Re: energy and mass

From	Bill Sloman <bill.sloman@ieee.org>
Newsgroups	sci.physics.relativity, sci.electronics.design
Subject	Re: energy and mass
Date	2026-03-23 22:31 +1100
Organization	A noiseless patient Spider
Message-ID	<10pr8a3$1db2$5@dont-email.me> (permalink)
References	(21 earlier) <n24jl7Fh4t8U9@mid.individual.net> <10pjqkv$1mlp8$3@dont-email.me> <n29qnmFbrurU2@mid.individual.net> <10pojcn$380fj$1@dont-email.me> <n2cavsFnf0rU4@mid.individual.net>

Cross-posted to 2 groups.

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On 23/03/2026 7:21 pm, Thomas Heger wrote:
> Am Sonntag000022, 22.03.2026 um 12:21 schrieb Bill Sloman:
> 
>>>>>>>>> the huge basement was not a compact mess of stone and steel, as 
>>>>>>>>> we would expect, but was almost entirely undamaged.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> As you might expect if you neglected to think about what had 
>>>>>>>> actually happened.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> No, not at all.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I personally thought, that an exotic weapon was used, which could 
>>>>>>> turn large structures of steel and concrete into fine dust.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> But I would have doubts about al-quida having such a device.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Or anybody else.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> That should shock you, since that would mean, that 80 to 90% of 
>>>>>>>>> the original building materials vanished without a trace.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Dust clouds are ephemeral. They blow away. They don't have to 
>>>>>>>> blow far away to avoid showing up in the basement. 
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Dust blows away, that's true.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> But how would you transform a 400m skyscraper into fine dust??
> ...
>>>>>>> It also happened in mid-air, because the fine dust was blown 
>>>>>>> away, before it had reached the ground.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 400 meters is quite a long way up in the air, and a fierce fire 
>>>>>> generates a lot of air-circulation. 
>>>>>
>>>>> Well, yes 400m is quite a height. But free-falling rubble needs 
>>>>> only a few seconds to pass that distance.
>>
>> 9.032 seconds. It gets up to a speed of 88.57m/sec.
> 
> A little wind drag and we get 10 seconds for a piece of rubble to fall 
> down from the roof.

The bulk of the building was below the roof.

> The speed would also be very high and in the range of 300 km/h.

Only if it fell all the way from the roof, and if it didn't slowed down 
the air currents feeding oxygen into the fires and replacing the hot air 
rising out of the fire.

> That would have the momentum of a fast train, which would smash with 
> enormous force against the floor.

If were a large piece of rubble, Stuff isn't going to fall off the 
building until the structural steel embedded in the concrete has got hot 
enough to lose it's structural integrity (and probably start burning to 
iron oxide).

> Such falling steel is used in 'bunker busters', which can penetrate 
> several meters of reinforced concrete.

But they aren't hot when they hit the reinforced concrete. A burning 
building doesn't disintegrate in a way that produces massive projectiles 
designed to penetrate cold reinforced concrete.

> Since the towers were extremly large, there would have been an enormous 
> number of such falling pieses.
> 
> The WTC-plaza should have looked like a target for bombing in a 
> jet-fighter training range.

In your not-all-that-well-inforned opinion.

> But that wasn't the case!
> 
> Instead of being totally destroyed, the WTC-plaza looked almost entirely 
> unharmed.
> 
> On the following day the street level was clearly visible and seemingly 
> undamaged.
> 
> E.g. you can see delivery- and fire-trucks in the rubble, which looked a 
> little dusty and had been hit by smaller parts. But the glass of their 
> windows wasn't broken.
> 
> Also the statue 'The Sphere' was a little damaged, but stood still upon 
> its pedestal and that on the WTC-plaza.
> 
>  From this we can draw the conclusion, that only a few/none of the 
> heavier parts falling down from up to 410 m made it to the ground.

Only if you ignore most of the evidence.

> This fact is actually quite surprising and would deserve an explanation.

The actual facts have been looked into at length

The post you are ostensibly responding to included this link.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Collapse_of_the_World_Trade_Center

which you seem to have snipped.

It is quite detailed, and seems to suggest that the towers collapsed one 
floor at a time, so most the debris fell one floor and provoked the 
collapse of the next floor, rather than falling unimpeded. Some of the 
outer columns peeled off and fell outwards, hitting adjacent buildings 
on the way down.

Nobody seem to have felt the need to invoke external forces to explain 
what happened.

