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Typical service life of residential and business PC?

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  Typical service life of residential and business PC? hancock4@bbs.cpcn.com - 2016-03-09 16:00 -0800
    Re: Typical service life of residential and business PC? "Osmium" <r124c4u102@comcast.net> - 2016-03-09 19:07 -0600
    Re: Typical service life of residential and business PC? "Sam Crean" <sg55443@gmail.com> - 2016-03-10 12:31 +1100
    Re: Typical service life of residential and business PC? Stephen Sprunk <stephen@sprunk.org> - 2016-03-09 21:38 -0600
      Re: Typical service life of residential and business PC? Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2016-03-10 04:13 +0000
    Re: Typical service life of residential and business PC? timcaffrey420@gmail.com - 2016-03-09 19:58 -0800
    Re: Typical service life of residential and business PC? Jon Elson <elson@pico-systems.com> - 2016-03-09 22:29 -0600
    Re: Typical service life of residential and business PC? Dave Garland <dave.garland@wizinfo.com> - 2016-03-09 22:30 -0600
      Re: Typical service life of residential and business PC? Mike Spencer <mds@bogus.nodomain.nowhere> - 2016-03-10 02:07 -0400
    Re: Typical service life of residential and business PC? Stan Barr <plan.b@bluesomatic.org> - 2016-03-10 08:20 +0000
      Re: Typical service life of residential and business PC? Morten Reistad <first@last.name.invalid> - 2016-03-10 14:31 +0100
    Re: Typical service life of residential and business PC? Bob Eager <news0006@eager.cx> - 2016-03-10 08:22 +0000
      Re: Typical service life of residential and business PC? Stan Barr <plan.b@bluesomatic.org> - 2016-03-10 17:02 +0000
        Re: Typical service life of residential and business PC? Walter Banks <walter@bytecraft.com> - 2016-03-10 14:10 -0500
        Re: Typical service life of residential and business PC? Lawrence Statton NK1G <lawrence@senguio.mx> - 2016-03-10 14:43 -0600
          Re: Typical service life of residential and business PC? Stan Barr <plan.b@bluesomatic.org> - 2016-03-11 08:14 +0000
    Re: Typical service life of residential and business PC? Stephen Wolstenholme <steve@easynn.com> - 2016-03-10 09:21 +0000
    Re: Typical service life of residential and business PC? Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> - 2016-03-10 10:22 +0000
      Re: Typical service life of residential and business PC? Morten Reistad <first@last.name.invalid> - 2016-03-10 15:19 +0100
    Re: Typical service life of residential and business PC? Morten Reistad <first@last.name.invalid> - 2016-03-10 11:02 +0100
      Re: Typical service life of residential and business PC? Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2016-03-10 06:30 -0700
    Re: Typical service life of residential and business PC? Joe Makowiec <makowiec@invalid.invalid> - 2016-03-10 14:47 +0000
    Re: Typical service life of residential and business PC? Mark Storkamp <mstorkamp@yahoo.com> - 2016-03-10 09:01 -0600
      Re: Typical service life of residential and business PC? Jon Elson <elson@pico-systems.com> - 2016-03-11 21:49 -0600
    Re: Typical service life of residential and business PC? Walter Banks <walter@bytecraft.com> - 2016-03-10 14:12 -0500
    Re: Typical service life of residential and business PC? Jan van den Broek <fortytwo@xs4all.nl> - 2016-05-02 09:51 +0100
    Re: Typical service life of residential and business PC? andrew@cucumber.demon.co.uk (Andrew Gabriel) - 2016-05-03 20:40 +0000
      Re: Typical service life of residential and business PC? Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2016-05-03 17:40 -0400
        Re: Typical service life of residential and business PC? Michael Black <et472@ncf.ca> - 2016-05-03 23:03 -0400
        Re: Typical service life of residential and business PC? scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2016-05-04 12:54 +0000
          Re: Typical service life of residential and business PC? Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2016-05-04 10:08 -0400
      Re: Typical service life of residential and business PC? pechter@pechter.net (William Pechter) - 2016-05-04 20:36 +0000
    Re: Typical service life of residential and business PC? jhhaynes@earthlink.net - 2016-05-03 19:53 -0700
      Re: Typical service life of residential and business PC? Jon Elson <jmelson@wustl.edu> - 2016-05-04 14:42 -0500
      Re: Typical service life of residential and business PC? "J. Clarke" <j.clarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2016-05-04 22:43 -0400
        Re: Typical service life of residential and business PC? Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2016-05-05 08:37 +0000
          Re: Typical service life of residential and business PC? Lawrence Statton NK1G <lawrence@senguio.mx> - 2016-05-05 13:26 -0500
            Re: Typical service life of residential and business PC? Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2016-05-05 20:13 +0000
            Re: Typical service life of residential and business PC? Morten Reistad <first@last.name.invalid> - 2016-05-06 14:09 +0200
              Re: Typical service life of residential and business PC? mausg@mail.com - 2016-05-06 19:42 +0000
                Re: Typical service life of residential and business PC? Morten Reistad <first@last.name.invalid> - 2016-05-07 02:42 +0200
          Re: Typical service life of residential and business PC? pechter@pechter.net (William Pechter) - 2016-05-09 22:53 +0000

