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Re: White Privilege

From Cheryl <cperkins@mun.ca>
Newsgroups alt.usage.english
Subject Re: White Privilege
Date 2015-12-28 11:53 -0330
Message-ID <ded2fbFbo82U1@mid.individual.net> (permalink)
References (4 earlier) <d2857e1f-8ac6-48cc-bc35-5306e5369c25@googlegroups.com> <49b3640b-83b5-4c9a-a244-ee361a09107b@googlegroups.com> <n5qutm$fku$1@dont-email.me> <decne5F8sopU1@mid.individual.net> <XnsA57E93D5BF2E5whhvans@178.63.61.145>

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On 2015-12-28 11:01 AM, HVS wrote:
> On 28 Dec 2015, Cheryl wrote
>
> -snip-
>>
>> It used to be considered proper years ago to give children formal,
>> serious names, often after older relatives names along the same
>> principles, and even if the children were actually called by some odd
>> nickname. After all, they might prefer a formal traditional name, or be
>> taken more seriously with one, as adults.
>
> There's certainly been a huge change in the conventions surrounding
> names/nicknames since IWAL.  There are undoubtedly exceptions, but I'd be
> fairly surprised to find somebody my age (early 60s) to have been christened
> with a nickname -- Jack/Harry/Zac/Beth/Penny/Maggie or such-like.
>
> My parents mentioned one time that if I'd been a girl, they would probably
> have christened me "Penelope" in order to call me "Penny". I don't think the
> idea of christening the child "Penny" would ever have occurred to them.
>
My mother had strong feelings against nicknames, and also quoted a 
departed priest who had been quite influential in her youth and who 
opposed naming children with anything other than formal names, 
preferably those associated with saints or admirable Biblical 
characters. I suspect my mother was even more influenced by her own 
ideas than those of the priest, though, in this case. My name was never 
shortened, but was certainly new and odd in it's day - and there's no 
Saint Cheryl or biblical Cheryl. My two sisters are both referred to by 
nicknames, one from birth (with a change in early adolescence when she 
rebelled against the baby nickname; the other after she left home, and 
I've never become accustomed to the nickname). My brother was always 
called by his full name, Edward, even as a child, and I think was 
confirmed in his preference for the full version by all the strangers 
who thought this was odd and tried to call him Ed or Eddie.

As the oldest, I was nearly named Edwina (my father was named Edward, 
although he went by a couple of different nicknames, based on his other 
names, to distinguish him from his father Edward). My father objected - 
I think he considered it too odd or old-fashioned. I certainly did, when 
I was old enough to have an opinion.

But on the whole, my mother's desire for children's names that couldn't 
be shortened or give rise to nicknames didn't work out so well.

One of my cousins, presumably baptized by a priest with more modern 
views on naming than the one my mother admired, was named Bonnie Lou. I 
think as she got older, she dropped the "Lou". Most compound names we 
were familiar with had "Mary" in them, and were very traditional - Mary 
Margaret, Mary Ann, Anne-Marie, etc.

Boys' names always seemed to be more conservative than girls'. Perhaps 
boys were expected to grow up to be serious professional men, and girls 
were expected to be frivolous wives and mothers.

