Groups | Search | Server Info | Keyboard shortcuts | Login | Register [http] [https] [nntp] [nntps]

Groups > rec.arts.sf.written > #488897 > unrolled thread

Societies of superhumans

Back to article view | Back to rec.arts.sf.written

Contents

  Societies of superhumans The  Zygon <stafford.martin@gmail.com> - 2018-03-23 00:15 -0700
    Re: Societies of superhumans Peter Trei <petertrei@gmail.com> - 2018-03-23 06:43 -0700
      Re: Societies of superhumans Peter Trei <petertrei@gmail.com> - 2018-03-23 07:02 -0700
        Re: Societies of superhumans djheydt@kithrup.com (Dorothy J Heydt) - 2018-03-23 14:29 +0000
        Re: Societies of superhumans Robert Carnegie <rja.carnegie@excite.com> - 2018-03-23 21:56 -0700
          Re: Societies of superhumans goldfarb@ocf.berkeley.edu (David Goldfarb) - 2018-03-24 18:08 +0000
            Re: Societies of superhumans Robert Carnegie <rja.carnegie@excite.com> - 2018-03-24 14:49 -0700
      Re: Societies of superhumans djheydt@kithrup.com (Dorothy J Heydt) - 2018-03-23 14:27 +0000
      Re: Societies of superhumans Johnny1A <johnny1a.again@gmail.com> - 2018-03-26 21:41 -0700
        Re: Societies of superhumans The  Zygon <stafford.martin@gmail.com> - 2018-03-27 21:49 -0700
    Re: Societies of superhumans djheydt@kithrup.com (Dorothy J Heydt) - 2018-03-23 13:37 +0000
      Re: Societies of superhumans D B Davis <g@crcomp.net> - 2018-03-23 18:45 +0000
        Re: Societies of superhumans Dimensional Traveler <dtravel@sonic.net> - 2018-03-23 13:00 -0700
        Re: Societies of superhumans "Michael F. Stemper" <michael.stemper@gmail.com> - 2018-03-23 15:03 -0500
          Re: Societies of superhumans D B Davis <g@crcomp.net> - 2018-03-23 21:19 +0000
            Re: Societies of superhumans djheydt@kithrup.com (Dorothy J Heydt) - 2018-03-23 22:25 +0000
              Re: Societies of superhumans D B Davis <g@crcomp.net> - 2018-03-23 23:48 +0000
          Re: Societies of superhumans The  Zygon <stafford.martin@gmail.com> - 2018-03-23 19:37 -0700
            Re: Societies of superhumans David Johnston <davidjohnston29@yahoo.com> - 2018-03-23 20:43 -0600
        Re: Societies of superhumans djheydt@kithrup.com (Dorothy J Heydt) - 2018-03-23 20:04 +0000
          Re: Societies of superhumans "Michael F. Stemper" <michael.stemper@gmail.com> - 2018-03-23 16:12 -0500
            Re: Societies of superhumans djheydt@kithrup.com (Dorothy J Heydt) - 2018-03-23 22:26 +0000
        Re: Societies of superhumans The  Zygon <stafford.martin@gmail.com> - 2018-03-23 19:31 -0700
      Re: Societies of superhumans The  Zygon <stafford.martin@gmail.com> - 2018-03-23 19:19 -0700
        Re: Societies of superhumans goldfarb@ocf.berkeley.edu (David Goldfarb) - 2018-03-24 18:00 +0000
          Re: Societies of superhumans Quadibloc <jsavard@ecn.ab.ca> - 2018-03-25 09:57 -0700
    Re: Societies of superhumans Ahasuerus <ahasuerus@email.com> - 2018-03-23 07:08 -0700
      Re: Societies of superhumans Peter Trei <petertrei@gmail.com> - 2018-03-23 07:39 -0700
      Re: Societies of superhumans The  Zygon <stafford.martin@gmail.com> - 2018-03-23 19:20 -0700
      Re: Societies of superhumans lal_truckee <lal_truckee@yahoo.com> - 2018-03-25 08:51 -0700
        Re: Societies of superhumans djheydt@kithrup.com (Dorothy J Heydt) - 2018-03-25 16:51 +0000
          Re: Societies of superhumans Ahasuerus <ahasuerus@email.com> - 2018-03-25 10:16 -0700
            Re: Societies of superhumans Quadibloc <jsavard@ecn.ab.ca> - 2018-03-26 17:11 -0700
              Re: Societies of superhumans djheydt@kithrup.com (Dorothy J Heydt) - 2018-03-27 00:18 +0000
                Re: Societies of superhumans Dimensional Traveler <dtravel@sonic.net> - 2018-03-26 19:59 -0700
                  Re: Societies of superhumans djheydt@kithrup.com (Dorothy J Heydt) - 2018-03-27 05:55 +0000
                    Re: Societies of superhumans Greg Goss <gossg@gossg.org> - 2018-03-27 05:29 -0600
                      Re: Societies of superhumans D B Davis <g@crcomp.net> - 2018-03-27 15:57 +0000
                        Re: Societies of superhumans The  Zygon <stafford.martin@gmail.com> - 2018-03-27 22:11 -0700
                        Re: Societies of superhumans David DeLaney <daviddelaney@earthlink.net> - 2018-04-02 04:29 -0500
                      Re: Societies of superhumans The  Zygon <stafford.martin@gmail.com> - 2018-03-27 22:01 -0700
                    Re: Societies of superhumans The  Zygon <stafford.martin@gmail.com> - 2018-03-27 21:54 -0700
                  Re: Societies of superhumans Gene Wirchenko <genew@telus.net> - 2018-03-27 14:22 -0700
                  Re: Societies of superhumans Johnny1A <johnny1a.again@gmail.com> - 2018-03-30 20:37 -0700
                    Re: Societies of superhumans mcdowell_ag@sky.com - 2018-03-30 22:09 -0700
                    Re: Societies of superhumans The  Zygon <stafford.martin@gmail.com> - 2018-03-31 01:25 -0700
                      Re: Societies of superhumans Kevrob <kevrob@my-deja.com> - 2018-03-31 05:51 -0700
                        Re: Societies of superhumans Robert Carnegie <rja.carnegie@excite.com> - 2018-03-31 20:07 -0700
          Re: Societies of superhumans lal_truckee <lal_truckee@yahoo.com> - 2018-03-26 22:26 -0700
            Re: Societies of superhumans djheydt@kithrup.com (Dorothy J Heydt) - 2018-03-27 05:55 +0000
              Re: Societies of superhumans The  Zygon <stafford.martin@gmail.com> - 2018-03-27 21:57 -0700
    Re: Societies of superhumans D B Davis <g@crcomp.net> - 2018-03-23 14:22 +0000
      Re: Societies of superhumans The  Zygon <stafford.martin@gmail.com> - 2018-03-23 19:24 -0700
        Re: Societies of superhumans Lynn McGuire <lynnmcguire5@gmail.com> - 2018-03-26 15:40 -0500
    Societies of superhumans Jack Bohn <jack.bohn64@gmail.com> - 2018-03-23 07:39 -0700
      Re: Societies of superhumans Leo Sgouros <adravirgo@gmail.com> - 2018-03-23 07:43 -0700
        Re: Societies of superhumans The  Zygon <stafford.martin@gmail.com> - 2018-03-23 19:27 -0700
      Re: Societies of superhumans djheydt@kithrup.com (Dorothy J Heydt) - 2018-03-23 18:26 +0000
      Re: Societies of superhumans David DeLaney <daviddelaney@earthlink.net> - 2018-04-02 04:37 -0500
    Re: Societies of superhumans David Johnston <davidjohnston29@yahoo.com> - 2018-03-23 14:25 -0600
      Re: Societies of superhumans David DeLaney <daviddelaney@earthlink.net> - 2018-04-02 04:49 -0500
    Re: Societies of superhumans "Sea Wasp (Ryk E. Spoor)" <seawasp@sgeinc.invalid.com> - 2018-03-24 22:05 -0400
      Re: Societies of superhumans ted@loft.tnolan.com (Ted Nolan <tednolan>) - 2018-03-25 03:21 +0000
        Re: Societies of superhumans Johnny1A <johnny1a.again@gmail.com> - 2018-03-26 21:48 -0700
      Re: Societies of superhumans David Johnston <davidjohnston29@yahoo.com> - 2018-03-24 21:37 -0600
        Re: Societies of superhumans "Sea Wasp (Ryk E. Spoor)" <seawasp@sgeinc.invalid.com> - 2018-03-27 07:34 -0400
          Re: Societies of superhumans The  Zygon <stafford.martin@gmail.com> - 2018-03-27 22:06 -0700
            Re: Societies of superhumans David DeLaney <daviddelaney@earthlink.net> - 2018-04-02 04:52 -0500
          Re: Societies of superhumans Johnny1A <johnny1a.again@gmail.com> - 2018-03-30 20:33 -0700
            Re: Societies of superhumans "Sea Wasp (Ryk E. Spoor)" <seawasp@sgeinc.invalid.com> - 2018-03-31 10:17 -0400
              Re: Societies of superhumans mcdowell_ag@sky.com - 2018-03-31 08:50 -0700
                Re: Societies of superhumans David DeLaney <daviddelaney@earthlink.net> - 2018-04-02 04:54 -0500
              Re: Societies of superhumans Ahasuerus <ahasuerus@email.com> - 2018-03-31 09:40 -0700
              Re: Societies of superhumans Jack Bohn <jack.bohn64@gmail.com> - 2018-03-31 12:37 -0700
              Re: Societies of superhumans David Johnston <davidjohnston29@yahoo.com> - 2018-03-31 14:05 -0600
              Re: Societies of superhumans Johnny1A <johnny1a.again@gmail.com> - 2018-04-01 19:42 -0700
                Re: Societies of superhumans David Johnston <davidjohnston29@yahoo.com> - 2018-04-01 21:22 -0600
                  Re: Societies of superhumans ted@loft.tnolan.com (Ted Nolan <tednolan>) - 2018-04-02 03:57 +0000
    Re: Societies of superhumans Lynn McGuire <lynnmcguire5@gmail.com> - 2018-03-26 15:36 -0500
      Re: Societies of superhumans Peter Trei <petertrei@gmail.com> - 2018-03-26 14:15 -0700
        Re: Societies of superhumans Lynn McGuire <lynnmcguire5@gmail.com> - 2018-03-26 16:22 -0500
          Re: Societies of superhumans Dimensional Traveler <dtravel@sonic.net> - 2018-03-26 14:34 -0700
      Re: Societies of superhumans Robert Carnegie <rja.carnegie@excite.com> - 2018-03-26 14:25 -0700
        Re: Societies of superhumans Lynn McGuire <lynnmcguire5@gmail.com> - 2018-03-26 16:28 -0500