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#160790

Morten Reistad <first@last.name.invalid> wrote:
> In article <b7e57958-7814-4742-affb-cdfd233ddda6@googlegroups.com>,
>  <hancock4@bbs.cpcn.com> wrote:
>> How long do people typically keep their personal PCs?  Do people 
>> replace it  because of obsolescence/lack of power, or because 
>> it is broken*?
>> 
>> Likewise for PCs used in business?  How long are they kept in service?
> 
> A little more than 3 years. It used to be shorter, but the 
> corporate leases had, and have, 3 years as the horizon. Now
> it is inching towards 4 years, very slowly. The return PCs are
> rarely used in business, they usually go to refurbishment and
> are sold cheaply or donated away.
> 
>> *Obviously, some computers break from accidents--they fall off a
>> table or something hits them.  Laptops can get lost or stolen.
>> But I'm not considering those.  I suspect most PCs are replaced
>> before they physically develop problems.
> 
> Private use is longer, but I doubt it is much beyond 5 on the
> average,
> 
> I have an average age of my computers of below 3 years, byt this
> is quite biased from new ARM boards for business/research.
> 


I'm trying to recall.  I have an XP box I'm trying to phase out that has to
be 14yo or more. My wife's laptop must be newer, that came with"vista".  My
stuff for work is newer, the laptop only (maybe) 2yo and a desktop a bit
older.  The still older stuff gets sent to the basement until I'm sure I'll
never need some h/w or s/w on them.

-- 
Pete

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#160799

On 09 Mar 2016 in alt.folklore.computers,  wrote:

> How long do people typically keep their personal PCs?  Do people 
> replace it  because of obsolescence/lack of power, or because 
> it is broken*?

My current laptop (a Lenovo T-series) is 4 years old; the previous one 
went for 10.  The desktop likewise is 4 years old; previous one went for 
8.  I'm using the lappy more like a desktop replacement of late.

All the desktops I've had - except the current one - have had hard drive 
space added at some point in their life cycle.  Many have had memory 
added.  In the last few years, I store more of my files on a file server, 
so hard drive space is less of an issue.

I've also gone through several boxen kept hidden in the basement.  They 
run some version of Linux headless and are used mainly as file servers.  
The current one is five years old and recently had two terabytes of HDD 
added.

-- 
Joe Makowiec
http://makowiec.org/
Email: http://makowiec.org/contact/?Joe
Usenet Improvement Project: http://twovoyagers.com/improve-usenet.org/

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#160800

In article <b7e57958-7814-4742-affb-cdfd233ddda6@googlegroups.com>,
 hancock4@bbs.cpcn.com wrote:

> How long do people typically keep their personal PCs?  Do people 
> replace it  because of obsolescence/lack of power, or because 
> it is broken*?
> 
> Likewise for PCs used in business?  How long are they kept in service?
> 
> 
> *Obviously, some computers break from accidents--they fall off a
> table or something hits them.  Laptops can get lost or stolen.
> But I'm not considering those.  I suspect most PCs are replaced
> before they physically develop problems.

Last fall we finally got rid of a large sign router that was powered by 
a PC running Windows 3.11. We still have a small VMC built in the 80's 
that runs on DOS. I'm typing this on a Mac Mini from '07.

