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| From | Joerg <invalid@invalid.invalid> |
| Newsgroups | sci.electronics.design, comp.arch.embedded |
| Subject | Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? |
| Date | Sat, 07 Sep 2013 14:48:53 -0700 |
| Organization | Consultant |
| Lines | 389 |
| Message-ID | <b91lacF5bvnU1@mid.individual.net> (permalink) |
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| Xref | csiph.com comp.arch.embedded:13364 |
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rickman wrote: > On 9/7/2013 3:39 PM, Joerg wrote: >> rickman wrote: >>> On 9/7/2013 1:59 PM, Joerg wrote: >>>> rickman wrote: >>>>> On 9/7/2013 11:10 AM, Joerg wrote: >>>>>> rickman wrote: >>>>>>> On 9/6/2013 7:10 PM, Joerg wrote: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> That is often the problem. Sometimes a buck fifty is the pain >>>>>>>> threshold. >>>>>>>> Not in this ATMega case, the 2560 is very expensive but comes with >>>>>>>> lots >>>>>>>> of ADC and analog muxes and all that. Things that will cost extra >>>>>>>> with a >>>>>>>> FPGA solution and eat real estate. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> For $3 however, you can get a >>>>>>>>> chip large enough for a CPU (with math) and room for your special >>>>>>>>> logic. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> For $3 I can get a big DSP. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> What "big" DSP can you get for $3? ... >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> For example, this: >>>>>> >>>>>> http://www.ti.com/lit/ds/symlink/tms320c5535.pdf >>>>> >>>>> I don't see it for $3. Did you get a quote for your project? TI says >>>>> it is $5 to $8 at qty 1k depending on the flavor. You still need >>>>> to add >>>>> Flash. >>>>> >>>> >>>> 1k qty is $3.67 at Digikey: >>>> >>>> http://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/TMS320C5532AZHH10/296-32741-ND/2749713 >>>> >>>> >>> >>> Not the same part pal. You're trying to pull a fast one on me? Are we >>> talking about the TMS320C5535 with "tons" of memory or the TMS320C5532 >>> with *much* less memory? >>> >> >> It doesn't have the single access RAM but it does have 64k dual access >> RAM. That's a lot of RAM in embedded. > > You do this often. Start talking about one thing and shift the context > to another. ... I didn't. I said it is a DSP with large memory, which it is. > ... Projects have design requirements. I often am able to meet > my design requirements with an FPGA and no MCU. I often can't say the > opposite, being able to use an MCU without the FPGA. > > >>>> $3.02 with 12wks leadtime at Arrow: >>>> >>>> http://components.arrow.com/part/detail/51425505S8988412N7713?region=na >>>> >>>> ROM is included. >>> >>> ROM is not Flash.. is it? Are you thinking in terms of a mask ROM? >>> >> >> You can use the bootloader or OTP your own bootloader if you don't want >> to store your programming in ROM. In most situations this is part of a >> larger computerized system from where it can download its programming. > > That's a different wrinkle. It is common to have a micro load an FPGA, > many don't contain their own Flash. But I haven't seen this done with > DSPs as often and almost never with MCUs. But if that works for your > project, great. You certainly wouldn't have a problem loading an FPGA > then. > The fact that most FPGA don't have flash is fine ... but ... there must be a decent bootloader inside. In one of the upcoming projects it must be able to bootload via USB. So the device must wake up with a certain minimum in brain functionality to handle the USB stuff. With FPGA that can become a challenge unless you provide a serial memory device (which adds cost). > >>>>>>> ... It has been a while since I looked >>>>>>> hard at DSP chips, but I don't recall any I would call remotely >>>>>>> "big" >>>>>>> for $3. The TI chips that would be "big" are the TMS6xxx line which >>>>>>> start somewhere around $20 the last time I looked and that requires >>>>>>> all >>>>>>> memory and I/O to be separate. The smaller DSP chips that you >>>>>>> can get >>>>>>> for the $3 range are not "big" in any sense and only a very few of >>>>>>> them >>>>>>> include Flash memory. So you still need another chip. >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> It has tons of memory on board. >>>>> >>>>> Yes, and many FPGAs have "tons" of memory on board although not for >>>>> $3... but then this isn't a $3 part either... >>>>> >>>> >>>> It is a $3 part. See above. >>> >>> No, you need to pick a part number and stick with it. >>> >> >> I gave a part number. Still waiting for your $3 FPGA part number :-) > > Actually you gave me two part numbers, one for $5 and one for just over > $3. What's your point? I gave you info to find the iCE40 line. Xilinx > also makes FPGAs that are very affordable and does Altera and Lattice. > Both of the ones I gave you are $3. The DSP costs $3.02 and the MSP430 is $3.09. These are over-the-counter no-haggle prices. Can a $3 iCE40 device emulate a TMS320 or a big MSP430? I can't tell because I don't know this Lattice series and I am not an FPGA expert. But it sure looks like they'd have a hard time. > >>>>>>> Even a "small" FPGA can run rings around a DSP when it comes to >>>>>>> performance. Usually "big" in DSPs means fast and when you want >>>>>>> really >>>>>>> fast DSP you use an FPGA with all the parallelism you can handle. >>>>>>> DSPs >>>>>>> can't touch FPGAs for speed, even with low power. >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> Most of the really powerful FPGA that I connected to or had to review >>>>>> designs with them in there were painfully expensive. >>>>> >>>>> Because you were looking at FPGAs that were "painfully" large I'm >>>>> sure. >>>>> How many pins, 256, 400+...? 