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| From | Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> |
| Newsgroups | comp.lang.javascript |
| Subject | There is no javascript (was: Read binary file) |
| Date | Sat, 19 Mar 2016 13:02:59 +0100 |
| Organization | PointedEars Software (PES) |
| Lines | 163 |
| Message-ID | <5231671.RQTnp4EjVP@PointedEars.de> (permalink) |
| References | <nccmg2$kq7$1@gioia.aioe.org> <145821661.4prVZSFEgG@PointedEars.de> <ncdmil$1ser$1@gioia.aioe.org> <2237637.9AE1fihV9u@PointedEars.de> <nceuqd$756$1@news.albasani.net> <6005521.MME42bj82n@PointedEars.de> <ncf81p$mqu$1@gioia.aioe.org> <ncfff1$64e$1@news.albasani.net> <2814357.mXD5CvAbfT@PointedEars.de> <nchnk0$ggt$1@gioia.aioe.org> <86oaabv18r.fsf@kwarg.de> <ncj092$6sr$1@gioia.aioe.org> |
| Reply-To | Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <cljs@PointedEars.de> |
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Herbert Kleebauer wrote:
> On 19.03.2016 00:02, Matthias Wiehl wrote:
>> Herbert Kleebauer <klee@unibwm.de> writes:
>>> JavaScript was introduced by and is a trademark of Netscape
>>> (now Oracle).
“JavaScript” was from 1996 to 2010 inclusive, by license agreement between
Netscape Communications Corporation and Sun Microsystems, Inc. (Sun) in
December 1995, a trademark of _Sun_, which had been acquired by Oracle
Corporation (Oracle) in 2010, through which “JavaScript” has become a
trademark of Oracle. [0a] (The legal successor to Netscape is not Oracle
as your statement could be misunderstood to mean, but AOL; see below.)
>>> Later the Standard ECMA-262 was created and there are many
>>> implementations of this standard
Correct. But note that “This ECMA Standard is based on several originating
technologies, the most well known being JavaScript™ (Netscape
Communications) and JScript™ (Microsoft Corporation).” [0b]
>>> (including JavaScript).
But even “JavaScript” does not in general refer to a single implementation
of ECMAScript since more than a decade, and the implementation*s* that it
would refer to differ from one another in their feature set (as shown by my
research).
>>> The commonly used name for all this implementation is "javascript".
Wishful thinking. Instead, it is primarily used by people, most of them
laymen, who do not know what they are talking about when using it (as shown
by the very posting that I am just replying to), which inherently
constitutes the majority of the people using it (since nobody can know about
everything in detail, there are always more people who do not know about
something than people who do).
But this is a technical newsgroup; we must aspire here to be *correct* and
*precise* instead of catering to the misconceptions and ambiguity of the
general public. For it is never the general public that defines the proper
meaning of technical terms, but the people employing the corresponding
technology professionally. And should there be a *well-founded*
disagreement about terminology among professionals, then it is not the place
of the general public to decide which terminology is the correct one; it is
not the place of the layman to tell the expert how they should name their
things. You do not (reasonably) try to tell a Chinese how to pronounce
Chinese properly either.
>>> Therefore normally is written:
>>>
>>>>>> <html><head><title>jpg</title>
>>>>>> <script type="text/javascript">
>>>
>>> and not:
>>>
>>>>>> <script type="text/JavaScript">
>>
>> No, that is because MIME types are lowercase by convention (and
>> case-insensitive, see RFC 2045).
>
> They are case insensitive and therefore there is no need for
> a convention
Not even wrong. It is the convention/standard that *defines* MIME media
types as case-insensitive (“not case sensitive”), not the other way around.
> (do you have any link to this convention?).
Inherently, there are no links here; this is a plain-text medium. You might
mean a URI which your NetNews client may be able to turn into a hyperlink.
He just gave you the proper reference: RFC 2045 (“Multipurpose Internet Mail
Extensions (MIME) Part One: Format of Internet Message Bodies”). I can add
that the definition can be found in the section on the “Content-Type” header
field. Look it up.
> But there is a good reason to not use "JavaScript" because this
> would suggest Netscapes implementation of ECMA-262 and not
> an arbitrary implementation.
