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Groups > comp.lang.forth > #19182
| From | rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> |
|---|---|
| Newsgroups | comp.lang.forth |
| Subject | Re: Examples of current implementations in Forth for bachelor thesis |
| Date | 2013-01-26 18:09 -0500 |
| Organization | A noiseless patient Spider |
| Message-ID | <ke1nnm$bb2$4@dont-email.me> (permalink) |
| References | (10 earlier) <50fecad0$0$9503$9b4e6d93@newsspool1.arcor-online.net> <kdsats$pki$1@dont-email.me> <51023533$0$6566$9b4e6d93@newsspool3.arcor-online.net> <kduuf6$qsp$1@dont-email.me> <510307a5$0$6566$9b4e6d93@newsspool3.arcor-online.net> |
On 1/25/2013 5:31 PM, A. K. wrote:
> On 25.01.2013 22:46, rickman wrote:
>> On 1/25/2013 2:33 AM, A. K. wrote:
>>> On 23.01.2013 19:07, rickman wrote:
>>>> On 1/22/2013 12:22 PM, A. K. wrote:
>>>>> On 22.01.2013 13:35, Mark Wills wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Note also that IL is stack based :-)
>>>>>>
>>>>>> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Instruction_list
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> True, and note also that one of the most important operators in IL is
>>>>> the closing bracket ) that does not exist in Forth. ;-)
>>>>>
>>>>> I.e. your have OR like in Forth and OR( .. ) where the .. represents
>>>>> another internal calculation block/path, i.e. OR( is a delayed OR
>>>>> until
>>>>> it is resolved by ). I always wondered why this idea never found its
>>>>> way
>>>>> into Forth, it's so simple...
>>>>
>>>> What would be the point?
>>>>
>>>> Rick
>>>
>>> When you do a lot of logic calculations, they tend to be nested very
>>> often to several levels. With modified operators { modified by the
>>> trailing opening bracket ( } you can save a bunch of OVERs and PICKs
>>> etc, making for more readable code.
>>
>> I am missing something. I don't see how the use of prefix operators
>> change anything with stack operators. Your idea is just an issue of
>> syntax and all the same calculations and stack operations have to be
>> done.
>> OR( Acalc Bcalc ) is no different from Acalc Bcalc OR in existing Forth.
>>
>> Or am I missing something else?
>>
>>
>>> As I said, it's not a big deal, but
>>> it translates also easier to contact or ladder diagrams used by control
>>> engineers.
>>>
>>> I remember also an extended version, that went:
>>> OR( <calc1> | <calc2> )
>>> where the modifier ( saved the stack, | reinstated it for <calc2> on top
>>> of the result of <calc1>, and ) resolved the delayed operator OR. Of
>>> course it was slow. But with today's optimizing compilers?
>>
>> Saved how much of the stack? Wouldn't that be important for the word to
>> know?
>>
>> Rick
>
> As already stated, this is not Forth, but a low-lecel postfix DSL for
> controller programming. However it is close enough to Forth to be
> implemented easily in Forth.
Not sure why you say that now. Read your post from above...
> True, and note also that one of the most important operators in IL is
> the closing bracket ) that does not exist in *Forth*.
>
> I.e. your have OR like in Forth and OR( .. ) where the .. represents
> another internal calculation block/path, i.e. OR( is a delayed OR until
> it is resolved by ). I always wondered why this idea never found its
> way
> into *Forth*, it's so simple...
emphasis added. BTW, what is a DSL?
> That said, the use of ( as operator modifier can
> a) make the source code more readable for humans
I don't want to be argumentative, but "readable" is subjective. More
importantly none of this stuff is ever readable when it is complex. I
have coded in Forth, C, Pascal, Occam, Lisp, VHDL, Verilog and assembly.
I have never seen a complex logic expression that was clear in any of
these languages.
> b) make the automatic code generation from ladder diagrams etc to
> program code more straightforward
I have no background in formal code generation, but I don't think this
is really an issue. I think conversion between infix, postfix and
prefix is a very simple process to automate. In fact, your description
of how your new word would work is essentially a mapping of prefix
notation to postfix execution.
> c) allow for easy stack depth check during compile-time
Really? Easier than postfix? I don't think it gets any easier than
postfix and prefix requires stacking of the operator!
> d) compile a task switch lock (for atomic calculations) or task slice
> timeout monitoring along with the calculation
I don't follow how this falls out of prefix notation at all.
> e) allow for computing parallel input chains in parallel execution
> threads eg on different CPU cores.
How does that work differently in postfix?