20,000 LUTs, 40,000 LUTs? >>>>> >>>> >>>> Sure, that's why I wrote "powerful". The less powerful ones have never >>>> impressed me much but I have to admit that I haven't looked the last >>>> five years. So, tell us, which FPGA can fully replace the above DSP for >>>> three bucks and where could one buy it off the shelf? >>> >>> Lol, I don't know where you are coming from now. You don't like the >>> large FPGAs because they use power like they are... well, large. You >>> don't like the small FPGAs because they are, well... small. >>> >>> When you stop using terms like "powerful" and want to actually consider >>> an FPGA for a design I can help you. Gut feel is nice as long as it is >>> based in fact. >>> >> >> So then, what would be an FPGA that can fully contain the above TMS320 >> and what does it cost? >> >> Which one could replace the MSP430F6733 including its ADCs and all, for >> around $3? >> >> http://www.ti.com/lit/ds/symlink/msp430f6720.pdf > > I have already explained that I would never do a design in an FPGA to > wholly incorporate a DSP or MCU. That would be absurd. So why do you > keep asking about that? > Because you wrote yesterday, quote "For $3 however, you can get a chip large enough for a CPU (with math) and room for your special logic". > Depending on your design requirements there are any number of FPGAs that > will do the job and some may be $3. What are your design requirements? > As I said, I do not have any hammered out ones yet but it'll come. This was just about you $3 claim. So I gave some examples of devices that cost $3. > >>>>> I can only remember one time where I iterated through design >>>>> changes in >>>>> the field and that was actually a case where I could have done it all >>>>> remotely, but I was pleasing the customer to be there. Turns out he >>>>> wasn't initializing the design right and it was hard to detect. >>>>> >>>> >>>> Well, if you are standing next to a huge roaring engine and this, that >>>> and the other subtle disturbance has to be ironed out it would be a >>>> major problem if the programmer is three time zones away. You don't >>>> have >>>> to believe me but that's how it is with some of my assignments. >>>> >>>> Just like EMC jobs on large gear can simply not be done remotely. Which >>>> is why I bought the Signalhound analyzer (fits into carry-on). >>> >>> I don't argue your needs. You keep saying these special jobs are a >>> small percentage of your work. So most assignments will work just fine >>> with remote support, no? >>> >> >> Yes, for myself I'd say it's>90%. For firmware and software support, >> much lower percentage. Currently<50% of cases. Meaning I (or some other >> folks) and the programmers have to literally work side-by-side. >> >> Mostly this simply has to do with the fact that gear is too large to >> ship and often also because operation by someone not used to it can >> become dangerous. When pressures are several thousand psi and someone >> screws up people could die. > > I understand the concept of work that can't be moved. You don't need to > continue to explain that. I was asking why you said most of your word > didn't have that requirement and yet you still were debating the point. > Now I get it, you are talking about two different things, work that can > be moved and work that can't be moved. > Yup. Hence the need for availability of local programmer talent. Less local availability means potential problems. That is because (where possible) I like to use architectures I am familiar with. Programmer talent means longterm. For example, if a client has an issue with an 8051 design long after the original programmer has moved on I could find programmers within a 10-mile radius. Try that with an FPGA. In San Jose it may be possible but not out here. [...] >>> Not sure what the requirements are for your CODEC, but I have been using >>> the AKM parts with good results. Minimal or *no* programming, >>> configuration is done by a small number of select pins, very simple. I >>> have yet to find another one as small, AK4552, AK4556. >>> >> >> Plus their prices are quite good. > > Which, AKM or the other? I'd like to think I can get a CD quality CODEC > for $3 from nearly anyone. I mainly picked AKM because of the size, 6x6 > mm without going to a microBGA. > AKM has good prices. > >>>>> You do know that it is not hard to add an ADC to an FPGA? No need >>>>> for a >>>>> mux if all the inputs can be connected to separate pins. It all >>>>> depends >>>>> on the resolution you need. 8 bits is easy, 16 bits - not so easy. >>>>> >>>> >>>> Mine are never less than 12-bit, often 16-bit. >>> >>> What about delay time? Is sigma-delta ok? >>> >> >> As long as I can get into the tens of ksps. > > High 10's or low 10's. Up to say, 20 or 30 ksps is easy to do