Page 1 of 5  [1] 2 3 4 5  Next page →

#488897 — Societies of superhumans

The idea of the superman pervades science fiction. But in most of the stories I have read, the superhumans are evil in some way and need to be destroyed. I have read very few in which all humans have become superhuman, compared to humanity of today. I am interested in hearing about stories which tackle this problem. That is, how to write a good story where all humans are superhuman, and so the story is not about the clash between the ordinary humans and superhumans.

Maybe I should add that sometimes the clash set to some remove.  The superhumans have become separated from the main branch of humanity, and the clash is between the main branch and separated superhumans.

[toc] | [next] | [standalone]

#488909

On Friday, March 23, 2018 at 3:15:06 AM UTC-4, The  Zygon wrote:
> The idea of the superman pervades science fiction. But in most of the stories I have read, the superhumans are evil in some way and need to be destroyed. I have read very few in which all humans have become superhuman, compared to humanity of today. I am interested in hearing about stories which tackle this problem. That is, how to write a good story where all humans are superhuman, and so the story is not about the clash between the ordinary humans and superhumans.
> 
> Maybe I should add that sometimes the clash set to some remove.  The superhumans have become separated from the main branch of humanity, and the clash is between the main branch and separated superhumans.

https://imgur.com/gallery/TKU6vPE (SFW).

There have been a number of stories which have every person having some talent
or power - Piers Anthony's 'Xanth' series, for example. In comics, there's "Normalman", and in MMORPGs "City of Heroes".

Its difficult to imagine a stable society where people had random and different
superpowers.

OTOH, you could argue that compared to the rest of the animal kingdom, humans
are *already* superpowered. Quite aside from the obvious physical traits
(long distance endurance, weaponized throwing), we've used our superior
intellect to equip ourselves with the ability to out fight, out run, and out
compete every other creature on Earth, and to do so in every surface habitat.

pt

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]

#488912

On Friday, March 23, 2018 at 9:43:50 AM UTC-4, Peter Trei wrote:
> On Friday, March 23, 2018 at 3:15:06 AM UTC-4, The  Zygon wrote:
> > The idea of the superman pervades science fiction. But in most of the stories I have read, the superhumans are evil in some way and need to be destroyed. I have read very few in which all humans have become superhuman, compared to humanity of today. I am interested in hearing about stories which tackle this problem. That is, how to write a good story where all humans are superhuman, and so the story is not about the clash between the ordinary humans and superhumans.
> > 
> > Maybe I should add that sometimes the clash set to some remove.  The superhumans have become separated from the main branch of humanity, and the clash is between the main branch and separated superhumans.
> 
> https://imgur.com/gallery/TKU6vPE (SFW).
> 
> There have been a number of stories which have every person having some talent
> or power - Piers Anthony's 'Xanth' series, for example. In comics, there's "Normalman", and in MMORPGs "City of Heroes".
> 
> Its difficult to imagine a stable society where people had random and different
> superpowers.
> 
> OTOH, you could argue that compared to the rest of the animal kingdom, humans
> are *already* superpowered. Quite aside from the obvious physical traits
> (long distance endurance, weaponized throwing), we've used our superior
> intellect to equip ourselves with the ability to out fight, out run, and out
> compete every other creature on Earth, and to do so in every surface habitat.
> 
> pt