-- 
Cheryl

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Thread

White Privilege David Kleinecke <dkleinecke@gmail.com> - 2015-12-26 12:18 -0800
  Re: White Privilege Horace LaBadie <hlabadie@nospam.com> - 2015-12-26 15:46 -0500
  Re: White Privilege Cheryl <cperkins@mun.ca> - 2015-12-26 17:58 -0330
  Re: White Privilege Harrison Hill <harrisonhill2345@gmail.com> - 2015-12-26 14:12 -0800
    Re: White Privilege Helen Lacedaemonian <helenofsunnyvale@gmail.com> - 2015-12-26 23:50 -0800
  Re: White Privilege Helen Lacedaemonian <helenofsunnyvale@gmail.com> - 2015-12-26 23:48 -0800
    Re: White Privilege Cheryl <cperkins@mun.ca> - 2015-12-27 06:58 -0330
      Re: White Privilege "Don Phillipson" <e925@SPAMBLOCK.ncf.ca> - 2015-12-27 08:46 -0500
        Re: White Privilege Jerry Friedman <jerry_friedman@yahoo.com> - 2015-12-27 08:32 -0800
      Re: White Privilege Jerry Friedman <jerry_friedman@yahoo.com> - 2015-12-27 08:49 -0800
        Re: White Privilege "Peter T. Daniels" <grammatim@verizon.net> - 2015-12-27 10:40 -0800
          Re: White Privilege Jerry Friedman <jerry_friedman@yahoo.com> - 2015-12-27 10:57 -0800
            Re: White Privilege Rich Ulrich <rich.ulrich@comcast.net> - 2015-12-27 20:20 -0500
          Re: White Privilege spuorgelgoog@gowanhill.com - 2015-12-27 12:16 -0800
            Re: White Privilege "Peter T. Daniels" <grammatim@verizon.net> - 2015-12-27 13:19 -0800
              Re: White Privilege charles <charles@candehope.me.uk> - 2015-12-27 21:49 +0000
                Re: White Privilege "Peter T. Daniels" <grammatim@verizon.net> - 2015-12-27 14:06 -0800
                Re: White Privilege James Hogg <Jas.Hogg@gOUTmail.com> - 2015-12-27 23:15 +0100
                Re: White Privilege charles <charles@candehope.me.uk> - 2015-12-27 22:20 +0000
                Re: White Privilege "Peter T. Daniels" <grammatim@verizon.net> - 2015-12-27 20:34 -0800
                Re: White Privilege Janet <nobody@home.org> - 2015-12-28 12:27 +0000
                Re: White Privilege richard@cogsci.ed.ac.uk (Richard Tobin) - 2015-12-28 19:29 +0000
                Re: White Privilege "Peter Duncanson [BrE]" <mail@peterduncanson.net> - 2015-12-28 22:15 +0000
                Re: White Privilege charles <charles@candehope.me.uk> - 2015-12-27 22:26 +0000
                Re: White Privilege Tony Cooper <tonycooper214@gmail.com> - 2015-12-27 20:06 -0500
                Re: White Privilege wollman@bimajority.org (Garrett Wollman) - 2015-12-28 01:34 +0000
                Re: White Privilege John Dawkins <artfldodgr@aol.com> - 2015-12-28 10:26 -0800
                Re: White Privilege "Peter T. Daniels" <grammatim@verizon.net> - 2015-12-27 20:40 -0800
                Re: White Privilege Horace LaBadie <hlabadie@nospam.com> - 2015-12-28 01:54 -0500
                Re: White Privilege "Peter T. Daniels" <grammatim@verizon.net> - 2015-12-28 04:18 -0800
                Re: White Privilege Horace LaBadie <hlabadie@nospam.com> - 2015-12-28 09:05 -0500
                Re: White Privilege Horace LaBadie <hlabadie@nospam.com> - 2015-12-28 11:59 -0500
                Re: White Privilege "Peter T. Daniels" <grammatim@verizon.net> - 2015-12-28 11:39 -0800
                Re: White Privilege Horace LaBadie <hlabadie@nospam.com> - 2015-12-28 15:42 -0500
                Re: White Privilege "Peter T. Daniels" <grammatim@verizon.net> - 2015-12-28 13:23 -0800
                Re: White Privilege charles <charles@candehope.me.uk> - 2015-12-28 09:27 +0000
                Re: White Privilege Janet <nobody@home.org> - 2015-12-28 12:30 +0000
                Re: White Privilege "Don Phillipson" <e925@SPAMBLOCK.ncf.ca> - 2015-12-28 11:44 -0500
                Re: White Privilege James Hogg <Jas.Hogg@gOUTmail.com> - 2015-12-27 23:15 +0100
                Re: White Privilege charles <charles@candehope.me.uk> - 2015-12-27 22:22 +0000
              Re: White Privilege "Peter Duncanson [BrE]" <mail@peterduncanson.net> - 2015-12-28 13:57 +0000