-- 
Bill Sloman, Sydney

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Re: energy and mass Ross Finlayson <ross.a.finlayson@gmail.com> - 2026-03-14 20:14 -0700
  Re: energy and mass Bill Sloman <bill.sloman@ieee.org> - 2026-03-15 16:16 +1100
    Re: energy and mass Ross Finlayson <ross.a.finlayson@gmail.com> - 2026-03-15 06:58 -0700
      Re: energy and mass Ross Finlayson <ross.a.finlayson@gmail.com> - 2026-03-15 08:13 -0700
    Re: energy and mass Jeroen Belleman <jeroen@nospam.please> - 2026-03-15 17:01 +0100
      Re: energy and mass Ross Finlayson <ross.a.finlayson@gmail.com> - 2026-03-15 09:39 -0700
        Re: energy and mass Ross Finlayson <ross.a.finlayson@gmail.com> - 2026-03-15 09:55 -0700
        Re: energy and mass Bill Sloman <bill.sloman@ieee.org> - 2026-03-16 15:16 +1100
          Re: energy and mass Ross Finlayson <ross.a.finlayson@gmail.com> - 2026-03-16 05:21 -0700
            Re: energy and mass Bill Sloman <bill.sloman@ieee.org> - 2026-03-17 02:10 +1100
              Re: energy and mass Ross Finlayson <ross.a.finlayson@gmail.com> - 2026-03-16 10:56 -0700
                Re: energy and mass Ross Finlayson <ross.a.finlayson@gmail.com> - 2026-03-16 11:29 -0700
                Re: energy and mass Bill Sloman <bill.sloman@ieee.org> - 2026-03-17 18:44 +1100
                Re: energy and mass Ross Finlayson <ross.a.finlayson@gmail.com> - 2026-03-17 07:57 -0700
                Re: energy and mass Bill Sloman <bill.sloman@ieee.org> - 2026-03-18 04:25 +1100
                Re: energy and mass Bill Sloman <bill.sloman@ieee.org> - 2026-03-17 18:35 +1100
      Re: energy and mass Bill Sloman <bill.sloman@ieee.org> - 2026-03-16 15:01 +1100
        Re: energy and mass Jeroen Belleman <jeroen@nospam.please> - 2026-03-16 11:00 +0100
          Re: energy and mass Bill Sloman <bill.sloman@ieee.org> - 2026-03-17 02:18 +1100
          Re: energy and mass john larkin <jl@glen--canyon.com> - 2026-03-16 08:34 -0700
            Re: energy and mass Ross Finlayson <ross.a.finlayson@gmail.com> - 2026-03-16 11:02 -0700
              Re: energy and mass john larkin <jl@glen--canyon.com> - 2026-03-17 07:20 -0700
                Re: energy and mass Ross Finlayson <ross.a.finlayson@gmail.com> - 2026-03-17 08:12 -0700
                Re: energy and mass Bill Sloman <bill.sloman@ieee.org> - 2026-03-18 06:56 +1100
                Re: energy and mass Ross Finlayson <ross.a.finlayson@gmail.com> - 2026-03-17 14:47 -0700
            Re: energy and mass nospam@de-ster.demon.nl (J. J. Lodder) - 2026-03-16 22:24 +0100
            Re: energy and mass Bill Sloman <bill.sloman@ieee.org> - 2026-03-17 18:49 +1100
              Re: energy and mass Ross Finlayson <ross.a.finlayson@gmail.com> - 2026-03-17 08:03 -0700
                Re: energy and mass Bill Sloman <bill.sloman@ieee.org> - 2026-03-18 04:37 +1100
                Re: energy and mass Ross Finlayson <ross.a.finlayson@gmail.com> - 2026-03-17 14:43 -0700
                Re: energy and mass Bill Sloman <bill.sloman@ieee.org> - 2026-03-18 16:05 +1100
                Re: energy and mass Ross Finlayson <ross.a.finlayson@gmail.com> - 2026-03-18 07:39 -0700
                Re: energy and mass Ross Finlayson <ross.a.finlayson@gmail.com> - 2026-03-18 09:07 -0700
    Re: energy and mass Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2026-03-18 09:11 +0100
      Re: energy and mass Bill Sloman <bill.sloman@ieee.org> - 2026-03-18 21:28 +1100
        Re: energy and mass Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2026-03-19 12:10 +0100
          Re: energy and mass Bill Sloman <bill.sloman@ieee.org> - 2026-03-20 01:35 +1100
            Re: energy and mass Ross Finlayson <ross.a.finlayson@gmail.com> - 2026-03-19 07:44 -0700
              Re: energy and mass Ross Finlayson <ross.a.finlayson@gmail.com> - 2026-03-19 07:52 -0700
                Re: energy and mass Ross Finlayson <ross.a.finlayson@gmail.com> - 2026-03-20 09:42 -0700
                Re: energy and mass Ross Finlayson <ross.a.finlayson@gmail.com> - 2026-03-20 09:58 -0700
                Re: energy and mass Ross Finlayson <ross.a.finlayson@gmail.com> - 2026-03-20 10:28 -0700
            Re: energy and mass Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2026-03-20 11:00 +0100
              Re: energy and mass Bill Sloman <bill.sloman@ieee.org> - 2026-03-21 02:54 +1100
                Re: energy and mass Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2026-03-22 10:31 +0100
                Re: energy and mass Bill Sloman <bill.sloman@ieee.org> - 2026-03-22 22:21 +1100
                Re: energy and mass Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2026-03-23 09:21 +0100
                Re: energy and mass Bill Sloman <bill.sloman@ieee.org> - 2026-03-23 22:31 +1100
                Re: energy and mass Ross Finlayson <ross.a.finlayson@gmail.com> - 2026-03-23 08:11 -0700
                Re: energy and mass Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2026-03-25 09:02 +0100
                Re: energy and mass Bill Sloman <bill.sloman@ieee.org> - 2026-03-25 21:40 +1100