in an > FPGA with decent resolution, 12 bits. Getting 16 bits is harder, I've > not tried it, but should be possible. > Mostly I need 40-50ksps. But 20 is often ok. > I was looking at using a LVDS input for a comparator and Xilinx did it > in a demo of a SDR. They are very short on details, but they talk about > 1 mV on the input. I know that's not anything special, I'm hoping to do > better, much better. > If you can keep substrate noise in check it could work. Try to remain fully differential as much as you can. Not sure if FPGA design suites still let you hand-place blocks so you can avoid making a big racket right next to the ADC area. > >>>>>>>> Last week I reviewed a design with some larger FPGA on there. >>>>>>>> What I >>>>>>>> found fairly disgusting was how much they had to be babied with the >>>>>>>> power sequencing. uCs don't have that problem. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> If you want to work with the wrong device, then you will find it >>>>>>> hard to >>>>>>> work with. There are still single voltage devices on the >>>>>>> market. If >>>>>>> this was an old design, most likely it was a Spartan 3 or similar >>>>>>> era >>>>>>> device when they (for still unknown reasons) used three, yes, count >>>>>>> them, *three* voltages on the FPGA. The 2.5 volt aux supply was >>>>>>> there >>>>>>> solely for the configuration interface which was normally to a 3.3 >>>>>>> volt >>>>>>> device! Only from Xilinx... >>>>>>> >>>>>>> If this was a new device, then I guess they picked one based on >>>>>>> something other than ease of use, eh? Don't assume all FPGAs are >>>>>>> the >>>>>>> same. >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> Well, this guy is a real expert on high-end FPGA and the project >>>>>> requires stuff with tons of horsepower. >>>>> >>>>> That's fine, just don't judge all FPGAs by the ones you have seen. If >>>>> the only MCU you had worked with were ARM 11s using 3 Watts and >>>>> running >>>>> a cell phone down in 8 hours, would you think the PIC MCUs were the >>>>> same? >>>>> >>>> >>>> Well, give us all here an example of a FPGA that can fully emulate a >>>> TSM320 and costs $3 :-) >>> >>> There are a number of $3 FPGAs. I can't imagine why you would want to >>> emulate a DSP in an FPGA. I would rather design a project using an >>> FPGA. TI likely has a restriction about running their code compiled >>> with their tools in an FPGA softcore. So what is your project? >>> >> >> I wasn't referring to a specific project, just your claim that FPGA can >> do the same job as processors at the same price. > > Yes, that is my claim. The obvious exception is when some feature is > needed that just isn't available in an FPGA. I'm not saying *every* > project can be done better in an FPGA. I'm saying that designers tend > to just not consider FPGAs when they are often viable solutions. > In most of my apps I need much of the functionality that a decent uC affords, like the $3 device from the MSP430 series I mentioned. > >> One project will probably require something of the caliber of a >> MSP430F6733. Whether this kind or a DSP, what is key is that we are able >> to use pre-coooked library routines. In my case for complex (I/Q) signal >> processing, FFT, non-linear filtering and so on. Sometimes legacy >> routines must be kept and in an FPGA that would require an IP block that >> can emulate the respective processor well enough. > > Ok, that is likely a no-go. If you really want to emulate a DSP chip > then an FPGA is not likely to be a useful way to proceed. Wanting to > run DSP precompiled library code is a bit of an extreme requirement. If > the customer wants a DSP, then by all means give them a DSP. But don't > automatically exclude an FPGA from the task. > Sometimes it would also be ok if there were similar pre-cooked FPGA routines (I/Q signal processing, non-linear filters et cetera). > >> But what I see most is this: The respective client has in-house talent >> for writing code. They are familiar with a particular architecture, have >> a vast arsenal of re-usable code built up, and naturally they do not >> wish to give this up. If it's a dsPIC like last year, then that goes in >> there. If it's Atmel and MSP430 like this year, then that is used. Has >> to be, the customer is king. > > Yeah, well that is a deal killer for *any* other alternative. That is > not related to what I was saying. My point is that if you don't have > any specific requirement that dictates the use of a given chip, an FPGA > has as good a chance at meeting the requirements as an MCU or DSP. In > fact, FPGAs are what get used when DSPs aren't fast enough. My point is > you don't have to limit them to the high end. They also do very well at > the low end. > No disagreement there, programables have come a long way since the days of GALs. Which I never used because they were expensive power guzzlers. One other challenge that needs to be met in most of my cases is longevity of the design. A FPGA would have to remain available for more than just a few years. For example, one of my uC-based designs from the mid 90's is still in production. Since I kind of had a hunch that this would happen I used an 8051 family uC. Is there something similar in the world of FPGA? -- Regards, Joerg http://www.analogconsultants.com/
