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Re: Why I dislike systemd

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Marko Rauhamaa <marko@pacujo.net> writes:

> Dan Espen <despen@verizon.net>:
>
>> Maybe I mis-read the question, but the question seemed to be about "my
>> new service". How does the distro know anything about a user developed
>> service. If the question is about postfix, the distro does the service
>> file.
>
> Well, there's a double standard. That's for sure. In particular, it
> isn't clear what is meant to be the division of labor between the
> sysadmin, the distro and the developer. It's not spelled out.
>
> Could the sysadmin replace the distro-provided systemd files? Should
> they? Should the developer be prepared for the sysadmin to override the
> developer's settings? These issues should be spelled out in the
> developer's guide as well as the sysadmin's guide.

Very unclear to me what you are getting at.

For any common administrative function, I would expect a command line
tool and a gui tool to change the setting.

I would NOT expect that setting to be in a .service file.

So, what are the cases where .service files need to be changed?
Probably similar to the cases where we changed start/stop scripts.
Debugging.  There are no rules for that kind of thing.

Still, if you think something is missing, it's not going to get
fixed by magic.

>> Without reading the man page, I'm going to guess the space in a
>> command would be backslashed.
>>
>> Now I read the command line section and it doesn't seem specific on
>> the backslash, but I still think it will work. They do mention if you
>> desire all the features of a shell command line you can get them by
>> doing soemthing like:
>>
>>            ExecStart=/bin/sh -c 'dmesg | tac'
>
> Unfortunately, they didn't provide a precise spec. The bit they did
> provide was messy including all kinds of backslashing, quoting and
> double dollar signs. It would have been helpful to provide an algorithm
> (a python program, perhaps) that quotes an arbitrary argv[] onto the
> ExecStart line.
>
> What's more, the ExecStart escaping is not applicable to all settings.
> So each setting is parsed differently.
>
> (You really can't do it from the man page alone. I've fought my way
> through much of this stuff putting together a product.)

Ideally, the man page should be sufficient.
The way to make that happen is to send bug reports.

-- 
Dan Espen

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Thread

Why I dislike systemd Rich <rich@example.invalid> - 2015-06-15 10:04 +0000
  Re: Why I dislike systemd Huge <Huge@nowhere.much.invalid> - 2015-06-15 11:17 +0000
  Re: Why I dislike systemd Dan Espen <despen@verizon.net> - 2015-06-15 09:46 -0400
    Re: Why I dislike systemd RS Wood <rsw@therandymon.com> - 2015-06-15 17:24 +0300
      Re: Why I dislike systemd Marko Rauhamaa <marko@pacujo.net> - 2015-06-15 18:45 +0300
        Re: Why I dislike systemd Dan Espen <despen@verizon.net> - 2015-06-15 12:33 -0400
          Re: Why I dislike systemd Marko Rauhamaa <marko@pacujo.net> - 2015-06-15 21:16 +0300
            Re: Why I dislike systemd Dan Espen <despen@verizon.net> - 2015-06-15 15:19 -0400
              Re: Why I dislike systemd Marko Rauhamaa <marko@pacujo.net> - 2015-06-15 23:11 +0300
                Re: Why I dislike systemd Dan Espen <despen@verizon.net> - 2015-06-15 16:53 -0400
                Re: Why I dislike systemd Marko Rauhamaa <marko@pacujo.net> - 2015-06-16 00:14 +0300
                Re: Why I dislike systemd Dan Espen <despen@verizon.net> - 2015-06-15 21:02 -0400
                Re: Why I dislike systemd Marko Rauhamaa <marko@pacujo.net> - 2015-06-16 07:48 +0300
                Re: Why I dislike systemd Dan Espen <despen@verizon.net> - 2015-06-16 11:08 -0400
        Re: Why I dislike systemd Richard Kettlewell <rjk@greenend.org.uk> - 2015-06-15 19:20 +0100
        Re: Why I dislike systemd Mike Spencer <mds@bogus.nodomain.nowhere> - 2015-06-15 16:19 -0300
      Re: Why I dislike systemd Richard Kettlewell <rjk@greenend.org.uk> - 2015-06-15 20:13 +0100
    Re: Why I dislike systemd Bob Eager <news0005@eager.cx> - 2015-06-15 15:50 +0000
      Re: Why I dislike systemd Dan Espen <despen@verizon.net> - 2015-06-15 12:14 -0400
      Re: Why I dislike systemd Richard Kettlewell <rjk@greenend.org.uk> - 2015-06-15 17:18 +0100

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