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Re: H-1B Reform

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On 2017-02-06 17:26, krw@notreal.com wrote:
> On Mon, 06 Feb 2017 07:27:48 -0800, Joerg <news@analogconsultants.com>
> wrote:
>
>> On 2017-02-05 15:02, krw@notreal.com wrote:
>>> On Sun, 05 Feb 2017 07:23:45 -0800, Joerg <news@analogconsultants.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 2017-02-04 22:52, dakupoto@gmail.com wrote:
>>>>> On Tuesday, January 31, 2017 at 8:12:03 PM UTC-5, Martin Riddle wrote:
>>>>>> On Tue, 31 Jan 2017 08:16:27 -0800 (PST),
>>>>>> bloggs.fredbloggs.fred@gmail.com wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> This is going to fly like a lead balloon:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> http://tinyurl.com/zg8k64f
>>>>>>
>>>>>> So instead of displacing 1 american worker, they'll displace 2?
>>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Huh? How can a single engineer do the work of two on a consistent basis?
>>>> The day has only 24h.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>> Cheers
>>>>>
>>>>> That is very well said. And now more and more
>>>>> US high tech companies will try to outsource
>>>>> as many of their jobs as possible to off-shore
>>>>> sites.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> They'll do that anyhow and that's got nothing to do with H1B. Running a
>>>> software outfit overseas is cheaper than paying for travel and housing
>>>> of someone temporarily moved over here. The pay will also be much lower
>>>> because the cost of daily life is much lower in many countries overseas.
>>>> Also, there can't be import tariffs on it because their work results
>>>> will flow across the borders on "singing wires".
>>>
>>> It may seem so but it's not true.  We have hundreds of H1B software
>>> engineers, mostly here in the US but, sure, some in India.  Having
>>> them here is more efficient than "out of sight - out of mind".
>>
>>
>> You would need good team leaders in India but yes, for many projects
>> that doesn't work well or results in more problems than if they were local.
>>
>> If managed right a remote relationship can work very well. 100% of my
>> client relationships are now remote. Zoom and GoToMeeting make this very
>> efficient.
>
> You forgot to say "YMMV".  We do both but some jobs just can't be done
> overseas.


Same here, there are always exceptions. This is why I had to find a 
local SW-engineer for one project. Pressure testing is hard to do via 
Internet. It also can't be shipped out because things can go seriously 
kablouie.

>>
>>>>
>>>> Raising and most of all enforcing the required wage is the perfect way
>>>> to fix H1B and I've always said that. Finally we have an administration
>>>> that understand it. H1B is meant to haul in talent where we truly can't
>>>> find an engineer for, not to obtain work results cheaper. The companies
>>>> I worked for used H1B for exactly that intended purpose and they paid
>>>> beaucoup bucks for those folks in salary.
>>>
>>> It's not all about wages.
>>
>>
>> It is.
>
> Of course it's not. Wages aren't the only cost of doing business.


This has nothing to do with business, it has to do with work visa. Abuse 
of work visa rules can be completely stopped by enforcing the prevailing 
wage or some other wage limit. It is simple. The new administration 
seems to be the first one that understands this (and some other things).

>>
>>>                   ...  It really is impossible to find hundreds of
>>> contractors, quickly, in the US.  H1B contractors fill the crests in
>>> workload so the employee base is more stable (we have a number of
>>> contract EEs, too, but they're not H1Bs).
>>>
>>
>> It's perfectly ok to use H1B contractors. However, they need to be paid
>> prevailing wage or higher and that must be _verified_ which is super
>> easy to do. I have suggested that all the time but it wasn't done. Now
>> it will be because the new administration seems to understand some stuff
>> that previous ones didn't.
>
> The H1Bs at my CPoE aren't paid the same as employees, sure, but they
> don't have the same responsibilities, either.  They're basically code
> jockeys.
>

Once they have to start paying them $130k/year each they will probably 
find Americans for that job, and fast. There are plenty of un- or 
under-employed coders around.

H1B was meant to obtain special talent that could not be found in the US 
or where we simply don't have enough engineers, not for hiring scores of 
cheap programmers. Now it will (hopefully) revert to that original intent.

