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Re: The best Wi-Fi upgrade I made wasn't a new router, it was moving one piece of furniture

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  Re: The best Wi-Fi upgrade I made wasn't a new router, it was moving one piece of furniture Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-08-18 00:47 +0000
    Re: The best Wi-Fi upgrade I made wasn't a new router, it was moving one piece of furniture c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-08-17 22:31 -0400
      Re: The best Wi-Fi upgrade I made wasn't a new router, it was moving one piece of furniture Rich <rich@example.invalid> - 2026-08-18 13:36 +0000
        Re: The best Wi-Fi upgrade I made wasn't a new router, it was moving one piece of furniture The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-08-18 17:18 +0100
          Re: The best Wi-Fi upgrade I made wasn't a new router, it was moving one piece of furniture Rich <rich@example.invalid> - 2026-08-18 22:00 +0000
            Re: The best Wi-Fi upgrade I made wasn't a new router, it was moving one piece of furniture The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-08-19 14:33 +0100
            [OT] Re: The best Wi-Fi upgrade I made wasn't a new router, it was moving one piece of furniture Nuno Silva <nunojsilva@invalid.invalid> - 2026-08-20 19:30 +0100
              Re: [OT] Re: The best Wi-Fi upgrade I made wasn't a new router, it was moving one piece of furniture rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-08-20 19:35 +0000
                Re: [OT] Re: The best Wi-Fi upgrade I made wasn't a new router, it was moving one piece of furniture Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-08-20 20:19 +0000
                  [OT] On feeding our overlords (was: Re: [OT] Re: The best Wi-Fi upgrade I made wasn't a new router, it was moving one piece of furniture) Nuno Silva <nunojsilva@invalid.invalid> - 2026-08-22 11:35 +0100
                    Re: [OT] On feeding our overlords (was: Re: [OT] Re: The best Wi-Fi upgrade I made wasn't a new router, it was moving one piece of furniture) rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-08-22 19:07 +0000
                      Re: [OT] On feeding our overlords The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-08-22 23:31 +0100
                        Re: [OT] On feeding our overlords rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-08-23 00:52 +0000
              Re: [OT] Re: The best Wi-Fi upgrade I made wasn't a new router, it was moving one piece of furniture c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-08-20 21:57 -0400
                Re: [OT] Re: The best Wi-Fi upgrade I made wasn't a new router, it was moving one piece of furniture The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-08-21 13:25 +0100
                  Re: [OT] Re: The best Wi-Fi upgrade I made wasn't a new router, it was moving one piece of furniture Rich <rich@example.invalid> - 2026-08-22 04:10 +0000
                    [OT] 10\+BASE-T on mobile phones (was: Re: [OT] Re: The best Wi-Fi upgrade I made wasn't a new router, it was moving one piece of furniture) Nuno Silva <nunojsilva@invalid.invalid> - 2026-08-22 11:40 +0100
                      Re: [OT] 10\+BASE-T on mobile phones The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-08-22 13:32 +0100
                      Re: [OT] 10\+BASE-T on mobile phones Rich <rich@example.invalid> - 2026-08-22 16:06 +0000
                      Re: [OT] 10\+BASE-T on mobile phones Andy Burns <usenet@andyburns.uk> - 2026-08-25 18:44 +0100
                      Re: [OT] 10\+BASE-T on mobile phones Lars Poulsen <lars@beagle-ears.com> - 2026-08-27 05:13 -0700
                        Re: [OT] 10\+BASE-T on mobile phones "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-08-27 20:44 +0200
                          Re: [OT] 10\+BASE-T on mobile phones The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-08-28 11:59 +0100
                            House Wiring (Re: [OT] 10\+BASE-T on mobile phones) Lars Poulsen <lars@beagle-ears.com> - 2026-08-28 06:34 -0700
                              Re: House Wiring (Re: [OT] 10\+BASE-T on mobile phones) "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-08-29 13:21 +0200
                                Re: House Wiring ... and other house stuff Lars Poulsen <lars@beagle-ears.com> - 2026-08-29 06:42 -0700
                                  Re: House Wiring ... and other house stuff "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-08-29 20:48 +0200
                                  Re: House Wiring ... and other house stuff "Kerr-Mudd, John" <admin@127.0.0.1> - 2026-08-29 21:31 +0100
                                    Re: House Wiring ... and other house stuff Lars Poulsen <lars@beagle-ears.com> - 2026-08-30 07:10 -0700
                                      Re: House Wiring ... and other house stuff rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-08-30 18:57 +0000
                                        Re: House Wiring ... and other house stuff c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-08-31 03:27 -0400
                                          Re: House Wiring ... and other house stuff The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-08-31 12:22 +0100
                                            Re: House Wiring ... and other house stuff rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-08-31 18:59 +0000
                                              Re: House Wiring ... and other house stuff c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-09-01 01:50 -0400
                                                Re: House Wiring ... and other house stuff rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-09-01 07:35 +0000
                                                Re: House Wiring ... and other house stuff The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-01 12:57 +0100