Rick
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Examples of current implementations in Forth for bachelor thesis Oliver Bach <decfreak@googlemail.com> - 2013-01-10 17:28 -0800
Re: Examples of current implementations in Forth for bachelor thesis Hugh Aguilar <hughaguilar96@yahoo.com> - 2013-01-10 19:52 -0800
Re: Examples of current implementations in Forth for bachelor thesis "Rod Pemberton" <do_not_have@notemailnotz.cnm> - 2013-01-11 03:35 -0500
Re: Examples of current implementations in Forth for bachelor thesis Hugh Aguilar <hughaguilar96@yahoo.com> - 2013-01-14 15:13 -0800
Re: Examples of current implementations in Forth for bachelor thesis "Rod Pemberton" <do_not_have@notemailnotz.cnm> - 2013-01-14 21:16 -0500
Re: Examples of current implementations in Forth for bachelor thesis Hugh Aguilar <hughaguilar96@yahoo.com> - 2013-01-15 14:47 -0800
Re: Examples of current implementations in Forth for bachelor thesis rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2013-01-18 23:24 -0500
Re: Examples of current implementations in Forth for bachelor thesis Mark Wills <forthfreak@gmail.com> - 2013-01-11 04:08 -0800
Re: Examples of current implementations in Forth for bachelor thesis Spam@ControlQ.com - 2013-01-11 13:09 -0500
Re: Examples of current implementations in Forth for bachelor thesis Roelf Toxopeus <rt4all@notthis.hetnet.nl> - 2013-01-12 11:59 +0100
Re: Examples of current implementations in Forth for bachelor thesis "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2013-01-13 07:41 +1300
Re: Examples of current implementations in Forth for bachelor thesis Chris <xrissmith@me.com> - 2013-01-12 21:05 -0800
Re: Examples of current implementations in Forth for bachelor thesis "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2013-01-13 22:26 +1300
Re: Examples of current implementations in Forth for bachelor thesis gavino_himself <visploveslisp@gmail.com> - 2013-01-13 18:41 -0800
Re: Examples of current implementations in Forth for bachelor thesis Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2013-01-17 23:42 -0800
Re: Examples of current implementations in Forth for bachelor thesis Hugh Aguilar <hughaguilar96@yahoo.com> - 2013-01-19 18:21 -0800
Re: Examples of current implementations in Forth for bachelor thesis Bernd Paysan <bernd.paysan@gmx.de> - 2013-01-20 14:26 +0100
Re: Examples of current implementations in Forth for bachelor thesis Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2013-01-20 10:58 -0600
Re: Examples of current implementations in Forth for bachelor thesis Hugh Aguilar <hughaguilar96@yahoo.com> - 2013-01-20 15:46 -0800
Re: Examples of current implementations in Forth for bachelor thesis Alex McDonald <blog@rivadpm.com> - 2013-01-21 01:51 -0800
Re: Examples of current implementations in Forth for bachelor thesis Mark Wills <forthfreak@gmail.com> - 2013-01-21 04:10 -0800
Re: Examples of current implementations in Forth for bachelor thesis Alex McDonald <blog@rivadpm.com> - 2013-01-21 04:45 -0800
Re: Examples of current implementations in Forth for bachelor thesis Alex McDonald <blog@rivadpm.com> - 2013-01-21 04:48 -0800
Re: Examples of current implementations in Forth for bachelor thesis Bernd Paysan <bernd.paysan@gmx.de> - 2013-01-21 22:01 +0100
Re: Examples of current implementations in Forth for bachelor thesis Alex McDonald <blog@rivadpm.com> - 2013-01-21 13:42 -0800
Re: Examples of current implementations in Forth for bachelor thesis Bernd Paysan <bernd.paysan@gmx.de> - 2013-01-22 02:18 +0100
Re: Examples of current implementations in Forth for bachelor thesis Alex McDonald <blog@rivadpm.com> - 2013-01-22 01:06 -0800
Re: Examples of current implementations in Forth for bachelor thesis Lauri Alanko <la@iki.fi> - 2013-02-01 04:54 +0000
Re: Examples of current implementations in Forth for bachelor thesis "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2013-01-31 19:34 -1000
Re: Examples of current implementations in Forth for bachelor thesis Bernd Paysan <bernd.paysan@gmx.de> - 2013-02-02 16:32 +0100
Re: Examples of current implementations in Forth for bachelor thesis stephenXXX@mpeforth.com (Stephen Pelc) - 2013-02-02 18:17 +0000
Re: Examples of current implementations in Forth for bachelor thesis albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl (Albert van der Horst) - 2013-02-02 17:51 +0000
Re: Examples of current implementations in Forth for bachelor thesis albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl (Albert van der Horst) - 2013-01-21 14:55 +0000
