2025-07-02 20:03 +0100
                Re: Can a Machine become self-aware? The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2025-07-02 13:12 -0700
                Re: Can a Machine become self-aware? squalk <sq@net.inv> - 2025-07-02 21:21 +0100
                Re: Can a Machine become self-aware? "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2025-07-02 15:30 -0700
                Re: Can a Machine become self-aware? Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2025-07-03 20:06 +0200
                Re: Can a Machine become self-aware? Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2025-07-03 20:04 +0200
                Re: Can a Machine become self-aware? Jan Panteltje <alien@comet.invalid> - 2025-07-03 08:24 +0000
                Re: Can a Machine become self-aware? Jan Panteltje <alien@comet.invalid> - 2025-07-03 08:37 +0000
                Re: Can a Machine become self-aware? The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2025-07-07 22:03 -0700
                Re: Can a Machine become self-aware? Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2025-07-03 20:01 +0200
    Re: Can a Machine become self-aware? "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2025-06-21 14:43 -0700

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