                                                  Re: House Wiring ... and other house stuff rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-09-01 18:58 +0000
                                              Re: House Wiring ... and other house stuff The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-01 12:56 +0100
                                                Re: House Wiring ... and other house stuff rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-09-01 18:52 +0000
                                                  Re: House Wiring ... and other house stuff Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-09-01 23:40 +0000
                                                    Re: House Wiring ... and other house stuff rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-09-02 03:07 +0000
                                          Re: House Wiring ... and other house stuff rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-08-31 18:53 +0000
                                            Re: House Wiring ... and other house stuff c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-09-01 01:37 -0400
                                              Re: House Wiring ... and other house stuff rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-09-01 07:27 +0000
                                              Re: House Wiring ... and other house stuff The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-01 13:01 +0100
                                                Re: House Wiring ... and other house stuff rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-09-01 18:45 +0000
                                            Re: House Wiring ... and other house stuff The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-01 12:52 +0100
                                  Re: House Wiring ... and other house stuff The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-08-29 22:45 +0100
                                  Re: House Wiring ... and other house stuff c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-08-29 22:08 -0400
                                    Re: House Wiring ... and other house stuff Lars Poulsen <lars@beagle-ears.com> - 2026-08-30 07:16 -0700
                                Re: House Wiring (Re: [OT] 10\+BASE-T on mobile phones) The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-08-29 22:43 +0100
                                  Re: House Wiring (Re: [OT] 10\+BASE-T on mobile phones) "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-08-30 13:49 +0200
                                    Re: House Wiring (Re: [OT] 10\+BASE-T on mobile phones) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-08-31 01:07 -0400
                          Re: [OT] 10\+BASE-T on mobile phones Lars Poulsen <lars@beagle-ears.com> - 2026-08-28 06:22 -0700
                        Re: [OT] 10\+BASE-T on mobile phones Andy Burns <usenet@andyburns.uk> - 2026-08-27 20:50 +0100
                          Re: [OT] 10\+BASE-T on mobile phones Nuno Silva <nunojsilva@invalid.invalid> - 2026-08-28 00:21 +0100
                            Re: [OT] 10\+BASE-T on mobile phones "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-08-29 14:16 +0200
                    Re: [OT] Re: The best Wi-Fi upgrade I made wasn't a new router, it was moving one piece of furniture The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-08-22 13:30 +0100
                      Re: [OT] Re: The best Wi-Fi upgrade I made wasn't a new router, it was moving one piece of furniture rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-08-22 19:03 +0000
                        Re: [OT] Re: The best Wi-Fi upgrade I made wasn't a new router, it was moving one piece of furniture The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-08-22 23:30 +0100
                          Re: [OT] Re: The best Wi-Fi upgrade I made wasn't a new router, it was moving one piece of furniture rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-08-23 00:50 +0000
          Re: The best Wi-Fi upgrade I made wasn't a new router, it was moving one piece of furniture c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-08-18 22:45 -0400
            Re: The best Wi-Fi upgrade I made wasn't a new router, it was moving one piece of furniture Rich <rich@example.invalid> - 2026-08-19 03:17 +0000
              Re: The best Wi-Fi upgrade I made wasn't a new router, it was moving one piece of furniture c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-08-19 01:57 -0400
                Re: The best Wi-Fi upgrade I made wasn't a new router, it was moving one piece of furniture rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-08-19 06:20 +0000
                  Re: The best Wi-Fi upgrade I made wasn't a new router, it was moving one piece of furniture c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-08-19 02:51 -0400
            Re: The best Wi-Fi upgrade I made wasn't a new router, it was moving one piece of furniture rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-08-19 03:58 +0000
              Re: The best Wi-Fi upgrade I made wasn't a new router, it was moving one piece of furniture c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-08-19 02:20 -0400
                Re: The best Wi-Fi upgrade I made wasn't a new router, it was moving one piece of furniture rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-08-19 14:19 +0000
            Re: The best Wi-Fi upgrade I made wasn't a new router, it was moving one piece of furniture The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-08-19 14:36 +0100
          Re: The best Wi-Fi upgrade I made wasn't a new router, it was moving one piece of furniture rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-08-19 03:47 +0000
    Re: The best Wi-Fi upgrade I made wasn't a new router, it was moving one piece of furniture rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-08-18 02:48 +0000

