Re: A short history of the stages of development and status of RP's Forth interpreter.

From	jacko <jackokring@gmail.com>
Newsgroups	comp.lang.forth
Subject	Re: A short history of the stages of development and status of RP's Forth interpreter.
Date	2012-04-14 09:04 -0700
Organization	http://groups.google.com
Message-ID	<28276169.1301.1334419440853.JavaMail.geo-discussion-forums@vbuo5> (permalink)
References	(9 earlier) <aee0e39c-a2b3-4d1a-8ba3-4c46e88da7fa@r9g2000yqd.googlegroups.com> <2012Apr13.174811@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at> <4f88a2cd.157452370@192.168.0.50> <PrSdnTUCcti6NRXSnZ2dnUVZ_sSdnZ2d@supernews.com> <96bd986a-eb9d-451e-8d50-f52d9d319066@x17g2000yqj.googlegroups.com>

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On Saturday, 14 April 2012 00:14:08 UTC+1, BruceMcF  wrote:
> On Apr 13, 6:26 pm, "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erat...@forth.com> wrote:
> > I completely agree with Stephen on this. It is possible for an XT to be
> > a direct connection to the executable portion of a word -- that is its
> > purpose. A name may be in a different data space, on a different
> > computer, or even non-existent. Having it be the primary runtime
> > identifier of a word would require some form of indirection, adversely
> > affecting performance.
> 
> As I understood it, the NT proposals I have seen is rather to preserve
> the XT's role, being as direct a connection to the executable portion
> of a word as practicable, and not overload onto it the means of
> accessing a name entry in a dictionary, given that a name may be in a
> different data space, on a different computer, or even non-existent.
> 
> This was in the face of the alternate proposal to address the
> challenges of writing portable programming aids that the XT also be
> sufficient to recover information about the dictionary entry that
> refers to the executable portion of a word, which requires the XT to
> support some form of indirection, adversely affecting performance.

I find that in jarvar, my language I'm developing, a lot of indirection is required to bring a variable onto stack, but the gain is an effective means of decompiling a word definition. Or it will be when I add a SEE word.

> > Moreover, there are reasons to give implementers broad latitude as to
> > the construction of name fields: they may include additional information
> > (such as a link to source files, usage counters, all sorts of stuff) or
> > be highly compressed in some fashion. There are good reasons in
> > different contexts for doing all of these things. If an NT is to be of
> > use, however, something must be standardized about what is at that
> > destination, constraining implementations.
> 
> The balance of the NT proposals I have seen are words that operate on
> NTs, and do not entail standardization of the contents of dictionary
> entries at all. They rather refer to accessing information that we
> know there exists to know about a dictionary entry, given already
> existing standard specifications.

So many NT operation words and a find like word to make an NT into an XT, which is what find does. But is not an NT then just a compact string form?

