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Re: Gravity and light question

From Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com>
Newsgroups sci.physics
Subject Re: Gravity and light question
Date 2016-07-15 13:18 -0500
Organization Aioe.org NNTP Server
Message-ID <nmb9d2$1vf7$2@gioia.aioe.org> (permalink)
References <0a163a49-9fa1-4559-9d24-690bc522b0c6@googlegroups.com> <d325e554-534a-4f0a-b450-d820f6ca40d2@googlegroups.com> <c267b576-2134-458c-af30-6b528f52ebbf@googlegroups.com>

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On 7/15/2016 12:50 PM, mapou001@gmail.com wrote:
> On Friday, July 15, 2016 at 10:41:17 AM UTC-7, edpr...@gmail.com wrote:
>> On Friday, July 15, 2016 at 2:01:12 AM UTC-4, mapo...@gmail.com wrote:
>>> Is there a hypothesis that explains why light falls twice as fast as mass?
>>
>> Actually that is wrong. It is more correct to say that light
>> falls 2 times faster than Newton's theory predicts.
>>
>> Or as put in another way light falls twice as fast as SLOW mass.
>>
>>>
>>> Please, don't offer equations because math explain nothing.
>>> On the contrary, it's the math that needs a physical explanation.
>>
>> (I hope you don't mind a little math.)
>>
>> My simple explanation is that Newton's theory does not account for
>> mass equivalent to the kinetic energy. remember E=Mc^2?
>>
>> Total energy of something is the energy due to it's mass plus
>>  it also has mass due to it's kinetic energy.
>> For things moving much slower than light, this mass is
>>  VERY, Very, very, ..., small.
>>
>> Now the acceleration due to gravity, g, is proportional
>> to the masses, Ma and Mb, multiplied together of both
>> bodies A & B involved.
>>
>> Lets think about motion relative to the larger body A.
>> then body B's total mass is the mass it has when it is
>> not moving (also called it's rest mass) PLUS the mass
>> equivalent of its kinetic energy.
>>
>> If B is moving VERY FAST, then this equivalent mass can
>> change the value of the acceleration g.
>>
>> For light the math has to be done a little differently
>> but the idea is the same. As a result the value of g
>> (the rate the smaller body "falls") is twice as large
>> using relativity theory than Newtonian theory.
>>
>> look here for some of the mathematical explanation:
>> http://arxiv.org/pdf/gr-qc/9909014v1.pdf
>>
>> That paper also make the same (IMHO) erroneous description,
>> but otherwise it seem quite good.
>
> Yeah, but this violates the equivalence principle.

No, it doesn't. I don't know why you think it does.

> Also, I have read somewhere that GR predicts that light falls
> slower (not faster) than ordinary massive particles.

Can you remember where you read this?

(If you can't remember where you read something, how confident are you 
in how well you remember what you read?)