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#90680 — Re: [OT] 10\+BASE-T on mobile phones

On 2026-08-22 03:40, Nuno Silva wrote:
> Are there phone models that somehow feature an 8P8C socket?

Other than IP phones, you mean?

But the 6P4C contacts on "conventional" phones and ISDN-style keysystems 
like the NorStar and Panasonic PBX systems work very well with a 
building wired for Ethernet. A 6P plug in an 8P jack fits perfectly.

-- 
Lars Poulsen - an old geek in Santa Barbara, California

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#90691 — Re: [OT] 10\+BASE-T on mobile phones

On 2026-08-27 14:13, Lars Poulsen wrote:
> On 2026-08-22 03:40, Nuno Silva wrote:
>> Are there phone models that somehow feature an 8P8C socket?
> 
> Other than IP phones, you mean?
> 
> But the 6P4C contacts on "conventional" phones and ISDN-style keysystems 
> like the NorStar and Panasonic PBX systems work very well with a 
> building wired for Ethernet. A 6P plug in an 8P jack fits perfectly.

If I understood what you are talking about correctly, the 4 pin analog 
phone plugs can go into the 8 pin ethernet plug, cabled to go at 10Mb, 
so that it connects to the 2 centre wires that are not connected to the 
ethernet hardware, but to the phone hardware. Ie, the strange sorting of 
the pins in the ethernet plug7socked is because the 2 centre wires were 
used for the phone service. I have seen this setup actually used.

-- 
Cheers,
        Carlos E.R.
        ES🇪🇸, EU🇪🇺.

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]

#90739 — Re: [OT] 10\+BASE-T on mobile phones

On 27/08/2026 19:44, Carlos E. R. wrote:
> On 2026-08-27 14:13, Lars Poulsen wrote:
>> On 2026-08-22 03:40, Nuno Silva wrote:
>>> Are there phone models that somehow feature an 8P8C socket?
>>
>> Other than IP phones, you mean?
>>
>> But the 6P4C contacts on "conventional" phones and ISDN-style 
>> keysystems like the NorStar and Panasonic PBX systems work very well 
>> with a building wired for Ethernet. A 6P plug in an 8P jack fits 
>> perfectly.
> 
> If I understood what you are talking about correctly, the 4 pin analog 
> phone plugs can go into the 8 pin ethernet plug, cabled to go at 10Mb, 
> so that it connects to the 2 centre wires that are not connected to the 
> ethernet hardware, but to the phone hardware. Ie, the strange sorting of 
> the pins in the ethernet plug7socked is because the 2 centre wires were 
> used for the phone service. I have seen this setup actually used.
> 
Its standard for traditional 'structured wiring'

The same CAT 5 carries phones on different pairs to the original Ethernet.

You patch in phone signals from the PABX rather than from an Ethernet 
switch.
A dongle converts from RJ45 to local phone socket

I wired my house that way.



-- 
In todays liberal progressive conflict-free education system, everyone 
gets full Marx.

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#90762 — House Wiring (Re: [OT] 10\+BASE-T on mobile phones)

