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Groups > linux.debian.user > #194433

Re: utf

From Darac Marjal <mailinglist@darac.org.uk>
Newsgroups linux.debian.user
Subject Re: utf
Date 2018-04-03 11:00 +0200
Message-ID <vApXj-5wU-1@gated-at.bofh.it> (permalink)
References <vzLQd-4cg-1@gated-at.bofh.it> <vzRsC-8m1-3@gated-at.bofh.it> <vA2o1-6N4-3@gated-at.bofh.it>
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On Mon, Apr 02, 2018 at 09:39:05AM +0200, Andre Majorel wrote:
>On 2018-04-02 08:00 +1200, Ben Caradoc-Davies wrote:
>> On 02/04/18 02:05, mess-mate wrote:
>> >howto change the system utf to eu character set ?
>>
>> Why? UTF (especially UTF-8) is vastly superior for all purposes:
>
>I wouldn't say that. UTF-8 breaks a number of assumptions. For
>instance,
>1) every character has the same size,
>2) every byte sequence is a valid character,
>3) the equality or inequality of two characters comes down to
>   the equality or inequality of the bytes they encode to.

If these things matter to you, it's better to convert from UTF-8 to 
Unicode, first. I tend to think of Unicode as an arbitrarily large code 
page. Each character maps to a number, but that number could be 1, 1000 
or 500_000 (Unicode seems to be growing without might end in sight). 
Internally, you might store those code points as Integers or QUad Words 
or whatever you like. Only once you're ready to transfer the text to 
another process (print on screen, save to a file, stream across a 
network), do you convert the Unicode back into UTF-8.

Basically, you consider UTF-8 to be a transfer-only format (like 
Base64). If you want to do anything non-trivial with it, decode it into 
Unicode.

>
>With ASCII and the many encodings based on it, most things can
>be done without having knowledge of the encoding. With UTF-8,
>even basic operations like determining the length of a string or
>reporting at what column an error occurred require knowledge of
>the encoding.
>
>-- 
>André Majorel <http://www.teaser.fr/~amajorel/>
>Imagine what would happen if the Debian project disclosed the email
>addresses of their users. Spambots would harvest them and Debian
>users would be inundated with spam. Good thing they don't, eh ?
>

-- 
For more information, please reread.