We tend to keep things that still work and still make money. But I also 
have a PC less than a year old that can handle modern 3D solid CAD and 
CAM packages. I replaced my previous computer because it couldn't run 
modern software.

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#160887

Mark Storkamp wrote:


> Last fall we finally got rid of a large sign router that was powered by
> a PC running Windows 3.11. We still have a small VMC built in the 80's
> that runs on DOS. I'm typing this on a Mac Mini from '07.
In 1996 I built a laser photplotter for PCB artwork.  I used a retired 
computer from work, which them was my home desktop for a while, to run it.  
It has Windows 95, a 100 MHz Cyrix CPU, and ISA bus.  It still runs, 
although it has only been run a few hours a year since 1996 for running that 
one device.

I finally retired it and replaced it with a Beagle Bone (ARM CPU on a credit 
card-sized board.)  That was certainly my oldest PC-type computer, and I was 
afraid it was going to croak when I needed to run the photoplotter.

Jon

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#160815

On 09/03/2016 7:00 PM, hancock4@bbs.cpcn.com wrote:
> How long do people typically keep their personal PCs?  Do people
> replace it  because of obsolescence/lack of power, or because
> it is broken*?
>
> Likewise for PCs used in business?  How long are they kept in service?
>
>
> *Obviously, some computers break from accidents--they fall off a
> table or something hits them.  Laptops can get lost or stolen.
> But I'm not considering those.  I suspect most PCs are replaced
> before they physically develop problems.
>
I have what was a high end PC when I bought it in 1999 that I still use 
daily. It is a dual processor 1.2 or 1.4Ghz machine running W2000. It 
has two monitors on it that have both been replaced twice.  At some 
point I maxed out the RAM it will support and I replaced the hard drive 
a few years ago to get more space.

It is the only desktop I still use.

I typically replace laptops every 3 or 4 years. Tablets seem to 
majically no longer get used after a couple years. The only exception is 
a old ASUS memo pad that has a low resolution camera to complain about.

I am currently on a trip with two laptops and three tablets (two windows 
and the ASUS android). It is a crazy computing world we live in.

w..

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#163108

Wed, 9 Mar 2016 16:00:59 -0800 (PST)
hancock4@bbs.cpcn.com schrieb:
>How long do people typically keep their personal PCs?  Do people 
>replace it  because of obsolescence/lack of power, or because 
>it is broken*?

I'm not sure if I'm  typical, but I'm reading this on a Compaq Prolinea 466
('96), next to it is a Philips PCD 315 ('96, 386sx)

>Likewise for PCs used in business?  How long are they kept in service?

At a PPOE, around 2005, a IBM 5150 was still used at the service-department.
They had to support and repair old serial devices, more modern PC's had
timing issues.

-- 
Jan van den Broek                           balglaas@xs4all.nl

I have a great .sig, but it won't fit at the end of this post.
                                         -Fermat

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#163157

In article <b7e57958-7814-4742-affb-cdfd233ddda6@googlegroups.com>,
	hancock4@bbs.cpcn.com writes:
> How long do people typically keep their personal PCs?  Do people 
> replace it  because of obsolescence/lack of power, or because 
> it is broken*?

Personally, as my main workhorse...
486DX2/66, 1990-1997 (and came out of retirement in 2000 as a firewall).
Pentium 120MHz, 1997-2004.
Pentium 120MHz fileserver and Athlon64 desktop 2004-2007.
Dual core Athlon64 2007-now. (over 9 years - replacement would pay
for itself in enhanced power management features in a few years)

Other people I end up helping out tend to use systems for a few years,
the last of which they'll be struggling with poor performance, lack
of disk space, etc, due to loading to much rubbish on to the system,
and having no idea how to sort it out (Windows).
Easiest way for them is to go and buy a new system at that point.

> Likewise for PCs used in business?  How long are they kept in service?

I would say 5 years is typical IME, both for desktops and servers.

