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Groups > comp.lang.c > #147633

Re: Is this kosher wrt Generic?

Subject Re: Is this kosher wrt Generic?
Newsgroups comp.lang.c
References (3 earlier) <qproui$1jg$1@news.albasani.net> <a341d8ef-f5ad-4a31-b5e0-28d82caced31@googlegroups.com> <qprq74$rl6$1@news.albasani.net> <dbc11ea8-b3c1-4862-9e27-9d75708f7643@googlegroups.com> <h2e87qFq967U1@mid.individual.net>
From Bart <bc@freeuk.com>
Message-ID <NwmwF.35074$L91.4737@fx02.am4> (permalink)
Organization virginmedia.com
Date 2019-11-05 22:16 +0000

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On 05/11/2019 21:34, Ian Collins wrote:
> On 06/11/2019 01:57, Thiago Adams wrote:
>>
>> C is dangerous but it is simple. When you know the tool you
>> know exactly what the compiler is doing and you know from a long
>> time what is important to do and check. How to deal with the
>> details.
>>
>> C++ is complex and nobody knows happens under the hood. This is why
>> site that shows the compiler output are so useful nowadays for C++
>> community.
>>
>> C is not perfect and C++ is not so bad. Personally I wish I could
>> select some features from both and add some extra ones.
>> This is why I created my own C front end.
> 
> The complexity in a programming problem is a constant.  You can solve it 
> in the C way with a large number of simple steps, which introduces extra 
> complexity in making sure they all work together. You can solve it with 
> fewer step in a higher level language, which introduces extra complexity 
> to the language.  The overall complexity remains constant.

A lot of the complexity in C++ appears to me gratuitous.

Even when it isn't, a considerable amount is exposed to the compiler 
(ie. each time it runs, it has to process library source code to 
implement features which in another language are compiled once)

In addition that extra complexity is exposed to the user, because when 
they gets some minor thing wrong, it doesn't directly report that thing, 
but reports instead the error that it invokes in the complex library code.

Advocates for the language like to pretend that it is for experts.

(To illustrate my points:

(1) Basic's PRINT X has to be written as:

     std::cout << X << std::endl;

(2) See what happens when you inadvertently type this instead:

     std::cout >> X >> std::endl;

)