                Re: White Privilege Tony Cooper <tonycooper214@gmail.com> - 2015-12-28 09:23 -0500
                Re: White Privilege "Don Phillipson" <e925@SPAMBLOCK.ncf.ca> - 2015-12-28 11:37 -0500
                Re: White Privilege Jerry Friedman <jerry_friedman@yahoo.com> - 2015-12-28 15:12 -0800
                Re: White Privilege Peter Moylan <peter@pmoylan.org.invalid> - 2015-12-29 15:38 +1100
                Re: White Privilege RH Draney <dadoctah@cox.net> - 2015-12-28 22:53 -0700
                Re: White Privilege "Peter T. Daniels" <grammatim@verizon.net> - 2015-12-28 06:41 -0800
                Re: White Privilege Tony Cooper <tonycooper214@gmail.com> - 2015-12-28 09:52 -0500
                Re: White Privilege "Peter T. Daniels" <grammatim@verizon.net> - 2015-12-28 08:38 -0800
                Re: White Privilege Tony Cooper <tonycooper214@gmail.com> - 2015-12-28 13:26 -0500
                Re: White Privilege "Peter Duncanson [BrE]" <mail@peterduncanson.net> - 2015-12-28 22:19 +0000
                Re: White Privilege Tony Cooper <tonycooper214@gmail.com> - 2015-12-28 17:47 -0500
                Re: White Privilege "Peter T. Daniels" <grammatim@verizon.net> - 2015-12-28 19:58 -0800
            Re: White Privilege "Peter Duncanson [BrE]" <mail@peterduncanson.net> - 2015-12-27 22:26 +0000
            Re: White Privilege Peter Moylan <peter@pmoylan.org.invalid> - 2015-12-28 20:23 +1100
              Re: White Privilege Cheryl <cperkins@mun.ca> - 2015-12-28 08:45 -0330
                Re: White Privilege HVS <usenet@REMOVETHISwhhvs.co.uk> - 2015-12-28 14:31 +0000
                Re: White Privilege Cheryl <cperkins@mun.ca> - 2015-12-28 11:53 -0330
                Re: White Privilege David Kleinecke <dkleinecke@gmail.com> - 2015-12-28 10:18 -0800
                Re: White Privilege Cheryl <cperkins@mun.ca> - 2015-12-28 15:52 -0330
                Re: White Privilege Oliver Cromm <lispamateur@crommatograph.info> - 2015-12-28 14:54 -0500
                Re: White Privilege David Kleinecke <dkleinecke@gmail.com> - 2015-12-28 14:14 -0800
                Re: White Privilege Philip Lantz <prl@canterey.us> - 2015-12-31 01:24 -0800
                Re: White Privilege David Kleinecke <dkleinecke@gmail.com> - 2015-12-31 09:38 -0800
                Re: White Privilege "Peter T. Daniels" <grammatim@verizon.net> - 2015-12-31 11:16 -0800
                Re: White Privilege David Kleinecke <dkleinecke@gmail.com> - 2015-12-31 12:31 -0800
                Re: White Privilege "Peter T. Daniels" <grammatim@verizon.net> - 2016-01-01 06:03 -0800
                Re: White Privilege Oliver Cromm <lispamateur@crommatograph.info> - 2016-01-04 09:12 -0500
                Re: White Privilege Jerry Friedman <jerry_friedman@yahoo.com> - 2016-01-04 07:26 -0800
                Re: White Privilege Oliver Cromm <lispamateur@crommatograph.info> - 2015-12-28 15:09 -0500
                Re: White Privilege Cheryl <cperkins@mun.ca> - 2015-12-28 16:55 -0330
                Re: White Privilege Oliver Cromm <lispamateur@crommatograph.info> - 2016-01-04 12:56 -0500
                Re: White Privilege RH Draney <dadoctah@cox.net> - 2016-01-04 14:07 -0700
                Re: White Privilege Mike Barnes <mikebarnes333@gmail.com> - 2016-01-04 22:07 +0000
                Re: White Privilege wollman@bimajority.org (Garrett Wollman) - 2016-01-04 21:57 +0000
                Re: White Privilege Oliver Cromm <lispamateur@crommatograph.info> - 2016-01-04 17:36 -0500
                Re: White Privilege wollman@bimajority.org (Garrett Wollman) - 2016-01-05 01:24 +0000
                Re: White Privilege Rich Ulrich <rich.ulrich@comcast.net> - 2016-01-04 21:14 -0500
                Re: White Privilege RH Draney <dadoctah@cox.net> - 2015-12-28 15:59 -0700
                Re: White Privilege msb@vex.net (Mark Brader) - 2015-12-28 18:20 -0600
                Re: White Privilege Tony Cooper <tonycooper214@gmail.com> - 2015-12-28 19:45 -0500