-- 
Andrew Gabriel
[email address is not usable -- followup in the newsgroup]

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#163161

Andrew Gabriel <andrew@cucumber.demon.co.uk> wrote:
> In article <b7e57958-7814-4742-affb-cdfd233ddda6@googlegroups.com>,
> 	hancock4@bbs.cpcn.com writes:
>> How long do people typically keep their personal PCs?  Do people 
>> replace it  because of obsolescence/lack of power, or because 
>> it is broken*?
> 
> Personally, as my main workhorse...
> 486DX2/66, 1990-1997 (and came out of retirement in 2000 as a firewall).
> Pentium 120MHz, 1997-2004.
> Pentium 120MHz fileserver and Athlon64 desktop 2004-2007.
> Dual core Athlon64 2007-now. (over 9 years - replacement would pay
> for itself in enhanced power management features in a few years)

You beat me, I think my old Dell is around 15 - some type of pentium.  It's
starting to drag a bit, and XP is going away (no longer supported by M$,
Firefox, or Chrome).  Since I have a couple of newer systems I'm trying to
move off the old one and scrap it.  It has a floppy disk drive, and right
now I'm working on looking through all my old floppies and seeing if
there's anything I need to keep.

> 
> Other people I end up helping out tend to use systems for a few years,
> the last of which they'll be struggling with poor performance, lack
> of disk space, etc, due to loading to much rubbish on to the system,
> and having no idea how to sort it out (Windows).
> Easiest way for them is to go and buy a new system at that point.

I decided some time ago that it isn't worth trying to upgrade an old
system.  Adding a bigger or faster disk, for example, won't make up for a
slow old CPU, lack of USB ports, limited memory, etc.  It's better, and
usually cheaper, just to buy new.

> 
>> Likewise for PCs used in business?  How long are they kept in service?
> 
> I would say 5 years is typical IME, both for desktops and servers.
> 



-- 
Pete

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#163175

On Tue, 3 May 2016, Peter Flass wrote:

> Andrew Gabriel <andrew@cucumber.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>> In article <b7e57958-7814-4742-affb-cdfd233ddda6@googlegroups.com>,
>> 	hancock4@bbs.cpcn.com writes:
>>> How long do people typically keep their personal PCs?  Do people
>>> replace it  because of obsolescence/lack of power, or because
>>> it is broken*?
>>
>> Personally, as my main workhorse...
>> 486DX2/66, 1990-1997 (and came out of retirement in 2000 as a firewall).
>> Pentium 120MHz, 1997-2004.
>> Pentium 120MHz fileserver and Athlon64 desktop 2004-2007.
>> Dual core Athlon64 2007-now. (over 9 years - replacement would pay
>> for itself in enhanced power management features in a few years)
>
> You beat me, I think my old Dell is around 15 - some type of pentium.  It's
> starting to drag a bit, and XP is going away (no longer supported by M$,
> Firefox, or Chrome).  Since I have a couple of newer systems I'm trying to
> move off the old one and scrap it.  It has a floppy disk drive, and right
> now I'm working on looking through all my old floppies and seeing if
> there's anything I need to keep.
>
>>
>> Other people I end up helping out tend to use systems for a few years,
>> the last of which they'll be struggling with poor performance, lack
>> of disk space, etc, due to loading to much rubbish on to the system,
>> and having no idea how to sort it out (Windows).
>> Easiest way for them is to go and buy a new system at that point.
>
> I decided some time ago that it isn't worth trying to upgrade an old
> system.  Adding a bigger or faster disk, for example, won't make up for a
> slow old CPU, lack of USB ports, limited memory, etc.  It's better, and
> usually cheaper, just to buy new.
>
For a long time, I was just dragging home fairly trailing edge computers, 
so all the computer books I found at used book sales either were "current" 
or in anticipation of me finding a more advanced old computer.

But then I jumped a bit, in 2001, and ever since I've tended to toss the 
oldest when something "new" comes in, well I mean generic IBM PC type 
computer.  The classic stuff, my KIM-1 and OSI SUperboard and some Radio 
Shack computers, they'll not be tossed, they are different enough to 
warrant keeping.

But I just got my first dual-core computer last month (though that 200MHz 
Pentium I got in mid-2001 to run Linux had a socket for a second CPU), in 
the form of two ten year old laptops.  Fairly decent specs, and small.

