Re: Messed up Email

From	Celejar <celejar@gmail.com>
Newsgroups	linux.debian.user
Subject	Re: Messed up Email
Date	2021-06-27 17:20 +0200
Message-ID	<CuEJH-4TM-5@gated-at.bofh.it> (permalink)
References	(4 earlier) <Cti8y-2rK-7@gated-at.bofh.it> <CtirT-2PD-1@gated-at.bofh.it> <CtjxE-3qp-3@gated-at.bofh.it> <CtBXz-6og-3@gated-at.bofh.it> <CudzP-4iF-5@gated-at.bofh.it>
Organization	linux.* mail to news gateway

Show all headers | View raw

On Sat, 26 Jun 2021 13:14:37 +0300
Andrei POPESCU <andreimpopescu@gmail.com> wrote:

> On Jo, 24 iun 21, 14:04:13, Celejar wrote:
> > On Thu, 24 Jun 2021 01:25:37 +0300
> > Andrei POPESCU <andreimpopescu@gmail.com> wrote:
> > 
> > > On Mi, 23 iun 21, 17:12:07, Michael Grant wrote:
> > > > > Apparently the lines are blurry enough for you to include Signal in that 
> > > > > list.
> > > > 
> > > > Why?  Not blurry at all.  Signal is just as closed a system as
> > > > WhatsApp.  Maybe more private, but unless you know something I don't,
> > > > Signal doesn't talk to anything other than other Signal.  Puppeted
> > > > bridges are not interoperability, as far as I am aware, all users
> > > > still need to be on Signal.
> > > 
> > > You seem to be using a completely different meaning of 'proprietary' (no 
> > > federation) than I do (closed source software, proprietary protocol that 
> > > must be reversed engineered, patents, etc.).
> > 
> > Well, Michael's original post that you challenged contrasted:
> > 
> > > a standards based system such as mail or the web and a proprietary
> > > system such as facebook, WhatsApp, Signal, Telegram, etc etc.
> > 
> > Would you call Signal "a standards based system?" I understand that the
> > software itself is open source, and the project does publish various
> > "Signal Protocal" libraries, but I'm not sure that's quite enough to
> > call it "standards based."
> 
> In the strict definition that would imply there is an RFC or so for the 
> Signal Protocol. Still the protocol is published and open for anyone to 
> re-implement[1].
> 
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Signal_Protocol
> 
> How is that proprietary?

I'm not arguing that it's proprietary, but that it's not "standards
based." I agree that the one is not the negation of the other.

> The trouble with actually making something a standard is that if later 
> it turns out something is a really bad idea it is basically impossible 
> to remove, because now it's part of the standard, and several 
> implementations have come to rely on that.

Fair - but standards have advantages, as well. We can debate whether
Signal is better off not using a real standard, but my point remains
that it's somewhat dubious to call Signal "standards based."

> [1] several other apps claim to have implemented the Signal Protocol. 

Celejar

Back to linux.debian.user | Previous | Next — Previous in thread | Find similar | Unroll thread