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AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? Joerg <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2013-08-19 13:14 -0700
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? John Devereux <john@devereux.me.uk> - 2013-08-20 20:16 +0100
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? Vladimir Vassilevsky <nospam@nowhere.com> - 2013-08-21 14:47 -0500
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? Jim Stewart <jstewart@jkmicro.com> - 2013-08-21 13:18 -0700
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? Joerg <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2013-08-21 16:38 -0700
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? "Tim Williams" <tmoranwms@charter.net> - 2013-08-21 21:30 -0500
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? Joerg <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2013-08-22 10:51 -0700
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2013-09-06 16:26 -0400
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? Joerg <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2013-09-06 13:33 -0700
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2013-09-06 17:12 -0400
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? Joerg <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2013-09-06 16:10 -0700
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2013-09-06 23:59 -0400
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? Joerg <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2013-09-07 08:10 -0700
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2013-09-07 13:03 -0400
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? Joerg <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2013-09-07 10:59 -0700
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2013-09-07 14:54 -0400
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? Joerg <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2013-09-07 12:39 -0700
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2013-09-07 16:44 -0400
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? Joerg <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2013-09-07 14:48 -0700
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? "Tim Williams" <tmoranwms@charter.net> - 2013-09-07 17:10 -0500
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? Joerg <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2013-09-07 15:34 -0700
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? Stef <stef33d@yahooI-N-V-A-L-I-D.com.invalid> - 2013-09-08 00:57 +0200
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? Joerg <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2013-09-07 16:56 -0700
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? Stef <stef33d@yahooI-N-V-A-L-I-D.com.invalid> - 2013-09-09 17:07 +0200
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? Joerg <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2013-09-09 10:19 -0700
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? Paul <paul@pcserviceselectronics.co.uk> - 2013-09-09 20:27 +0100
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? Joerg <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2013-09-09 12:55 -0700
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? Stef <stef33d@yahooI-N-V-A-L-I-D.com.invalid> - 2013-09-11 09:44 +0200
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? Joerg <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2013-09-11 07:27 -0700
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? Stef <stef33d@yahooI-N-V-A-L-I-D.com.invalid> - 2013-09-13 12:42 +0200
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? Joerg <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2013-09-14 11:56 -0700
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2013-09-07 19:38 -0400
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2013-09-07 17:39 -0700
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2013-09-07 23:20 -0400
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? Joerg <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2013-09-08 07:41 -0700
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? krw@attt.bizz - 2013-09-07 11:17 -0400
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2013-09-07 13:23 -0400
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? krw@attt.bizz - 2013-09-08 11:19 -0400
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2013-09-08 14:03 -0400
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? krw@attt.bizz - 2013-09-08 19:42 -0400
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2013-09-08 17:18 -0700
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? krw@attt.bizz - 2013-09-09 13:13 -0400
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2013-09-10 20:21 -0400
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? krw@attt.bizz - 2013-09-10 23:42 -0400
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? John Devereux <john@devereux.me.uk> - 2013-09-07 09:24 +0100
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2013-09-07 10:00 -0400
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? krw@attt.bizz - 2013-09-07 11:32 -0400
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2013-09-07 13:35 -0400
