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Re: Gravity and light question

From Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com>
Newsgroups sci.physics
Subject Re: Gravity and light question
Date 2016-07-15 13:11 -0500
Organization Aioe.org NNTP Server
Message-ID <nmb90o$1v6a$1@gioia.aioe.org> (permalink)
References <0a163a49-9fa1-4559-9d24-690bc522b0c6@googlegroups.com> <nmako8$rof$3@gioia.aioe.org> <c3474368-e92e-4f11-a6d7-c04c11def351@googlegroups.com> <nmb1ec$1j11$1@gioia.aioe.org> <49ae83e7-5e93-4cdc-9a44-b6647718669f@googlegroups.com>

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On 7/15/2016 12:46 PM, edprochak@gmail.com wrote:
> On Friday, July 15, 2016 at 12:02:26 PM UTC-4, Odd Bodkin wrote:
>> On 7/15/2016 10:36 AM, mapou001@gmail.com wrote:
>>> On Friday, July 15, 2016 at 5:25:48 AM UTC-7, Odd Bodkin wrote:
>>>> On 7/15/2016 1:01 AM, mapou001@gmail.com wrote:
>>>>> Is there a hypothesis that explains why light falls twice as fast as mass?
>>>>>
>>>>> Please, don't offer equations because math explain nothing. On the contrary,
>>>>> it's the math that needs a physical explanation.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Math is just a shorthand language. Either you know how to read it or you
>>>> don't. But if you have someone that expresses things well in French, it
>>>> is silly to say that French expresses nothing and that French needs to
>>>> be translated into English.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> Odd Bodkin --- maker of fine toys, tools, tables
>>>
>>> Fuck you.
>>>
>>
>> I think I just want to add that you announced you were leaving the
>> newsgroup, and then you didn't.
>>
>> Then you said "adios" to a few people, letting them know you would have
>> nothing more to do with them, and then you didn't follow through on that
>> either.
>>
>> All this is pretty indicative of someone who is all bluster but no
>> substance, a lot of noise and no follow-through, a lot of "gonnas" and
>> no actual doing. I imagine you are very familiar with hearing this comment.
>>
>> --
>> Odd Bodkin --- maker of fine toys, tools, tables
>
> Funny, I keep coming here hoping to discuss physics.
> If you don't want to help mapou001, then consider posting
> a thoughtful answer for others that only read this group
> or are visiting for the first time.
>
> A little civility can go a long was to quieting even trolls.
>   ed
>

Fine. I will just note that the OP has a habit of declaring that it's 
all nonsense before even knowing what the heck he's talking about. Had 
he approached with a little more civility, he would have earned some back.

The way I understand it, reduced down in a way that hopefully OP can 
follow, is that a more accurate representation of gravity (general 
relativity) has TWO terms for the rate of bend. There is a term that is 
proportional to G and this is the term that survives even in the low 
speed approximation. But there is an additional term that comes from the 
curvature of spacetime, which corresponds to the familiar Newtonian 
expression for the centripetal acceleration: v^2 / r. The radius of 
curvature of spacetime is c^2 / G, and so substituting in, this term is 
then G(v/c)^2. Combining both terms, you get
G + G(v/c)^2.
This applies to BOTH light and for matter, so strictly speaking, it is 
not different for light and for matter at all.

But if the matter is slow moving (v<<c), then the second term is 
negligibly small and so the only part that remains is the first term, 
which is what Newton was aware of.

When it is light, though, v=c and so the second term is just as big as 
the first term, hence the factor of 2. But it also would apply to a 
proton moving at nearly the speed of light.

So, basically, the CORRECT answer for the deflection of ANYTHING by 
gravity is proportional to G[ 1+(v/c)^2 ], and there is no physical 
reason to explain about a difference in the freefall of ordinary matter 
and of light because they are the SAME. It's just that the INCORRECT 
answer (given by Newton) happens to be "ok enough" when v<<c and the 
term in [ ] is indistinguishable from 1.

