Re: [PATCH 2/2] block: create ioctl to discard-or-zeroout a range of blocks

From	Theodore Ts'o <tytso@mit.edu>
Newsgroups	linux.kernel
Subject	Re: [PATCH 2/2] block: create ioctl to discard-or-zeroout a range of blocks
Date	2016-03-03 23:50 +0100
Message-ID	<r8Kee-5DY-17@gated-at.bofh.it> (permalink)
References	(3 earlier) <r8nUm-6fn-19@gated-at.bofh.it> <r8oQq-6Vq-13@gated-at.bofh.it> <r8FRh-2vI-7@gated-at.bofh.it> <r8FRh-2vI-11@gated-at.bofh.it> <r8GDD-2P0-3@gated-at.bofh.it>
Organization	linux.* mail to news gateway

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On Thu, Mar 03, 2016 at 01:54:54PM -0500, Martin K. Petersen wrote:
> >>>>> "Christoph" == Christoph Hellwig <hch@infradead.org> writes:
> 
> Christoph>  - FALLOC_FL_PUNCH_HOLE assures zeroes are returned, but
> Christoph> space is deallocated as much as possible -
> Christoph> FALLOC_FL_ZERO_RANGE assures zeroes are returned, AND blocks
> Christoph> are actually allocated
> 
> That works for me. I think it would be great if we could have consistent
> interfaces for fs and block. The more commonality the merrier.

So a question I have is do we want to add a "discard-as-a-hint" analog
for fallocate?  In the past we've said no because we don't trust
userspace.  (We seem to have as a core held belief that application
programmers are idiots and are not to be trusted with anything
dangerous, even if it would be highly useful in certain use cases.)

As a result I'm carrying an out-of-tree patch in our Google kernels so
that ext4 will honor BLKDISCARD on files.  I can't remember if I
floated it on linux-fsdevel, or I didn't bother because I knew it
would instantly shot down.  I believe it was the former, but I can't
be 100% sure.

It would be kind of nice, though, if we had some kind of agreement on
a consistent, unified interface for all three kinds of
"discard-as-a-hint", "zeroout", and "zeroout with deallocation" that
worked on block devices and files.  Whether it's via fallocate(2) or
BLK* ioctls, I'm agnostic.

							- Ted

P.S.  Speaking of things that are powerful and too dangerous for
application programmers, after the Linux FAST workshop, I was having
dinner with the Ceph developers and Ric Wheeler, and we were talking
about things they really needed.  Turns out they also could use an
FALLOC_FL_NO_HIDE_STALE functionality.  I told them I had an
out-of-tree patch that had that functionality, and even Ric Wheeler
started getting tempted....  :-)