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Re: A short history of the stages of development and status of RP's Forth interpreter. "Rod Pemberton" <do_not_have@notemailnot.cmm> - 2012-04-10 11:07 -0400
  Re: A short history of the stages of development and status of RP's Forth interpreter. "Rod Pemberton" <do_not_have@notemailnot.cmm> - 2012-04-11 19:00 -0400
    Re: A short history of the stages of development and status of RP's Forth interpreter. BruceMcF <agila61@netscape.net> - 2012-04-11 19:24 -0700
      Re: A short history of the stages of development and status of RP's Forth interpreter. "Rod Pemberton" <do_not_have@notemailnot.cmm> - 2012-04-12 14:03 -0400
        Re: A short history of the stages of development and status of RP's Forth interpreter. "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2012-04-12 08:19 -1000
          Re: A short history of the stages of development and status of RP's Forth interpreter. "Rod Pemberton" <do_not_have@notemailnot.cmm> - 2012-04-14 17:21 -0400
            Re: A short history of the stages of development and status of RP's Forth interpreter. Coos Haak <chforth@hccnet.nl> - 2012-04-15 00:11 +0200
            Re: A short history of the stages of development and status of RP's Forth interpreter. "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2012-04-14 13:48 -1000
              Re: A short history of the stages of development and status of RP's Forth interpreter. "Rod Pemberton" <do_not_have@notemailnot.cmm> - 2012-04-15 13:09 -0400
                Re: A short history of the stages of development and status of RP's Forth interpreter. "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2012-04-15 08:06 -1000
                Re: A short history of the stages of development and status of RP's Forth interpreter. Albert van der Horst <albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl> - 2012-04-16 09:45 +0000
                Re: A short history of the stages of development and status of RP's Forth interpreter. jacko <jackokring@gmail.com> - 2012-04-16 05:26 -0700
                Re: A short history of the stages of development and status of RP's Forth interpreter. BruceMcF <agila61@netscape.net> - 2012-04-15 11:10 -0700
                Re: A short history of the stages of development and status of RP's Forth interpreter. "Rod Pemberton" <do_not_have@notemailnot.cmm> - 2012-04-15 17:57 -0400
                Re: A short history of the stages of development and status of RP's Forth interpreter. "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2012-04-15 12:22 -1000
                Re: A short history of the stages of development and status of RP's Forth interpreter. BruceMcF <agila61@netscape.net> - 2012-04-15 19:35 -0700
                Re: A short history of the stages of development and status of RP's Forth interpreter. "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2012-04-15 16:58 -1000
                Re: A short history of the stages of development and status of RP's Forth interpreter. "Rod Pemberton" <do_not_have@notemailnot.cmm> - 2012-04-16 15:50 -0400
                Re: A short history of the stages of development and status of RP's Forth interpreter. BruceMcF <agila61@netscape.net> - 2012-04-16 13:24 -0700
                Re: A short history of the stages of development and status of RP's Forth interpreter. "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2012-04-16 11:17 -1000
            Re: A short history of the stages of development and status of RP's Forth interpreter. BruceMcF <agila61@netscape.net> - 2012-04-14 17:07 -0700
              Re: A short history of the stages of development and status of RP's Forth interpreter. Mark Wills <markrobertwills@yahoo.co.uk> - 2012-04-14 22:37 -0700
                Re: A short history of the stages of development and status of RP's Forth interpreter. "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2012-04-14 20:54 -1000
                Re: A short history of the stages of development and status of RP's Forth interpreter. Mark Wills <markrobertwills@yahoo.co.uk> - 2012-04-15 00:22 -0700
                Re: A short history of the stages of development and status of RP's Forth interpreter. BruceMcF <agila61@netscape.net> - 2012-04-15 07:00 -0700
        Re: A short history of the stages of development and status of RP's Forth interpreter. BruceMcF <agila61@netscape.net> - 2012-04-12 12:45 -0700
          Re: A short history of the stages of development and status of RP's Forth interpreter. Mark Wills <markrobertwills@yahoo.co.uk> - 2012-04-12 13:29 -0700
            Re: A short history of the stages of development and status of RP's Forth interpreter. BruceMcF <agila61@netscape.net> - 2012-04-12 13:56 -0700
            Re: A short history of the stages of development and status of RP's Forth interpreter. "Rod Pemberton" <do_not_have@notemailnot.cmm> - 2012-04-13 10:25 -0400
              Re: A short history of the stages of development and status of RP's Forth interpreter. BruceMcF <agila61@netscape.net> - 2012-04-13 08:12 -0700
                Re: A short history of the stages of development and status of RP's Forth interpreter. "Rod Pemberton" <do_not_have@notemailnot.cmm> - 2012-04-14 17:22 -0400