Crap. Posted wrong link.

https://i.imgur.com/TrtPr.jpg (still SFW)

pt

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]

#488921

In article <8bbfda15-c729-4103-bda8-8f0732b91aec@googlegroups.com>,
Peter Trei  <petertrei@gmail.com> wrote:
>On Friday, March 23, 2018 at 9:43:50 AM UTC-4, Peter Trei wrote:
>> On Friday, March 23, 2018 at 3:15:06 AM UTC-4, The  Zygon wrote:
>> > The idea of the superman pervades science fiction. But in most of
>the stories I have read, the superhumans are evil in some way and need
>to be destroyed. I have read very few in which all humans have become
>superhuman, compared to humanity of today. I am interested in hearing
>about stories which tackle this problem. That is, how to write a good
>story where all humans are superhuman, and so the story is not about the
>clash between the ordinary humans and superhumans.
>> > 
>> > Maybe I should add that sometimes the clash set to some remove.  The
>superhumans have become separated from the main branch of humanity, and
>the clash is between the main branch and separated superhumans.
>> 
>> https://imgur.com/gallery/TKU6vPE (SFW).
>> 
>> There have been a number of stories which have every person having some talent
>> or power - Piers Anthony's 'Xanth' series, for example. In comics,
>there's "Normalman", and in MMORPGs "City of Heroes".
>> 
>> Its difficult to imagine a stable society where people had random and
>different
>> superpowers.
>> 
>> OTOH, you could argue that compared to the rest of the animal kingdom, humans
>> are *already* superpowered. Quite aside from the obvious physical traits
>> (long distance endurance, weaponized throwing), we've used our superior
>> intellect to equip ourselves with the ability to out fight, out run, and out
>> compete every other creature on Earth, and to do so in every surface habitat.
>> 
>> pt
>
>Crap. Posted wrong link.
>
>https://i.imgur.com/TrtPr.jpg (still SFW)

And yet, both Mr. Rogers and Sesame Street spent decades telling
every little kid that s/he was special.  Because the little kids
were not yet expected to know the word "unique."

-- 
Dorothy J. Heydt
Vallejo, California
djheydt at gmail dot com

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]

#488969

On Friday, 23 March 2018 14:02:54 UTC, Peter Trei  wrote:
> On Friday, March 23, 2018 at 9:43:50 AM UTC-4, Peter Trei wrote:
> > On Friday, March 23, 2018 at 3:15:06 AM UTC-4, The  Zygon wrote:
> > > The idea of the superman pervades science fiction. But in most of the stories I have read, the superhumans are evil in some way and need to be destroyed. I have read very few in which all humans have become superhuman, compared to humanity of today. I am interested in hearing about stories which tackle this problem. That is, how to write a good story where all humans are superhuman, and so the story is not about the clash between the ordinary humans and superhumans.
> > > 
> > > Maybe I should add that sometimes the clash set to some remove.  The superhumans have become separated from the main branch of humanity, and the clash is between the main branch and separated superhumans.
> > 
> > https://imgur.com/gallery/TKU6vPE (SFW).
> > 
> > There have been a number of stories which have every person having some talent
> > or power - Piers Anthony's 'Xanth' series, for example. In comics, there's "Normalman", and in MMORPGs "City of Heroes".
> > 
> > Its difficult to imagine a stable society where people had random and different
> > superpowers.
> > 
> > OTOH, you could argue that compared to the rest of the animal kingdom, humans
> > are *already* superpowered. Quite aside from the obvious physical traits
> > (long distance endurance, weaponized throwing), we've used our superior
> > intellect to equip ourselves with the ability to out fight, out run, and out
> > compete every other creature on Earth, and to do so in every surface habitat.
> > 
> > pt
> 
> Crap. Posted wrong link.
> 
> https://i.imgur.com/TrtPr.jpg (still SFW)
> 
> pt

"There lived a king, as I've been told" - Gilbert and Sullivan.
Doesn't really convince me that for everyone to be rich wouldn't
be nice, but that's unreliable narrators for you.

Doctor Who claimed to have not met anyone who wasn't important,
but after the episode I just watched where he met "Donna Noble"
(Catherine Tate) and told her that she wasn't important.
Granted, she turned out to be colossally important.

<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Top_10_%28comics%29>: city of
supermen.

Monty Python's "Bicycle Repairman", which I suspect isn't
related at all to Bruce Sterling's.

Attilan, secret city of The Inhumans; come to think, most
of he locations in this web page
<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Features_of_the_Marvel_Universe>
are cities populated mainly by superhumans.  Including New York!  :-)

(And in some future stories the normal humans have indeed died out,
and the superheroes just carry on...)

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]

#488992

In article <6b801c63-3f38-40a2-8089-8a997b42c289@googlegroups.com>,
Robert Carnegie  <rja.carnegie@excite.com> wrote:
>Doctor Who claimed to have not met anyone who wasn't important,
>but after the episode I just watched where he met "Donna Noble"
>(Catherine Tate) and told her that she wasn't important.
>Granted, she turned out to be colossally important.

There's an episode a little further on, where the Doctor visits
Pompeii shortly before the eruption. The eruption itself is a
"fixed point in time" and can't be averted: but Donna convinces
the Doctor to rescue one family. "Save *somebody*."

Now, "I've never met anyone who wasn't important" is a lovely, 
humanist sentiment. And so is "Save *somebody*". But...they're 
in direct conflict. The only way it's possible to save that
family from dying is if they ARE in fact unimportant -- if it
really doesn't matter whether they live or die. Otherwise you've
just wrecked history.

Yeah, I know: I'm overthinking it, it's just a show, I should 
really just relax.