> This, too, would break the EP.
>


-- 
Odd Bodkin --- maker of fine toys, tools, tables

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Gravity and light question mapou001@gmail.com - 2016-07-14 23:01 -0700
  Re: Gravity and light question Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-07-15 07:25 -0500
    Re: Gravity and light question mapou001@gmail.com - 2016-07-15 08:36 -0700
      Re: Gravity and light question Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-07-15 10:41 -0500
      Re: Gravity and light question Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-07-15 11:02 -0500
        Re: Gravity and light question edprochak@gmail.com - 2016-07-15 10:46 -0700
          Re: Gravity and light question Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-07-15 13:11 -0500
            Re: Gravity and light question Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2016-07-17 16:30 +0200
              Re: Gravity and light question Sergio <invalid@invalid.com> - 2016-07-17 11:15 -0500
              Re: Gravity and light question Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-07-17 15:29 -0500
                Re: Gravity and light question Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2016-07-18 00:16 +0200
                Re: Gravity and light question Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-07-18 06:39 -0500
                Re: Gravity and light question xxein1@att.net - 2016-07-18 09:32 -0700
                Re: Gravity and light question Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2016-07-18 22:55 +0200
  Re: Gravity and light question Sergio <invalid@invalid.com> - 2016-07-15 09:33 -0500
    Re: Gravity and light question mapou001@gmail.com - 2016-07-15 08:36 -0700
      Re: Gravity and light question Sergio <invalid@invalid.com> - 2016-07-15 11:25 -0500
        Re: Gravity and light question "reber g=emc^2" <herbertglazier0@gmail.com> - 2016-07-15 10:02 -0700
    Re: Gravity and light question edprochak@gmail.com - 2016-07-15 10:42 -0700
      Re: Gravity and light question Sergio <invalid@invalid.com> - 2016-07-15 14:22 -0500
  glightinos noTthaTguY <abu.kuanysh05@gmail.com> - 2016-07-15 10:06 -0700
  Re: Gravity and light question mapou001@gmail.com - 2016-07-15 10:40 -0700
    Re: Gravity and light question mapou001@gmail.com - 2016-07-15 10:42 -0700
      Re: Gravity and light question edprochak@gmail.com - 2016-07-15 10:51 -0700
        Re: Gravity and light question mapou001@gmail.com - 2016-07-15 11:05 -0700
          Re: Gravity and light question Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-07-15 13:23 -0500
            Re: Gravity and light question mapou001@gmail.com - 2016-07-15 11:31 -0700
              Re: Gravity and light question Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-07-15 13:40 -0500
                Re: Gravity and light question mapou001@gmail.com - 2016-07-15 11:47 -0700
                Re: Gravity and light question Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-07-15 13:56 -0500
                Re: Gravity and light question mapou001@gmail.com - 2016-07-15 11:54 -0700
                Re: Gravity and light question Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-07-15 13:58 -0500
              Re: Gravity and light question edprochak@gmail.com - 2016-07-18 10:29 -0700
                Re: Gravity and light question mapou001@gmail.com - 2016-07-18 11:09 -0700
                Re: Gravity and light question edprochak@gmail.com - 2016-07-19 09:45 -0700
                Re: Gravity and light question mapou001@gmail.com - 2016-07-19 09:59 -0700
                Re: Gravity and light question Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-07-19 12:59 -0500
                Re: Gravity and light question mapou001@gmail.com - 2016-07-19 11:15 -0700
          Re: Gravity and light question edprochak@gmail.com - 2016-07-18 09:56 -0700
            Re: Gravity and light question mapou001@gmail.com - 2016-07-18 10:03 -0700
              Re: Gravity and light question Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-07-18 12:22 -0500
              Re: Gravity and light question Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-07-18 12:38 -0500
                Re: Gravity and light question mapou001@gmail.com - 2016-07-18 11:04 -0700
                Re: Gravity and light question Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-07-18 13:25 -0500
                Re: Gravity and light question mapou001@gmail.com - 2016-07-18 11:45 -0700
                Re: Gravity and light question Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-07-18 14:12 -0500
                Re: Gravity and light question Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-07-18 14:19 -0500
                Re: Gravity and light question mapou001@gmail.com - 2016-07-18 12:24 -0700
                Re: Gravity and light question Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-07-18 14:33 -0500
                Re: Gravity and light question xxein1@att.net - 2016-07-18 14:01 -0700
                Re: Gravity and light question Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-07-18 16:13 -0500
                Re: Gravity and light question benj <benj@nobody.net> - 2016-07-18 19:02 -0400
                Re: Gravity and light question mapou001@gmail.com - 2016-07-18 16:45 -0700
                Re: Gravity and light question Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-07-19 13:12 -0500
                Re: Gravity and light question mapou001@gmail.com - 2016-07-19 11:17 -0700
                Re: Gravity and light question Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-07-19 13:46 -0500
                Re: Gravity and light question mapou001@gmail.com - 2016-07-19 11:51 -0700
                Re: Gravity and light question Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-07-19 13:58 -0500
                Re: Gravity and light question mapou001@gmail.com - 2016-07-19 12:11 -0700
                Re: Gravity and light question Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-07-19 14:19 -0500