On 2026-08-28 03:59, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
> On 27/08/2026 19:44, Carlos E. R. wrote:
>> On 2026-08-27 14:13, Lars Poulsen wrote:
>>> On 2026-08-22 03:40, Nuno Silva wrote:
>>>> Are there phone models that somehow feature an 8P8C socket?
>>>
>>> Other than IP phones, you mean?
>>>
>>> But the 6P4C contacts on "conventional" phones and ISDN-style 
>>> keysystems like the NorStar and Panasonic PBX systems work very well 
>>> with a building wired for Ethernet. A 6P plug in an 8P jack fits 
>>> perfectly.
>>
>> If I understood what you are talking about correctly, the 4 pin analog 
>> phone plugs can go into the 8 pin ethernet plug, cabled to go at 10Mb, 
>> so that it connects to the 2 centre wires that are not connected to 
>> the ethernet hardware, but to the phone hardware. Ie, the strange 
>> sorting of the pins in the ethernet plug7socked is because the 2 
>> centre wires were used for the phone service. I have seen this setup 
>> actually used.
>>
> Its standard for traditional 'structured wiring'
> 
> The same CAT 5 carries phones on different pairs to the original Ethernet.
> 
> You patch in phone signals from the PABX rather than from an Ethernet 
> switch.
> A dongle converts from RJ45 to local phone socket
> 
> I wired my house that way.
Me too. My house was built in 1951 and had only minimal phone outlets. 
When I moved in in 1985, TV coax had been pulled into the living room, 
and I added a couple more coax outlets, and pulled a second (modem) 
phone line into my home office, which happened to be right next to the 
telephone demarc box on the outside, so I just drilled a hole right 
through the wall.

In 2013, I rebuilt the kitchen, and took the opportunity to identify 
every spot where one might want to put a computer, a telephone or a TV, 
and each got two RJ45s and a coax socket (well, only 6 got the coax)
all wired to the bottom of a back hall closet, which became my wiring 
closet, and home to the cable modem and root ethernet switch. That has 
served me well. Of course, the landline POTS telephone service is long 
gone, and it's been a while since I dropped the coax cable service when 
I switched my Internet connection to fiber.

-- 
Lars Poulsen - an old geek in Santa Barbara, California

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]

#90818 — Re: House Wiring (Re: [OT] 10\+BASE-T on mobile phones)

On 2026-08-28 15:34, Lars Poulsen wrote:
> On 2026-08-28 03:59, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
>> On 27/08/2026 19:44, Carlos E. R. wrote:
>>> On 2026-08-27 14:13, Lars Poulsen wrote:
>>>> On 2026-08-22 03:40, Nuno Silva wrote:
>>>>> Are there phone models that somehow feature an 8P8C socket?
>>>>
>>>> Other than IP phones, you mean?
>>>>
>>>> But the 6P4C contacts on "conventional" phones and ISDN-style 
>>>> keysystems like the NorStar and Panasonic PBX systems work very well 
>>>> with a building wired for Ethernet. A 6P plug in an 8P jack fits 
>>>> perfectly.
>>>
>>> If I understood what you are talking about correctly, the 4 pin 
>>> analog phone plugs can go into the 8 pin ethernet plug, cabled to go 
>>> at 10Mb, so that it connects to the 2 centre wires that are not 
>>> connected to the ethernet hardware, but to the phone hardware. Ie, 
>>> the strange sorting of the pins in the ethernet plug7socked is 
>>> because the 2 centre wires were used for the phone service. I have 
>>> seen this setup actually used.
>>>
>> Its standard for traditional 'structured wiring'
>>
>> The same CAT 5 carries phones on different pairs to the original 
>> Ethernet.
>>
>> You patch in phone signals from the PABX rather than from an Ethernet 
>> switch.
>> A dongle converts from RJ45 to local phone socket
>>
>> I wired my house that way.
> Me too. My house was built in 1951 and had only minimal phone outlets. 
> When I moved in in 1985, TV coax had been pulled into the living room, 
> and I added a couple more coax outlets, and pulled a second (modem) 
> phone line into my home office, which happened to be right next to the 
> telephone demarc box on the outside, so I just drilled a hole right 
> through the wall.
> 
> In 2013, I rebuilt the kitchen, and took the opportunity to identify 
> every spot where one might want to put a computer, a telephone or a TV, 
> and each got two RJ45s and a coax socket (well, only 6 got the coax)
> all wired to the bottom of a back hall closet, which became my wiring 
> closet, and home to the cable modem and root ethernet switch. That has 
> served me well. Of course, the landline POTS telephone service is long 
> gone, and it's been a while since I dropped the coax cable service when 
> I switched my Internet connection to fiber.
> 

When I wired my house, I did it for gigabit, so no, I did not put the 
phone in the ethernet cable.

-- 
Cheers,
        Carlos E.R.
        ES🇪🇸, EU🇪🇺.

