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Groups > comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage > #2659

Re: Initialize / format 500 GB Momentus XT to make bootable clone

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AndyHancock wrote
> Rod Speed <rod.speed....@gmail.com> wrote
>> AndyHancock wrote
>>> Rod Speed <rod.speed....@gmail.com> wrote

>>>> ...The worst that can happen is that you do somehow manage to boot
>>>> the clone without intending to do that, and the worst that can do
>>>> is end up with a clone that wont boot without the source drive
>>>> being visible to the clone when booting.

>>>> The only thing you have to do then is to just reclone the source
>>>> again.  Just a nuisance in the very unlikely even that you do
>>>> manage to boot the clone accidentally somehow.

>>> So based on that, I assume that the C-drive content on the source
>>> HDD won't be modified during the clone bootup in any consequential
>>> way?  By consequential, I mean in ways that could mess up any
>>> future bootups from the source HDD.

>> Correct.

>>> The reason why this question comes to mind is that, according to
>>> the webpage I cited, the registry of the clone specifies paths to
>>> the C- drive.

>> Yes, but the registry on the source drive wont be affected even if
>> you boot the clone with the source visible.

>>> ...I'm not sure what is done with the C-drive paths in the registry during bootup.

>> Nothing with the registry on the source drive when booting the clone
>> even with the source drive visible.

> Understood.  The registry on the source HDD isn't changed.

> Would you know if some of the registry entries (duplicated in the source
> and target HDDs) pointing to the C-drive are file paths that are written to?

Dont understand the question.

>>>>> I can't plug in the clone HDD (in eSATA enclosure) after the
>>>>> booting because it is not hot-swappable.  So far as I've tried, I
>>>>> haven't found a way to make it visible to the laptop other than
>>>>> to have it connected during boot time.
>>>> You can usually make it visible just by gettng the system to
>>>> rescan for devices in the device manageer.
>>> That was one of the first things I tried when I was first attempted
>>> cloning to the Toshiba replacement HDD (which was placed into the
>>> eSATA housing).  Did all sorts of variations until there was
>>> nothing left to try.  It didn't work then, but it works now.

>> It can get a bit confused if you dont try things in the right order.

>> You really need to reboot with the drive not connected between trys.

> Now that's a pain.

Yep.

>>> I'm pretty sure that I also tried plugging in the USB cables before
>>> the eSATA cable, and vice-versa.

>> You shouldnt need to have them all connected, just the ones you want
>> to use.  Likely thats what confused it.

>>> This time, when it works, it was the USB cables before eSATA
>>> cables.  I suspect that the USB cables are for power

>> Nope, not with a 3.5" drive.

> The drive doesn't light up or make any noises without the USB cables.
> It also doesn't show up on the laptop, even if connected via eSATA
> (only) at boot time.  I'm sure the USB cables are for power -- 

Thats unlikely with a 3.5" drive.

> I just wasn't sure that's all they're for.  Nothing shows up in the USB
> devices, but that's no guarantee that they're not using the cables for
> more than just power.  After all, an iPod Touch doesn't show up as a
> USB device either.

>>> (documentation for the enclosure is skimpy).  Anyway, since I don't
>>> know what caused the failure before, I'm hopeful but not confident
>>> that rescanning will make the auxiliary HDD visible in the future.
>>> Fingers crossed.

>> Should do, it shouldnt be variable in the sense that the same
>> sequence should work reliably.

> I would hope so, but since the same sequence didn't make the auxiliary HDD
> visible after a rescan, it might be the system getting confused, as you suggested.

>>>> Just dont bother to boot the clone after every reclone for backup.
>>>> If you are really paranoid, you clould try booting the clone every
>>>> couple of months, but I wouldnt bother personally.

>>> Well, it *is* a pain...it's just that I've read accounts of what
>>> can happen when someone didn't.  He found that his safety net
>>> wasn't there after he found that he needed it.

>> Yes, but thats checking that it is bootable, not doing that after every clone.

> Alright, I'll keep that in mind.  Thanks.

>>>>> My challenge above is to ensure that I boot from the source.

>>>> I'd just rely on the bios to not change the boot drive until you
>>>> change that manually.

>>> That's exactly the unknown from my perspective (which admittedly
>>> isn't one of an expert).  Since the auxiliary HDD disappears from
>>> the boot- order list, there is no boot order for the bios to
>>> maintain, at least as it pertains to the auxiliary HDD.  So when I
>>> plug it in and boot, I'm not sure that the internal HDD will have
>>> precedence in the boot order.