Thread

[PATCH v5.1 0/2] create BLKZEROOUT ioctl that invalidates page cache "Darrick J. Wong" <darrick.wong@oracle.com> - 2016-03-02 05:20 +0100
  [PATCH 2/2] block: create ioctl to discard-or-zeroout a range of  blocks "Darrick J. Wong" <darrick.wong@oracle.com> - 2016-03-02 05:20 +0100
    Re: [PATCH 2/2] block: create ioctl to discard-or-zeroout a range of  blocks Christoph Hellwig <hch@infradead.org> - 2016-03-02 10:30 +0100
    Re: [PATCH 2/2] block: create ioctl to discard-or-zeroout a range of blocks Linus Torvalds <torvalds@linux-foundation.org> - 2016-03-02 20:00 +0100
      Re: [PATCH 2/2] block: create ioctl to discard-or-zeroout a range of  blocks "Darrick J. Wong" <darrick.wong@oracle.com> - 2016-03-03 00:00 +0100
        Re: [PATCH 2/2] block: create ioctl to discard-or-zeroout a range of blocks Linus Torvalds <torvalds@linux-foundation.org> - 2016-03-03 01:00 +0100
          Re: [PATCH 2/2] block: create ioctl to discard-or-zeroout a range of  blocks Theodore Ts'o <tytso@mit.edu> - 2016-03-03 18:10 +0100
            Re: [PATCH 2/2] block: create ioctl to discard-or-zeroout a range of blocks Linus Torvalds <torvalds@linux-foundation.org> - 2016-03-03 19:00 +0100
              Re: [PATCH 2/2] block: create ioctl to discard-or-zeroout a range of  blocks Christoph Hellwig <hch@infradead.org> - 2016-03-03 19:10 +0100
              Re: [PATCH 2/2] block: create ioctl to discard-or-zeroout a range of blocks "Martin K. Petersen" <martin.petersen@oracle.com> - 2016-03-03 19:20 +0100
              Re: [PATCH 2/2] block: create ioctl to discard-or-zeroout a range of  blocks Theodore Ts'o <tytso@mit.edu> - 2016-03-03 19:30 +0100
          Re: [PATCH 2/2] block: create ioctl to discard-or-zeroout a range of blocks "Martin K. Petersen" <martin.petersen@oracle.com> - 2016-03-03 19:10 +0100
            Re: [PATCH 2/2] block: create ioctl to discard-or-zeroout a range of  blocks Christoph Hellwig <hch@infradead.org> - 2016-03-03 19:10 +0100
              Re: [PATCH 2/2] block: create ioctl to discard-or-zeroout a range of  blocks "Darrick J. Wong" <darrick.wong@oracle.com> - 2016-03-03 19:20 +0100
              Re: [PATCH 2/2] block: create ioctl to discard-or-zeroout a range of blocks "Martin K. Petersen" <martin.petersen@oracle.com> - 2016-03-03 20:00 +0100
                Re: [PATCH 2/2] block: create ioctl to discard-or-zeroout a range of  blocks Theodore Ts'o <tytso@mit.edu> - 2016-03-03 23:50 +0100
                Re: [PATCH 2/2] block: create ioctl to discard-or-zeroout a range of  blocks Dave Chinner <david@fromorbit.com> - 2016-03-04 00:20 +0100
                Re: [PATCH 2/2] block: create ioctl to discard-or-zeroout a range of  blocks Theodore Ts'o <tytso@mit.edu> - 2016-03-04 01:30 +0100
                Re: [PATCH 2/2] block: create ioctl to discard-or-zeroout a range of blocks Gregory Farnum <greg@gregs42.com> - 2016-03-09 23:30 +0100
                Re: [PATCH 2/2] block: create ioctl to discard-or-zeroout a range of  blocks Theodore Ts'o <tytso@mit.edu> - 2016-03-10 00:10 +0100
                Re: [PATCH 2/2] block: create ioctl to discard-or-zeroout a range of  blocks Ric Wheeler <ricwheeler@gmail.com> - 2016-03-10 16:00 +0100
                Re: [PATCH 2/2] block: create ioctl to discard-or-zeroout a range of blocks Linus Torvalds <torvalds@linux-foundation.org> - 2016-03-10 19:40 +0100
                Re: [PATCH 2/2] block: create ioctl to discard-or-zeroout a range of  blocks Theodore Ts'o <tytso@mit.edu> - 2016-03-10 22:50 +0100