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]

#90826 — Re: House Wiring ... and other house stuff

On 2026-08-29 04:21, Carlos E. R. wrote:
> On 2026-08-28 15:34, Lars Poulsen wrote:
...
>> In 2013, I rebuilt the kitchen, and took the opportunity to identify 
>> every spot where one might want to put a computer, a telephone or a 
>> TV, and each got two RJ45s and a coax socket (well, only 6 got the coax)
>> all wired to the bottom of a back hall closet, which became my wiring 
>> closet, and home to the cable modem and root ethernet switch. That has 
>> served me well. Of course, the landline POTS telephone service is long 
>> gone, and it's been a while since I dropped the coax cable service 
>> when I switched my Internet connection to fiber.
>>
> 
> When I wired my house, I did it for gigabit, so no, I did not put the 
> phone in the ethernet cable.
So that was considerably more recent that 2013?

This year we discovered a bunch of water in the crawlspace under the 
bathroom, which had led to dry rot in load-bearing wood beams (girders 
and floor joists) and fungus/mildew/mold on walls and furniture.

By the time we were done we had spent about a half million dollars (plus 
income taxes as we pulled the money out of the capital pension fund).
My savings are significantly diminished, but hopefully my wife's 
allergies and autoimmune problems will diminish. We replaced the 
electrical wiring, but did not bother with communications wiring this 
time; wireless is enough for the TVs.
-- 
Lars Poulsen - an old geek in Santa Barbara, California

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]

#90836 — Re: House Wiring ... and other house stuff

On 2026-08-29 15:42, Lars Poulsen wrote:
> On 2026-08-29 04:21, Carlos E. R. wrote:
>> On 2026-08-28 15:34, Lars Poulsen wrote:
> ...
>>> In 2013, I rebuilt the kitchen, and took the opportunity to identify 
>>> every spot where one might want to put a computer, a telephone or a 
>>> TV, and each got two RJ45s and a coax socket (well, only 6 got the coax)
>>> all wired to the bottom of a back hall closet, which became my wiring 
>>> closet, and home to the cable modem and root ethernet switch. That 
>>> has served me well. Of course, the landline POTS telephone service is 
>>> long gone, and it's been a while since I dropped the coax cable 
>>> service when I switched my Internet connection to fiber.
>>>
>>
>> When I wired my house, I did it for gigabit, so no, I did not put the 
>> phone in the ethernet cable.
> So that was considerably more recent that 2013?

Probably. When we changed from ADSL to Fibre. And I did not switch at 
the start.


> This year we discovered a bunch of water in the crawlspace under the 
> bathroom, which had led to dry rot in load-bearing wood beams (girders 
> and floor joists) and fungus/mildew/mold on walls and furniture.
> 
> By the time we were done we had spent about a half million dollars (plus 
> income taxes as we pulled the money out of the capital pension fund).
> My savings are significantly diminished, but hopefully my wife's 
> allergies and autoimmune problems will diminish. We replaced the 
> electrical wiring, but did not bother with communications wiring this 
> time; wireless is enough for the TVs.

With ADSL I had the so to speak "modem" upstairs, by the computer. With 
fibre, the company put the router close to the TV downstairs and I was 
forced to put a cable to upstairs. The wifi signal was weak upstairs, 
and and at that time WiFi was about 20, maybe 40 mbits. And then I 
installed a switch upstairs, and an wifi AP.

-- 
Cheers,
        Carlos E.R.
        ES🇪🇸, EU🇪🇺.

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]

#90846 — Re: House Wiring ... and other house stuff

On Sat, 29 Aug 2026 06:42:09 -0700
Lars Poulsen <lars@beagle-ears.com> wrote:

> On 2026-08-29 04:21, Carlos E. R. wrote:
> > On 2026-08-28 15:34, Lars Poulsen wrote:
> ...
> >> In 2013, I rebuilt the kitchen, and took the opportunity to identify 
> >> every spot where one might want to put a computer, a telephone or a 
> >> TV, and each got two RJ45s and a coax socket (well, only 6 got the coax)
> >> all wired to the bottom of a back hall closet, which became my wiring 
> >> closet, and home to the cable modem and root ethernet switch. That has 
> >> served me well. Of course, the landline POTS telephone service is long 
> >> gone, and it's been a while since I dropped the coax cable service 
> >> when I switched my Internet connection to fiber.
> >>
> > 
> > When I wired my house, I did it for gigabit, so no, I did not put the 
> > phone in the ethernet cable.
> So that was considerably more recent that 2013?
> 
> This year we discovered a bunch of water in the crawlspace under the 
> bathroom, which had led to dry rot in load-bearing wood beams (girders 
> and floor joists) and fungus/mildew/mold on walls and furniture.
> 
> By the time we were done we had spent about a half million dollars (plus 

WIWAL that would have bought a decent sized house. Maybe 2.

