Groups > sci.physics.relativity > #430115

Re: What modern physics is really about, from a woodworker's view

From	The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com>
Newsgroups	sci.physics, sci.physics.relativity
Subject	Re: What modern physics is really about, from a woodworker's view
Date	2017-08-26 17:08 -0700
Organization	Aioe.org NNTP Server
Message-ID	<59A20D77.6BBB@ix.netcom.com> (permalink)
References	<onq8a4$1a70$1@gioia.aioe.org> <59A1FCDF.4685@ix.netcom.com>

Cross-posted to 2 groups.

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The Starmaker wrote:
> 
> Odd Bodkin wrote:
> >
> > I'm aware that there are a number of people on this group who are not
> > even comfortable with the concepts of 19th century physics, let alone
> > 20th century physics, and these people prefer to just speculate and
> > argue about what "feels right" to them, justified or not.
> >
> > I'm aware that there are a number of people on this group who think 19th
> > century physics (the "classical" physics of Newton and Kelvin and
> > Maxwell) is still the best model, and that physics went astray with
> > relativity and quantum mechanics and basically anything that says
> > classical physics is off a bit.
> >
> > But what's interesting to me is that, with some of the reading that I've
> > done over the last decade, even the "modern physics" of the 20th century
> > has been left behind for newer and much different ideas.
> >
> > Even in the "modern physics" paradigm, amateurs are prone to think of
> > physics as being about things (objects, particles, material things)
> > moving around in a backdrop of space and time, where their behaviors are
> > controlled by certain laws of physics (like conservation of momentum or
> > Gauss' law) and by certain interactions mediated by other "things"
> > (gauge bosons, for example).
> >
> > But the real picture of the 21st century is far stranger, and amateurs
> > may not be fully aware of it.
> >
> > In a very brief nutshell, all "things" have been replaced by fields
> > which extend over ALL space and time. They don't live IN space and time
> > like you imagine particles or ping pong balls. They are part of the
> > fabric OF space and time.
> >
> > There are ripples in these fields, which have behavior constrained by
> > symmetries of nature, which are more fundamental in a deep sense than
> > the conservation laws of nature.
> >
> > Ripples can be measured by a quantity called "action", which physicists
> > have known about for a long time. What they didn't know until the 20th
> > century is that the smallest chunk of action is given by a number called
> > Planck's constant. These smallest ripples are what we associate with
> > field quanta, and when physicists say "fundamental particles" they are
> > really talking about these field quanta.
> >
> > So, recapping so far, the idea of "things" moving through space and time
> > has become replaced with the idea of fields that extend everywhere, and
> > the ripples in them that are bestowed with small amounts of action.
> >
> > (I've glossed over a key idea that a field is nothing more than a map of
> > the value(s) of a property(ies) OF spacetime itself. Different fields
> > correspond to different sets of properties of spacetime, and all the
> > fields overlay each other. The little quantized ripples in the fields
> > can be distinct from each other though, in some sense.)
> >
> > Now the last core concept is that a ripple carrying some action in one
> > field can generate or disturb a ripple carrying some action in a
> > different field. This is what we call an interaction between fields.
> > Here's where another old idea gets replaced -- charge (like color charge
> > or electromagnetic charge) is not some kind of "stuff" that belongs to
> > "things"; instead, charge is just defined as that tendency for a given
> > pair of fields to interact and create ripples in each other. The laws
> > that control these interactions are in fact driven by yet more
> > symmetries of nature (local gauge symmetries).
> >
> > What's astonishing about this is that physicists now believe that the
> > fundamental thing that physics is about is the interaction, not the
> > object. And rather than physical laws, physicists now think of
> > symmetries as the fundamental constraint.
> >
> > So gone are the days of thinking of the world as moving things in a
> > backdrop of space and time. Here today we have the primacy of the
> > interaction, of action, and of symmetry. And THAT is what 21st century
> > physics seems to me to be really about.
> >
> > There are lots of good references here that support this nutshell recap
> > in much better detail.
> >
> > --
> > Odd Bodkin -- maker of fine toys, tools, tables
> 
> "interaction" is not what "physicists now believe", it's just another
> 'rehash' of an old theory.
> 
> You certaintly fell for the new lingo "interaction".
> 
> It's pushcart science.




Let me explain to yous what "interation" really means in the 'old hat' world...

it's simply a rehash of the word....entanglement, or quantum entanglement.




'spooky at a distance' is a very old concept, ...now lem me see if i can remember who thought of that?

give me a break with..."physicists now believe".


Poppycock, hogwash...fake science news.