-- 
Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/

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H-1B Reform bloggs.fredbloggs.fred@gmail.com - 2017-01-31 08:16 -0800
  Re: H-1B Reform George Herold <gherold@teachspin.com> - 2017-01-31 09:15 -0800
  Re: H-1B Reform Martin Riddle <martin_rid@verizon.net> - 2017-01-31 20:11 -0500
    Re: H-1B Reform Spehro Pefhany <speffSNIP@interlogDOTyou.knowwhat> - 2017-01-31 22:49 -0500
    Re: H-1B Reform dakupoto@gmail.com - 2017-02-04 22:52 -0800
      Re: H-1B Reform Joerg <news@analogconsultants.com> - 2017-02-05 07:23 -0800
        Re: H-1B Reform krw@notreal.com - 2017-02-05 18:02 -0500
          Re: H-1B Reform Joerg <news@analogconsultants.com> - 2017-02-06 07:27 -0800
            Re: H-1B Reform krw@notreal.com - 2017-02-06 20:26 -0500
              Re: H-1B Reform Joerg <news@analogconsultants.com> - 2017-02-07 07:49 -0800
                Re: H-1B Reform krw@notreal.com - 2017-02-07 12:18 -0500
                Re: H-1B Reform Joerg <news@analogconsultants.com> - 2017-02-07 10:02 -0800
                Re: H-1B Reform krw@notreal.com - 2017-02-07 20:21 -0500
                Re: H-1B Reform Joerg <news@analogconsultants.com> - 2017-02-08 08:08 -0800
                Re: H-1B Reform krw@notreal.com - 2017-02-08 12:28 -0500
                Re: H-1B Reform Joerg <news@analogconsultants.com> - 2017-02-08 10:05 -0800
                Re: H-1B Reform krw@notreal.com - 2017-02-08 13:13 -0500
                Re: H-1B Reform Joerg <news@analogconsultants.com> - 2017-02-08 12:16 -0800
                Re: H-1B Reform krw@notreal.com - 2017-02-08 20:13 -0500
                Re: H-1B Reform Joerg <news@analogconsultants.com> - 2017-02-09 07:19 -0800
                Re: H-1B Reform Phil Hobbs <pcdhSpamMeSenseless@electrooptical.net> - 2017-02-08 13:42 -0500
                Re: H-1B Reform Joerg <news@analogconsultants.com> - 2017-02-08 12:06 -0800
        Re: H-1B Reform rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2017-02-06 03:18 -0500
          Re: H-1B Reform bill.sloman@ieee.org - 2017-02-06 03:17 -0800
          Re: H-1B Reform Joerg <news@analogconsultants.com> - 2017-02-06 07:51 -0800
            Re: H-1B Reform makolber@yahoo.com - 2017-02-06 10:08 -0800
              Re: H-1B Reform Joerg <news@analogconsultants.com> - 2017-02-06 10:11 -0800
                Re: H-1B Reform Lasse Langwadt Christensen <langwadt@fonz.dk> - 2017-02-06 12:53 -0800
                Re: H-1B Reform Joerg <news@analogconsultants.com> - 2017-02-06 13:22 -0800
              Re: H-1B Reform Tom Gardner <spamjunk@blueyonder.co.uk> - 2017-02-06 20:36 +0000
              Re: H-1B Reform Neon John <no@never.com> - 2017-02-08 17:20 -0500
                Re: H-1B Reform krw@notreal.com - 2017-02-08 20:14 -0500
            Re: H-1B Reform rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2017-02-06 19:36 -0500
              Re: H-1B Reform Joerg <news@analogconsultants.com> - 2017-02-07 08:02 -0800
                Re: H-1B Reform Phil Hobbs <pcdhSpamMeSenseless@electrooptical.net> - 2017-02-07 17:01 -0500
                Re: H-1B Reform rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2017-02-07 20:33 -0500
                Re: H-1B Reform Joerg <news@analogconsultants.com> - 2017-02-08 08:18 -0800
                Re: H-1B Reform rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2017-02-08 17:02 -0500
                Re: H-1B Reform Joerg <news@analogconsultants.com> - 2017-02-08 14:36 -0800
                Re: H-1B Reform rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2017-02-08 21:12 -0500
                Re: H-1B Reform Joerg <news@analogconsultants.com> - 2017-02-09 07:42 -0800
                Re: H-1B Reform Neon John <no@never.com> - 2017-02-09 11:02 -0500
                Re: H-1B Reform Joerg <news@analogconsultants.com> - 2017-02-09 10:36 -0800
                Re: H-1B Reform Phil Hobbs <pcdhSpamMeSenseless@electrooptical.net> - 2017-02-09 14:34 -0500
                Re: H-1B Reform Joerg <news@analogconsultants.com> - 2017-02-09 12:27 -0800
                Re: H-1B Reform Phil Hobbs <pcdhSpamMeSenseless@electrooptical.net> - 2017-02-09 15:33 -0500
                Re: H-1B Reform Joerg <news@analogconsultants.com> - 2017-02-09 12:40 -0800
                Re: H-1B Reform bill.sloman@ieee.org - 2017-02-09 17:58 -0800
        Re: H-1B Reform Tom Gardner <spamjunk@blueyonder.co.uk> - 2017-02-06 17:10 +0000
          Re: H-1B Reform Lasse Langwadt Christensen <langwadt@fonz.dk> - 2017-02-06 09:24 -0800
            Re: H-1B Reform Tom Gardner <spamjunk@blueyonder.co.uk> - 2017-02-06 18:05 +0000
              Re: H-1B Reform Joerg <news@analogconsultants.com> - 2017-02-06 10:18 -0800
                Re: H-1B Reform Tom Gardner <spamjunk@blueyonder.co.uk> - 2017-02-06 20:41 +0000
                Re: H-1B Reform Joerg <news@analogconsultants.com> - 2017-02-06 13:31 -0800
                Re: H-1B Reform Tom Gardner <spamjunk@blueyonder.co.uk> - 2017-02-06 22:05 +0000
                Re: H-1B Reform Joerg <news@analogconsultants.com> - 2017-02-06 14:56 -0800
      Re: H-1B Reform mixed nuts <melopsitticus@undulatus.budgie> - 2017-02-05 10:32 -0500
        Re: H-1B Reform Jeroen Belleman <jeroen@nospam.please> - 2017-02-05 19:15 +0100
          Re: H-1B Reform mixed nuts <melopsitticus@undulatus.budgie> - 2017-02-05 23:06 -0500
            Re: H-1B Reform bill.sloman@ieee.org - 2017-02-06 03:24 -0800

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