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Groups > comp.lang.forth > #58964

Re: FP stack

From Ron Aaron <rambamist@gmail.com>
Newsgroups comp.lang.forth
Subject Re: FP stack
Date 2017-05-10 14:17 +0300
Organization A noiseless patient Spider
Message-ID <oeusmf$ift$1@dont-email.me> (permalink)
References (7 earlier) <oeue6m$60g$1@dont-email.me> <6tednSpqKomGXY_EnZ2dnUU7-N1QAAAA@supernews.com> <oeugmr$d7s$1@dont-email.me> <oeuh5h$eo7$1@dont-email.me> <2017May10.115818@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at>

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On 05/10/17 12:58, Anton Ertl wrote:
> Ron Aaron <rambamist@gmail.com> writes:

> In most cases, numbers just use one cell.  It's rare that 64 bits is
> not enough.  

That may be true, but the doubles exist and people will use them -- in
'portable' code.  Doubles always take two cells (I believe, can't
remember what the standard says).  It's not at all rare to use doubles,
especially in code ported from 16 or 32 bit systems.


> For strings, having address and length as separate cells
> gives us easy access to the address and to the length.  Of course, you
> can argue that we so often use both as an atomic unit that it would be
> more convenient to have 128-bit cells on 64-bit machines, and have
> extraction words for address and length.  And likewise for doubles.

Or you can use counted strings, with cell-sized counts.  Now you have
the size, and the data, in one cell (you know what I mean).

> But we also have existing code, and a little convenience is not enough
> reason to break that (there are ways to deal with that, though, see
> below).  

This is true.  But if you're already making a new standard, you can
deprecate old code.  Or make a 'pragma' or such where you notify the
compiler you're using old code (or new code, depending on where the
pain-point is).


> Another reason against is that operations like DUP and SWAP
> would become more expensive (not much, but still)

Ehh.  Not much indeed.

> And finally, small systems with a few KB of
> RAM or less are still relevant for Forth, and you don't want to waste
> anything there.

Again, that's true.  But are users of tiny systems going to pursue using
the latest compiler?  Should they?  I don't know...