                Re: White Privilege RH Draney <dadoctah@cox.net> - 2015-12-28 17:53 -0700
                Re: White Privilege msb@vex.net (Mark Brader) - 2015-12-28 22:53 -0600
                Re: White Privilege Richard Yates <richard@yatesguitar.com> - 2015-12-28 21:08 -0800
                Re: White Privilege RH Draney <dadoctah@cox.net> - 2015-12-28 22:54 -0700
                Re: White Privilege msb@vex.net (Mark Brader) - 2015-12-29 06:23 -0600
                Re: White Privilege Peter Moylan <peter@pmoylan.org.invalid> - 2015-12-30 11:51 +1100
                Re: White Privilege RH Draney <dadoctah@cox.net> - 2015-12-29 18:58 -0700
                Re: White Privilege msb@vex.net (Mark Brader) - 2015-12-29 22:19 -0600
                Re: White Privilege bill van <billvan@delete.shaw.ca> - 2015-12-29 21:04 -0800
                Re: White Privilege "Peter T. Daniels" <grammatim@verizon.net> - 2015-12-30 07:01 -0800
                Re: White Privilege Horace LaBadie <hlabadie@nospam.com> - 2015-12-30 11:47 -0500
                Re: White Privilege Philip Lantz <prl@canterey.us> - 2015-12-31 01:30 -0800
                Re: White Privilege Philip Lantz <prl@canterey.us> - 2015-12-31 01:37 -0800
                Re: White Privilege "Peter T. Daniels" <grammatim@verizon.net> - 2015-12-28 20:02 -0800
                Re: White Privilege RH Draney <dadoctah@cox.net> - 2015-12-28 22:55 -0700
                Re: White Privilege Athel Cornish-Bowden <acornish@imm.cnrs.fr> - 2015-12-29 11:08 +0100
                Re: White Privilege Peter Moylan <peter@pmoylan.org.invalid> - 2015-12-29 15:57 +1100
                Re: White Privilege "Peter T. Daniels" <grammatim@verizon.net> - 2015-12-28 08:44 -0800
                Re: White Privilege "Dr. HotSalt" <alien8752@gmail.com> - 2015-12-28 18:09 -0800
                Re: White Privilege RH Draney <dadoctah@cox.net> - 2015-12-28 20:50 -0700
                Re: White Privilege Jerry Friedman <jerry_friedman@yahoo.com> - 2015-12-28 20:44 -0800
                Re: White Privilege "Peter T. Daniels" <grammatim@verizon.net> - 2015-12-29 06:49 -0800
                Re: White Privilege rcpj@panix.com (Pierre Jelenc) - 2015-12-29 17:18 +0000
                Re: White Privilege Peter Moylan <peter@pmoylan.org.invalid> - 2015-12-29 15:48 +1100
                Re: White Privilege RH Draney <dadoctah@cox.net> - 2015-12-28 22:57 -0700
                Re: White Privilege Cheryl <cperkins@mun.ca> - 2015-12-29 08:42 -0330
                Re: White Privilege Oliver Cromm <lispamateur@crommatograph.info> - 2016-01-04 12:56 -0500
                Re: White Privilege Will Parsons <varro@nodomain.invalid> - 2016-01-04 18:38 +0000
                Re: White Privilege David Kleinecke <dkleinecke@gmail.com> - 2016-01-04 12:03 -0800
                Re: White Privilege Oliver Cromm <lispamateur@crommatograph.info> - 2016-01-04 17:36 -0500
                Re: White Privilege Tony Cooper <tonycooper214@gmail.com> - 2016-01-04 18:03 -0500
                Re: White Privilege David Kleinecke <dkleinecke@gmail.com> - 2016-01-04 16:11 -0800
                Re: White Privilege Oliver Cromm <lispamateur@crommatograph.info> - 2016-01-04 17:36 -0500
                Re: White Privilege Cheryl <cperkins@mun.ca> - 2016-01-04 19:14 -0330
                Re: White Privilege richard@cogsci.ed.ac.uk (Richard Tobin) - 2016-01-04 22:52 +0000
                Re: White Privilege wollman@bimajority.org (Garrett Wollman) - 2016-01-05 01:34 +0000
                Re: White Privilege RH Draney <dadoctah@cox.net> - 2016-01-04 19:55 -0700
                Re: White Privilege Cheryl <cperkins@mun.ca> - 2016-01-05 06:24 -0330
                Re: White Privilege Oliver Cromm <lispamateur@crommatograph.info> - 2016-01-05 13:32 -0500
                Re: White Privilege Peter Moylan <peter@pmoylan.org.invalid> - 2016-01-05 15:20 +1100
                Re: White Privilege Cheryl <cperkins@mun.ca> - 2016-01-04 19:02 -0330