                Re: [PATCH 2/2] block: create ioctl to discard-or-zeroout a range of  blocks Ric Wheeler <rwheeler@redhat.com> - 2016-03-11 05:50 +0100
                Re: [PATCH 2/2] block: create ioctl to discard-or-zeroout a range  of blocks One Thousand Gnomes <gnomes@lxorguk.ukuu.org.uk> - 2016-03-11 15:10 +0100
                Re: [PATCH 2/2] block: create ioctl to discard-or-zeroout a range of  blocks Theodore Ts'o <tytso@mit.edu> - 2016-03-11 16:30 +0100
                Re: [PATCH 2/2] block: create ioctl to discard-or-zeroout a range of blocks Linus Torvalds <torvalds@linux-foundation.org> - 2016-03-11 18:30 +0100
                Re: [PATCH 2/2] block: create ioctl to discard-or-zeroout a range of blocks Andy Lutomirski <luto@amacapital.net> - 2016-03-11 18:40 +0100
                Re: [PATCH 2/2] block: create ioctl to discard-or-zeroout a range of blocks Linus Torvalds <torvalds@linux-foundation.org> - 2016-03-11 19:30 +0100
                Re: [PATCH 2/2] block: create ioctl to discard-or-zeroout a range of  blocks Dave Chinner <david@fromorbit.com> - 2016-03-11 23:40 +0100
                Re: [PATCH 2/2] block: create ioctl to discard-or-zeroout a range of  blocks Theodore Ts'o <tytso@mit.edu> - 2016-03-12 01:40 +0100
                Re: [PATCH 2/2] block: create ioctl to discard-or-zeroout a range of blocks Linus Torvalds <torvalds@linux-foundation.org> - 2016-03-12 01:50 +0100
                Re: [PATCH 2/2] block: create ioctl to discard-or-zeroout a range of  blocks Theodore Ts'o <tytso@mit.edu> - 2016-03-12 08:30 +0100
                Re: [PATCH 2/2] block: create ioctl to discard-or-zeroout a range of  blocks Thomas Schoebel-Theuer <tst@schoebel-theuer.de> - 2016-03-12 11:20 +0100
                Re: [PATCH 2/2] block: create ioctl to discard-or-zeroout a range of  blocks Dave Chinner <david@fromorbit.com> - 2016-03-14 00:40 +0100
                Re: [PATCH 2/2] block: create ioctl to discard-or-zeroout a range of  blocks Ric Wheeler <rwheeler@redhat.com> - 2016-03-14 11:40 +0100
                Re: [PATCH 2/2] block: create ioctl to discard-or-zeroout a range of  blocks Theodore Ts'o <tytso@mit.edu> - 2016-03-14 15:50 +0100
                Re: [PATCH 2/2] block: create ioctl to discard-or-zeroout a range of  blocks Dave Chinner <david@fromorbit.com> - 2016-03-15 21:20 +0100
                Re: [PATCH 2/2] block: create ioctl to discard-or-zeroout a range of blocks Linus Torvalds <torvalds@linux-foundation.org> - 2016-03-15 21:50 +0100
                Re: [PATCH 2/2] block: create ioctl to discard-or-zeroout a range of  blocks Theodore Ts'o <tytso@mit.edu> - 2016-03-15 22:30 +0100
                Re: [PATCH 2/2] block: create ioctl to discard-or-zeroout a range of  blocks Dave Chinner <david@fromorbit.com> - 2016-03-15 23:40 +0100
                Re: [PATCH 2/2] block: create ioctl to discard-or-zeroout a range of  blocks Theodore Ts'o <tytso@mit.edu> - 2016-03-16 00:00 +0100
                Re: [PATCH 2/2] block: create ioctl to discard-or-zeroout a range of  blocks "Darrick J. Wong" <darrick.wong@oracle.com> - 2016-03-16 03:00 +0100
                Re: [PATCH 2/2] block: create ioctl to discard-or-zeroout a range of blocks Andreas Dilger <adilger@dilger.ca> - 2016-03-16 22:50 +0100
                Re: [PATCH 2/2] block: create ioctl to discard-or-zeroout a range of  blocks Theodore Ts'o <tytso@mit.edu> - 2016-03-17 01:20 +0100