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? krw@attt.bizz - 2013-09-08 11:30 -0400
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? Phil Hobbs <pcdhSpamMeSenseless@electrooptical.net> - 2013-09-09 09:56 -0400
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? Robert Wessel <robertwessel2@yahoo.com> - 2013-09-12 11:50 -0500
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? Phil Hobbs <pcdhSpamMeSenseless@electrooptical.net> - 2013-09-12 15:06 -0400
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? Piotr Wyderski <peter.pan@neverland.mil> - 2013-09-12 14:57 +0200
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2013-09-13 00:21 -0400
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? Piotr Wyderski <peter.pan@neverland.mil> - 2013-09-13 14:08 +0200
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? Tom Gardner <spamjunk@blueyonder.co.uk> - 2013-09-13 15:15 +0100
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2013-09-13 11:46 -0400
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? Piotr Wyderski <peter.pan@neverland.mil> - 2013-09-13 18:43 +0200
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? Piotr Wyderski <peter.pan@neverland.mil> - 2013-09-13 19:14 +0200
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2013-09-13 15:26 -0400
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2013-09-13 15:24 -0400
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? David Brown <david.brown@removethis.hesbynett.no> - 2013-09-13 20:22 +0200
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? Joerg <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2013-09-07 09:32 -0700
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2013-09-07 13:44 -0400
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? Joerg <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2013-09-07 12:46 -0700
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2013-09-07 13:33 -0700
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? Joerg <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2013-09-07 13:46 -0700
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2013-09-07 17:05 -0400
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? Joerg <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2013-09-07 15:23 -0700
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2013-09-07 19:02 -0400
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? Joerg <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2013-09-07 16:45 -0700
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2013-09-07 23:16 -0400
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? Joerg <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2013-09-08 08:05 -0700
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2013-09-08 14:27 -0400
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? Joerg <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2013-09-08 12:56 -0700
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2013-09-10 23:07 -0400
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? Tom Gardner <spamjunk@blueyonder.co.uk> - 2013-09-11 10:05 +0100
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? Joerg <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2013-09-11 07:49 -0700
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? Paul <paul@pcserviceselectronics.co.uk> - 2013-09-11 16:54 +0100
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? "Tim Williams" <tmoranwms@charter.net> - 2013-09-11 11:25 -0500
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? Joerg <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2013-09-11 09:49 -0700
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? krw@attt.bizz - 2013-09-08 11:40 -0400
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? krw@attt.bizz - 2013-09-08 11:38 -0400
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? Joerg <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2013-09-08 09:34 -0700
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2013-09-08 14:29 -0400
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? Joerg <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2013-09-08 13:01 -0700
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? krw@attt.bizz - 2013-09-08 16:22 -0400
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2013-09-10 23:09 -0400
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? krw@attt.bizz - 2013-09-08 16:15 -0400
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? Joerg <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2013-09-08 14:20 -0700
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? krw@attt.bizz - 2013-09-08 18:15 -0400
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? Joerg <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2013-09-08 15:57 -0700
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? krw@attt.bizz - 2013-09-08 19:46 -0400
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? Joerg <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2013-09-08 17:15 -0700
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? krw@attt.bizz - 2013-09-08 20:20 -0400
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? Joerg <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2013-09-09 07:17 -0700