>> Its trivial to test.

> Here's the result from my test.  The auxiliary HDD is listed last on
> the boot list.  If I move it up to the top, it is remembered after I
> shut down.  I can disconnect the auxiliary HDD and reconnect it, and
> it will still remain at the top.  However, if I boot once without the
> auxiliary HDD, it will have lost its place in the boot list.  Next
> time I reconnect and boot, it will show up last again.  Thanks for the
> push to characterize that.

>>>>>>> ...is there a web page that describes why this hazard
>>>>>>> exists?

>>>>> Someone posted this on another forum:
>>>>> http://www.goodells.net/multiboot/partsigs.shtml
>>>>> The first section,"Fixing Windows 2000/XP Drive Letters" I found it quite helpful.

>>>> The problem isnt actually with drive letters. If you boot the
>>>> clone after a clone has been done with the source still visible,
>>>> it boots fine with the drive letters the way you expect them to
>>>> be. The problem is that once its booted, you will find that if you
>>>> remove the source drive, you cant boot anymore. The reason you
>>>> cant is because the boot of the clone uses files on the source
>>>> drive and they arent visible anymore.

>>> I guess it is a matter of perspective.  The clone's registry info
>>> is meant to point at its own drive.  It will work if it points to the
>>> source partition, but that's not how things were meant to be set up.

>> The problem with the boot config when you boot the clone for the
>> first time with the source visible doesnt involve the registry.
>> Thats part of the very early part of the boot phase, before the
>> registry is used.

> OK, looks like either the website didn't tell the whole story,

Thats correct, it doesnt, particularly with the early boot phase before
the registry is even relevant.

> or I didn't quit understand it.  I thought it meant that there are C-drive
> paths in the cloned registry, so when someone takes away the source
> C-drive, then the corresponding files won't be available to the clone.

>>> I'm assuming from your answers that there is no risk of the
>>> clone-booting process doing writes to the source HDD's C-drive in a
>>> way that would creates problems for the booting of the source HDD.

>> Correct. 