> income taxes as we pulled the money out of the capital pension fund).
> My savings are significantly diminished, but hopefully my wife's 
> allergies and autoimmune problems will diminish. We replaced the 
> electrical wiring, but did not bother with communications wiring this 
> time; wireless is enough for the TVs.
> -- 
> Lars Poulsen - an old geek in Santa Barbara, California


-- 
Bah, and indeed Humbug.

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#90903 — Re: House Wiring ... and other house stuff

On 2026-08-29 13:31, Kerr-Mudd, John wrote:
> On Sat, 29 Aug 2026 06:42:09 -0700
> Lars Poulsen <lars@beagle-ears.com> wrote:
> 
>> On 2026-08-29 04:21, Carlos E. R. wrote:
>>> On 2026-08-28 15:34, Lars Poulsen wrote:
>> ...
>>>> In 2013, I rebuilt the kitchen, and took the opportunity to identify
>>>> every spot where one might want to put a computer, a telephone or a
>>>> TV, and each got two RJ45s and a coax socket (well, only 6 got the coax)
>>>> all wired to the bottom of a back hall closet, which became my wiring
>>>> closet, and home to the cable modem and root ethernet switch. That has
>>>> served me well. Of course, the landline POTS telephone service is long
>>>> gone, and it's been a while since I dropped the coax cable service
>>>> when I switched my Internet connection to fiber.
>>>>
>>>
>>> When I wired my house, I did it for gigabit, so no, I did not put the
>>> phone in the ethernet cable.
>> So that was considerably more recent that 2013?
>>
>> This year we discovered a bunch of water in the crawlspace under the
>> bathroom, which had led to dry rot in load-bearing wood beams (girders
>> and floor joists) and fungus/mildew/mold on walls and furniture.
>>
>> By the time we were done we had spent about a half million dollars (plus
> 
> WIWAL that would have bought a decent sized house. Maybe 2.
> 
>> income taxes as we pulled the money out of the capital pension fund).
>> My savings are significantly diminished, but hopefully my wife's
>> allergies and autoimmune problems will diminish. We replaced the
>> electrical wiring, but did not bother with communications wiring this
>> time; wireless is enough for the TVs.
It might have been simpler to tear down the house and build a new one on 
the same lot, and not a lot more expensive, but ... that could not have 
been done in 4 months!

Half a block from me, someone bought a decent-looking house for $1.8M, 
which was at that point the most expensive sale in the neighborhood. 
Only to immediately apply to tear down the 1100 sqft house and replace 
it with a 2400 sqft (while retaining the 500 sqft garage in the back 
that had been converted to an ADU).

It has so far been 18 months since the yellow sign alerting neighbors to 
the permit application went up, and the house is not yet move-in ready, 
but it is getting close.

My brother in Copenhagen and his wife decided their 3-story house was 
going to be unwieldy as they age, to they sold it, rented an apartment 
in the bedroom suburbs, bought a teardown half a mile from the old house 
and built a new house. 10 months later they are living in the new house.

The city of Copenhagen actively wants to renew its housing stock and 
helps people build. The city of Santa Barbara wants to make it as 
expensive as possible to build; that keeps the riff-raff out.
-- 
Lars Poulsen - an old geek in Santa Barbara, California

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#90919 — Re: House Wiring ... and other house stuff

On Sun, 30 Aug 2026 07:10:34 -0700, Lars Poulsen wrote:

> The city of Copenhagen actively wants to renew its housing stock and
> helps people build. The city of Santa Barbara wants to make it as
> expensive as possible to build; that keeps the riff-raff out.

Figures. My brother lived in Lompoc. Santa Barbara and Solvang were on the 
list of places to take visitors. Santa Maria is where he went for anything 
not available in Lompoc. 

It was good for laughs. After the mandatory visit to Streans Wharf we were 
approached by a, er, sex worker, so some of the riff-raff must have 
slipped in. We were laughing as we politely declined. I don't know if she 
gave a senior citizens discount.