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? Joerg <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2013-09-09 12:17 -0700
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? krw@attt.bizz - 2013-09-09 19:30 -0400
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? Joerg <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2013-09-09 16:38 -0700
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? krw@attt.bizz - 2013-09-10 14:02 -0400
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2013-09-10 23:41 -0400
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? krw@attt.bizz - 2013-09-11 00:04 -0400
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? Joerg <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2013-09-11 07:53 -0700
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? krw@attt.bizz - 2013-09-11 21:50 -0400
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? Joerg <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2013-09-12 09:58 -0700
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? krw@attt.bizz - 2013-09-12 18:54 -0400
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? Piotr Wyderski <peter.pan@neverland.mil> - 2013-09-12 16:17 +0200
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? Joerg <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2013-09-12 10:03 -0700
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? Piotr Wyderski <peter.pan@neverland.mil> - 2013-09-12 19:24 +0200
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? Tauno Voipio <tauno.voipio@notused.fi.invalid> - 2013-09-12 20:38 +0300
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? Joerg <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2013-09-12 11:23 -0700
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? Tauno Voipio <tauno.voipio@notused.fi.invalid> - 2013-09-12 22:36 +0300
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? Joerg <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2013-09-12 12:41 -0700
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? Tauno Voipio <tauno.voipio@notused.fi.invalid> - 2013-09-12 23:08 +0300
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? Joerg <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2013-09-12 11:19 -0700
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? krw@attt.bizz - 2013-09-12 18:59 -0400
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? Piotr Wyderski <peter.pan@neverland.mil> - 2013-09-13 13:00 +0200
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? Joerg <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2013-09-14 12:05 -0700
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2013-09-12 16:03 -0400
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? Joerg <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2013-09-12 14:42 -0700
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2013-09-13 00:24 -0400
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? Piotr Wyderski <peter.pan@neverland.mil> - 2013-09-13 14:27 +0200
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? Joerg <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2013-09-14 12:07 -0700
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2013-09-15 02:26 -0400
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? krw@attt.bizz - 2013-09-15 09:51 -0400
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? krw@attt.bizz - 2013-09-13 20:06 -0400
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2013-09-07 16:50 -0400
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2013-09-07 14:33 -0700
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2013-09-07 19:07 -0400
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2013-09-07 16:31 -0700
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2013-09-07 23:38 -0400
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2013-09-08 20:19 -0700
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2013-09-10 23:36 -0400
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? krw@attt.bizz - 2013-09-08 11:46 -0400
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? krw@attt.bizz - 2013-09-08 11:36 -0400
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? John Devereux <john@devereux.me.uk> - 2013-09-08 09:04 +0100
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2013-09-08 13:42 -0400
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? John Devereux <john@devereux.me.uk> - 2013-09-08 19:04 +0100
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2013-09-08 07:29 -0400
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? John Devereux <john@devereux.me.uk> - 2013-09-09 08:56 +0100
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2013-09-10 23:54 -0400
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? krw@attt.bizz - 2013-09-08 16:24 -0400
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? Ulf Samuelsson <ulf_samuelsson@invalid.telia.com> - 2013-09-07 20:11 +0200
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2013-09-07 15:06 -0400
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? Joerg <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2013-09-07 12:54 -0700
Re: AREF bypass capacitance on ATMega2560? Ulf Samuelsson <ulf_samuelsson@invalid.telia.com> - 2013-09-02 22:27 +0200
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