                Re: White Privilege Oliver Cromm <lispamateur@crommatograph.info> - 2016-01-05 13:32 -0500
                Re: White Privilege "Dr. HotSalt" <alien8752@gmail.com> - 2016-01-04 18:49 -0800
                Re: White Privilege "Peter Duncanson [BrE]" <mail@peterduncanson.net> - 2016-01-05 12:02 +0000
                Re: White Privilege msb@vex.net (Mark Brader) - 2015-12-29 06:24 -0600
                Re: White Privilege RH Draney <dadoctah@cox.net> - 2015-12-29 06:01 -0700
                Re: White Privilege msb@vex.net (Mark Brader) - 2015-12-29 22:15 -0600
                Re: White Privilege Jerry Friedman <jerry_friedman@yahoo.com> - 2015-12-29 08:30 -0800
                Re: White Privilege Tony Cooper <tonycooper214@gmail.com> - 2015-12-29 12:28 -0500
                Re: White Privilege Cheryl <cperkins@mun.ca> - 2015-12-29 14:11 -0330
                Re: White Privilege Jerry Friedman <jerry_friedman@yahoo.com> - 2015-12-29 10:29 -0800
                Re: White Privilege Cheryl <cperkins@mun.ca> - 2015-12-29 16:16 -0330
                Re: White Privilege Cheryl <cperkins@mun.ca> - 2015-12-29 16:20 -0330
                Re: White Privilege RH Draney <dadoctah@cox.net> - 2015-12-29 14:05 -0700
                Re: White Privilege Cheryl <cperkins@mun.ca> - 2015-12-29 17:58 -0330
                Re: White Privilege Snidely <snidely.too@gmail.com> - 2016-01-05 23:25 -0800
                Re: White Privilege "Dr. HotSalt" <alien8752@gmail.com> - 2015-12-29 17:58 -0800
                Re: White Privilege Athel Cornish-Bowden <acornish@imm.cnrs.fr> - 2015-12-30 10:27 +0100
                Re: White Privilege Ross <benlizro@ihug.co.nz> - 2015-12-30 01:57 -0800
                Re: White Privilege Jack Campin <bogus@purr.demon.co.uk> - 2015-12-30 10:04 +0000
                Re: White Privilege HVS <usenet@REMOVETHISwhhvs.co.uk> - 2015-12-30 12:01 +0000
                Re: White Privilege Peter Moylan <peter@pmoylan.org.invalid> - 2015-12-30 11:57 +1100
                Re: White Privilege Will Parsons <varro@nodomain.invalid> - 2015-12-30 01:24 +0000
                Re: White Privilege Snidely <snidely.too@gmail.com> - 2016-01-05 23:32 -0800
              Re: White Privilege "Peter T. Daniels" <grammatim@verizon.net> - 2015-12-28 04:20 -0800
          Re: White Privilege "Don Phillipson" <e925@SPAMBLOCK.ncf.ca> - 2015-12-27 14:08 -0500
            Re: White Privilege "Peter T. Daniels" <grammatim@verizon.net> - 2015-12-27 13:23 -0800
            Re: White Privilege Tony Cooper <tonycooper214@gmail.com> - 2015-12-27 16:49 -0500
              Re: White Privilege "Peter T. Daniels" <grammatim@verizon.net> - 2015-12-27 14:07 -0800
              Re: White Privilege RH Draney <dadoctah@cox.net> - 2015-12-27 19:08 -0700
            Re: White Privilege Jerry Friedman <jerry_friedman@yahoo.com> - 2015-12-27 19:14 -0800
              Re: White Privilege Jerry Friedman <jerry_friedman@yahoo.com> - 2015-12-27 19:19 -0800
        Re: White Privilege "Dr. HotSalt" <alien8752@gmail.com> - 2015-12-27 11:25 -0800
          Re: White Privilege "Peter T. Daniels" <grammatim@verizon.net> - 2015-12-27 13:27 -0800
          Re: White Privilege Snidely <snidely.too@gmail.com> - 2016-01-05 23:37 -0800
            Re: White Privilege RH Draney <dadoctah@cox.net> - 2016-01-06 03:15 -0700
              Re: White Privilege Helen Lacedaemonian <helenofsunnyvale@gmail.com> - 2016-01-06 21:16 -0800
                Re: White Privilege bill van <billvan@delete.shaw.ca> - 2016-01-06 22:51 -0800
        Re: White Privilege Helen Lacedaemonian <helenofsunnyvale@gmail.com> - 2015-12-27 12:19 -0800
        Re: White Privilege Cheryl <cperkins@mun.ca> - 2015-12-27 17:26 -0330
    Re: White Privilege David Kleinecke <dkleinecke@gmail.com> - 2015-12-27 10:36 -0800
      Re: White Privilege Athel Cornish-Bowden <acornish@imm.cnrs.fr> - 2015-12-28 10:12 +0100
    Re: White Privilege Peter Moylan <peter@pmoylan.org.invalid> - 2015-12-28 20:10 +1100

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