-- 
Odd Bodkin --- maker of fine toys, tools, tables

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Gravity and light question mapou001@gmail.com - 2016-07-14 23:01 -0700
  Re: Gravity and light question Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-07-15 07:25 -0500
    Re: Gravity and light question mapou001@gmail.com - 2016-07-15 08:36 -0700
      Re: Gravity and light question Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-07-15 10:41 -0500
      Re: Gravity and light question Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-07-15 11:02 -0500
        Re: Gravity and light question edprochak@gmail.com - 2016-07-15 10:46 -0700
          Re: Gravity and light question Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-07-15 13:11 -0500
            Re: Gravity and light question Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2016-07-17 16:30 +0200
              Re: Gravity and light question Sergio <invalid@invalid.com> - 2016-07-17 11:15 -0500
              Re: Gravity and light question Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-07-17 15:29 -0500
                Re: Gravity and light question Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2016-07-18 00:16 +0200
                Re: Gravity and light question Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-07-18 06:39 -0500
                Re: Gravity and light question xxein1@att.net - 2016-07-18 09:32 -0700
                Re: Gravity and light question Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2016-07-18 22:55 +0200
  Re: Gravity and light question Sergio <invalid@invalid.com> - 2016-07-15 09:33 -0500
    Re: Gravity and light question mapou001@gmail.com - 2016-07-15 08:36 -0700
      Re: Gravity and light question Sergio <invalid@invalid.com> - 2016-07-15 11:25 -0500
        Re: Gravity and light question "reber g=emc^2" <herbertglazier0@gmail.com> - 2016-07-15 10:02 -0700
    Re: Gravity and light question edprochak@gmail.com - 2016-07-15 10:42 -0700
      Re: Gravity and light question Sergio <invalid@invalid.com> - 2016-07-15 14:22 -0500
  glightinos noTthaTguY <abu.kuanysh05@gmail.com> - 2016-07-15 10:06 -0700
  Re: Gravity and light question mapou001@gmail.com - 2016-07-15 10:40 -0700
    Re: Gravity and light question mapou001@gmail.com - 2016-07-15 10:42 -0700
      Re: Gravity and light question edprochak@gmail.com - 2016-07-15 10:51 -0700
        Re: Gravity and light question mapou001@gmail.com - 2016-07-15 11:05 -0700
          Re: Gravity and light question Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-07-15 13:23 -0500
            Re: Gravity and light question mapou001@gmail.com - 2016-07-15 11:31 -0700
              Re: Gravity and light question Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-07-15 13:40 -0500
                Re: Gravity and light question mapou001@gmail.com - 2016-07-15 11:47 -0700
                Re: Gravity and light question Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-07-15 13:56 -0500
                Re: Gravity and light question mapou001@gmail.com - 2016-07-15 11:54 -0700
                Re: Gravity and light question Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-07-15 13:58 -0500
              Re: Gravity and light question edprochak@gmail.com - 2016-07-18 10:29 -0700
                Re: Gravity and light question mapou001@gmail.com - 2016-07-18 11:09 -0700
                Re: Gravity and light question edprochak@gmail.com - 2016-07-19 09:45 -0700
                Re: Gravity and light question mapou001@gmail.com - 2016-07-19 09:59 -0700
                Re: Gravity and light question Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-07-19 12:59 -0500
                Re: Gravity and light question mapou001@gmail.com - 2016-07-19 11:15 -0700
          Re: Gravity and light question edprochak@gmail.com - 2016-07-18 09:56 -0700
            Re: Gravity and light question mapou001@gmail.com - 2016-07-18 10:03 -0700
              Re: Gravity and light question Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-07-18 12:22 -0500
              Re: Gravity and light question Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-07-18 12:38 -0500
                Re: Gravity and light question mapou001@gmail.com - 2016-07-18 11:04 -0700
                Re: Gravity and light question Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-07-18 13:25 -0500
                Re: Gravity and light question mapou001@gmail.com - 2016-07-18 11:45 -0700
                Re: Gravity and light question Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-07-18 14:12 -0500
                Re: Gravity and light question Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-07-18 14:19 -0500
                Re: Gravity and light question mapou001@gmail.com - 2016-07-18 12:24 -0700
                Re: Gravity and light question Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-07-18 14:33 -0500
                Re: Gravity and light question xxein1@att.net - 2016-07-18 14:01 -0700
                Re: Gravity and light question Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-07-18 16:13 -0500
                Re: Gravity and light question benj <benj@nobody.net> - 2016-07-18 19:02 -0400
                Re: Gravity and light question mapou001@gmail.com - 2016-07-18 16:45 -0700
                Re: Gravity and light question Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-07-19 13:12 -0500
                Re: Gravity and light question mapou001@gmail.com - 2016-07-19 11:17 -0700
                Re: Gravity and light question Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-07-19 13:46 -0500
                Re: Gravity and light question mapou001@gmail.com - 2016-07-19 11:51 -0700
                Re: Gravity and light question Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-07-19 13:58 -0500
                Re: Gravity and light question mapou001@gmail.com - 2016-07-19 12:11 -0700
                Re: Gravity and light question Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-07-19 14:19 -0500