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Recognizers discussion Alex <alex@rivadpm.com> - 2017-05-02 15:27 +0100
  Recognizers discussion lehs <skydda.barnen@gmail.com> - 2017-05-02 07:52 -0700
    Re: Recognizers discussion Mark Wills <markwills1970@gmail.com> - 2017-05-02 08:19 -0700
      Re: Recognizers discussion lehs <skydda.barnen@gmail.com> - 2017-05-02 08:27 -0700
    Re: Recognizers discussion Alex <alex@rivadpm.com> - 2017-05-02 19:55 +0100
      Re: Recognizers discussion lehs <skydda.barnen@gmail.com> - 2017-05-03 02:38 -0700
        Re: Recognizers discussion anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2017-05-04 15:16 +0000
  Re: Recognizers discussion Alex <alex@rivadpm.com> - 2017-05-02 17:05 +0100
    Re: Recognizers discussion Alex <alex@rivadpm.com> - 2017-05-02 17:23 +0100
      Re: Recognizers discussion Alex <alex@rivadpm.com> - 2017-05-02 17:26 +0100
      Re: Recognizers discussion Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2017-05-02 13:03 -0500
        Re: Recognizers discussion Matthias Trute <matthias.trute@gmail.com> - 2017-05-02 12:44 -0700
          Re: Recognizers discussion Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2017-05-03 04:36 -0500
        Re: Recognizers discussion anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2017-05-04 13:28 +0000
          Re: Recognizers discussion Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2017-05-04 09:13 -0500
  Re: Recognizers discussion Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2017-05-02 12:35 -0500
    Re: Recognizers discussion Alex <alex@rivadpm.com> - 2017-05-02 18:53 +0100
      Re: Recognizers discussion Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2017-05-02 13:10 -0500
        Re: Recognizers discussion Alex <alex@rivadpm.com> - 2017-05-02 19:22 +0100
        Re: Recognizers discussion Bernd Paysan <bernd@net2o.de> - 2017-05-02 22:53 +0000
          Re: Recognizers discussion Gerry Jackson <gerry@jackson9000.fsnet.co.uk> - 2017-05-03 07:39 +0100
            Re: Recognizers discussion Alex <alex@rivadpm.com> - 2017-05-03 10:58 +0100
            Re: Recognizers discussion anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2017-05-04 13:53 +0000
            Re: Recognizers discussion Bernd Paysan <bernd@net2o.de> - 2017-05-06 01:21 +0000
            Re: Recognizers discussion pahihu <pahihu@gmail.com> - 2017-05-06 00:22 -0700
              Re: Recognizers discussion Gerry Jackson <gerry@jackson9000.fsnet.co.uk> - 2017-05-06 23:05 +0100
                Re: Recognizers discussion pahihu <pahihu@gmail.com> - 2017-05-06 22:36 -0700
          Re: Recognizers discussion Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2017-05-03 04:38 -0500
            Re: Recognizers discussion minforth@arcor.de - 2017-05-03 04:49 -0700
              Re: Recognizers discussion Mark Wills <markwills1970@gmail.com> - 2017-05-03 05:03 -0700
                Re: Recognizers discussion Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2017-05-03 09:02 -0500
                Re: Recognizers discussion Mark Wills <markwills1970@gmail.com> - 2017-05-03 07:45 -0700
                Re: Recognizers discussion Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2017-05-03 11:24 -0500
                Re: Recognizers discussion Mark Wills <markwills1970@gmail.com> - 2017-05-03 09:45 -0700
                Re: Recognizers discussion Raimond Dragomir <raimond.dragomir@gmail.com> - 2017-05-03 10:08 -0700
                Re: Recognizers discussion "Rudy Velthuis" <newsgroups@rvelthuis.de> - 2017-05-09 15:56 +0000
                Re: Recognizers discussion Alex <alex@rivadpm.com> - 2017-05-03 18:37 +0100
                Re: Recognizers discussion Mark Wills <markwills1970@gmail.com> - 2017-05-03 11:07 -0700
                Re: Recognizers discussion Alex <alex@rivadpm.com> - 2017-05-03 20:55 +0100
                Re: Recognizers discussion Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2017-05-04 02:47 -0500
                Re: Recognizers discussion Alex <alex@rivadpm.com> - 2017-05-04 13:07 +0100
                Re: Recognizers discussion Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2017-05-04 07:59 -0500
                Re: Recognizers discussion Alex <alex@rivadpm.com> - 2017-05-04 17:38 +0100
                Re: Recognizers discussion Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2017-05-04 12:42 -0500
                Re: Recognizers discussion Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2017-05-04 02:43 -0500
