Groups | Search | Server Info | Keyboard shortcuts | Login | Register [http] [https] [nntp] [nntps]

Groups > linux.debian.maint.python > #15538

Re: Suggesting change in DPT policy

Show key headers only | View raw

Hi Christian (2024.03.02_22:09:29_+0000)
> Some packages are complex, some packages have lots of reverse
> dependencies. Where these two circles overlap, a careless "drive-by"
> maintainer can do a lot of harm.

Maybe we should look at ways we can improve this situation, without
having to have packages under the team umbrella that aren't really team
maintained.

Now that we have Salsa with Merge Requests, it's hard for me to see much
benefit from having packages in the team with the weak team membership
(uploader).

As a team member all I can do to contribute to such packages is commit
to git. If I'm not sure my changes will be approved, I'd rather file a
merge request. At that point, it may as well not be a team package.
I filed merge requests to improve a weak team package, a couple of
months ago. They never got reviewed. Is this still a team package?
Yes I was able to do emergency uploads of it too, but I could also do
that via NMU.

> Things like "oh, documentation doesn't build anymore, I'll just disable
> it", rather than fixing it. Or "oh, these tests don't pass anymore, I'll
> just disable them", rather than looking into the regression. "Oh, my
> upload triggered a transition, I'm no longer interested in this".
> 
> (This are all things that have happened to me.)
> 
> All that stuff is then left for others to clean up. And if one is
> unlucky enough, this doesn't just cause work for the package, but for
> all reverse dependencies.

I don't think any of the things you describe there are acceptable for
team maintenance.

Disabling tests or docs may be necessary in the short term. Or if they
will never be able to work again. But I don't think those are OK to do,
upload and walk away.

If the tests are broken and you can't figure it out, you talk to the
people who know the package better.

We could spell these things out more clearly in the team rules.
We can also push back on team members who behave like this. Repeatedly
doing the things you describe, when asked not to, should lead to being
kicked out of the team.

Picking up a bug and realising you are in over year head is something
that will happen to new contributors to Debian. Having a team there to
help out when someone does make a mess like that is useful.

A few lines in a README.source about what makes a package complex is
probably also useful to your collaborators (although, yes, of course
writing this is work).

> I see Uploaders as a signal of "these are the regular maintainers, I
> should check with these people before doing any *major* changes". And I
> argue that this is reasonable.

I'd say it's best practice to do that whenever a package has people who
seem to be caring about it.

That's not the case for many packages in the team. Even ones listed with
the team in Uploaders and a human as Maintainer.

Stefano

-- 
Stefano Rivera
  http://tumbleweed.org.za/
  +1 415 683 3272

Back to linux.debian.maint.python | Previous | Next — Previous in thread | Next in thread | Find similar | Unroll thread