-- 
   David Goldfarb          |"Feeling smug about one's opinions is the very 
goldfarbdj@gmail.com       | lifeblood of the Net."
goldfarb@ocf.berkeley.edu  |           -- Dawn Friedman

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]

#488998

On Saturday, 24 March 2018 18:30:05 UTC, David Goldfarb  wrote:
> In article <6b801c63-3f38-40a2-8089-8a997b42c289@googlegroups.com>,
> Robert Carnegie  <rja.carnegie@excite.com> wrote:
> >Doctor Who claimed to have not met anyone who wasn't important,
> >but after the episode I just watched where he met "Donna Noble"
> >(Catherine Tate) and told her that she wasn't important.
> >Granted, she turned out to be colossally important.
> 
> There's an episode a little further on, where the Doctor visits
> Pompeii shortly before the eruption. The eruption itself is a
> "fixed point in time" and can't be averted: but Donna convinces
> the Doctor to rescue one family. "Save *somebody*."
> 
> Now, "I've never met anyone who wasn't important" is a lovely, 
> humanist sentiment. And so is "Save *somebody*". But...they're 
> in direct conflict. The only way it's possible to save that
> family from dying is if they ARE in fact unimportant -- if it
> really doesn't matter whether they live or die. Otherwise you've
> just wrecked history.
> 
> Yeah, I know: I'm overthinking it, it's just a show, I should 
> really just relax.

Perhaps someone's life changing the course of history is not
the only way to be important - in real life as well as in 
the show. 

Is an alien allowed to kill people that are unimportant?
No.  The Doctor stops it.  Although actually, the alien usually
gets to kill at least one person, often before the titles come,
to establish that it is a bad alien.  So this may be hypocrisy.

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]

#488920

In article <1a3e449f-0df7-4635-9af1-f6464094ec40@googlegroups.com>,
Peter Trei  <petertrei@gmail.com> wrote:
>On Friday, March 23, 2018 at 3:15:06 AM UTC-4, The  Zygon wrote:
>> The idea of the superman pervades science fiction. But in most of the
>stories I have read, the superhumans are evil in some way and need to be
>destroyed. I have read very few in which all humans have become
>superhuman, compared to humanity of today. I am interested in hearing
>about stories which tackle this problem. That is, how to write a good
>story where all humans are superhuman, and so the story is not about the
>clash between the ordinary humans and superhumans.
>> 
>> Maybe I should add that sometimes the clash set to some remove.  The
>superhumans have become separated from the main branch of humanity, and
>the clash is between the main branch and separated superhumans.
>
>https://imgur.com/gallery/TKU6vPE (SFW).
>
>There have been a number of stories which have every person having some talent
>or power - Piers Anthony's 'Xanth' series, for example. In comics,
>there's "Normalman", and in MMORPGs "City of Heroes".
>
>Its difficult to imagine a stable society where people had random and different
>superpowers.
>
>OTOH, you could argue that compared to the rest of the animal kingdom, humans
>are *already* superpowered. Quite aside from the obvious physical traits
>(long distance endurance, weaponized throwing), we've used our superior
>intellect to equip ourselves with the ability to out fight, out run, and out
>compete every other creature on Earth, and to do so in every surface habitat.

This, e.g.

http://teal-deer.tumblr.com/post/57910877901/siderealsandman-friendlytroll-astrakiseki?utm_content=bufferb15db&utm_source=buffer&utm_medium=twitter&utm_campaign=Buffer

Note: this used to be a nice, readable post, and then somebody
(the site owner?) decided it needed Fancy Formatting.  You can
still read it if you work at it.

-- 
Dorothy J. Heydt
Vallejo, California
djheydt at gmail dot com

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]

#489143

On Friday, March 23, 2018 at 8:43:50 AM UTC-5, Peter Trei wrote:
> On Friday, March 23, 2018 at 3:15:06 AM UTC-4, The  Zygon wrote:

> 
> OTOH, you could argue that compared to the rest of the animal kingdom, humans
> are *already* superpowered. Quite aside from the obvious physical traits
> (long distance endurance, weaponized throwing), we've used our superior
> intellect to equip ourselves with the ability to out fight, out run, and out
> compete every other creature on Earth, and to do so in every surface habitat.
> 
> pt

Now take a look at what the equation looks like, from the POV of the other animal species.

Which is why so many stories on this line tend to end being about the human vs. superhuman _conflict_.  It's very difficult to create a believable setting of peaceful coexistence between two different species that want to occupy the same niche when one is far more able than the other.

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]

#489229

On Tuesday, March 27, 2018 at 12:41:29 AM UTC-4, Johnny1A wrote:
> On Friday, March 23, 2018 at 8:43:50 AM UTC-5, Peter Trei wrote:
> > On Friday, March 23, 2018 at 3:15:06 AM UTC-4, The  Zygon wrote:
> 
> > 
> > OTOH, you could argue that compared to the rest of the animal kingdom, humans
> > are *already* superpowered. Quite aside from the obvious physical traits
> > (long distance endurance, weaponized throwing), we've used our superior
> > intellect to equip ourselves with the ability to out fight, out run, and out
> > compete every other creature on Earth, and to do so in every surface habitat.
> > 
> > pt
> 
> Now take a look at what the equation looks like, from the POV of the other animal species.
> 
> Which is why so many stories on this line tend to end being about the human vs. superhuman _conflict_.  It's very difficult to create a believable setting of peaceful coexistence between two different species that want to occupy the same niche when one is far more able than the other.

I can imagine many stories where the superhuman humans struggle against ET's.  I love those stories.  _The Monster_, a short by A E Van Vogt is my favorite short story, even though I would never hold it up as a great short story.

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]

#488911

In article <35f964bd-b204-4342-9da2-21e8e19ac2b1@googlegroups.com>,
The Zygon  <stafford.martin@gmail.com> wrote:
>The idea of the superman pervades science fiction. But in most of the
>stories I have read, the superhumans are evil in some way and need to be
>destroyed. I have read very few in which all humans have become
>superhuman, compared to humanity of today. I am interested in hearing
>about stories which tackle this problem. That is, how to write a good
>story where all humans are superhuman, and so the story is not about the
>clash between the ordinary humans and superhumans.

>Maybe I should add that sometimes the clash set to some remove.  The
>superhumans have become separated from the main branch of humanity, and
>the clash is between the main branch and separated superhumans.

Well, Anderson's _Brain Wave_, in which the Solar System drifts
out of a cloud of handwavium and everybody becomes much more
intelligent.  Some people can't take it.

Van Vogt's _Slan,_ of course.  They're not superhumans, but they
are telepaths, which gives everybody else the creeps.

Ditto Padgett's _Mutant_, whose Baldies have the same problem.

Heinlein's _Methuselah's Children_ comes to mind, in which the
Howard Families have to leave Earth because of conflict with
normals ... but they're not superhumans, with the exception maybe
of Andrew Libby.  They're just longaevi.  

This is just off the top of my head at 6:30 in the morning.  Note
also that these are all old stories.  Others will be able to
provide some newer ones.