Re: Examples of current implementations in Forth for bachelor thesis "Rod Pemberton" <do_not_have@notemailnotz.cnm> - 2013-01-22 03:18 -0500
Re: Examples of current implementations in Forth for bachelor thesis Mark Wills <forthfreak@gmail.com> - 2013-01-22 01:10 -0800
Re: Examples of current implementations in Forth for bachelor thesis Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2013-01-22 03:31 -0600
Re: Examples of current implementations in Forth for bachelor thesis Alex McDonald <blog@rivadpm.com> - 2013-01-22 03:41 -0800
Re: Examples of current implementations in Forth for bachelor thesis "Rod Pemberton" <do_not_have@notemailnotz.cnm> - 2013-01-22 14:36 -0500
Re: Examples of current implementations in Forth for bachelor thesis Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2013-01-22 17:23 -0600
Re: Examples of current implementations in Forth for bachelor thesis rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2013-01-25 09:38 -0500
Re: Examples of current implementations in Forth for bachelor thesis "A. K." <akk@nospam.org> - 2013-01-22 12:52 +0100
Re: Examples of current implementations in Forth for bachelor thesis Mark Wills <forthfreak@gmail.com> - 2013-01-22 04:31 -0800
Re: Examples of current implementations in Forth for bachelor thesis Mark Wills <forthfreak@gmail.com> - 2013-01-22 04:35 -0800
Re: Examples of current implementations in Forth for bachelor thesis "A. K." <akk@nospam.org> - 2013-01-22 18:22 +0100
Re: Examples of current implementations in Forth for bachelor thesis Alex McDonald <blog@rivadpm.com> - 2013-01-22 09:40 -0800
Re: Examples of current implementations in Forth for bachelor thesis "A. K." <akk@nospam.org> - 2013-01-22 21:02 +0100
Re: Examples of current implementations in Forth for bachelor thesis Alex McDonald <blog@rivadpm.com> - 2013-01-22 13:30 -0800
Re: Examples of current implementations in Forth for bachelor thesis "A. K." <akk@nospam.org> - 2013-01-22 23:07 +0100
Re: Examples of current implementations in Forth for bachelor thesis Alex McDonald <blog@rivadpm.com> - 2013-01-22 15:16 -0800
Re: Examples of current implementations in Forth for bachelor thesis rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2013-01-23 13:07 -0500
Re: Examples of current implementations in Forth for bachelor thesis "A. K." <akk@nospam.org> - 2013-01-25 08:33 +0100
Re: Examples of current implementations in Forth for bachelor thesis rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2013-01-25 16:46 -0500
Re: Examples of current implementations in Forth for bachelor thesis "A. K." <akk@nospam.org> - 2013-01-25 23:31 +0100
Re: Examples of current implementations in Forth for bachelor thesis rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2013-01-26 18:09 -0500
Re: Examples of current implementations in Forth for bachelor thesis "A. K." <akk@nospam.org> - 2013-01-27 10:15 +0100
Re: Examples of current implementations in Forth for bachelor thesis rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2013-01-31 14:41 -0500
Re: Examples of current implementations in Forth for bachelor thesis "A. K." <akk@nospam.org> - 2013-01-31 21:03 +0100
Re: Examples of current implementations in Forth for bachelor thesis mhx@iae.nl (Marcel Hendrix) - 2013-01-31 21:44 +0200
Re: Examples of current implementations in Forth for bachelor thesis Mark Wills <forthfreak@gmail.com> - 2013-01-31 23:16 -0800
Re: Examples of current implementations in Forth for bachelor thesis Mark Wills <forthfreak@gmail.com> - 2013-01-31 12:47 -0800
Re: Examples of current implementations in Forth for bachelor thesis "A. K." <akk@nospam.org> - 2013-02-01 08:23 +0100
Re: Examples of current implementations in Forth for bachelor thesis Alex McDonald <blog@rivadpm.com> - 2013-01-22 04:48 -0800
Re: Examples of current implementations in Forth for bachelor thesis Bernd Paysan <bernd.paysan@gmx.de> - 2013-01-22 17:30 +0100
Re: Examples of current implementations in Forth for bachelor thesis Mark Wills <forthfreak@gmail.com> - 2013-01-22 04:32 -0800
Re: Examples of current implementations in Forth for bachelor thesis "Rod Pemberton" <do_not_have@notemailnotz.cnm> - 2013-01-22 14:35 -0500
Re: Examples of current implementations in Forth for bachelor thesis Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2013-01-22 17:29 -0600
Re: Examples of current implementations in Forth for bachelor thesis Mark Wills <forthfreak@gmail.com> - 2013-01-23 02:21 -0800
Re: Examples of current implementations in Forth for bachelor thesis Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2013-01-23 04:43 -0600