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#90945 — Re: House Wiring ... and other house stuff

On 8/30/26 14:57, rbowman wrote:
> On Sun, 30 Aug 2026 07:10:34 -0700, Lars Poulsen wrote:
> 
>> The city of Copenhagen actively wants to renew its housing stock and
>> helps people build. The city of Santa Barbara wants to make it as
>> expensive as possible to build; that keeps the riff-raff out.
> 
> Figures. My brother lived in Lompoc. Santa Barbara and Solvang were on the
> list of places to take visitors. Santa Maria is where he went for anything
> not available in Lompoc.

   Have a number of relatives in Denmark. SOME,
   if infrequent communication.

   For a TIME Denmark was able to insulate
   itself from the world. This insulation
   seems to be breaking down. Now TOO linked
   to the EU, now TOO infiltrated by Islamists.

> It was good for laughs. After the mandatory visit to Streans Wharf we were
> approached by a, er, sex worker, so some of the riff-raff must have
> slipped in. We were laughing as we politely declined. I don't know if she
> gave a senior citizens discount.

   Well, gotta love "sex workers" !!! :-)

   Basic humanity.

   However that's NOT all there is anymore.

   Like it or not, Denmark is being dragged,
   kicking and screaming, into the General EU
   experience. "Utopia" didn't, couldn't, last.
   Believing in that illusion, their own fault.

   Denmark does not have the resources to DEAL
   with many of those EU realities.

   Have encouraged the relatives to BAIL OUT and
   move to the USA.

   Most won't/can't alas ......

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#90957 — Re: House Wiring ... and other house stuff

On 31/08/2026 08:27, c186282 wrote:
> Have encouraged the relatives to BAIL OUT and
>    move to the USA.
> 
You don't bail out into the middle of a shark infested ocean

Even Denmark is better than the USA.

>    Most won't/can't alas ......

-- 
"Women actually are capable of being far more than the feminists will 
let them."

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#90977 — Re: House Wiring ... and other house stuff

On Mon, 31 Aug 2026 12:22:26 +0100, The Natural Philosopher wrote:

> On 31/08/2026 08:27, c186282 wrote:
>> Have encouraged the relatives to BAIL OUT and
>>    move to the USA.
>> 
> You don't bail out into the middle of a shark infested ocean
> 
> Even Denmark is better than the USA.

A little too flat for my taste. I recently read a series of crime novels 
my Inger Wolf. It's tangential to the story but the detective is looking 
for a potential suspect in a mountaineering store, thinking 'what is a 
mountaineering store doing in a place where the highest point is 560'?'

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M%C3%B8lleh%C3%B8j

For some reason I want to read that as 'molehill'.  Better than Florida I 
guess. The answer to her question was the store outfitted people going on 
vacation in Norway.

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#90986 — Re: House Wiring ... and other house stuff

On 8/31/26 14:59, rbowman wrote:
> On Mon, 31 Aug 2026 12:22:26 +0100, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
> 
>> On 31/08/2026 08:27, c186282 wrote:
>>> Have encouraged the relatives to BAIL OUT and
>>>     move to the USA.
>>>
>> You don't bail out into the middle of a shark infested ocean
>>
>> Even Denmark is better than the USA.
> 
> A little too flat for my taste. I recently read a series of crime novels
> my Inger Wolf. It's tangential to the story but the detective is looking
> for a potential suspect in a mountaineering store, thinking 'what is a
> mountaineering store doing in a place where the highest point is 560'?'
> 
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M%C3%B8lleh%C3%B8j

   Well, SOME want to climb mountains. So, where do
   they buy The Stuff ?  :-)

   No mountains IN Denmark, of course - but a few
   hundred KM south there are MANY.

> For some reason I want to read that as 'molehill'.  Better than Florida I
> guess. The answer to her question was the store outfitted people going on
> vacation in Norway.

   Florida is seriously FLAT. There are 'hills' in the
   middle but they aren't really hills - just the places
   between giant sink-holes.

   Oh, if you ever wanna buy land there - DO have a good
   corp do a serious seismic/ground-penetrating-radar
   survey of the property. A lot of the state is 30 feet
   of dirt over sink-holes that can collapse any time.
   It's become so bad most can't even GET sink-hole
   insurance anymore. "Karst topography".