-- 
Dorothy J. Heydt
Vallejo, California
djheydt at gmail dot com

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]

#488933

Dorothy J Heydt <djheydt@kithrup.com> wrote:
> In article <35f964bd-b204-4342-9da2-21e8e19ac2b1@googlegroups.com>,
> The Zygon  <stafford.martin@gmail.com> wrote:
>>The idea of the superman pervades science fiction. But in most of the
>>stories I have read, the superhumans are evil in some way and need to be
>>destroyed. I have read very few in which all humans have become
>>superhuman, compared to humanity of today. I am interested in hearing
>>about stories which tackle this problem. That is, how to write a good
>>story where all humans are superhuman, and so the story is not about the
>>clash between the ordinary humans and superhumans.
>
>>Maybe I should add that sometimes the clash set to some remove.  The
>>superhumans have become separated from the main branch of humanity, and
>>the clash is between the main branch and separated superhumans.
>
> Well, Anderson's _Brain Wave_, in which the Solar System drifts
> out of a cloud of handwavium and everybody becomes much more
> intelligent.  Some people can't take it.
>
> Van Vogt's _Slan,_ of course.  They're not superhumans, but they
> are telepaths, which gives everybody else the creeps.
>
> Ditto Padgett's _Mutant_, whose Baldies have the same problem.
>
> Heinlein's _Methuselah's Children_ comes to mind, in which the
> Howard Families have to leave Earth because of conflict with
> normals ... but they're not superhumans, with the exception maybe
> of Andrew Libby.  They're just longaevi.
>
> This is just off the top of my head at 6:30 in the morning.  Note
> also that these are all old stories.  Others will be able to
> provide some newer ones.
>

Re: _Brain Wave_. Shades of Fred Hoyle's panspermia. Most people who
give a hoot in hell about Hoyle like that theory. It's not my favorite
theory. Hoyle's steady state universe theory is my favorite theory
because it explains galactic blue shifts. Most people who like the
panspermia theory don't like the steady state theory. So, that makes me
out of step with most people who give a hoot in hell about Hoyle.
    Re: _Slan_. Do the Dreeges of "Asylum" (Van Vogt) count? If so, then
surely _Twilight_ (Meyers) along with most of Unnatural Quarter stomping
grounds of Dan Shamble, Zombie P.I.
    Do mutants count? If so, there's "The Golden Man" (PKD), _Flow My
Tears the Policeman Said_ (PKD) and _Jumper_ (Gould).
    People with six fingers can enter accelerated time at their pleasure
in "Six Fingers of Time" (Lafferty). "Big Ancestor" (Wallace) contains
a mix of humans in different stages of evolution who more-or-less get
along.

Thank you,

--
Don

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]

#488938

On 3/23/2018 11:45 AM, D B Davis wrote:
> Dorothy J Heydt <djheydt@kithrup.com> wrote:
>>
>> This is just off the top of my head at 6:30 in the morning.  Note
>> also that these are all old stories.  Others will be able to
>> provide some newer ones.
>>
> 
> Re: _Brain Wave_. Shades of Fred Hoyle's panspermia. Most people who
> give a hoot in hell about Hoyle like that theory. It's not my favorite
> theory. Hoyle's steady state universe theory is my favorite theory
> because it explains galactic blue shifts.

Did you mean galactic red shifts?


-- 
Inquiring minds want to know while minds with a self-preservation 
instinct are running screaming.

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]

#488940

On 2018-03-23 13:45, D B Davis wrote:
> Dorothy J Heydt <djheydt@kithrup.com> wrote:

>> Well, Anderson's _Brain Wave_, in which the Solar System drifts
>> out of a cloud of handwavium and everybody becomes much more
>> intelligent.  Some people can't take it.

> Re: _Brain Wave_. Shades of Fred Hoyle's panspermia.

Excuse me? I've read _Brain Wave_ multiple times, and can't think of
anything in it that hints at panspermia.

In case you haven't had the opportunity, here's a little expansion of
what Dorothy said:

In the story, there is some field emanating from the center of the
galaxy (that's her "cloud of handwavium") that suppresses mental
activity. (If you've read Vinge's _A Fire Upon the Deep_, think of
the Zones of Thought. If you haven't, I highly recommend that you do.)

As Sol was orbiting around the galaxy, it passed into this field about
65 Myr back. Thus, the extinction of the dinosaurs, who'd been top dog
for upwards of 100 Myr. But, Mammalia now had a wide-open ecosystem to
fill, and expanded enthusiastically into all of those niches.

Intelligence developed -- under the effects of that field. When Sol
finally exited that field, it was as if humanity (and apes, and farm
animals, and so on) had been running metaphorical marathons while
carrying full packs. Field goes away and bang! everybody (and
everything) is suddenly able to think much more effectively.

Nothing to do with panspermia, as far as I can tell.

>   Hoyle's steady state universe theory is my favorite theory
> because it explains galactic blue shifts.

I assume that you're referring to the fact that for "nearby"
galaxies, their peculiar velocity[1] is large compared to
their velocity due to the Hubble flow. This effect is not
really observed further away than the Virgo cluster.[2]

But, the expansion of the universe is supported by more than
galactic redshift. For instance, there's the cosmic microwave
background.[3] This was the final nail in Steady State's coffin,
since Hot Big Bang predicted its existence, while Steady State
couldn't even explain it.

There's also the distributions of quasars and young galaxies.

The relative abundances of hydrogen and helium in the universe
(74% H, 26% He) are predicted by the Big Bang model as well.[4]
Without Big Bang nucleosynthesis, Hoyle spent much of the latter
part of his career trying to deduce a mechanism by which the
quarks or hydrogen atoms of continuous creation[5] could be turned
into an adequate supply of helium.

Of course, "steady state" doesn't mean "non-expanding", anyway.
Hoyle himself knew that the universe was expanding, which was
why he had to posit continuous creation to keep the universe
from changing as it expanded.

That having been said, the scene in Blish's _The Triumph of
Time_ where our intrepid band is in a position to observe the
"ping"s of hydrogen atoms popping into existence is still
pretty cool, even if it's based on a since-falsified theory.

[1] <http://astronomy.swin.edu.au/cosmos/P/Peculiar+Velocity>
[2] 
<http://www.astro.cornell.edu/academics/courses/astro201/hubbles_law.htm>
[3] <https://wmap.gsfc.nasa.gov/universe/bb_tests_cmb.html>
[4] <http://hyperphysics.phy-astr.gsu.edu/hbase/Astro/hydhel.html>
[5] <http://www.originsquest.org/objections-to-continuous-creation.html>

-- 
Michael F. Stemper
Why doesn't anybody care about apathy?