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Thread

utf mess-mate <mess-mate@gmx.com> - 2018-04-01 16:10 +0200
  Re: utf Curt <curty@free.fr> - 2018-04-01 17:50 +0200
  Re: utf Ionel Mugurel Ciobîcă <I.M.Ciobica@upcmail.nl> - 2018-04-01 18:30 +0200
  Re: utf Andre Majorel <aym-naibed@teaser.fr> - 2018-04-01 18:40 +0200
  Re: utf Ben Caradoc-Davies <ben@transient.nz> - 2018-04-01 22:10 +0200
    Re: utf Cindy-Sue Causey <butterflybytes@gmail.com> - 2018-04-02 00:50 +0200
      Re: utf Curt <curty@free.fr> - 2018-04-02 09:50 +0200
        Re: utf Richard Hector <richard@walnut.gen.nz> - 2018-04-02 11:40 +0200
        Re: utf Greg Wooledge <wooledg@eeg.ccf.org> - 2018-04-02 15:30 +0200
    Re: utf Andre Majorel <aym-naibed@teaser.fr> - 2018-04-02 09:50 +0200
      Invalid UTF-8 byte? (was: Re: utf) rhkramer@gmail.com - 2018-04-02 14:40 +0200
        Re: Invalid UTF-8 byte? (was: Re: utf) <tomas@tuxteam.de> - 2018-04-02 15:10 +0200
        Re: Invalid UTF-8 byte? (was: Re: utf) Henrique de Moraes Holschuh <hmh@debian.org> - 2018-04-02 15:10 +0200
          Re: Invalid UTF-8 byte? (was: Re: utf) rhkramer@gmail.com - 2018-04-02 19:50 +0200
            Re: Invalid UTF-8 byte? (was: Re: utf) Henrique de Moraes Holschuh <hmh@debian.org> - 2018-04-02 20:20 +0200
              Re: Invalid UTF-8 byte? (was: Re: utf) <tomas@tuxteam.de> - 2018-04-02 20:50 +0200
                Re: Invalid UTF-8 byte? (was: Re: utf) tomas@tuxteam.de - 2018-04-02 21:00 +0200
                Re: Invalid UTF-8 byte? (was: Re: utf) rhkramer@gmail.com - 2018-04-02 21:10 +0200
        Re: Invalid UTF-8 byte? (was: Re: utf) Michael Lange <klappnase@freenet.de> - 2018-04-03 00:50 +0200
          Re: Invalid UTF-8 byte? (was: Re: utf) rhkramer@gmail.com - 2018-04-03 13:50 +0200
            Re: Invalid UTF-8 byte? (was: Re: utf) Nicolas George <george@nsup.org> - 2018-04-03 14:00 +0200
              Re: Invalid UTF-8 byte? (was: Re: utf) rhkramer@gmail.com - 2018-04-03 14:30 +0200
            Re: Invalid UTF-8 byte? (was: Re: utf) Michael Lange <klappnase@freenet.de> - 2018-04-03 14:10 +0200
              Re: Invalid UTF-8 byte? (was: Re: utf) Michael Lange <klappnase@freenet.de> - 2018-04-03 14:20 +0200
                Re: Invalid UTF-8 byte? (was: Re: utf) <tomas@tuxteam.de> - 2018-04-03 14:40 +0200
                Re: Invalid UTF-8 byte? (was: Re: utf) Michael Lange <klappnase@freenet.de> - 2018-04-03 21:50 +0200
                Re: Invalid UTF-8 byte? (was: Re: utf) Greg Wooledge <wooledg@eeg.ccf.org> - 2018-04-03 21:50 +0200
                Re: Invalid UTF-8 byte? (was: Re: utf) Michael Lange <klappnase@freenet.de> - 2018-04-03 22:10 +0200
                Re: Invalid UTF-8 byte? (was: Re: utf) Greg Wooledge <wooledg@eeg.ccf.org> - 2018-04-03 14:40 +0200
                Re: Invalid UTF-8 byte? (was: Re: utf) rhkramer@gmail.com - 2018-04-04 03:10 +0200
                Re: Invalid UTF-8 byte? (was: Re: utf) rhkramer@gmail.com - 2018-04-04 03:20 +0200
                Re: Invalid UTF-8 byte? (was: Re: utf) Nicolas George <george@nsup.org> - 2018-04-04 13:30 +0200
                Re: Invalid UTF-8 byte? (was: Re: utf) rhkramer@gmail.com - 2018-04-04 14:10 +0200
                Re: Invalid UTF-8 byte? (was: Re: utf) Nicolas George <george@nsup.org> - 2018-04-04 14:10 +0200
                Re: Invalid UTF-8 byte? (was: Re: utf) rhkramer@gmail.com - 2018-04-04 14:50 +0200
                Re: Invalid UTF-8 byte? (was: Re: utf) Nicolas George <george@nsup.org> - 2018-04-04 15:00 +0200
                Re: Invalid UTF-8 byte? (was: Re: utf) Andre Majorel <aym-naibed@teaser.fr> - 2018-04-04 16:20 +0200
                Re: Invalid UTF-8 byte? (was: Re: utf) Greg Wooledge <wooledg@eeg.ccf.org> - 2018-04-04 16:30 +0200
                Re: Invalid UTF-8 byte? (was: Re: utf) rhkramer@gmail.com - 2018-04-04 18:00 +0200
                Re: Invalid UTF-8 byte? (was: Re: utf) rhkramer@gmail.com - 2018-04-04 18:00 +0200
                Re: Invalid UTF-8 byte? (was: Re: utf) Jonathan de Boyne Pollard <J.deBoynePollard-newsgroups@NTLWorld.COM> - 2018-04-04 20:50 +0200
                Re: Invalid UTF-8 byte? (was: Re: utf) Greg Wooledge <wooledg@eeg.ccf.org> - 2018-04-04 14:30 +0200
                Re: Invalid UTF-8 byte? (was: Re: utf) rhkramer@gmail.com - 2018-04-04 15:10 +0200
                Re: Invalid UTF-8 byte? (was: Re: utf) Don Armstrong <don@debian.org> - 2018-04-04 19:40 +0200
                Re: Invalid UTF-8 byte? (was: Re: utf) Nicolas George <george@nsup.org> - 2018-04-04 19:50 +0200
                mbox vs maildir vs better formats [Re: Invalid UTF-8 byte? (was: Re:  utf)] Don Armstrong <don@debian.org> - 2018-04-04 20:00 +0200
                Re: mbox vs maildir vs better formats [Re: Invalid UTF-8 byte? (was:  Re: utf)] Nicolas George <george@nsup.org> - 2018-04-04 20:10 +0200