But I've been planning to splurge on something "better" for a couple of 
years, undecided about what refurbished computer to get.  A workstation 
would be nice, but the ones I've seen use old CPUs that are current hogs, 
a bit much for me, even though the price is right and lots of ram. But 
thinking of getting something better, that will clear out some junk. 
Anyway, I think there's a balance point.  I have spare SATA drives, but 
nothing to run them on yet.  But while it's tempting to stop fussing and 
just buy at Best Buy or something, that means less space for expansion, 
and maybe no more serial and parallel ports built in.  So refurbished or 
used means getting something decent but old enough that it includes such 
features.  I'd rather like a computer with PS/2 ports, since I have a 
trackball that only does PS/2.

   Michael

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#163189

Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> writes:
>Andrew Gabriel <andrew@cucumber.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>> In article <b7e57958-7814-4742-affb-cdfd233ddda6@googlegroups.com>,
>> 	hancock4@bbs.cpcn.com writes:
>>> How long do people typically keep their personal PCs?  Do people 
>>> replace it  because of obsolescence/lack of power, or because 
>>> it is broken*?
>> 
>> Personally, as my main workhorse...
>> 486DX2/66, 1990-1997 (and came out of retirement in 2000 as a firewall).
>> Pentium 120MHz, 1997-2004.
>> Pentium 120MHz fileserver and Athlon64 desktop 2004-2007.
>> Dual core Athlon64 2007-now. (over 9 years - replacement would pay
>> for itself in enhanced power management features in a few years)
>
>You beat me, I think my old Dell is around 15 - some type of pentium.  It's
>starting to drag a bit, and XP is going away (no longer supported by M$,
>Firefox, or Chrome).  Since I have a couple of newer systems I'm trying to
>move off the old one and scrap it.  It has a floppy disk drive, and right
>now I'm working on looking through all my old floppies and seeing if
>there's anything I need to keep.

There are usb floppy drives available.

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#163204

Scott Lurndal <scott@slp53.sl.home> wrote:
> Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> writes:
>> Andrew Gabriel <andrew@cucumber.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>>> In article <b7e57958-7814-4742-affb-cdfd233ddda6@googlegroups.com>,
>>> hancock4@bbs.cpcn.com writes:
>>>> How long do people typically keep their personal PCs?  Do people 
>>>> replace it  because of obsolescence/lack of power, or because 
>>>> it is broken*?
>>> 
>>> Personally, as my main workhorse...
>>> 486DX2/66, 1990-1997 (and came out of retirement in 2000 as a firewall).
>>> Pentium 120MHz, 1997-2004.
>>> Pentium 120MHz fileserver and Athlon64 desktop 2004-2007.
>>> Dual core Athlon64 2007-now. (over 9 years - replacement would pay
>>> for itself in enhanced power management features in a few years)
>> 
>> You beat me, I think my old Dell is around 15 - some type of pentium.  It's
>> starting to drag a bit, and XP is going away (no longer supported by M$,
>> Firefox, or Chrome).  Since I have a couple of newer systems I'm trying to
>> move off the old one and scrap it.  It has a floppy disk drive, and right
>> now I'm working on looking through all my old floppies and seeing if
>> there's anything I need to keep.
> 
> There are usb floppy drives available.
> 
> 

I thought of this as a last resort, but I'd rather clean out and get the
stuff I still want on CD or DVD.  I just tossed a grocery bag full of
floppies.

-- 
Pete

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#163244

In article <ngb2bf$u2p$1@dont-email.me>,
Andrew Gabriel <andrew@cucumber.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>In article <b7e57958-7814-4742-affb-cdfd233ddda6@googlegroups.com>,
>	hancock4@bbs.cpcn.com writes:
>> How long do people typically keep their personal PCs?  Do people 
>> replace it  because of obsolescence/lack of power, or because 
>> it is broken*?
>
>Personally, as my main workhorse...
<snip>
>
>> Likewise for PCs used in business?  How long are they kept in service?
>
>I would say 5 years is typical IME, both for desktops and servers.
>
>-- 
>Andrew Gabriel
>[email address is not usable -- followup in the newsgroup]

Actually, my last job had a 3 year limit for critical machines.
As soon as it's off warranty they move to newer supported hardware for
critical stuff.  They felt it was cheaper than service contracts and
since they could get more stuff on fewer boxes due to faster CPU and
cheaper Memory -- they just migrated the VMware ESXi VM's and swapped out 
the production stuff.