   HAVE cave-dived there. Note that the underlying
   'rock', limestone, looks like Swiss Cheese but
   without much cheese anymore. Been there, seen
   it, touched it.

   Eventually the whole state will have a HUGE
   inland lake running from the border to below
   lake Okeechobee with just a 20km dirt rim
   surrounding it. Not tomorrow, but eventually.

   Odd note : almost all of Florida is the same
   rock as Morocco, different from the rest of
   the USA. An artifact of when the continents
   split up.

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#90993 — Re: House Wiring ... and other house stuff

On Tue, 1 Sep 2026 01:50:55 -0400, c186282 wrote:

>    Florida is seriously FLAT. There are 'hills' in the middle but they
>    aren't really hills - just the places between giant sink-holes.

Years before GPSs I went looking for Britton Hill.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Britton_Hill

I never did find it. I probably circled it driving around on the Alabama 
border  65' of prominence hardly makes it stand out. I think it's Palatka 
where one of the streets has a noticeable hill, probably a sink hole.

I spent some time in the Ocala NF. Fun but the trail wasn't very 
challenging.

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#91002 — Re: House Wiring ... and other house stuff

On 01/09/2026 06:50, c186282 wrote:
> Well, SOME want to climb mountains. So, where do
>    they buy The Stuff ?  🙂
> 
>    No mountains IN Denmark, of course - but a few
>    hundred KM south there are MANY.
Not really. Its a long way to the Alps.

Norway is closer.

-- 
Canada is all right really, though not for the whole weekend.

"Saki"

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#91031 — Re: House Wiring ... and other house stuff

On Tue, 1 Sep 2026 12:57:38 +0100, The Natural Philosopher wrote:

> On 01/09/2026 06:50, c186282 wrote:
>> Well, SOME want to climb mountains. So, where do
>>    they buy The Stuff ?  🙂
>> 
>>    No mountains IN Denmark, of course - but a few hundred KM south
>>    there are MANY.
> Not really. Its a long way to the Alps.
> 
> Norway is closer.

In the story the owner of the mountaineering shop mentions Norway 
explicitly. 

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#91001 — Re: House Wiring ... and other house stuff

On 31/08/2026 19:59, rbowman wrote:
>> Even Denmark is better than the USA.
> A little too flat for my taste. I recently read a series of crime novels
> my Inger Wolf. It's tangential to the story but the detective is looking
> for a potential suspect in a mountaineering store, thinking 'what is a
> mountaineering store doing in a place where the highest point is 560'?'
> 
Well national boundaries in Europe in the Shengen area carry about as 
much weight as a US state boundary.

Or used to. They are being closed right now to stem the flow of illegal 
migrants


> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M%C3%B8lleh%C3%B8j
> 
> For some reason I want to read that as 'molehill'.  Better than Florida I
> guess. The answer to her question was the store outfitted people going on
> vacation in Norway.

I am surprised that Denmark has a hill that high, It is just another 
part of the great soggy mass that comprises NE Europe and the E coast of 
Britain.

I live on the highest point of E Anglia for about 50 miles. All of 300' 
ASL...



-- 
"I am inclined to tell the truth and dislike people who lie consistently.
This makes me unfit for the company of people of a Left persuasion, and 
all women"

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#91030 — Re: House Wiring ... and other house stuff

On Tue, 1 Sep 2026 12:56:53 +0100, The Natural Philosopher wrote:

> I live on the highest point of E Anglia for about 50 miles. All of 300'
> ASL...

I'm 10 times further from sea level. Strictly by elevation Ben Nevis would 
be considered a speed bump. 

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#91043 — Re: House Wiring ... and other house stuff

On 2026-09-01, rbowman <bowman@montana.com> wrote:

> On Tue, 1 Sep 2026 12:56:53 +0100, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
>
>> I live on the highest point of E Anglia for about 50 miles. All of 300'
>> ASL...
>
> I'm 10 times further from sea level. Strictly by elevation Ben Nevis would 
> be considered a speed bump. 

I'm basically at sea level 5 miles from salt water and have an assortment
of 7000-foot peaks within 10 miles or so.  Lots of fjords...

-- 
/~\  Charlie Gibbs                  |  In this world there are
\ /  <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid>      |  two kinds of people:
 X   I'm really at ac.dekanfrus     |  1. Those who can extrapolate
/ \  if you read it the right way.  |  from incomplete data.

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