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Thread

Is this kosher wrt Generic? "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2019-11-04 22:55 -0800
  Re: Is this kosher wrt Generic? Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2019-11-05 08:12 +0100
    Re: Is this kosher wrt Generic? Thiago Adams <thiago.adams@gmail.com> - 2019-11-05 03:52 -0800
      Re: Is this kosher wrt Generic? Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2019-11-05 13:12 +0100
        Re: Is this kosher wrt Generic? Thiago Adams <thiago.adams@gmail.com> - 2019-11-05 04:24 -0800
          Re: Is this kosher wrt Generic? Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2019-11-05 13:33 +0100
            Re: Is this kosher wrt Generic? Thiago Adams <thiago.adams@gmail.com> - 2019-11-05 04:57 -0800
              Re: Is this kosher wrt Generic? Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2019-11-05 14:08 +0100
                Re: Is this kosher wrt Generic? Thiago Adams <thiago.adams@gmail.com> - 2019-11-05 05:21 -0800
                Re: Is this kosher wrt Generic? Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2019-11-05 14:27 +0100
                Re: Is this kosher wrt Generic? Thiago Adams <thiago.adams@gmail.com> - 2019-11-05 05:42 -0800
                Re: Is this kosher wrt Generic? Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2019-11-05 14:51 +0100
                Re: Is this kosher wrt Generic? Bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2019-11-05 14:49 +0000
                Re: Is this kosher wrt Generic? Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2019-11-05 15:53 +0100
                Re: Is this kosher wrt Generic? Bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2019-11-05 15:59 +0000
                Re: Is this kosher wrt Generic? Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2019-11-05 17:11 +0100
                Re: Is this kosher wrt Generic? Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2019-11-05 09:19 -0800
                Re: Is this kosher wrt Generic? Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2019-11-05 07:00 -0800
                Re: Is this kosher wrt Generic? David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2019-11-05 16:30 +0100
                Re: Is this kosher wrt Generic? Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2019-11-05 15:31 +0100
              Re: Is this kosher wrt Generic? Ian Collins <ian-news@hotmail.com> - 2019-11-06 10:34 +1300
                Re: Is this kosher wrt Generic? Bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2019-11-05 22:16 +0000
                Re: Is this kosher wrt Generic? Ian Collins <ian-news@hotmail.com> - 2019-11-06 11:34 +1300
                Re: Is this kosher wrt Generic? Bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2019-11-05 23:12 +0000
                Re: Is this kosher wrt Generic? Ian Collins <ian-news@hotmail.com> - 2019-11-06 12:29 +1300
                Re: Is this kosher wrt Generic? David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2019-11-06 10:17 +0100
                Re: Is this kosher wrt Generic? Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2019-11-06 10:56 +0100
                Re: Is this kosher wrt Generic? Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2019-11-06 10:02 +0100
                Re: Is this kosher wrt Generic? Bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2019-11-06 10:43 +0000
                Re: Is this kosher wrt Generic? Thiago Adams <thiago.adams@gmail.com> - 2019-11-06 04:56 -0800
                Re: Is this kosher wrt Generic? Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2019-11-06 14:05 +0100
                Re: Is this kosher wrt Generic? Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com> - 2019-11-08 21:03 -0800
                Re: Is this kosher wrt Generic? Ian Collins <ian-news@hotmail.com> - 2019-11-10 08:45 +1300
                Re: Is this kosher wrt Generic? Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com> - 2019-11-28 16:35 -0800
                Re: Is this kosher wrt Generic? David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2019-11-29 12:41 +0100
                Re: Is this kosher wrt Generic? Thiago Adams <thiago.adams@gmail.com> - 2019-11-29 04:08 -0800
                Re: Is this kosher wrt Generic? Bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2019-11-29 13:01 +0000
                Re: Is this kosher wrt Generic? Thiago Adams <thiago.adams@gmail.com> - 2019-11-29 06:43 -0800
                Re: Is this kosher wrt Generic? Bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2019-11-29 17:31 +0000
                Re: Is this kosher wrt Generic? David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2019-11-29 14:31 +0100
                Re: Is this kosher wrt Generic? Öö Tiib <ootiib@hot.ee> - 2019-11-30 13:16 -0800
                Re: Is this kosher wrt Generic? Thiago Adams <thiago.adams@gmail.com> - 2019-12-02 03:31 -0800
                Re: Is this kosher wrt Generic? Öö Tiib <ootiib@hot.ee> - 2019-12-02 23:30 -0800
                Re: Is this kosher wrt Generic? Ian Collins <ian-news@hotmail.com> - 2019-12-01 12:10 +1300
                Re: Is this kosher wrt Generic? Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com> - 2020-01-11 09:35 -0800
              Re: Is this kosher wrt Generic? Jorgen Grahn <grahn+nntp@snipabacken.se> - 2019-11-05 22:49 +0000
            Re: Is this kosher wrt Generic? Thiago Adams <thiago.adams@gmail.com> - 2019-11-05 05:12 -0800
              Re: Is this kosher wrt Generic? Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2019-11-05 14:20 +0100
    Re: Is this kosher wrt Generic? guinness.tony@gmail.com - 2019-11-05 16:19 -0800
    Re: Is this kosher wrt Generic? "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2019-11-06 00:06 -0800
  Re: Is this kosher wrt Generic? Thiago Adams <thiago.adams@gmail.com> - 2019-11-05 03:19 -0800
    Re: Is this kosher wrt Generic? "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2019-11-05 22:38 -0800
      Re: Is this kosher wrt Generic? Thiago Adams <thiago.adams@gmail.com> - 2019-11-06 04:50 -0800
        Re: Is this kosher wrt Generic? Thiago Adams <thiago.adams@gmail.com> - 2019-11-06 05:32 -0800
          Re: Is this kosher wrt Generic? Thiago Adams <thiago.adams@gmail.com> - 2019-11-06 05:56 -0800
            Re: Is this kosher wrt Generic? Bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2019-11-06 14:26 +0000
              Re: Is this kosher wrt Generic? Thiago Adams <thiago.adams@gmail.com> - 2019-11-06 09:04 -0800
              Re: Is this kosher wrt Generic? David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2019-11-06 22:45 +0100
                Re: Is this kosher wrt Generic? "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2019-11-29 14:35 -0800
                Re: Is this kosher wrt Generic? Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2019-11-29 23:23 +0000
                Re: Is this kosher wrt Generic? "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2019-11-29 19:08 -0800
                Re: Is this kosher wrt Generic? "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2019-11-29 19:12 -0800
                Re: Is this kosher wrt Generic? Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2019-11-30 10:44 +0000
            Re: Is this kosher wrt Generic? "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2019-11-09 23:21 -0800
            Re: Is this kosher wrt Generic? "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2019-11-09 23:22 -0800

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