                Re: Invalid UTF-8 byte? (was: Re: utf) rhkramer@gmail.com - 2018-04-04 20:40 +0200
                Re: Invalid UTF-8 byte? (was: Re: utf) Don Armstrong <don@debian.org> - 2018-04-04 20:50 +0200
                Re: Invalid UTF-8 byte? (was: Re: utf) rhkramer@gmail.com - 2018-04-05 14:40 +0200
                Re: Invalid UTF-8 byte? (was: Re: utf) deloptes <deloptes@gmail.com> - 2018-04-05 00:20 +0200
                Re: Invalid UTF-8 byte? (was: Re: utf) rhkramer@gmail.com - 2018-04-04 21:30 +0200
              Re: Invalid UTF-8 byte? (was: Re: utf) Henrique de Moraes Holschuh <hmh@debian.org> - 2018-04-04 13:20 +0200
                Re: Invalid UTF-8 byte? (was: Re: utf) <tomas@tuxteam.de> - 2018-04-04 16:10 +0200
                Re: Invalid UTF-8 byte? (was: Re: utf) Henrique de Moraes Holschuh <hmh@debian.org> - 2018-04-04 20:50 +0200
                Re: Invalid UTF-8 byte? (was: Re: utf) <tomas@tuxteam.de> - 2018-04-04 21:30 +0200
                Re: Invalid UTF-8 byte? Ben Caradoc-Davies <ben@transient.nz> - 2018-04-04 23:50 +0200
                Re: Invalid UTF-8 byte? Michael Stone <mstone@debian.org> - 2018-04-05 01:00 +0200
                Re: Invalid UTF-8 byte? (was: Re: utf) Jonathan de Boyne Pollard <J.deBoynePollard-newsgroups@NTLWorld.COM> - 2018-04-04 21:00 +0200
        Re: Invalid UTF-8 byte? (was: Re: utf) Jonathan de Boyne Pollard <J.deBoynePollard-newsgroups@NTLWorld.COM> - 2018-04-04 20:30 +0200
          Re: Invalid UTF-8 byte? (was: Re: utf) rhkramer@gmail.com - 2018-04-04 21:30 +0200
      Re: utf Ben Caradoc-Davies <ben@transient.nz> - 2018-04-02 23:40 +0200
      Re: utf Darac Marjal <mailinglist@darac.org.uk> - 2018-04-03 11:00 +0200
        Re: utf Richard Hector <richard@walnut.gen.nz> - 2018-04-03 11:20 +0200
          Re: utf <tomas@tuxteam.de> - 2018-04-03 11:30 +0200
        Re: utf Nicolas George <george@nsup.org> - 2018-04-03 12:20 +0200
        Re: utf Ben Caradoc-Davies <ben@transient.nz> - 2018-04-03 22:50 +0200
          Re: utf Nicolas George <george@nsup.org> - 2018-04-03 23:00 +0200
            Re: utf Greg Wooledge <wooledg@eeg.ccf.org> - 2018-04-03 23:00 +0200
              Re: utf Nicolas George <george@nsup.org> - 2018-04-03 23:30 +0200
                Re: utf deloptes <deloptes@gmail.com> - 2018-04-04 19:00 +0200
                Re: utf Nicolas George <george@nsup.org> - 2018-04-04 19:10 +0200
                Re: utf Greg Wooledge <wooledg@eeg.ccf.org> - 2018-04-04 19:30 +0200
                Re: utf Nicolas George <george@nsup.org> - 2018-04-04 19:40 +0200
                Re: utf deloptes <deloptes@gmail.com> - 2018-04-04 19:40 +0200
                Re: utf Nicolas George <george@nsup.org> - 2018-04-04 19:40 +0200
                Re: utf Greg Wooledge <wooledg@eeg.ccf.org> - 2018-04-04 19:50 +0200
                Re: utf Nicolas George <george@nsup.org> - 2018-04-04 20:00 +0200
                Re: utf deloptes <deloptes@gmail.com> - 2018-04-04 23:20 +0200
                Re: utf Richard Hector <richard@walnut.gen.nz> - 2018-04-05 02:30 +0200
                Re: utf Nicolas George <george@nsup.org> - 2018-04-05 14:10 +0200
                Re: utf Stefan Monnier <monnier@iro.umontreal.ca> - 2018-04-05 00:00 +0200
                Re: utf rhkramer@gmail.com - 2018-04-04 20:30 +0200
                Re: utf Joel Roth <joelz@pobox.com> - 2018-04-04 21:30 +0200
                Re: utf deloptes <deloptes@gmail.com> - 2018-04-04 23:40 +0200
                Re: utf <tomas@tuxteam.de> - 2018-04-05 08:30 +0200
                Re: utf rhkramer@gmail.com - 2018-04-05 14:50 +0200
                Re: utf <tomas@tuxteam.de> - 2018-04-05 15:00 +0200
                Re: utf Nicolas George <george@nsup.org> - 2018-04-05 15:00 +0200
                Re: utf tomas@tuxteam.de - 2018-04-05 15:10 +0200
                Re: utf deloptes <deloptes@gmail.com> - 2018-04-05 21:40 +0200
                Re: utf Stefan Monnier <monnier@iro.umontreal.ca> - 2018-04-05 23:30 +0200
                Re: utf deloptes <deloptes@gmail.com> - 2018-04-05 23:40 +0200
                Re: utf Stefan Monnier <monnier@iro.umontreal.ca> - 2018-04-06 03:20 +0200
                Re: utf <tomas@tuxteam.de> - 2018-04-06 09:00 +0200
                Re: utf Ben Caradoc-Davies <ben@transient.nz> - 2018-04-06 04:20 +0200
                Re: utf <tomas@tuxteam.de> - 2018-04-06 09:10 +0200
                Re: utf Stefan Monnier <monnier@iro.umontreal.ca> - 2018-04-05 19:00 +0200
                Re: utf rhkramer@gmail.com - 2018-04-05 20:00 +0200
              Re: utf Stefan Monnier <monnier@iro.umontreal.ca> - 2018-04-03 23:40 +0200
        Re: utf Henrique de Moraes Holschuh <hmh@debian.org> - 2018-04-04 14:20 +0200

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