                Re: A short history of the stages of development and status of RP's Forth interpreter. BruceMcF <agila61@netscape.net> - 2012-04-14 16:10 -0700
                Re: A short history of the stages of development and status of RP's Forth interpreter. "Rod Pemberton" <do_not_have@notemailnot.cmm> - 2012-04-15 12:53 -0400
                Re: A short history of the stages of development and status of RP's Forth interpreter. BruceMcF <agila61@netscape.net> - 2012-04-15 11:01 -0700
              Re: A short history of the stages of development and status of RP's Forth interpreter. BruceMcF <agila61@netscape.net> - 2012-04-13 08:23 -0700
    Re: A short history of the stages of development and status of RP's Forth interpreter. "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2012-04-11 17:27 -1000
    Re: A short history of the stages of development and status of RP's Forth interpreter. Mark Wills <markrobertwills@yahoo.co.uk> - 2012-04-12 00:19 -0700
      Re: A short history of the stages of development and status of RP's Forth interpreter. "Rod Pemberton" <do_not_have@notemailnot.cmm> - 2012-04-12 13:54 -0400
        Re: A short history of the stages of development and status of RP's Forth interpreter. Mark Wills <markrobertwills@yahoo.co.uk> - 2012-04-12 13:43 -0700
    Re: A short history of the stages of development and status of RP's Forth interpreter. BruceMcF <agila61@netscape.net> - 2012-04-12 06:45 -0700
      Re: A short history of the stages of development and status of RP's  Forth interpreter. anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2012-04-12 15:01 +0000
        Re: A short history of the stages of development and status of RP's  Forth interpreter. "Rod Pemberton" <do_not_have@notemailnot.cmm> - 2012-04-12 13:54 -0400
        Re: A short history of the stages of development and status of RP's Forth interpreter. BruceMcF <agila61@netscape.net> - 2012-04-12 10:49 -0700
          Re: A short history of the stages of development and status of RP's Forth interpreter. "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2012-04-12 08:40 -1000
            Re: A short history of the stages of development and status of RP's Forth interpreter. BruceMcF <agila61@netscape.net> - 2012-04-12 12:38 -0700
              Re: A short history of the stages of development and status of RP's Forth interpreter. "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2012-04-12 13:58 -1000
          Re: A short history of the stages of development and status of RP's  Forth interpreter. anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2012-04-13 10:42 +0000
            Re: A short history of the stages of development and status of RP's Forth interpreter. BruceMcF <agila61@netscape.net> - 2012-04-13 08:34 -0700
              Re: A short history of the stages of development and status of RP's  Forth interpreter. anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2012-04-13 15:48 +0000
                Re: A short history of the stages of development and status of RP's  Forth interpreter. "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2012-04-13 08:25 -1000
                Re: A short history of the stages of development and status of RP's  Forth interpreter. stephenXXX@mpeforth.com (Stephen Pelc) - 2012-04-13 22:08 +0000
                Re: A short history of the stages of development and status of RP's  Forth interpreter. "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2012-04-13 12:26 -1000
                Re: A short history of the stages of development and status of RP's Forth interpreter. BruceMcF <agila61@netscape.net> - 2012-04-13 16:14 -0700
                Re: A short history of the stages of development and status of RP's Forth interpreter. jacko <jackokring@gmail.com> - 2012-04-14 09:04 -0700
                Re: A short history of the stages of development and status of RP's Forth interpreter. BruceMcF <agila61@netscape.net> - 2012-04-14 15:59 -0700
                Re: A short history of the stages of development and status of RP's Forth interpreter. Albert van der Horst <albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl> - 2012-04-15 10:50 +0000
                Re: A short history of the stages of development and status of RP's Forth interpreter. BruceMcF <agila61@netscape.net> - 2012-04-15 07:06 -0700
                XT only or XT+NT (was: A short history ...) anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2012-04-14 14:06 +0000
                Re: XT only or XT+NT (was: A short history ...) Alex McDonald <blog@rivadpm.com> - 2012-04-16 02:39 -0700
            Re: A short history of the stages of development and status of RP's Forth interpreter. BruceMcF <agila61@netscape.net> - 2012-04-13 08:46 -0700
      Re: A short history of the stages of development and status of RP's Forth interpreter. "Rod Pemberton" <do_not_have@notemailnot.cmm> - 2012-04-12 13:53 -0400
    Re: A short history of the stages of development and status of RP's Forth interpreter. "Rod Pemberton" <do_not_have@notemailnot.cmm> - 2012-04-19 17:06 -0400

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