Old production went to development/test...

Old development/test became scrap pile in corner and dumped.

Now here at home I'm running 7-10 year old Core2 duo laptops ($35.00 ebay) 
which with memory and SSD upgrades cost less than $100. (The thinkpad parts
to keep them running, swap disks, replace CD drives run less than $5-25 so
they last a long long time).  I'd kill for the ability to put more memory
in them (they've got 2x2gb on most.  I bought 2x4's on one box but
the memory is cost prohibitive.)

Unfortunately, the rarer the memory is the more expensive and 
2x4gb PC DDR2 PC2-5300 or PC2-6400 laptop memory is expensive.

Lenovo used to only support 2x2gb as max memory but the later bios lets
them go to 2x4gb... which is quite useable.  SSD boxes with 4gb boot to login
in under 5 seconds.

They'll run VM's, *BSD, *Linux as well as Dos, Win3.1, etc and even
some SCO and Solaris in a pinch...  Thinkpads are very well supported.

For heavier use I've got 2 Lenovo Xeon boxes (one single 6 core, one dual)
which will run just about anything.  Both have 24gb of memory.

Bill

-- 
-- 
Digital had it then.  Don't you wish you could buy it now!
pechter-at-gmail.com  http://xkcd.com/705/

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#163174

The last several computers I have bought came through ebay.com and were fairly
up-to-date machines at the time.  Hence had been dumped by the former owners
for some reason.  I steered a friend last fall to buy such a machine - he paid
about $80 for a 64 bit machine with Windows 7 and ample for his purpose disk
space.  Just for the bare machine; he reused his previous monitor and keyboard
and mouse.  And then he did the free Windows 10 upgrade.  My own machines
mostly run Linux, but I need to keep Windows around for a few things, so
my last two are Win 7 and upgraded to Win 10.

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#163231

jhhaynes@earthlink.net wrote:

> The last several computers I have bought came through ebay.com and were
> fairly
> up-to-date machines at the time.  Hence had been dumped by the former
> owners
> for some reason.  I steered a friend last fall to buy such a machine - he
> paid about $80 for a 64 bit machine with Windows 7 and ample for his
> purpose disk
> space.  Just for the bare machine; he reused his previous monitor and
> keyboard
> and mouse.  And then he did the free Windows 10 upgrade.  My own machines
> mostly run Linux, but I need to keep Windows around for a few things, so
> my last two are Win 7 and upgraded to Win 10.
Yup, I have bought a bunch of used desktop and a few laptop machines on 
eBay.  I prefer Dell, maybe just because I mostly know their models.  I 
usually get them with no disk drive, they sell for less without the drive, 
OS, etc.  Then, I put in a new eBay drive.  That's the one thing I don't 
really care for, used, would be the hard drive.  For my main machines (1 
desktop and one laptop) I use an SSD for the performance.

I have had EXCELLENT results with the Dell Optiplex line (their commercial 
rather than consumer grade line.)  My last desktop was an eBay special and 
ran continuously for 12 years before I decided to retire it mostly just due 
to fear it would die without warning.  It is STILL running at my mother in 
law's house.

Jon

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#163249

In article <3a377291-53ad-4ea1-a8d1-3260e3e114d2@googlegroups.com>, 
jhhaynes@earthlink.net says...
> 
> The last several computers I have bought came through ebay.com and were fairly
> up-to-date machines at the time.  Hence had been dumped by the former owners
> for some reason.

Probably off-lease corporate machines.  My employer swaps our computers 
out every three years or so whether they need it or not.

> I steered a friend last fall to buy such a machine - he paid
> about $80 for a 64 bit machine with Windows 7 and ample for his purpose disk
> space.  Just for the bare machine; he reused his previous monitor and keyboard
> and mouse.  And then he did the free Windows 10 upgrade.  My own machines
> mostly run Linux, but I need to keep Windows around for a few things, so
> my last two are Win 7 and upgraded to Win 10.