Only to the underinformed (who have read neither the ECMAScript Support
Matrix nor the scientific work referred therein¹):
First of all, Netscape Communications (Corporation) as an independent
company does not exist anymore. It stopped being a vendor of programming
languages in 1998 (CE), of Internet application suites in 2002 (after the
acquisition by America Online, Inc.), and of Web browsers in 2008 (on March
1st, when support for all Netscape browser and client products was
terminated by AOL²). [1a]
Its legacy is carried on by the Mozilla Organization and contributors
(Mozilla) since 1998 and the Mozilla Corporation since 2005. Mozilla’s
ECMAScript implementation, Mozilla JavaScript (first release: version 1.5 in
2000), has both regarding its source code and its feature set little to do
with the last released versions of Netscape JavaScript (1.3 in 1998, and 1.4
in 1999). [2]
Second, contrary to common belief, using “javascript” conveys exactly
*nothing* to the reader about the referred implementation of ECMAScript;
it does not even convey anything to the reader about the author’s intention
to refer to implementations of ECMAScript. Both are making it impossible
to assign truth values to any statement made about “javascript” as not
all implementations are conforming. Instead, it conveys the misconception
(intentionally or not) that there would be a single programming language,
“javascript”, that also encompasses all the features actually provided by
language-independent APIs that can also be used with implementations of
ECMAScript.
Third, there are now several implementations of ECMAScript, including some
distributed wider than Mozilla JavaScript (as seen worldwide), by vendors
other than Mozilla, whose names contain “JavaScript” (in possible trademark
violation) without being compatible to any version of either Netscape
JavaScript or Mozilla JavaScript (most notably, Google V8 JavaScript [3]).
So even using just “JavaScript” leaves ambiguity, exhibiting the same
problems as “Javascript” or “javascript”, only to a lesser extent.
[IOW, the charter and tagline of this newsgroup are more than a decade
out of date, and do not reflect what is being rightfully discussed here:
ECMAScript and its implementations, and applications thereof, unless
there is a more specific newsgroup (see the FAQ). (Neither does the name
of this newsgroup reflect what is being discussed here, so any arguments
that it should be “javascript” because of “comp.lang.javascript” are
utterly ridiculous, also because *all* Usenet newsgroup names are
lowercase by convention.)]
__________
¹ My experiments with transparent proxying because of this thread caused
temporary denial of access to my Web site. Also, due to migration
to Git, my thesis had not been available online since at least
2016-03-08. Sorry for the inconvenience; it is fixed now.
² I just tried to access <http://netscape.com/> and
<http://www.netscape.com/>, and was redirected to <http://www.aol.com//>
(sic!). So it appears that Netscape does not even exist as an Internet
service anymore, which had not been the case yet a few months ago when
I had been redirected to <http://netscape.aol.com/> instead. [1b]
[0a] <http://www.infoworld.com/article/2653798/application-development/javascript-creator-ponders-past--future.html>
[0b] <http://www.ecma-international.org/publications/files/ECMA-ST-ARCH/ECMA-262,%201st%20edition,%20June%201997.pdf>
[1a] <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Netscape>
[1b]
<http://wayback.archive.org/web/20160229003526/http://www.netscape.com/>
[2] <https://developer.mozilla.org/de/docs/Web/JavaScript>
[3] <http://gs.statcounter.com/#all-browser-ww-monthly-201603-201603-bar>
(Chrome: 47.26 %; Firefox: 8.67 %)
<http://gs.statcounter.com/#all-browser-ww-monthly-201603-201603-map>
(Considering all devices, Chrome/Chromium, therefore Google V8
JavaScript, dominates the Americas, Europe, most of Asia, and
Australia; Firefox, therefore Mozilla JavaScript, is only dominant in
Greenland and Eritrea, Opera dominates most of Africa; UC Browser
dominates Mali, India, and most of Oceania. The situation is only
slightly better for Firefox if you consider only the desktop, where it
still also dominates Germany, the minority of Africa, Iran, Bangladesh,
and Myanmar. Also note that these considerations do not include V8
JavaScript with Node.js outside the Web browser.)
--
PointedEars
FAQ: <http://PointedEars.de/faq> | SVN: <http://PointedEars.de/wsvn/>
Twitter: @PointedEars2 | ES Matrix: <http://PointedEars.de/es-matrix>
Please do not cc me. / Bitte keine Kopien per E-Mail.