                Re: Recognizers discussion Alex <alex@rivadpm.com> - 2017-05-04 13:05 +0100
                Re: Recognizers discussion Ron Aaron <rambamist@gmail.com> - 2017-05-04 15:10 +0300
                Re: Recognizers discussion Alex <alex@rivadpm.com> - 2017-05-04 13:25 +0100
                Re: Recognizers discussion Ron Aaron <rambamist@gmail.com> - 2017-05-04 15:33 +0300
                Re: Recognizers discussion Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2017-05-04 08:05 -0500
                Re: Recognizers discussion "Rudy Velthuis" <newsgroups@rvelthuis.de> - 2017-05-09 15:54 +0000
                Re: Recognizers discussion Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2017-05-09 11:10 -0500
                Re: Recognizers discussion "Rudy Velthuis" <newsgroups@rvelthuis.de> - 2017-05-10 11:49 +0000
                Re: Recognizers discussion anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2017-05-04 16:14 +0000
                Re: Recognizers discussion Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2017-05-04 13:02 -0500
                Re: Recognizers discussion Bernd Paysan <bernd@net2o.de> - 2017-05-05 23:29 +0000
                Re: Recognizers discussion Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2017-05-07 03:56 -0500
                Re: Recognizers discussion Bernd Paysan <bernd@net2o.de> - 2017-05-07 22:42 +0000
                Re: Recognizers discussion Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2017-05-08 04:08 -0500
                Re: Recognizers discussion Julian Fondren <julian.fondren@gmail.com> - 2017-05-03 08:51 -0700
                Re: Recognizers discussion Mark Wills <markwills1970@gmail.com> - 2017-05-03 09:38 -0700
                Re: Recognizers discussion Julian Fondren <julian.fondren@gmail.com> - 2017-05-03 09:59 -0700
                Re: Recognizers discussion Mark Wills <markwills1970@gmail.com> - 2017-05-03 10:16 -0700
                Re: Recognizers discussion albert@cherry.spenarnc.xs4all.nl (Albert van der Horst) - 2017-05-03 22:04 +0200
                Re: Recognizers discussion minforth@arcor.de - 2017-05-03 22:09 -0700
                Re: Recognizers discussion Joel Rees <joel.rees@gmail.com> - 2017-05-07 19:50 -0700
                Re: Recognizers discussion "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2017-05-07 21:33 -1000
                Re: Recognizers discussion Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2017-05-08 04:12 -0500
                Re: Recognizers discussion Joel Rees <joel.rees@gmail.com> - 2017-05-08 20:21 -0700
                FP stack (was: Recognizers discussion) anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2017-05-08 12:35 +0000
                Re: FP stack (was: Recognizers discussion) Joel Rees <joel.rees@gmail.com> - 2017-05-08 20:50 -0700
                Re: FP stack Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2017-05-09 03:39 -0500
                Re: FP stack Joel Rees <joel.rees@gmail.com> - 2017-05-09 20:59 -0700
                Re: FP stack Julian Fondren <julian.fondren@gmail.com> - 2017-05-10 00:03 -0700
                Re: FP stack Alex <alex@rivadpm.com> - 2017-05-10 08:10 +0100
                Re: FP stack "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2017-05-09 21:24 -1000
                Re: FP stack Julian Fondren <julian.fondren@gmail.com> - 2017-05-10 00:37 -0700
                Re: FP stack "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2017-05-09 22:53 -1000
                Re: FP stack Alex <alex@rivadpm.com> - 2017-05-10 08:53 +0100
                Re: FP stack Ron Aaron <rambamist@gmail.com> - 2017-05-10 11:00 +0300
                Re: FP stack Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-10 01:02 -0700
                Re: FP stack Ron Aaron <rambamist@gmail.com> - 2017-05-10 11:06 +0300
                Re: FP stack anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2017-05-10 09:58 +0000
                Re: FP stack Ron Aaron <rambamist@gmail.com> - 2017-05-10 14:17 +0300
                Re: FP stack Alex <alex@rivadpm.com> - 2017-05-10 13:09 +0100
                Re: FP stack anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2017-05-10 15:05 +0000
                Re: FP stack albert@cherry.spenarnc.xs4all.nl (Albert van der Horst) - 2017-05-10 11:43 +0200
                Re: FP stack "HAA" <someone@microsoft.com> - 2017-05-10 18:34 +1000
                Re: FP stack anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2017-05-10 09:45 +0000