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#163257

On 2016-05-05, J. Clarke <j.clarke.873638@gmail.com> wrote:

> In article <3a377291-53ad-4ea1-a8d1-3260e3e114d2@googlegroups.com>, 
> jhhaynes@earthlink.net says...
> 
>> The last several computers I have bought came through ebay.com and were
>> fairly up-to-date machines at the time.  Hence had been dumped by the
>> former owners for some reason.
>
> Probably off-lease corporate machines.  My employer swaps our computers 
> out every three years or so whether they need it or not.

A local chain sells refurbished Lenovo laptops.  Not only are they cheap,
they have professional-grade keyboards rather than the cheap junk that
is pushed on you everywhere else.

-- 
/~\  cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid (Charlie Gibbs)
\ /  I'm really at ac.dekanfrus if you read it the right way.
 X   Top-posted messages will probably be ignored.  See RFC1855.
/ \  HTML will DEFINITELY be ignored.  Join the ASCII ribbon campaign!

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#163276

Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> writes:
> A local chain sells refurbished Lenovo laptops.  Not only are they cheap,
> they have professional-grade keyboards rather than the cheap junk that
> is pushed on you everywhere else.

The problem is -- the newer Lenovo gear is getting chintzier ... I
bought a half-dozen T400s a couple of years ago (I'm really hard on
hardware -- I travel a LOT, and I travel to inhospitable places) so I'd
have a supply for the next few years.

In terms of performance -- outside of the occasional runaway memory leak
on some video plugin for web stuff, I could not imagine needing more CPU
zorch.  (Of course, one of the prime consumers of CPU cycles is gaming,
which I steadfastly avoid).

--NK1G

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#163287

On 2016-05-05, Lawrence Statton NK1G <lawrence@senguio.mx> wrote:

> Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> writes:
>
>> A local chain sells refurbished Lenovo laptops.  Not only are they cheap,
>> they have professional-grade keyboards rather than the cheap junk that
>> is pushed on you everywhere else.
>
> The problem is -- the newer Lenovo gear is getting chintzier ... I
> bought a half-dozen T400s a couple of years ago (I'm really hard on
> hardware -- I travel a LOT, and I travel to inhospitable places) so I'd
> have a supply for the next few years.

Yes, I'm typing this on a T410 which replaces an earlier Lenovo, one of
whose hinges broke - on the outbound flight on a month-long vacation.
(I kept it going, though.  It still works, but it's in the closet now.)

> In terms of performance -- outside of the occasional runaway memory leak
> on some video plugin for web stuff, I could not imagine needing more CPU
> zorch.

Yes, this one's X server occasionally locks up too.  Enough remains alive
that I can ssh into it and do an orderly reboot, but it's a bit of a pain.

> (Of course, one of the prime consumers of CPU cycles is gaming,
> which I steadfastly avoid).

I normally avoid games too, but I did get hooked on Portal a while ago
thanks to Jamie Zawinski - the description of the xscreensaver hack
"CompanionCube" pointed me to a wiki article that led me down the dark
path.  The T410 has just enough power to run Portal 2 if I need a fix
away from home.

-- 
/~\  cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid (Charlie Gibbs)
\ /  I'm really at ac.dekanfrus if you read it the right way.
 X   Top-posted messages will probably be ignored.  See RFC1855.
/ \  HTML will DEFINITELY be ignored.  Join the ASCII ribbon campaign!

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#163314

In article <871t5guzss.fsf@senguio.mx>,
Lawrence Statton NK1G  <lawrence@senguio.mx> wrote:
>Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> writes:
>> A local chain sells refurbished Lenovo laptops.  Not only are they cheap,
>> they have professional-grade keyboards rather than the cheap junk that
>> is pushed on you everywhere else.
>
>The problem is -- the newer Lenovo gear is getting chintzier ... I
>bought a half-dozen T400s a couple of years ago (I'm really hard on
>hardware -- I travel a LOT, and I travel to inhospitable places) so I'd
>have a supply for the next few years.
>
>In terms of performance -- outside of the occasional runaway memory leak
>on some video plugin for web stuff, I could not imagine needing more CPU
>zorch.  (Of course, one of the prime consumers of CPU cycles is gaming,
>which I steadfastly avoid).