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]

#488946

Michael F. Stemper <michael.stemper@gmail.com> wrote:
> On 2018-03-23 13:45, D B Davis wrote:
>> Dorothy J Heydt <djheydt@kithrup.com> wrote:
>
>>> Well, Anderson's _Brain Wave_, in which the Solar System drifts
>>> out of a cloud of handwavium and everybody becomes much more
>>> intelligent.  Some people can't take it.
>
>> Re: _Brain Wave_. Shades of Fred Hoyle's panspermia.
>
> Excuse me? I've read _Brain Wave_ multiple times, and can't think of
> anything in it that hints at panspermia.
>
> In case you haven't had the opportunity, here's a little expansion of
> what Dorothy said:
>
> In the story, there is some field emanating from the center of the
> galaxy (that's her "cloud of handwavium") that suppresses mental
> activity. (If you've read Vinge's _A Fire Upon the Deep_, think of
> the Zones of Thought. If you haven't, I highly recommend that you do.)
>
> As Sol was orbiting around the galaxy, it passed into this field about
> 65 Myr back. Thus, the extinction of the dinosaurs, who'd been top dog
> for upwards of 100 Myr. But, Mammalia now had a wide-open ecosystem to
> fill, and expanded enthusiastically into all of those niches.
>
> Intelligence developed -- under the effects of that field. When Sol
> finally exited that field, it was as if humanity (and apes, and farm
> animals, and so on) had been running metaphorical marathons while
> carrying full packs. Field goes away and bang! everybody (and
> everything) is suddenly able to think much more effectively.
>
> Nothing to do with panspermia, as far as I can tell.
>
>>   Hoyle's steady state universe theory is my favorite theory
>> because it explains galactic blue shifts.
>
> I assume that you're referring to the fact that for "nearby"
> galaxies, their peculiar velocity[1] is large compared to
> their velocity due to the Hubble flow. This effect is not
>
> But, the expansion of the universe is supported by more than
> galactic redshift. For instance, there's the cosmic microwave
> background.[3] This was the final nail in Steady State's coffin,
> since Hot Big Bang predicted its existence, while Steady State
> couldn't even explain it.
>
> There's also the distributions of quasars and young galaxies.
>
> The relative abundances of hydrogen and helium in the universe
> (74% H, 26% He) are predicted by the Big Bang model as well.[4]
> Without Big Bang nucleosynthesis, Hoyle spent much of the latter
> part of his career trying to deduce a mechanism by which the
> quarks or hydrogen atoms of continuous creation[5] could be turned
> into an adequate supply of helium.
>
> Of course, "steady state" doesn't mean "non-expanding", anyway.
> Hoyle himself knew that the universe was expanding, which was
> why he had to posit continuous creation to keep the universe
> from changing as it expanded.
>
> That having been said, the scene in Blish's _The Triumph of
> Time_ where our intrepid band is in a position to observe the
> "ping"s of hydrogen atoms popping into existence is still
> pretty cool, even if it's based on a since-falsified theory.
>
> [1] <http://astronomy.swin.edu.au/cosmos/P/Peculiar+Velocity>
> [2]
> <http://www.astro.cornell.edu/academics/courses/astro201/hubbles_law.htm>
> [3] <https://wmap.gsfc.nasa.gov/universe/bb_tests_cmb.html>
> [4] <http://hyperphysics.phy-astr.gsu.edu/hbase/Astro/hydhel.html>
> [5] <http://www.originsquest.org/objections-to-continuous-creation.html>
>

Isn't a cloud of microorganisms is central to panspermia?  Among other
things, _The Black Cloud_ (Hoyle) leaves me with that impression.
Although _Brain Wave_ remains unread by me at present, a cloud of
handwavium seems similar to a cloud of microorganisms /to me/. YMMV and
obviously does.
    "Galactic blue shifts" is my lingo for the galactic spin discrepancy
whereby the rims of galaxies rotate faster than the nucleus. After an
amusing apoplectic sputtering fit full of blue language Wikipedia
finally manages to spit out a fair description of the discrepancy. [1]

    ... The rotational/orbital speeds of galaxies/stars do not
    follow the rules found in other orbital systems such as
    stars/planets and planets/moons that have most of their
    mass at the centre. Stars revolve around their galaxy's
    centre at equal or increasing speed over a large range of
    distances. In contrast, the orbital velocities of planets
    in planetary systems and moons orbiting planets decline
    with distance. In the latter cases, this reflects the
    mass distributions within those systems. The mass
    estimations for galaxies based on the light they emit
    are far too low to explain the velocity observations.

    The galaxy rotation problem is the discrepancy between
    observed galaxy rotation curves and the theoretical
    prediction, assuming a centrally dominated mass associated
    with the observed luminous material. When mass profiles of
    galaxies are calculated from the distribution of stars in
    spirals and mass-to-light ratios in the stellar disks,
    they do not match with the masses derived from the
    observed rotation curves and the law of gravity. A
    solution to this conundrum is to hypothesize the existence
    of dark matter and to assume its distribution from the
    galaxy's center out to its halo.

    Though dark matter is by far the most accepted explanation
    of the rotation problem, other proposals have been
    offered with varying degrees of success. Of the possible
    alternatives, the most notable is Modified Newtonian
    Dynamics (MOND), which involves modifying the laws of
    gravity.

     Hoyle's steady state theory might also explain the phenomenon.
Except most people who give a hoot in hell about Hoyle flat out won't
hear of it.

Note.

1. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Galaxy_rotation_curve

Thank you,

--
Don

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]

#488950

In article <20180323c@crcomp.net>, D B Davis  <g@crcomp.net> wrote:
>
>
>Isn't a cloud of microorganisms is central to panspermia?  Among other
>things, _The Black Cloud_ (Hoyle) leaves me with that impression.
>Although _Brain Wave_ remains unread by me at present, a cloud of
>handwavium seems similar to a cloud of microorganisms /to me/. YMMV and
>obviously does.

From what I remember of _Brain Wave_, it wasn't a cloud of
microorganisms, but of Mysterious Galactic Force.  Poul didn't
attempt to explain it; he was dealing with what happened as a
result of Earth getting out of it.  Some people seized on their
expanded intelligence with glee; others hated it (one woman blew
some of her brains out, so as to go back to "normal").

Much later, I was trying to rewrite a chunk of fanfic that Astrid
Anderson and I had written in the sixties, in an attempt to make
it salable (which failed), and Hal had invented a spacedrive for
me, the "tachyone conversion drive."  It converted normal matter
(aka "tardyons") into tachyons, which can only go *faster than*
light.

So Poul ran into Hal at a con or an SCA event or something, and
asked him to explain the tachyon drive.  Hal said, "I'll explain
it as soon as you explain quantum microjump."  And Poul said,
"Gotcha."

As I said, handwavium.

