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Re: What modern physics is really about, from a woodworker's view

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On 8/27/17 2:00 AM, dancouriann@gmail.com wrote:
> On Saturday, August 26, 2017 at 1:23:29 PM UTC-7, Odd Bodkin wrote:
>> There is also a fair amount of work that has been done with
>> quantum field theory in a curved, dynamic spacetime...
> 
> Sure, but that's semi-classical GR, and the quantum fields still reside IN spacetime, they are not aspects OF spacetime.  There is currently no quantum theory of gravity.

Again, I'm not talking about a quantum field theory of gravity. I'm 
talking about for example Wald's treatment of a general QFT (like a 
simple harmonic oscillator) in curved spacetime.

> 
>> As for whether the fields are separate in existence from the
>> background, this is precisely the shift that I'm starting to
>> see in what I'm reading ...
> 
> I think what you're describing is speculative ideas.  Modern physics (the subject of this thread) presently consists of the standard model, plus general relativity.  The quantum fields exist IN spacetime, they are not aspects OF spacetime.
> 
>> -- that there is no reason to think that fields are a thing IN
>> spacetime. That is, if you consider that a field is essentially defined
>> as a map of some properties over space and time, then the question is,
>> properties of WHAT?
> 
> I'm not sure what you're referring to here.  When you say "a field is a map of properties over space and time", what exactly does that mean?  Are you just saying that a field is defined to have values as a function of space and time?  For example, the value of a scalar field, or the components of a vector field, are defined as functions of space and time?  This has always been the case, even in the 19th century fields.  And I don't know how to interpret your question "Properties of what?"  Are you harkening back to the 19th century question about what is the medium of electromagnetic waves and fields?
> 
> Are these your own ideas, or are you reporting things from some papers or books describing the current state of modern physics (as distinct from speculative ideas like the multiverse, etc)?
> 

These are not my ideas. They are being floated by people like Smolin and 
Arkani-Hamed and Penrose and Randall. Yes, they may be speculative in 
the sense that they are extensions of the standard model. But the 
insight seems to be important.


-- 
Odd Bodkin -- maker of fine toys, tools, tables

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What modern physics is really about, from a woodworker's view Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-08-25 17:28 -0500
  Re: What modern physics is really about, from a woodworker's view numbernumber1964@gmail.com - 2017-08-25 15:42 -0700
  Re: What modern physics is really about, from a woodworker's view Serg io <invalid@invalid.com> - 2017-08-25 19:17 -0500
    Re: What modern physics is really about, from a woodworker's view benj <nobody@yahoo.com> - 2017-08-26 01:50 -0400
      Re: What modern physics is really about, from a woodworker's view Serg io <invalid@invalid.com> - 2017-08-26 09:07 -0500
        Re: What modern physics is really about, from a woodworker's view Gary Harnagel <hitlong@yahoo.com> - 2017-08-26 08:03 -0700
        Re: What modern physics is really about, from a woodworker's view Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-08-26 10:43 -0500
          Re: What modern physics is really about, from a woodworker's view mlwozniak@wp.pl - 2017-08-26 09:13 -0700
          Re: What modern physics is really about, from a woodworker's view Serg io <invalid@invalid.com> - 2017-08-26 11:26 -0500
            Re: What modern physics is really about, from a woodworker's view benj <benj@nobody.net> - 2017-08-26 17:43 -0400
              Re: What modern physics is really about, from a woodworker's view Serg io <invalid@invalid.com> - 2017-08-27 11:41 -0500
                Re: What modern physics is really about, from a woodworker's view benj <benj@nobody.net> - 2017-08-28 16:23 -0400
          Re: What modern physics is really about, from a woodworker's view benj <benj@nobody.net> - 2017-08-26 17:35 -0400
        Re: What modern physics is really about, from a woodworker's view benj <benj@nobody.net> - 2017-08-26 17:31 -0400
          Re: What modern physics is really about, from a woodworker's view Serg io <invalid@invalid.com> - 2017-08-26 17:01 -0500
            Re: What modern physics is really about, from a woodworker's view benj <benj@nobody.net> - 2017-08-26 18:53 -0400
              Re: What modern physics is really about, from a woodworker's view Serg io <invalid@invalid.com> - 2017-08-27 10:20 -0500
                Re: What modern physics is really about, from a woodworker's view benj <benj@nobody.net> - 2017-08-28 16:21 -0400
          Re: What modern physics is really about, from a woodworker's view mlwozniak@wp.pl - 2017-08-26 22:52 -0700
  Re: What modern physics is really about, from a woodworker's view mlwozniak@wp.pl - 2017-08-25 23:51 -0700
  Re: What modern physics is really about, from a woodworker's view Bídníkùm Laterá <bila@wehia.ui> - 2017-08-26 12:00 +0000
  Re: What modern physics is really about, from a woodworker's view moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com (Michael Moroney) - 2017-08-26 16:19 +0000
    Re: What modern physics is really about, from a woodworker's view Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-08-26 14:25 -0500
      Re: What modern physics is really about, from a woodworker's view mlwozniak@wp.pl - 2017-08-26 13:38 -0700
  Re: What modern physics is really about, from a woodworker's view dancouriann@gmail.com - 2017-08-26 13:01 -0700
    Re: What modern physics is really about, from a woodworker's view Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-08-26 15:23 -0500
      Re: What modern physics is really about, from a woodworker's view dancouriann@gmail.com - 2017-08-27 00:00 -0700
        Re: What modern physics is really about, from a woodworker's view Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-08-27 16:59 -0500
          Re: What modern physics is really about, from a woodworker's view The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2017-08-28 10:55 -0700
            Re: What modern physics is really about, from a woodworker's view Gary Harnagel <hitlong@yahoo.com> - 2017-08-28 11:09 -0700
      Re: What modern physics is really about, from a woodworker's view Prokaryotic Caspase Homolog <prokaryotic.caspase.homolog@gmail.com> - 2017-08-27 01:33 -0700
  Re: What modern physics is really about, from a woodworker's view numbernumber1964@gmail.com - 2017-08-26 14:43 -0700
  Re: What modern physics is really about, from a woodworker's view The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2017-08-26 15:57 -0700
    Re: What modern physics is really about, from a woodworker's view The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2017-08-26 17:08 -0700
      Re: What modern physics is really about, from a woodworker's view The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2017-08-26 18:00 -0700
        Re: What modern physics is really about, from a woodworker's view The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2017-08-26 19:15 -0700
  Re: What modern physics is really about, from a woodworker's view Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2017-08-28 21:11 +0200
    Re: What modern physics is really about, from a woodworker's view The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2017-08-28 12:22 -0700
      Re: What modern physics is really about, from a woodworker's view Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2017-08-28 21:49 +0200
        Re: What modern physics is really about, from a woodworker's view The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2017-08-28 23:43 -0700
          Re: What modern physics is really about, from a woodworker's view Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2017-08-29 16:01 +0200
            Re: What modern physics is really about, from a woodworker's view The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2017-08-29 10:42 -0700
              Re: What modern physics is really about, from a woodworker's view The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2017-08-30 09:37 -0700
                Re: What modern physics is really about, from a woodworker's view The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2017-08-30 10:06 -0700
                Re: What modern physics is really about, from a woodworker's view Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2017-08-30 21:45 +0200
          Re: What modern physics is really about, from a woodworker's view The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2017-09-02 12:46 -0700
            Re: What modern physics is really about, from a woodworker's view Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2017-09-03 22:32 +0200

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