Re: Examples of current implementations in Forth for bachelor thesis Mark Wills <forthfreak@gmail.com> - 2013-01-23 03:28 -0800
Re: Examples of current implementations in Forth for bachelor thesis Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2013-01-23 09:19 -0600
Re: Examples of current implementations in Forth for bachelor thesis Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2013-01-23 09:24 -0800
Re: Examples of current implementations in Forth for bachelor thesis Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2013-01-23 12:01 -0600
Re: Examples of current implementations in Forth for bachelor thesis David Thompson <dave.thompson2@verizon.net> - 2013-02-04 03:09 -0500
Re: Examples of current implementations in Forth for bachelor thesis rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2013-01-25 09:59 -0500
Re: Examples of current implementations in Forth for bachelor thesis Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2013-01-26 03:05 -0600
Re: Examples of current implementations in Forth for bachelor thesis Alex McDonald <blog@rivadpm.com> - 2013-01-26 04:38 -0800
Re: Examples of current implementations in Forth for bachelor thesis Mark Wills <markrobertwills@yahoo.co.uk> - 2013-01-26 07:19 -0800
Re: Examples of current implementations in Forth for bachelor thesis Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2013-01-26 13:13 -0600
Re: Examples of current implementations in Forth for bachelor thesis rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2013-01-26 17:00 -0500
Re: Examples of current implementations in Forth for bachelor thesis None <vandys@vsta.org> - 2013-01-26 22:04 +0000
Re: Examples of current implementations in Forth for bachelor thesis kenney@cix.compulink.co.uk - 2013-01-22 18:20 -0600
Re: Examples of current implementations in Forth for bachelor thesis Mark Wills <forthfreak@gmail.com> - 2013-01-22 23:25 -0800
Re: Examples of current implementations in Forth for bachelor thesis Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2013-01-23 03:02 -0600
Re: Examples of current implementations in Forth for bachelor thesis Hugh Aguilar <hughaguilar96@yahoo.com> - 2013-01-24 18:28 -0800
Re: Examples of current implementations in Forth for bachelor thesis Bernd Paysan <bernd.paysan@gmx.de> - 2013-01-25 16:57 +0100
Re: Examples of current implementations in Forth for bachelor thesis Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2013-01-25 08:41 -0800
Re: Examples of current implementations in Forth for bachelor thesis Coos Haak <chforth@hccnet.nl> - 2013-01-25 20:04 +0100
Re: Examples of current implementations in Forth for bachelor thesis "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2013-01-26 09:25 +1300
Re: Examples of current implementations in Forth for bachelor thesis Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2013-01-26 13:16 -0800
Re: Examples of current implementations in Forth for bachelor thesis Hugh Aguilar <hughaguilar96@yahoo.com> - 2013-01-30 18:40 -0800
Re: Examples of current implementations in Forth for bachelor thesis Bernd Paysan <bernd.paysan@gmx.de> - 2013-01-31 15:15 +0100
Re: Examples of current implementations in Forth for bachelor thesis anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2013-01-31 15:55 +0000
Re: Examples of current implementations in Forth for bachelor thesis mhx@iae.nl (Marcel Hendrix) - 2013-02-24 00:57 +0200
Re: Examples of current implementations in Forth for bachelor thesis Brad Eckert <hwfwguy@gmail.com> - 2013-01-31 09:01 -0800
Re: Examples of current implementations in Forth for bachelor thesis Bernd Paysan <bernd.paysan@gmx.de> - 2013-01-31 19:41 +0100
Re: Examples of current implementations in Forth for bachelor thesis anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2013-02-01 16:08 +0000
Re: Examples of current implementations in Forth for bachelor thesis albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl (Albert van der Horst) - 2013-02-02 02:16 +0000
Re: Examples of current implementations in Forth for bachelor thesis Bernd Paysan <bernd.paysan@gmx.de> - 2013-02-02 16:38 +0100
Re: Examples of current implementations in Forth for bachelor thesis anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2013-02-04 14:50 +0000
Re: Examples of current implementations in Forth for bachelor thesis Hugh Aguilar <hughaguilar96@yahoo.com> - 2013-02-06 00:32 -0800
Re: Examples of current implementations in Forth for bachelor thesis Bernd Paysan <bernd.paysan@gmx.de> - 2013-02-06 19:39 +0100
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