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| From | HenHanna <HenHanna@dev.null> |
|---|---|
| Newsgroups | sci.lang, alt.usage.english, soc.culture.france, soc.culture.french |
| Subject | Re: [embonpoint] was once a completely positive term in France |
| Date | 2024-06-16 05:07 +0000 |
| Organization | novaBBS |
| Message-ID | <a0dcee78b84c2e75b132e10392e577d0@www.novabbs.com> (permalink) |
| References | (2 earlier) <a0d9dd1146753f2af4ec4ff5eb6bcaeb@www.novabbs.com> <85dfa5191c254d7b6d4971efc4cb9129@www.novabbs.com> <v4lccq$3mt2j$3@dont-email.me> <v4lf6d$3rce9$1@dont-email.me> <9b862f823220569227306f1baf37a020@www.novabbs.com> |
Cross-posted to 4 groups.
HenHanna wrote:
> Peter Moylan wrote:
>>>> Bebercito wrote: ...............
>>>>
>>>>>> Si tu dures
>>>>>> Trop malade,
>>>>>> Couleur fade
>>>>>> Tu prendras,
>>>>>> Et perdras
>>>>>> L’embonpoint. <--------------
>>>>>> Dieu te doint
>>>>>> Santé bonne,
>>>>>> Ma mignonne.
>> I've never seen "doint" before. Is this an archaic form of "doit"?
> i just assumed it was Subjunctive... --- as in: Thy kingdom come
> or God save the Queen
> My trusty book (paperback) [501 French Verbs]
> has Donner (page 167) and has Subjunctives...
> but i'm not seeing Doint
Found it!!!
https://fr.wiktionary.org/wiki/doint
(Désuet) Troisième personne du singulier du présent du subjonctif de
donner.
Or, prions Dieu qu'il leur doint paradis. — (J.-J.
Rousseau)
---------- So this is Tutoyer for God ?
"tutoyement" (informal address) and "vouvoiement" (formal address) in
French grammar
_____________________________
The verb "doint" in the sentence "Dieu te doint Santé bonne" is actually
not a correct verb form in modern French. Here's the breakdown:
Original Phrase: "Dieu te doint Santé bonne"
Intended Verb: The intended verb was likely "donne" (conjugated form).
Explanation:
Outdated Conjugation: "Doint" is an outdated conjugation of the
verb "donner" (to give) in the third person singular form. In Old
French, "doint" was used for the second-person singular "tu" pronoun
(you).
Modern French: Modern French uses the verb "donner" and
conjugates it according to the pronoun. In this case, "te" (you)
requires the second-person singular conjugation, which is "donnes."
Corrected Sentence:
Modern French: "Dieu te donne Santé bonne"
_____________________________
Yes, your sentence "Dieu te doint Santé bonne" uses the informal "tu"
pronoun ("te") when addressing God. This is interesting because in
French, traditionally, God was addressed with the formal "vous" pronoun
("vous").
Here's a breakdown of why things might have changed:
Historical Context: Traditionally, French used "vous" with God,
reflecting a sense of awe and respect.
Modern Shift: Over time, especially in Catholic prayers, "tu" has
become more common when addressing God. This shift reflects a more
personal and intimate relationship with the divine.
Is it always okay to use "tu" with God?
While "tu" is becoming more common, it's not universally accepted. Here
are some things to consider:
Denomination: Some denominations might be more traditional and prefer
"vous."
Context: In formal prayers or religious ceremonies, "vous" might still
be used.
Personal Preference: Ultimately, the choice depends on your own comfort
level and understanding of God.
Alternatives:
Here are some alternative ways to address God in French, depending on
the context:
Seigneur (Lord): This is a formal and respectful way to address God.
Mon Dieu (My God): This adds a personal touch while retaining respect.
Père (Father): Used in some Christian contexts to express a father-child
relationship with God.
Overall, your sentence "Dieu te doint Santé bonne" is grammatically
correct using the informal "tu" with God. It reflects a more personal
way of addressing the divine. However, be mindful of the context and
your own beliefs when choosing how to speak to God in French.
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[embonpoint] was once a completely positive term in France HenHanna <HenHanna@devnull.tb> - 2024-05-07 16:33 -0700
Re: [embonpoint] was once a completely positive term in France bebercito@aol.com (Bebercito) - 2024-05-08 15:49 +0000
Re: [embonpoint] was once a completely positive term in France HenHanna <HenHanna@dev.null> - 2024-05-08 19:32 +0000
Re: [embonpoint] was once a completely positive term in France Hibou <vpaereru-unmonitored@yahoo.com.invalid> - 2024-05-09 06:07 +0100
Re: [embonpoint] was once a completely positive term in France occam <occam@nowhere.nix> - 2024-05-09 10:55 +0200
Re: [embonpoint] was once a completely positive term in France HenHanna <HenHanna@dev.null> - 2024-05-10 19:19 +0000
Re: [embonpoint] was once a completely positive term in France bebercito@aol.com (Bebercito) - 2024-05-11 05:25 +0000
Re: [embonpoint] was once a completely positive term in France HenHanna <HenHanna@dev.null> - 2024-05-11 07:32 +0000
Re: [embonpoint] was once a completely positive term in France HenHanna <HenHanna@devnull.tb> - 2024-06-15 17:42 -0700
Re: [embonpoint] was once a completely positive term in France Peter Moylan <peter@pmoylan.org> - 2024-06-16 11:29 +1000
Re: [embonpoint] was once a completely positive term in France HenHanna <HenHanna@dev.null> - 2024-06-16 03:24 +0000
Re: [embonpoint] was once a completely positive term in France HenHanna <HenHanna@dev.null> - 2024-06-16 05:07 +0000
Re: [embonpoint] was once a completely positive term in France Peter Moylan <peter@pmoylan.org> - 2024-06-16 15:28 +1000
Re: [embonpoint] was once a completely positive term in France Julien ÉLIE <iulius@nom-de-mon-site.com.invalid> - 2024-06-16 09:08 +0200
Re: [embonpoint] was once a completely positive term in France HenHanna <HenHanna@devnull.tb> - 2024-06-16 00:44 -0700
Re: [embonpoint] was once a completely positive term in France Hibou <vpaereru-unmonitored@yahoo.com.invalid> - 2024-06-16 09:03 +0100
Re: [embonpoint] was once a completely positive term in France Peter Moylan <peter@pmoylan.org> - 2024-06-16 19:41 +1000
Re: [embonpoint] was once a completely positive term in France Aidan Kehoe <kehoea@parhasard.net> - 2024-06-16 19:26 +0100
Re: [embonpoint] was once a completely positive term in France Aidan Kehoe <kehoea@parhasard.net> - 2024-10-27 11:43 +0000
Re: [embonpoint] was once a completely positive term in France Bertel Lund Hansen <rundtosset@lundhansen.dk> - 2024-10-27 19:53 +0100
Re: [embonpoint] was once a completely positive term in France Peter Moylan <peter@pmoylan.org> - 2024-10-28 12:43 +1100
Re: [embonpoint] was once a completely positive term in France Aidan Kehoe <kehoea@parhasard.net> - 2024-10-28 18:47 +0000
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