                Re: FP stack "HAA" <someone@microsoft.com> - 2017-05-11 19:13 +1000
                Re: FP stack Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2017-05-11 04:50 -0500
                Re: FP stack anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2017-05-11 16:18 +0000
                Re: FP stack Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2017-05-11 12:12 -0500
                Re: FP stack stephen@mpeforth.com (Stephen Pelc) - 2017-05-11 13:53 +0000
                Re: FP stack anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2017-05-11 15:43 +0000
                Re: FP stack Joel Rees <joel.rees@gmail.com> - 2017-05-12 08:48 -0700
                Re: FP stack anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2017-05-11 16:31 +0000
                Re: FP stack "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2017-05-11 10:18 -1000
                Re: FP stack Cecil Bayona <cbayona@cbayona.com> - 2017-05-11 15:37 -0500
                Re: FP stack "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2017-05-11 17:25 -1000
                Re: FP stack Cecil Bayona <cbayona@cbayona.com> - 2017-05-11 22:55 -0500
                Re: FP stack "HAA" <someone@microsoft.com> - 2017-05-13 14:24 +1000
                Re: FP stack albert@cherry.spenarnc.xs4all.nl (Albert van der Horst) - 2017-05-13 13:44 +0200
                Re: FP stack Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2017-05-10 05:58 -0500
                Re: FP stack (was: Recognizers discussion) anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2017-05-09 13:50 +0000
                Re: FP stack (was: Recognizers discussion) Joel Rees <joel.rees@gmail.com> - 2017-05-10 00:25 -0700
                Re: FP stack (was: Recognizers discussion) anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2017-05-10 11:39 +0000
                Re: FP stack (was: Recognizers discussion) Joel Rees <joel.rees@gmail.com> - 2017-05-10 11:49 -0700
                Re: FP stack (was: Recognizers discussion) "HAA" <someone@microsoft.com> - 2017-05-09 21:15 +1000
                Re: Recognizers discussion "HAA" <someone@microsoft.com> - 2017-05-09 14:16 +1000
              Re: Recognizers discussion Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2017-05-03 08:57 -0500
                Re: Recognizers discussion minforth@arcor.de - 2017-05-03 07:54 -0700
                Re: Recognizers discussion Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2017-05-03 11:30 -0500
                Re: Recognizers discussion Cecil Bayona <cbayona@cbayona.com> - 2017-05-03 14:05 -0500
                Re: Recognizers discussion Alex <alex@rivadpm.com> - 2017-05-03 18:42 +0100
                Re: Recognizers discussion Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2017-05-04 02:51 -0500
                Re: Recognizers discussion "HAA" <someone@microsoft.com> - 2017-05-04 22:29 +1000
                Re: Recognizers discussion Alex <alex@rivadpm.com> - 2017-05-04 13:41 +0100
                Re: Recognizers discussion Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2017-05-04 09:06 -0500
                Re: Recognizers discussion "Rudy Velthuis" <newsgroups@rvelthuis.de> - 2017-05-15 12:22 +0000
                Re: Recognizers discussion Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2017-05-15 07:36 -0500
                Re: Recognizers discussion "Rudy Velthuis" <newsgroups@rvelthuis.de> - 2017-05-18 21:21 +0000
                Re: Recognizers discussion "Rudy Velthuis" <newsgroups@rvelthuis.de> - 2017-05-18 21:24 +0000
                Re: Recognizers discussion albert@cherry.spenarnc.xs4all.nl (Albert van der Horst) - 2017-05-04 20:17 +0200
                Re: Recognizers discussion "HAA" <someone@microsoft.com> - 2017-05-05 11:03 +1000
                Re: Recognizers discussion minforth@arcor.de - 2017-05-05 00:16 -0700
                Re: Recognizers discussion JUERGEN <epldfpga@aol.com> - 2017-05-05 13:15 -0700
                Re: Recognizers discussion "HAA" <someone@microsoft.com> - 2017-05-06 16:49 +1000
                Re: Recognizers discussion Alex <alex@rivadpm.com> - 2017-05-05 21:00 +0100
      Re: Recognizers discussion "Rudy Velthuis" <newsgroups@rvelthuis.de> - 2017-05-09 14:17 +0000
        Re: Recognizers discussion Alex <alex@rivadpm.com> - 2017-05-09 15:46 +0100
          Re: Recognizers discussion "Rudy Velthuis" <newsgroups@rvelthuis.de> - 2017-05-10 11:50 +0000
            Re: Recognizers discussion Alex <alex@rivadpm.com> - 2017-05-10 13:11 +0100