Thread

Messed up Email "Gary L. Roach" <garyroach719@gmail.com> - 2021-06-22 01:30 +0200
  Re: Messed up Email Mark Allums <mark@allums.email> - 2021-06-22 06:10 +0200
  Gmail's special approach to Email [was: Re: Messed up Email] Andrei POPESCU <andreimpopescu@gmail.com> - 2021-06-22 10:50 +0200
    Re: Gmail's special approach to Email [was: Re: Messed up Email]  (SOLVED) "Gary L. Roach" <garyroach719@gmail.com> - 2021-06-22 22:20 +0200
  Re: Messed up Email Brad Rogers <brad@fineby.me.uk> - 2021-06-22 12:40 +0200
    Re: Messed up Email Richard Owlett <rowlett@cloud85.net> - 2021-06-22 13:10 +0200
      Re: Messed up Email Gene Heskett <gheskett@shentel.net> - 2021-06-22 13:20 +0200
        Re: Messed up Email The Wanderer <wanderer@fastmail.fm> - 2021-06-22 13:40 +0200
          Re: Messed up Email Richard Owlett <rowlett@cloud85.net> - 2021-06-22 13:50 +0200
        Re: Messed up Email Joe <joe@jretrading.com> - 2021-06-22 16:50 +0200
    Re: Messed up Email Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2021-06-22 20:40 +0200
      Re: Messed up Email Tixy <tixy@yxit.co.uk> - 2021-06-22 20:50 +0200
        Re: Messed up Email Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2021-06-22 21:00 +0200
      Re: Messed up Email Brad Rogers <brad@fineby.me.uk> - 2021-06-22 21:10 +0200
        Re: Messed up Email Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2021-06-22 21:40 +0200
      Re: Messed up Email Michael Grant <mgrant@grant.org> - 2021-06-23 14:00 +0200
        Re: Messed up Email Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2021-06-23 21:30 +0200
          Re: Messed up Email Brian Thompson <bthompson.deb@gmail.com> - 2021-06-23 23:20 +0200
        Re: Messed up Email Andrei POPESCU <andreimpopescu@gmail.com> - 2021-06-23 23:00 +0200
          Re: Messed up Email Michael Grant <mgrant@grant.org> - 2021-06-23 23:20 +0200
            Re: Messed up Email Andrei POPESCU <andreimpopescu@gmail.com> - 2021-06-24 00:30 +0200
              Re: Messed up Email Celejar <celejar@gmail.com> - 2021-06-24 20:10 +0200
                Re: Messed up Email Dan Ritter <dsr@randomstring.org> - 2021-06-24 20:20 +0200
                Re: Messed up Email Andrei POPESCU <andreimpopescu@gmail.com> - 2021-06-26 12:40 +0200
                Re: Messed up Email Andrei POPESCU <andreimpopescu@gmail.com> - 2021-06-26 13:20 +0200
                Re: Messed up Email Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2021-06-26 15:10 +0200
                Re: Messed up Email Andrei POPESCU <andreimpopescu@gmail.com> - 2021-06-26 16:10 +0200
                Re: Messed up Email Celejar <celejar@gmail.com> - 2021-06-27 17:40 +0200
                Re: Messed up Email Dan Ritter <dsr@randomstring.org> - 2021-06-26 13:50 +0200
                Re: Messed up Email Andrei POPESCU <andreimpopescu@gmail.com> - 2021-06-26 16:00 +0200
                Re: Messed up Email Celejar <celejar@gmail.com> - 2021-06-27 18:00 +0200
                Re: Messed up Email Andrei POPESCU <andreimpopescu@gmail.com> - 2021-06-28 09:30 +0200
                Re: Messed up Email Celejar <celejar@gmail.com> - 2021-06-27 17:50 +0200
                Re: Messed up Email Celejar <celejar@gmail.com> - 2021-06-27 17:30 +0200
                Re: Messed up Email Andrei POPESCU <andreimpopescu@gmail.com> - 2021-06-28 08:40 +0200
                Re: Messed up Email Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2021-06-24 22:10 +0200
                Re: Messed up Email Celejar <celejar@gmail.com> - 2021-06-25 00:50 +0200
                Re: Messed up Email Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2021-06-25 20:10 +0200
                Re: Messed up Email Celejar <celejar@gmail.com> - 2021-06-25 20:50 +0200
                Re: Messed up Email Gene Heskett <gheskett@shentel.net> - 2021-06-26 04:40 +0200
                Re: Messed up Email John Hasler <john@sugarbit.com> - 2021-06-26 15:20 +0200
                Re: Messed up Email Andrei POPESCU <andreimpopescu@gmail.com> - 2021-06-26 12:10 +0200
                Re: Messed up Email Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2021-06-26 14:00 +0200
                Re: Messed up Email Andrei POPESCU <andreimpopescu@gmail.com> - 2021-06-26 12:20 +0200
                Re: Messed up Email Celejar <celejar@gmail.com> - 2021-06-27 17:20 +0200

csiph-web