Thread

What modern physics is really about, from a woodworker's view Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-08-25 17:28 -0500
  Re: What modern physics is really about, from a woodworker's view numbernumber1964@gmail.com - 2017-08-25 15:42 -0700
  Re: What modern physics is really about, from a woodworker's view Serg io <invalid@invalid.com> - 2017-08-25 19:17 -0500
    Re: What modern physics is really about, from a woodworker's view benj <nobody@yahoo.com> - 2017-08-26 01:50 -0400
      Re: What modern physics is really about, from a woodworker's view Serg io <invalid@invalid.com> - 2017-08-26 09:07 -0500
        Re: What modern physics is really about, from a woodworker's view Gary Harnagel <hitlong@yahoo.com> - 2017-08-26 08:03 -0700
        Re: What modern physics is really about, from a woodworker's view Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-08-26 10:43 -0500
          Re: What modern physics is really about, from a woodworker's view mlwozniak@wp.pl - 2017-08-26 09:13 -0700
          Re: What modern physics is really about, from a woodworker's view Serg io <invalid@invalid.com> - 2017-08-26 11:26 -0500
            Re: What modern physics is really about, from a woodworker's view benj <benj@nobody.net> - 2017-08-26 17:43 -0400
              Re: What modern physics is really about, from a woodworker's view Serg io <invalid@invalid.com> - 2017-08-27 11:41 -0500
                Re: What modern physics is really about, from a woodworker's view benj <benj@nobody.net> - 2017-08-28 16:23 -0400
          Re: What modern physics is really about, from a woodworker's view benj <benj@nobody.net> - 2017-08-26 17:35 -0400
        Re: What modern physics is really about, from a woodworker's view benj <benj@nobody.net> - 2017-08-26 17:31 -0400
          Re: What modern physics is really about, from a woodworker's view Serg io <invalid@invalid.com> - 2017-08-26 17:01 -0500
            Re: What modern physics is really about, from a woodworker's view benj <benj@nobody.net> - 2017-08-26 18:53 -0400
              Re: What modern physics is really about, from a woodworker's view Serg io <invalid@invalid.com> - 2017-08-27 10:20 -0500
                Re: What modern physics is really about, from a woodworker's view benj <benj@nobody.net> - 2017-08-28 16:21 -0400
          Re: What modern physics is really about, from a woodworker's view mlwozniak@wp.pl - 2017-08-26 22:52 -0700
  Re: What modern physics is really about, from a woodworker's view mlwozniak@wp.pl - 2017-08-25 23:51 -0700
  Re: What modern physics is really about, from a woodworker's view Bídníkùm Laterá <bila@wehia.ui> - 2017-08-26 12:00 +0000
  Re: What modern physics is really about, from a woodworker's view moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com (Michael Moroney) - 2017-08-26 16:19 +0000
    Re: What modern physics is really about, from a woodworker's view Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-08-26 14:25 -0500
      Re: What modern physics is really about, from a woodworker's view mlwozniak@wp.pl - 2017-08-26 13:38 -0700
  Re: What modern physics is really about, from a woodworker's view dancouriann@gmail.com - 2017-08-26 13:01 -0700
    Re: What modern physics is really about, from a woodworker's view Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-08-26 15:23 -0500
      Re: What modern physics is really about, from a woodworker's view dancouriann@gmail.com - 2017-08-27 00:00 -0700
        Re: What modern physics is really about, from a woodworker's view Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-08-27 16:59 -0500
          Re: What modern physics is really about, from a woodworker's view The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2017-08-28 10:55 -0700
            Re: What modern physics is really about, from a woodworker's view Gary Harnagel <hitlong@yahoo.com> - 2017-08-28 11:09 -0700
      Re: What modern physics is really about, from a woodworker's view Prokaryotic Caspase Homolog <prokaryotic.caspase.homolog@gmail.com> - 2017-08-27 01:33 -0700
  Re: What modern physics is really about, from a woodworker's view numbernumber1964@gmail.com - 2017-08-26 14:43 -0700
  Re: What modern physics is really about, from a woodworker's view The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2017-08-26 15:57 -0700
    Re: What modern physics is really about, from a woodworker's view The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2017-08-26 17:08 -0700
      Re: What modern physics is really about, from a woodworker's view The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2017-08-26 18:00 -0700
        Re: What modern physics is really about, from a woodworker's view The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2017-08-26 19:15 -0700
  Re: What modern physics is really about, from a woodworker's view Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2017-08-28 21:11 +0200
    Re: What modern physics is really about, from a woodworker's view The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2017-08-28 12:22 -0700
      Re: What modern physics is really about, from a woodworker's view Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2017-08-28 21:49 +0200
        Re: What modern physics is really about, from a woodworker's view The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2017-08-28 23:43 -0700
          Re: What modern physics is really about, from a woodworker's view Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2017-08-29 16:01 +0200
            Re: What modern physics is really about, from a woodworker's view The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2017-08-29 10:42 -0700
              Re: What modern physics is really about, from a woodworker's view The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2017-08-30 09:37 -0700
                Re: What modern physics is really about, from a woodworker's view The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2017-08-30 10:06 -0700
                Re: What modern physics is really about, from a woodworker's view Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2017-08-30 21:45 +0200
          Re: What modern physics is really about, from a woodworker's view The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2017-09-02 12:46 -0700
            Re: What modern physics is really about, from a woodworker's view Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2017-09-03 22:32 +0200

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