Thread

Suggesting change in DPT policy Andreas Tille <andreas@an3as.eu> - 2024-02-27 09:10 +0100
  Re: Suggesting change in DPT policy Scott Talbert <swt@techie.net> - 2024-02-27 15:30 +0100
    Re: Suggesting change in DPT policy Scott Kitterman <debian@kitterman.com> - 2024-02-27 19:40 +0100
      Re: Suggesting change in DPT policy Scott Kitterman <debian@kitterman.com> - 2024-02-28 01:00 +0100
        Re: Suggesting change in DPT policy Andreas Tille <andreas@an3as.eu> - 2024-02-28 08:10 +0100
          Re: Suggesting change in DPT policy Scott Kitterman <debian@kitterman.com> - 2024-02-28 12:50 +0100
            Re: Suggesting change in DPT policy Andreas Tille <andreas@an3as.eu> - 2024-02-28 15:40 +0100
        Re: Suggesting change in DPT policy Scott Kitterman <debian@kitterman.com> - 2024-02-28 13:00 +0100
      Re: Suggesting change in DPT policy Jeroen Ploemen <jcfp@debian.org> - 2024-02-29 20:50 +0100
        Re: Suggesting change in DPT policy Julian Gilbey <julian@d-and-j.net> - 2024-03-01 08:30 +0100
          Re: Suggesting change in DPT policy Jeroen Ploemen <jcfp@debian.org> - 2024-03-01 13:10 +0100
            Re: Suggesting change in DPT policy Andreas Tille <tille@debian.org> - 2024-03-02 21:40 +0100
              Re: Suggesting change in DPT policy Scott Kitterman <debian@kitterman.com> - 2024-03-02 22:20 +0100
                Re: Suggesting change in DPT policy Andreas Tille <andreas@an3as.eu> - 2024-03-02 23:20 +0100
                Re: Suggesting change in DPT policy Andreas Tille <andreas@an3as.eu> - 2024-03-03 07:20 +0100
                Re: Suggesting change in DPT policy Scott Kitterman <debian@kitterman.com> - 2024-03-03 18:20 +0100
  +1 (Re: Suggesting change in DPT policy) Jochen Sprickerhof <jspricke@debian.org> - 2024-02-27 15:40 +0100
  Re: Suggesting change in DPT policy Timo Röhling <roehling@debian.org> - 2024-02-27 16:10 +0100
    Re: Suggesting change in DPT policy Andreas Tille <andreas@an3as.eu> - 2024-02-28 08:20 +0100
      Re: Suggesting change in DPT policy Étienne Mollier <emollier@debian.org> - 2024-02-28 09:40 +0100
        Maintaining packages with complex relationships (Was: Suggesting  change in DPT policy) Andreas Tille <andreas@an3as.eu> - 2024-02-28 12:00 +0100
          Re: Maintaining packages with complex relationships (Was: Suggesting  change in DPT policy) Timo Röhling <roehling@debian.org> - 2024-02-28 16:50 +0100
  Re: Suggesting change in DPT policy Martin <debacle@debian.org> - 2024-02-27 16:40 +0100
  Re: Suggesting change in DPT policy weepingclown <weepingclown@disroot.org> - 2024-02-27 17:30 +0100
    Re: Suggesting change in DPT policy Andreas Tille <andreas@an3as.eu> - 2024-02-28 09:10 +0100
  Re: Suggesting change in DPT policy Arto Jantunen <viiru@debian.org> - 2024-02-27 21:30 +0100
  Re: Suggesting change in DPT policy Louis-Philippe Véronneau <pollo@debian.org> - 2024-02-27 21:40 +0100
    Re: Suggesting change in DPT policy Andreas Tille <andreas@an3as.eu> - 2024-02-28 09:30 +0100
      Re: Suggesting change in DPT policy Scott Kitterman <debian@kitterman.com> - 2024-02-28 15:30 +0100
        Re: Suggesting change in DPT policy Andreas Tille <andreas@an3as.eu> - 2024-02-28 15:50 +0100
  Re: Suggesting change in DPT policy Stefano Rivera <stefanor@debian.org> - 2024-02-28 03:00 +0100
  Re: Suggesting change in DPT policy Agathe Porte <gagath@debian.org> - 2024-02-28 10:30 +0100
  Re: Suggesting change in DPT policy Julian Gilbey <julian@d-and-j.net> - 2024-02-28 11:50 +0100
  Re: Suggesting change in DPT policy Salvo Tomaselli <tiposchi@tiscali.it> - 2024-03-01 01:20 +0100
  Re: Suggesting change in DPT policy Stefano Rivera <stefanor@debian.org> - 2024-03-03 00:10 +0100
  Re: Suggesting change in DPT policy Emmanuel Arias <eamanu@yaerobi.com> - 2024-03-03 00:40 +0100
    Re: Suggesting change in DPT policy Alexandre Detiste <alexandre.detiste@gmail.com> - 2024-03-03 16:20 +0100
  Re: Suggesting change in DPT Policy Nilesh Patra <nilesh@debian.org> - 2024-03-09 18:00 +0100
    Re: Suggesting change in DPT Policy Anton Gladky <gladk@debian.org> - 2024-03-09 18:50 +0100
      Re: Suggesting change in DPT Policy Julian Gilbey <julian@d-and-j.net> - 2024-03-09 22:30 +0100
        Re: Suggesting change in DPT Policy Andreas Tille <andreas@an3as.eu> - 2024-03-19 08:40 +0100

csiph-web