                Re: energy and mass Ross Finlayson <ross.a.finlayson@gmail.com> - 2026-03-25 07:26 -0700
                Re: energy and mass Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2026-03-27 08:54 +0100
                Re: energy and mass Bill Sloman <bill.sloman@ieee.org> - 2026-03-28 02:51 +1100
                Re: energy and mass Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2026-03-29 09:56 +0200
                Re: energy and mass Daren Remond <ndno@dmrndd.us> - 2026-03-29 13:04 +0000
                Re: energy and mass Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2026-03-30 08:33 +0200
                Re: energy and mass Bill Sloman <bill.sloman@ieee.org> - 2026-03-30 01:32 +1100
                Re: energy and mass Ross Finlayson <ross.a.finlayson@gmail.com> - 2026-03-29 07:39 -0700
                Re: energy and mass Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2026-03-30 08:48 +0200
                Re: energy and mass Bill Sloman <bill.sloman@ieee.org> - 2026-03-30 18:15 +1100
                Re: energy and mass Maciej Woźniak <mlwozniak@wp.pl> - 2026-03-30 10:17 +0200
                Re: energy and mass Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2026-03-31 09:13 +0200
                Re: energy and mass Bill Sloman <bill.sloman@ieee.org> - 2026-03-31 22:46 +1100
                Re: energy and mass Maciej Woźniak <mlwozniak@wp.pl> - 2026-03-31 13:57 +0200
                Re: energy and mass Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2026-03-25 08:59 +0100
                Re: energy and mass Bill Sloman <bill.sloman@ieee.org> - 2026-03-25 22:01 +1100
                Re: energy and mass Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2026-03-26 15:00 +0100
                Re: energy and mass Bill Sloman <bill.sloman@ieee.org> - 2026-03-27 02:47 +1100
                Re: energy and mass Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2026-03-27 09:13 +0100
                Re: energy and mass Bill Sloman <bill.sloman@ieee.org> - 2026-03-28 03:17 +1100
                Re: energy and mass Ross Finlayson <ross.a.finlayson@gmail.com> - 2026-03-27 10:39 -0700
                Re: energy and mass Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2026-03-29 10:19 +0200
                Re: energy and mass Cloro Sandiford <iofnd@dosc.us> - 2026-03-29 13:01 +0000
                Re: energy and mass Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2026-03-30 08:31 +0200
                Re: energy and mass Bill Sloman <bill.sloman@ieee.org> - 2026-03-31 02:45 +1100
                Re: energy and mass Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2026-03-31 09:39 +0200
                Re: energy and mass Bill Sloman <bill.sloman@ieee.org> - 2026-03-31 23:10 +1100
                Re: energy and mass Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2026-04-01 09:47 +0200
                Re: energy and mass Bill Sloman <bill.sloman@ieee.org> - 2026-04-02 02:34 +1100
                Re: energy and mass Maciej Woźniak <mlwozniak@wp.pl> - 2026-04-01 18:23 +0200
                Re: energy and mass Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2026-04-03 10:12 +0200
                Re: energy and mass Bill Sloman <bill.sloman@ieee.org> - 2026-04-03 23:42 +1100
                Re: energy and mass Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2026-04-05 09:57 +0200
                Re: energy and mass Bill Sloman <bill.sloman@ieee.org> - 2026-04-06 02:53 +1000
                Re: energy and mass Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2026-04-06 13:09 +0200
                Re: energy and mass Bill Sloman <bill.sloman@ieee.org> - 2026-04-07 04:11 +1000
                Re: energy and mass Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2026-04-08 09:13 +0200
                Re: energy and mass Bill Sloman <bill.sloman@ieee.org> - 2026-04-08 22:56 +1000
                Re: energy and mass Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2026-04-03 10:31 +0200
                Re: energy and mass Bill Sloman <bill.sloman@ieee.org> - 2026-04-04 03:16 +1100
                Re: energy and mass The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2026-04-03 09:38 -0700
                Re: energy and mass Bill Sloman <bill.sloman@ieee.org> - 2026-04-04 04:15 +1100
                Re: energy and mass The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2026-04-03 23:18 -0700
                Re: energy and mass Bill Sloman <bill.sloman@ieee.org> - 2026-04-04 21:37 +1100
                Re: energy and mass Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2026-04-05 10:14 +0200
                Re: energy and mass Bill Sloman <bill.sloman@ieee.org> - 2026-04-05 20:58 +1000
                Re: energy and mass Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2026-04-06 12:51 +0200
                Re: energy and mass Bill Sloman <bill.sloman@ieee.org> - 2026-04-07 04:27 +1000
          Re: energy and mass The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2026-03-19 11:17 -0700

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