                Re: Gravity and light question mapou001@gmail.com - 2016-07-19 12:30 -0700
                Re: Gravity and light question Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-07-19 14:38 -0500
                Re: Gravity and light question mapou001@gmail.com - 2016-07-19 12:43 -0700
                Re: Gravity and light question Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-07-19 15:08 -0500
                Re: Gravity and light question mapou001@gmail.com - 2016-07-19 13:26 -0700
      Re: Gravity and light question Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-07-15 13:15 -0500
    Re: Gravity and light question Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-07-15 12:54 -0500
  Re: Gravity and light question edprochak@gmail.com - 2016-07-15 10:41 -0700
    Re: Gravity and light question mapou001@gmail.com - 2016-07-15 10:50 -0700
      Re: Gravity and light question Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-07-15 13:18 -0500
        Re: Gravity and light question mapou001@gmail.com - 2016-07-15 11:22 -0700
          Re: Gravity and light question Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-07-15 13:36 -0500
            Re: Gravity and light question mapou001@gmail.com - 2016-07-15 11:43 -0700
              Re: Gravity and light question Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-07-15 13:49 -0500
                Re: Gravity and light question mapou001@gmail.com - 2016-07-15 11:58 -0700
                Re: Gravity and light question Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-07-15 14:01 -0500
                Re: Gravity and light question mapou001@gmail.com - 2016-07-15 12:06 -0700
                Re: Gravity and light question Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-07-15 14:17 -0500
                Re: Gravity and light question mapou001@gmail.com - 2016-07-15 12:19 -0700
                Re: Gravity and light question Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-07-15 14:29 -0500
                Re: Gravity and light question Sergio <invalid@invalid.com> - 2016-07-15 14:23 -0500
                Re: Gravity and light question mapou001@gmail.com - 2016-07-15 12:33 -0700
                Re: Gravity and light question Sergio <invalid@invalid.com> - 2016-07-15 16:58 -0500
  Re: Gravity and light question mapou001@gmail.com - 2016-07-15 13:18 -0700
    Re: Gravity and light question mapou001@gmail.com - 2016-07-15 13:34 -0700
      Re: Gravity and light question pnalsing@gmail.com - 2016-07-15 15:19 -0700
        Re: Gravity and light question mapou001@gmail.com - 2016-07-15 15:29 -0700
          Re: Gravity and light question pnalsing@gmail.com - 2016-07-15 16:15 -0700
            Re: Gravity and light question mapou001@gmail.com - 2016-07-15 16:17 -0700
              Re: Gravity and light question pnalsing@gmail.com - 2016-07-15 16:46 -0700
                Re: Gravity and light question mapou001@gmail.com - 2016-07-15 17:14 -0700
                Re: Gravity and light question pnalsing@gmail.com - 2016-07-15 17:55 -0700
                Re: Gravity and light question mapou001@gmail.com - 2016-07-15 18:08 -0700
                Re: Gravity and light question pnalsing@gmail.com - 2016-07-15 19:47 -0700
      Re: Gravity and light question Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-07-17 15:41 -0500
        Re: Gravity and light question mapou001@gmail.com - 2016-07-17 14:08 -0700
          Re: Gravity and light question Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-07-18 06:38 -0500
    Re: Gravity and light question Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-07-15 15:38 -0500
      Re: Gravity and light question mapou001@gmail.com - 2016-07-15 14:03 -0700
        Re: Gravity and light question Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-07-16 13:02 -0500
          Re: Gravity and light question mapou001@gmail.com - 2016-07-16 12:56 -0700
            Re: Gravity and light question pnalsing@gmail.com - 2016-07-16 14:02 -0700
              Re: Gravity and light question mapou001@gmail.com - 2016-07-16 14:10 -0700
                Re: Gravity and light question Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-07-16 16:38 -0500
                Re: Gravity and light question mapou001@gmail.com - 2016-07-16 14:46 -0700
            Re: Gravity and light question Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-07-16 16:36 -0500
              Re: Gravity and light question mapou001@gmail.com - 2016-07-16 14:45 -0700
                Re: Gravity and light question Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-07-16 16:48 -0500
                Re: Gravity and light question mapou001@gmail.com - 2016-07-16 15:10 -0700
                Re: Gravity and light question mapou001@gmail.com - 2016-07-16 16:11 -0700
                Re: Gravity and light question pnalsing@gmail.com - 2016-07-16 18:18 -0700
                Re: Gravity and light question mapou001@gmail.com - 2016-07-16 19:40 -0700
                Re: Gravity and light question pnalsing@gmail.com - 2016-07-16 23:35 -0700
                Re: Gravity and light question mapou001@gmail.com - 2016-07-17 00:35 -0700
                Re: Gravity and light question Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-07-17 15:24 -0500
                Re: Gravity and light question xxein1@att.net - 2016-07-16 22:22 -0700
                Re: Gravity and light question Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-07-17 15:22 -0500
    all properties of light are wave(y\s, including the photon-electrical effect noTthaTguY <abu.kuanysh05@gmail.com> - 2016-07-16 17:03 -0700
  Re: Gravity and light question mapou001@gmail.com - 2016-07-15 16:42 -0700
    Re: Gravity and light question Sergio <invalid@invalid.com> - 2016-07-17 16:37 -0500
  Re: Gravity and light question "nuny@bid.nes" <Alien8752@gmail.com> - 2016-07-17 13:15 -0700
    Re: Gravity and light question mapou001@gmail.com - 2016-07-17 13:17 -0700
      Re: Gravity and light question Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-07-17 15:41 -0500

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