If you need them for linux while travelling I can recommend the Samsung
Chromebooks with ARM processors highly. They use a LOT less power, and even
the cheap ones are pretty solidly built. I have used one on my 3 days/week
commute for 3 years now before wearing it down, losing two keys in a fall
from 2 meters; but otherwise fully functional.

You get chromeOS by default, and if you install an SD card you can install
a second set of user space stuff on it. Backups means cloning the SD card, 
and the clone (or original) drops right in to another one. OK; you have to
settle for 16/32 G SSD and ..128G for the SD card, but it is exactly what
I need for travelling.

The normal Linux apps take around 38% as much space on disk, and around 45%
as much in memory, as a standard x86. Tested this extensively with an identical
user space buiild (ubuntu 14.10) on an Acer i5.

You get them with 2 and 4 processors, and 2 to 8 G ram, 16 or 32G ssd, and
a small set of IO ports. 

The 4 processor ones show 1024x768 youtube videos without a glitch. The 2
processor ones show SD similarly.

The CPU speeds are up to 2 GHz, and the processing power is about 10% weaker 
than an intel i5 Mhz for Mhz. Tested this extensively. Power consumption on
the faster cpu speeds are around 12-15% of what the i5 uses, and the standby
is around 40% of the i5; dominated by the illumination of the screen.

They all have around 9 hours of actual work time on the batteries, and around
4 days of standby time (with remote ssh active, and wake-on-lan on), but the
lid shut.

-- mrr

Not your typical pc. But there are VERY few virii for arm-based linux that
is not android.

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#163320

On 2016-05-06, Morten Reistad <first@last.name.invalid> wrote:
> In article <871t5guzss.fsf@senguio.mx>,
> Lawrence Statton NK1G  <lawrence@senguio.mx> wrote:
>>Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> writes:
>>> A local chain sells refurbished Lenovo laptops.  Not only are they cheap,
>>> they have professional-grade keyboards rather than the cheap junk that
>>> is pushed on you everywhere else.
>>
>>The problem is -- the newer Lenovo gear is getting chintzier ... I
>>bought a half-dozen T400s a couple of years ago (I'm really hard on
>>hardware -- I travel a LOT, and I travel to inhospitable places) so I'd
>>have a supply for the next few years.
>>
>>In terms of performance -- outside of the occasional runaway memory leak
>>on some video plugin for web stuff, I could not imagine needing more CPU
>>zorch.  (Of course, one of the prime consumers of CPU cycles is gaming,
>>which I steadfastly avoid).
>
> If you need them for linux while travelling I can recommend the Samsung
> Chromebooks with ARM processors highly. They use a LOT less power, and even
> the cheap ones are pretty solidly built. I have used one on my 3 days/week
> commute for 3 years now before wearing it down, losing two keys in a fall
> from 2 meters; but otherwise fully functional.
>
> You get chromeOS by default, and if you install an SD card you can install
> a second set of user space stuff on it. Backups means cloning the SD card, 
> and the clone (or original) drops right in to another one. OK; you have to
> settle for 16/32 G SSD and ..128G for the SD card, but it is exactly what
> I need for travelling.
>
> The normal Linux apps take around 38% as much space on disk, and around 45%
> as much in memory, as a standard x86. Tested this extensively with an identical
> user space buiild (ubuntu 14.10) on an Acer i5.
>
> You get them with 2 and 4 processors, and 2 to 8 G ram, 16 or 32G ssd, and
> a small set of IO ports. 
>
> The 4 processor ones show 1024x768 youtube videos without a glitch. The 2
> processor ones show SD similarly.
>
> The CPU speeds are up to 2 GHz, and the processing power is about 10% weaker 
> than an intel i5 Mhz for Mhz. Tested this extensively. Power consumption on
> the faster cpu speeds are around 12-15% of what the i5 uses, and the standby
> is around 40% of the i5; dominated by the illumination of the screen.
>
> They all have around 9 hours of actual work time on the batteries, and around
> 4 days of standby time (with remote ssh active, and wake-on-lan on), but the
> lid shut.
>
> -- mrr
>
> Not your typical pc. But there are VERY few virii for arm-based linux that
> is not android.

I hate Chromos. Dunno why, but I gave it to my sister, her to her son,
and so it went.

-- 
greymaus

iD|marrA Raa|fLa 
Ireland

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