-- 
Dorothy J. Heydt
Vallejo, California
djheydt at gmail dot com

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]

#488953

Dorothy J Heydt <djheydt@kithrup.com> wrote:
> In article <20180323c@crcomp.net>, D B Davis  <g@crcomp.net> wrote:
>>
>>
>>Isn't a cloud of microorganisms is central to panspermia?  Among other
>>things, _The Black Cloud_ (Hoyle) leaves me with that impression.
>>Although _Brain Wave_ remains unread by me at present, a cloud of
>>handwavium seems similar to a cloud of microorganisms /to me/. YMMV and
>>obviously does.
>
> From what I remember of _Brain Wave_, it wasn't a cloud of
> microorganisms, but of Mysterious Galactic Force.  Poul didn't
> attempt to explain it; he was dealing with what happened as a
> result of Earth getting out of it.  Some people seized on their
> expanded intelligence with glee; others hated it (one woman blew
> some of her brains out, so as to go back to "normal").
>
> Much later, I was trying to rewrite a chunk of fanfic that Astrid
> Anderson and I had written in the sixties, in an attempt to make
> it salable (which failed), and Hal had invented a spacedrive for
> me, the "tachyone conversion drive."  It converted normal matter
> (aka "tardyons") into tachyons, which can only go *faster than*
> light.
>
> So Poul ran into Hal at a con or an SCA event or something, and
> asked him to explain the tachyon drive.  Hal said, "I'll explain
> it as soon as you explain quantum microjump."  And Poul said,
> "Gotcha."
>
> As I said, handwavium.
>

Michael's description of the premise behind the Anderson's excellent. It
makes me want to read the Anderson. Unfortunately, there's too many
other stories at the front of my line.
    Allow me to belatedly note that Michael and you bring a far more
comprehensive understanding of the flaws in my association to the table
beings both of you actually read _Brain Wave_. OTOH, in my simple world,
one interstellar cloud pretty much looks the same as the next, even if
one of them's not really a cloud but actually a stationary field.
    My own knowledge of "galactic blue shift" is just about exhausted at
this point. Someone once said in passing that steady state might explain
it.
    And, it really goes without saying that the sky map research done by
people such as John D Kraus is legendary. That said, maybe, just maybe,
something was overlooked in Hoyle's steady state theory.

Thank you,

--
Don

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]

#488962

On Friday, March 23, 2018 at 4:03:13 PM UTC-4, Michael F. Stemper wrote:
> On 2018-03-23 13:45, D B Davis wrote:
> > Dorothy J Heydt <djheydt@kithrup.com> wrote:
> 
> >> Well, Anderson's _Brain Wave_, in which the Solar System drifts
> >> out of a cloud of handwavium and everybody becomes much more
> >> intelligent.  Some people can't take it.
> 
> > Re: _Brain Wave_. Shades of Fred Hoyle's panspermia.
> 
> Excuse me? I've read _Brain Wave_ multiple times, and can't think of
> anything in it that hints at panspermia.
> 
> In case you haven't had the opportunity, here's a little expansion of
> what Dorothy said:
> 
> In the story, there is some field emanating from the center of the
> galaxy (that's her "cloud of handwavium") that suppresses mental
> activity. (If you've read Vinge's _A Fire Upon the Deep_, think of
> the Zones of Thought. If you haven't, I highly recommend that you do.)
> 
> As Sol was orbiting around the galaxy, it passed into this field about
> 65 Myr back. Thus, the extinction of the dinosaurs, who'd been top dog
> for upwards of 100 Myr. But, Mammalia now had a wide-open ecosystem to
> fill, and expanded enthusiastically into all of those niches.
> 
> Intelligence developed -- under the effects of that field. When Sol
> finally exited that field, it was as if humanity (and apes, and farm
> animals, and so on) had been running metaphorical marathons while
> carrying full packs. Field goes away and bang! everybody (and
> everything) is suddenly able to think much more effectively.
> 
> Nothing to do with panspermia, as far as I can tell.
> 
> >   Hoyle's steady state universe theory is my favorite theory
> > because it explains galactic blue shifts.
> 
> I assume that you're referring to the fact that for "nearby"
> galaxies, their peculiar velocity[1] is large compared to
> their velocity due to the Hubble flow. This effect is not
> really observed further away than the Virgo cluster.[2]
> 
> But, the expansion of the universe is supported by more than
> galactic redshift. For instance, there's the cosmic microwave
> background.[3] This was the final nail in Steady State's coffin,
> since Hot Big Bang predicted its existence, while Steady State
> couldn't even explain it.
> 
> There's also the distributions of quasars and young galaxies.
> 
> The relative abundances of hydrogen and helium in the universe
> (74% H, 26% He) are predicted by the Big Bang model as well.[4]
> Without Big Bang nucleosynthesis, Hoyle spent much of the latter
> part of his career trying to deduce a mechanism by which the
> quarks or hydrogen atoms of continuous creation[5] could be turned
> into an adequate supply of helium.
> 
> Of course, "steady state" doesn't mean "non-expanding", anyway.
> Hoyle himself knew that the universe was expanding, which was
> why he had to posit continuous creation to keep the universe
> from changing as it expanded.
> 
> That having been said, the scene in Blish's _The Triumph of
> Time_ where our intrepid band is in a position to observe the
> "ping"s of hydrogen atoms popping into existence is still
> pretty cool, even if it's based on a since-falsified theory.
> 
> [1] <http://astronomy.swin.edu.au/cosmos/P/Peculiar+Velocity>
> [2] 
> <http://www.astro.cornell.edu/academics/courses/astro201/hubbles_law.htm>
> [3] <https://wmap.gsfc.nasa.gov/universe/bb_tests_cmb.html>
> [4] <http://hyperphysics.phy-astr.gsu.edu/hbase/Astro/hydhel.html>
> [5] <http://www.originsquest.org/objections-to-continuous-creation.html>
> 
> -- 
> Michael F. Stemper
> Why doesn't anybody care about apathy?

The field did not directly suppress intelligence.   It reduced the speed of electromagnetic transmissions in vacuum to the to the 1c we know. Once earth moved out of the field, light reverted to its "normal" speed which is vastly higher. As a result all electronic and electro-chemical devices work much, much faster.