                Re: Gravity and light question mapou001@gmail.com - 2016-07-19 12:30 -0700
                Re: Gravity and light question Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-07-19 14:38 -0500
                Re: Gravity and light question mapou001@gmail.com - 2016-07-19 12:43 -0700
                Re: Gravity and light question Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-07-19 15:08 -0500
                Re: Gravity and light question mapou001@gmail.com - 2016-07-19 13:26 -0700
      Re: Gravity and light question Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-07-15 13:15 -0500
    Re: Gravity and light question Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-07-15 12:54 -0500
  Re: Gravity and light question edprochak@gmail.com - 2016-07-15 10:41 -0700
    Re: Gravity and light question mapou001@gmail.com - 2016-07-15 10:50 -0700
      Re: Gravity and light question Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-07-15 13:18 -0500
        Re: Gravity and light question mapou001@gmail.com - 2016-07-15 11:22 -0700
          Re: Gravity and light question Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-07-15 13:36 -0500
            Re: Gravity and light question mapou001@gmail.com - 2016-07-15 11:43 -0700
              Re: Gravity and light question Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-07-15 13:49 -0500
                Re: Gravity and light question mapou001@gmail.com - 2016-07-15 11:58 -0700
                Re: Gravity and light question Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-07-15 14:01 -0500
                Re: Gravity and light question mapou001@gmail.com - 2016-07-15 12:06 -0700
                Re: Gravity and light question Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-07-15 14:17 -0500
                Re: Gravity and light question mapou001@gmail.com - 2016-07-15 12:19 -0700
                Re: Gravity and light question Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-07-15 14:29 -0500
                Re: Gravity and light question Sergio <invalid@invalid.com> - 2016-07-15 14:23 -0500
                Re: Gravity and light question mapou001@gmail.com - 2016-07-15 12:33 -0700
                Re: Gravity and light question Sergio <invalid@invalid.com> - 2016-07-15 16:58 -0500
  Re: Gravity and light question mapou001@gmail.com - 2016-07-15 13:18 -0700
    Re: Gravity and light question mapou001@gmail.com - 2016-07-15 13:34 -0700
      Re: Gravity and light question pnalsing@gmail.com - 2016-07-15 15:19 -0700
        Re: Gravity and light question mapou001@gmail.com - 2016-07-15 15:29 -0700
          Re: Gravity and light question pnalsing@gmail.com - 2016-07-15 16:15 -0700
            Re: Gravity and light question mapou001@gmail.com - 2016-07-15 16:17 -0700
              Re: Gravity and light question pnalsing@gmail.com - 2016-07-15 16:46 -0700
                Re: Gravity and light question mapou001@gmail.com - 2016-07-15 17:14 -0700
                Re: Gravity and light question pnalsing@gmail.com - 2016-07-15 17:55 -0700
                Re: Gravity and light question mapou001@gmail.com - 2016-07-15 18:08 -0700
                Re: Gravity and light question pnalsing@gmail.com - 2016-07-15 19:47 -0700
      Re: Gravity and light question Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-07-17 15:41 -0500
        Re: Gravity and light question mapou001@gmail.com - 2016-07-17 14:08 -0700
          Re: Gravity and light question Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-07-18 06:38 -0500
    Re: Gravity and light question Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-07-15 15:38 -0500
      Re: Gravity and light question mapou001@gmail.com - 2016-07-15 14:03 -0700
        Re: Gravity and light question Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-07-16 13:02 -0500
          Re: Gravity and light question mapou001@gmail.com - 2016-07-16 12:56 -0700
            Re: Gravity and light question pnalsing@gmail.com - 2016-07-16 14:02 -0700
              Re: Gravity and light question mapou001@gmail.com - 2016-07-16 14:10 -0700
                Re: Gravity and light question Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-07-16 16:38 -0500
                Re: Gravity and light question mapou001@gmail.com - 2016-07-16 14:46 -0700
            Re: Gravity and light question Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-07-16 16:36 -0500
              Re: Gravity and light question mapou001@gmail.com - 2016-07-16 14:45 -0700
                Re: Gravity and light question Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-07-16 16:48 -0500
                Re: Gravity and light question mapou001@gmail.com - 2016-07-16 15:10 -0700
                Re: Gravity and light question mapou001@gmail.com - 2016-07-16 16:11 -0700
                Re: Gravity and light question pnalsing@gmail.com - 2016-07-16 18:18 -0700
                Re: Gravity and light question mapou001@gmail.com - 2016-07-16 19:40 -0700
                Re: Gravity and light question pnalsing@gmail.com - 2016-07-16 23:35 -0700
                Re: Gravity and light question mapou001@gmail.com - 2016-07-17 00:35 -0700
                Re: Gravity and light question Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-07-17 15:24 -0500
                Re: Gravity and light question xxein1@att.net - 2016-07-16 22:22 -0700
                Re: Gravity and light question Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-07-17 15:22 -0500
    all properties of light are wave(y\s, including the photon-electrical effect noTthaTguY <abu.kuanysh05@gmail.com> - 2016-07-16 17:03 -0700
  Re: Gravity and light question mapou001@gmail.com - 2016-07-15 16:42 -0700
    Re: Gravity and light question Sergio <invalid@invalid.com> - 2016-07-17 16:37 -0500
  Re: Gravity and light question "nuny@bid.nes" <Alien8752@gmail.com> - 2016-07-17 13:15 -0700
    Re: Gravity and light question mapou001@gmail.com - 2016-07-17 13:17 -0700
      Re: Gravity and light question Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-07-17 15:41 -0500

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