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Thread

Initialize / format 500 GB Momentus XT to make bootable clone AndyHancock <andymhancock@gmail.com> - 2012-01-06 22:57 -0800
  Re: Initialize / format 500 GB Momentus XT to make bootable clone "Rod Speed" <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> - 2012-01-08 07:18 +1100
    Re: Initialize / format 500 GB Momentus XT to make bootable clone AndyHancock <andymhancock@gmail.com> - 2012-01-08 16:17 -0800
      Re: Initialize / format 500 GB Momentus XT to make bootable clone "Rod Speed" <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> - 2012-01-09 13:53 +1100
        Re: Initialize / format 500 GB Momentus XT to make bootable clone AndyHancock <andymhancock@gmail.com> - 2012-01-11 22:22 -0800
          Re: Initialize / format 500 GB Momentus XT to make bootable clone "Rod Speed" <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> - 2012-01-12 19:34 +1100
            Re: Initialize / format 500 GB Momentus XT to make bootable clone AndyHancock <andymhancock@gmail.com> - 2012-01-13 21:08 -0800
              Re: Initialize / format 500 GB Momentus XT to make bootable clone "Rod Speed" <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> - 2012-01-14 16:32 +1100
          Re: Initialize / format 500 GB Momentus XT to make bootable clone Mike Tomlinson <mike@jasper.org.uk> - 2012-01-13 11:46 +0000
            Re: Initialize / format 500 GB Momentus XT to make bootable clone Arno <me@privacy.net> - 2012-01-13 17:08 +0000
              Re: Initialize / format 500 GB Momentus XT to make bootable clone AndyHancock <andymhancock@gmail.com> - 2012-01-13 21:14 -0800
                Re: Initialize / format 500 GB Momentus XT to make bootable clone "Rod Speed" <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> - 2012-01-14 16:41 +1100
                Re: Initialize / format 500 GB Momentus XT to make bootable clone AndyHancock <andymhancock@gmail.com> - 2012-01-14 21:38 -0800
                Re: Initialize / format 500 GB Momentus XT to make bootable clone "Rod Speed" <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> - 2012-01-15 20:37 +1100
                Re: Initialize / format 500 GB Momentus XT to make bootable clone AndyHancock <andymhancock@gmail.com> - 2012-01-15 21:23 -0800
                Re: Initialize / format 500 GB Momentus XT to make bootable clone "Rod Speed" <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> - 2012-01-16 20:14 +1100
                Re: Initialize / format 500 GB Momentus XT to make bootable clone AndyHancock <andymhancock@gmail.com> - 2012-01-16 20:57 -0800
                Re: Initialize / format 500 GB Momentus XT to make bootable clone "Rod Speed" <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> - 2012-01-17 19:44 +1100
                Re: Initialize / format 500 GB Momentus XT to make bootable clone AndyHancock <andymhancock@gmail.com> - 2012-02-15 20:48 -0800
                Re: Initialize / format 500 GB Momentus XT to make bootable clone "Rod Speed" <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> - 2012-02-16 16:10 +1100
                Re: Initialize / format 500 GB Momentus XT to make bootable clone AndyHancock <andymhancock@gmail.com> - 2012-02-16 20:50 -0800
                Re: Initialize / format 500 GB Momentus XT to make bootable clone AndyHancock <andymhancock@gmail.com> - 2012-02-17 04:26 -0800
                Re: Initialize / format 500 GB Momentus XT to make bootable clone "Rod Speed" <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> - 2012-02-18 00:58 +1100
                Re: Initialize / format 500 GB Momentus XT to make bootable clone AndyHancock <andymhancock@gmail.com> - 2012-02-19 15:04 -0800
                Re: Initialize / format 500 GB Momentus XT to make bootable clone "Rod Speed" <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> - 2012-02-20 10:55 +1100
                Re: Initialize / format 500 GB Momentus XT to make bootable clone AndyHancock <andymhancock@gmail.com> - 2012-02-19 21:27 -0800
                Re: Initialize / format 500 GB Momentus XT to make bootable clone "Rod Speed" <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> - 2012-02-20 20:12 +1100
                Re: Initialize / format 500 GB Momentus XT to make bootable clone AndyHancock <andymhancock@gmail.com> - 2012-02-20 22:50 -0800
                Re: Initialize / format 500 GB Momentus XT to make bootable clone "Rod Speed" <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> - 2012-02-21 20:20 +1100
                Re: Initialize / format 500 GB Momentus XT to make bootable clone AndyHancock <andymhancock@gmail.com> - 2012-02-21 22:08 -0800
                Re: Initialize / format 500 GB Momentus XT to make bootable clone "Rod Speed" <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> - 2012-02-22 19:34 +1100
                Re: Initialize / format 500 GB Momentus XT to make bootable clone "Rod Speed" <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> - 2012-02-23 05:09 +1100
                Re: Initialize / format 500 GB Momentus XT to make bootable clone AndyHancock <andymhancock@gmail.com> - 2012-02-22 20:26 -0800
                Re: Initialize / format 500 GB Momentus XT to make bootable clone AndyHancock <andymhancock@gmail.com> - 2012-02-22 20:46 -0800
                Re: Initialize / format 500 GB Momentus XT to make bootable clone "Rod Speed" <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> - 2012-02-23 20:04 +1100
                Re: Initialize / format 500 GB Momentus XT to make bootable clone AndyHancock <andymhancock@gmail.com> - 2012-02-23 18:49 -0800
                Re: Initialize / format 500 GB Momentus XT to make bootable clone "Rod Speed" <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> - 2012-02-24 15:58 +1100
                Re: Initialize / format 500 GB Momentus XT to make bootable clone AndyHancock <andymhancock@gmail.com> - 2012-02-23 21:09 -0800
                Re: Initialize / format 500 GB Momentus XT to make bootable clone "Rod Speed" <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> - 2012-02-24 17:30 +1100
                Re: Initialize / format 500 GB Momentus XT to make bootable clone AndyHancock <andymhancock@gmail.com> - 2012-02-24 20:39 -0800
                Re: Initialize / format 500 GB Momentus XT to make bootable clone Winniethepooh@100acrewoods.net (GMAN) - 2012-02-22 15:48 +0000
                Re: Initialize / format 500 GB Momentus XT to make bootable clone Arno <me@privacy.net> - 2012-01-14 18:37 +0000
                Re: Initialize / format 500 GB Momentus XT to make bootable clone AndyHancock <andymhancock@gmail.com> - 2012-01-14 21:42 -0800

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