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]

#488963

On 2018-03-23 8:37 PM, The Zygon wrote:
> On Friday, March 23, 2018 at 4:03:13 PM UTC-4, Michael F. Stemper wrote:
>> On 2018-03-23 13:45, D B Davis wrote:
>>> Dorothy J Heydt <djheydt@kithrup.com> wrote:
>>
>>>> Well, Anderson's _Brain Wave_, in which the Solar System drifts
>>>> out of a cloud of handwavium and everybody becomes much more
>>>> intelligent.  Some people can't take it.
>>
>>> Re: _Brain Wave_. Shades of Fred Hoyle's panspermia.
>>
>> Excuse me? I've read _Brain Wave_ multiple times, and can't think of
>> anything in it that hints at panspermia.
>>
>> In case you haven't had the opportunity, here's a little expansion of
>> what Dorothy said:
>>
>> In the story, there is some field emanating from the center of the
>> galaxy (that's her "cloud of handwavium") that suppresses mental
>> activity. (If you've read Vinge's _A Fire Upon the Deep_, think of
>> the Zones of Thought. If you haven't, I highly recommend that you do.)
>>
>> As Sol was orbiting around the galaxy, it passed into this field about
>> 65 Myr back. Thus, the extinction of the dinosaurs, who'd been top dog
>> for upwards of 100 Myr. But, Mammalia now had a wide-open ecosystem to
>> fill, and expanded enthusiastically into all of those niches.
>>
>> Intelligence developed -- under the effects of that field. When Sol
>> finally exited that field, it was as if humanity (and apes, and farm
>> animals, and so on) had been running metaphorical marathons while
>> carrying full packs. Field goes away and bang! everybody (and
>> everything) is suddenly able to think much more effectively.
>>
>> Nothing to do with panspermia, as far as I can tell.
>>
>>>    Hoyle's steady state universe theory is my favorite theory
>>> because it explains galactic blue shifts.
>>
>> I assume that you're referring to the fact that for "nearby"
>> galaxies, their peculiar velocity[1] is large compared to
>> their velocity due to the Hubble flow. This effect is not
>> really observed further away than the Virgo cluster.[2]
>>
>> But, the expansion of the universe is supported by more than
>> galactic redshift. For instance, there's the cosmic microwave
>> background.[3] This was the final nail in Steady State's coffin,
>> since Hot Big Bang predicted its existence, while Steady State
>> couldn't even explain it.
>>
>> There's also the distributions of quasars and young galaxies.
>>
>> The relative abundances of hydrogen and helium in the universe
>> (74% H, 26% He) are predicted by the Big Bang model as well.[4]
>> Without Big Bang nucleosynthesis, Hoyle spent much of the latter
>> part of his career trying to deduce a mechanism by which the
>> quarks or hydrogen atoms of continuous creation[5] could be turned
>> into an adequate supply of helium.
>>
>> Of course, "steady state" doesn't mean "non-expanding", anyway.
>> Hoyle himself knew that the universe was expanding, which was
>> why he had to posit continuous creation to keep the universe
>> from changing as it expanded.
>>
>> That having been said, the scene in Blish's _The Triumph of
>> Time_ where our intrepid band is in a position to observe the
>> "ping"s of hydrogen atoms popping into existence is still
>> pretty cool, even if it's based on a since-falsified theory.
>>
>> [1] <http://astronomy.swin.edu.au/cosmos/P/Peculiar+Velocity>
>> [2]
>> <http://www.astro.cornell.edu/academics/courses/astro201/hubbles_law.htm>
>> [3] <https://wmap.gsfc.nasa.gov/universe/bb_tests_cmb.html>
>> [4] <http://hyperphysics.phy-astr.gsu.edu/hbase/Astro/hydhel.html>
>> [5] <http://www.originsquest.org/objections-to-continuous-creation.html>
>>
>> -- 
>> Michael F. Stemper
>> Why doesn't anybody care about apathy?
> 
> The field did not directly suppress intelligence.   It reduced the speed of electromagnetic transmissions in vacuum to the to the 1c we know. Once earth moved out of the field, light reverted to its "normal" speed which is vastly higher. As a result all electronic and electro-chemical devices work much, much faster.
> 

Which really ought to lead to everyone living a slow motion existence as 
their muscles fail to keep up with their brain and nerves and objects 
fall with glacial speed to our perceptions.

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]

#488942

In article <20180323b@crcomp.net>, D B Davis  <g@crcomp.net> wrote:
>
>Dorothy J Heydt <djheydt@kithrup.com> wrote:
>> In article <35f964bd-b204-4342-9da2-21e8e19ac2b1@googlegroups.com>,
>> The Zygon  <stafford.martin@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>The idea of the superman pervades science fiction. But in most of the
>>>stories I have read, the superhumans are evil in some way and need to be
>>>destroyed. I have read very few in which all humans have become
>>>superhuman, compared to humanity of today. I am interested in hearing
>>>about stories which tackle this problem. That is, how to write a good
>>>story where all humans are superhuman, and so the story is not about the
>>>clash between the ordinary humans and superhumans.
>>
>>>Maybe I should add that sometimes the clash set to some remove.  The
>>>superhumans have become separated from the main branch of humanity, and
>>>the clash is between the main branch and separated superhumans.
>>
>> Well, Anderson's _Brain Wave_, in which the Solar System drifts
>> out of a cloud of handwavium and everybody becomes much more
>> intelligent.  Some people can't take it.
>>
>> Van Vogt's _Slan,_ of course.  They're not superhumans, but they
>> are telepaths, which gives everybody else the creeps.
>>
>> Ditto Padgett's _Mutant_, whose Baldies have the same problem.
>>
>> Heinlein's _Methuselah's Children_ comes to mind, in which the
>> Howard Families have to leave Earth because of conflict with
>> normals ... but they're not superhumans, with the exception maybe
>> of Andrew Libby.  They're just longaevi.
>>
>> This is just off the top of my head at 6:30 in the morning.  Note
>> also that these are all old stories.  Others will be able to
>> provide some newer ones.
>>
>
>Re: _Brain Wave_. Shades of Fred Hoyle's panspermia. Most people who
>give a hoot in hell about Hoyle like that theory. It's not my favorite
>theory. Hoyle's steady state universe theory is my favorite theory
>because it explains galactic blue shifts. Most people who like the
>panspermia theory don't like the steady state theory. So, that makes me
>out of step with most people who give a hoot in hell about Hoyle.
>    Re: _Slan_. Do the Dreeges of "Asylum" (Van Vogt) count? If so, then
>surely _Twilight_ (Meyers) along with most of Unnatural Quarter stomping
>grounds of Dan Shamble, Zombie P.I.
>    Do mutants count? If so, there's "The Golden Man" (PKD), _Flow My
>Tears the Policeman Said_ (PKD) and _Jumper_ (Gould).
>    People with six fingers can enter accelerated time at their pleasure
>in "Six Fingers of Time" (Lafferty). "Big Ancestor" (Wallace) contains
>a mix of humans in different stages of evolution who more-or-less get
>along.

Until they figure out where they really came from.  I remember
that story fondly.

-- 
Dorothy J. Heydt
Vallejo, California
djheydt at gmail dot com

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]

Page 1 of 5  [1] 2 3 4 5  Next page →

Back to top | Article view | rec.arts.sf.written

csiph-web