Back to comp.lang.javascript | Previous | Next — Previous in thread | Next in thread | Find similar | Unroll thread
Read binary file Herbert Kleebauer <klee@unibwm.de> - 2016-03-16 23:20 +0100
Re: Read binary file Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2016-03-17 01:04 +0100
Re: Read binary file Stefan Weiss <krewecherl@gmail.com> - 2016-03-17 02:34 +0100
Re: Read binary file Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2016-03-17 07:56 +0100
Re: Read binary file Herbert Kleebauer <klee@unibwm.de> - 2016-03-17 08:31 +0100
Re: Read binary file Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2016-03-17 19:10 +0100
Re: Read binary file Stefan Weiss <krewecherl@gmail.com> - 2016-03-17 19:59 +0100
Re: Read binary file Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2016-03-17 21:43 +0100
Re: Read binary file Herbert Kleebauer <klee@unibwm.de> - 2016-03-17 22:36 +0100
Re: Read binary file Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2016-03-17 23:15 +0100
Re: Read binary file Stefan Weiss <krewecherl@gmail.com> - 2016-03-18 00:43 +0100
Re: Read binary file Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2016-03-18 17:22 +0100
Re: Read binary file Herbert Kleebauer <klee@unibwm.de> - 2016-03-18 21:14 +0100
Re: Read binary file Matthias Wiehl <mw@kwarg.de> - 2016-03-19 00:02 +0100
Re: Read binary file Herbert Kleebauer <klee@unibwm.de> - 2016-03-19 08:48 +0100
There is no javascript (was: Read binary file) Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2016-03-19 13:02 +0100
Re: There is no javascript (was: Read binary file) Mark - <nonemail@spamspamapam.net> - 2016-03-19 14:33 +0000
Re: There is no javascript (was: Read binary file) Andrew Poulos <ap_prog@hotmail.com> - 2016-03-20 14:30 +1100
Re: There is no javascript (was: Read binary file) Mark - <nonemail@spamspamapam.net> - 2016-03-20 13:07 +0000
Re: There is no javascript (was: Read binary file) John Harris <niam@jghnorth.org.uk.invalid> - 2016-03-20 10:39 +0000
Re: There is no javascript (was: Read binary file) John Harris <niam@jghnorth.org.uk.invalid> - 2016-03-20 11:19 +0000
Re: There is no javascript (was: Read binary file) Philip Herlihy <thiswillbounceback@you.com> - 2016-03-21 17:06 +0000
Re: Read binary file Scott Sauyet <scott.sauyet@gmail.com> - 2016-03-22 17:18 -0700
Re: Read binary file "Evertjan." <exxjxw.hannivoort@inter.nl.net> - 2016-03-23 10:12 +0100
Re: Read binary file John Harris <niam@jghnorth.org.uk.invalid> - 2016-03-23 16:27 +0000
Re: Read binary file Herbert Kleebauer <klee@unibwm.de> - 2016-03-24 10:41 +0100
Re: Read binary file "Evertjan." <exxjxw.hannivoort@inter.nl.net> - 2016-03-24 11:14 +0100
Re: Read binary file John Harris <niam@jghnorth.org.uk.invalid> - 2016-03-24 11:41 +0000
Re: Read binary file "Evertjan." <exxjxw.hannivoort@inter.nl.net> - 2016-03-24 13:36 +0100
Re: Read binary file John Harris <niam@jghnorth.org.uk.invalid> - 2016-03-25 10:07 +0000
Re: Read binary file "Evertjan." <exxjxw.hannivoort@inter.nl.net> - 2016-03-25 11:28 +0100
Re: Read binary file "Christoph M. Becker" <cmbecker69@arcor.de> - 2016-03-24 11:31 +0100
Re: Read binary file Herbert Kleebauer <klee@unibwm.de> - 2016-03-24 12:34 +0100
Re: Read binary file "Christoph M. Becker" <cmbecker69@arcor.de> - 2016-03-24 17:15 +0100
Re: Read binary file Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2016-03-24 11:33 +0000
Re: Read binary file "Evertjan." <exxjxw.hannivoort@inter.nl.net> - 2016-03-24 11:05 +0100
Re: Read binary file Scott Sauyet <scott.sauyet@gmail.com> - 2016-03-23 20:16 -0700
Re: Read binary file "Evertjan." <exxjxw.hannivoort@inter.nl.net> - 2016-03-24 10:36 +0100
Re: Read binary file "Evertjan." <exxjxw.hannivoort@inter.nl.net> - 2016-03-24 11:18 +0100
Re: Read binary file Scott Sauyet <scott.sauyet@gmail.com> - 2016-03-27 10:22 -0700
Re: Read binary file "Evertjan." <exxjxw.hannivoort@inter.nl.net> - 2016-03-28 00:18 +0200
Re: Read binary file Scott Sauyet <scott.sauyet@gmail.com> - 2016-03-28 05:35 -0700
Re: Read binary file "Evertjan." <exxjxw.hannivoort@inter.nl.net> - 2016-03-29 00:53 +0200
Re: Read binary file Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2016-03-17 02:23 +0100
Re: Read binary file Herbert Kleebauer <klee@unibwm.de> - 2016-03-17 08:42 +0100
Re: Read binary file Dr J R Stockton <reply1600@merlyn.demon.co.uk.invalid> - 2016-03-20 22:03 +0000
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