              Re: Recognizers discussion "Rudy Velthuis" <newsgroups@rvelthuis.de> - 2017-05-10 13:49 +0000
                Re: Recognizers discussion Alex <alex@rivadpm.com> - 2017-05-10 15:57 +0100
                Re: Recognizers discussion "Rudy Velthuis" <newsgroups@rvelthuis.de> - 2017-05-12 14:17 +0000
  Re: Recognizers discussion "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2017-05-02 09:25 -1000
    Re: Recognizers discussion albert@cherry.spenarnc.xs4all.nl (Albert van der Horst) - 2017-05-03 01:19 +0200
    Re: Recognizers discussion "Rudy Velthuis" <newsgroups@rvelthuis.de> - 2017-05-05 15:50 +0000
      Re: Recognizers discussion "HAA" <someone@microsoft.com> - 2017-05-08 11:43 +1000
        Re: Recognizers discussion "Rudy Velthuis" <newsgroups@rvelthuis.de> - 2017-05-08 19:17 +0000
          Re: Recognizers discussion anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2017-05-09 14:25 +0000
            Re: Recognizers discussion "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2017-05-09 21:22 -1000
              Re: Recognizers discussion "HAA" <someone@microsoft.com> - 2017-05-13 13:33 +1000
                Re: Recognizers discussion "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2017-05-12 21:32 -1000
                Re: Recognizers discussion Howerd <howerdo@yahoo.co.uk> - 2017-05-13 07:12 -0700
                Re: Recognizers discussion "Rudy Velthuis" <newsgroups@rvelthuis.de> - 2017-05-13 14:30 +0000
  Re: Recognizers discussion rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2017-05-04 11:37 -0400
    Re: Recognizers discussion Alex <alex@rivadpm.com> - 2017-05-04 17:51 +0100
      Re: Recognizers discussion anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2017-05-05 07:31 +0000
        Re: Recognizers discussion Lars Brinkhoff <lars.spam@nocrew.org> - 2017-05-05 20:35 +0200
          Re: Recognizers discussion minforth@arcor.de - 2017-05-05 12:27 -0700
          Re: Recognizers discussion Cecil Bayona <cbayona@cbayona.com> - 2017-05-05 15:03 -0500
          Re: Recognizers discussion anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2017-05-06 16:26 +0000
            Re: Recognizers discussion Alex <alex@rivadpm.com> - 2017-05-06 18:17 +0100
              Re: Recognizers discussion Brad Eckert <hwfwguy@gmail.com> - 2017-05-06 12:26 -0700
                Re: Recognizers discussion Alex <alex@rivadpm.com> - 2017-05-06 21:39 +0100
            Re: Recognizers discussion Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2017-05-07 03:58 -0500
              Re: Recognizers discussion Alex <alex@rivadpm.com> - 2017-05-07 10:39 +0100
                Re: Recognizers discussion Bernd Paysan <bernd@net2o.de> - 2017-05-07 23:39 +0000
                Re: Recognizers discussion Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-07 17:38 -0700
                Re: Recognizers discussion anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2017-05-08 13:40 +0000
                Re: Recognizers discussion anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2017-05-08 13:25 +0000
                Re: Recognizers discussion Lars Brinkhoff <lars.spam@nocrew.org> - 2017-05-08 16:25 +0200
              Flash (was: Recognizers discussion) anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2017-05-07 10:51 +0000
                Re: Flash Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2017-05-07 08:06 -0500
                Re: Flash anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2017-05-07 13:57 +0000
                Re: Flash Lars Brinkhoff <lars.spam@nocrew.org> - 2017-05-07 16:46 +0200
                Re: Flash Alex <alex@rivadpm.com> - 2017-05-07 16:31 +0100
                Re: Flash anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2017-05-07 17:16 +0000
                Re: Flash Alex <alex@rivadpm.com> - 2017-05-07 19:18 +0100
                Re: Flash albert@cherry.spenarnc.xs4all.nl (Albert van der Horst) - 2017-05-07 21:45 +0200
                Re: Flash Matthias Trute <matthias.trute@gmail.com> - 2017-05-07 12:54 -0700
                Re: Flash Alex <alex@rivadpm.com> - 2017-05-07 19:33 +0100
                Re: Flash Raimond Dragomir <raimond.dragomir@gmail.com> - 2017-05-07 08:50 -0700
                Re: Flash anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2017-05-07 17:21 +0000
    Re: Recognizers discussion Matthias Trute <matthias.trute@gmail.com> - 2017-05-04 10:07 -0700

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