                Re: [PATCH 2/2] block: create ioctl to discard-or-zeroout a range of  blocks Eric Sandeen <esandeen@redhat.com> - 2016-03-17 01:40 +0100
                Re: [PATCH 2/2] block: create ioctl to discard-or-zeroout a range of  blocks Theodore Ts'o <tytso@mit.edu> - 2016-03-17 02:00 +0100
                Re: [PATCH 2/2] block: create ioctl to discard-or-zeroout a range of blocks Gregory Farnum <greg@gregs42.com> - 2016-03-17 06:20 +0100
                Re: [PATCH 2/2] block: create ioctl to discard-or-zeroout a range of  blocks Theodore Ts'o <tytso@mit.edu> - 2016-03-17 13:40 +0100
                Re: [PATCH 2/2] block: create ioctl to discard-or-zeroout a range of  blocks Dave Chinner <david@fromorbit.com> - 2016-03-17 02:10 +0100
                Re: [PATCH 2/2] block: create ioctl to discard-or-zeroout a range of  blocks "Darrick J. Wong" <darrick.wong@oracle.com> - 2016-03-17 03:50 +0100
                Re: [PATCH 2/2] block: create ioctl to discard-or-zeroout a range of blocks Linus Torvalds <torvalds@linux-foundation.org> - 2016-03-16 00:10 +0100
                Re: [PATCH 2/2] block: create ioctl to discard-or-zeroout a range of blocks Linus Torvalds <torvalds@linux-foundation.org> - 2016-03-16 00:20 +0100
                Re: [PATCH 2/2] block: create ioctl to discard-or-zeroout a range of  blocks Dave Chinner <david@fromorbit.com> - 2016-03-16 01:10 +0100
                Re: [PATCH 2/2] block: create ioctl to discard-or-zeroout a range of  blocks Dave Chinner <david@fromorbit.com> - 2016-03-16 01:00 +0100
                Re: [PATCH 2/2] block: create ioctl to discard-or-zeroout a range of blocks Linus Torvalds <torvalds@linux-foundation.org> - 2016-03-16 01:10 +0100
                Re: [PATCH 2/2] block: create ioctl to discard-or-zeroout a range of  blocks Eric Sandeen <esandeen@redhat.com> - 2016-03-16 01:40 +0100
                Re: [PATCH 2/2] block: create ioctl to discard-or-zeroout a range of  blocks Chris Mason <clm@fb.com> - 2016-03-16 02:00 +0100
                Re: [PATCH 2/2] block: create ioctl to discard-or-zeroout a range of  blocks Chris Mason <clm@fb.com> - 2016-03-16 23:30 +0100
                Re: [PATCH 2/2] block: create ioctl to discard-or-zeroout a range of  blocks Ric Wheeler <rwheeler@redhat.com> - 2016-03-17 14:50 +0100
                Re: [PATCH 2/2] block: create ioctl to discard-or-zeroout a range of  blocks Eric Sandeen <esandeen@redhat.com> - 2016-03-15 23:40 +0100
                Re: [PATCH 2/2] block: create ioctl to discard-or-zeroout a range of blocks Linus Torvalds <torvalds@linux-foundation.org> - 2016-03-12 01:40 +0100
                Re: [PATCH 2/2] block: create ioctl to discard-or-zeroout a range of  blocks Dave Chinner <david@fromorbit.com> - 2016-03-04 00:00 +0100
                Re: [PATCH 2/2] block: create ioctl to discard-or-zeroout a range of  blocks Thomas Schoebel-Theuer <tst@schoebel-theuer.de> - 2016-03-04 03:40 +0100
            Re: [PATCH 2/2] block: create ioctl to discard-or-zeroout a range of blocks Linus Torvalds <torvalds@linux-foundation.org> - 2016-03-03 19:20 +0100
  Re: [PATCH v5.1 0/2] create BLKZEROOUT ioctl that invalidates page cache Arnd Bergmann <arnd@arndb.de> - 2016-03-02 10:20 +0100
    Re: [PATCH v5.1 0/2] create BLKZEROOUT ioctl that invalidates page  cache Christoph Hellwig <hch@infradead.org> - 2016-03-02 10:50 +0100
      Re: [PATCH v5.1 0/2] create BLKZEROOUT ioctl that invalidates page cache Arnd Bergmann <arnd@arndb.de> - 2016-03-02 12:00 +0100

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