Re: Reference

Path	csiph.com!newsfeed.hal-mli.net!feeder3.hal-mli.net!newsfeed.hal-mli.net!feeder1.hal-mli.net!newsfeed.xs4all.nl!newsfeed3.news.xs4all.nl!xs4all!newsgate.cistron.nl!newsgate.news.xs4all.nl!post.news.xs4all.nl!not-for-mail
Return-Path	<python-python-list@m.gmane.org>
X-Original-To	python-list@python.org
Delivered-To	python-list@mail.python.org
X-Spam-Status	OK 0.011
X-Spam-Evidence	'H': 0.98; 'S': 0.00; 'python,': 0.02; 'discard': 0.07; 'abstraction': 0.09; 'received:80.91': 0.09; 'received:80.91.229': 0.09; 'received:gmane.org': 0.09; 'received:list': 0.09; '\xe2\x80\x94': 0.09; 'conveys': 0.16; 'finney': 0.16; 'justified': 0.16; 'opposite': 0.16; 'received:80.91.229.3': 0.16; 'received:plane.gmane.org': 0.16; 'statement.': 0.16; "skip:' 30": 0.19; 'saying': 0.22; 'header :User-Agent:1': 0.23; 'case.': 0.24; "haven't": 0.24; 'header:X -Complaints-To:1': 0.27; 'correct': 0.29; 'statement': 0.30; 'writes:': 0.31; 'supposed': 0.32; 'another': 0.32; 'something': 0.35; 'but': 0.35; '8bit%:17': 0.36; 'false': 0.36; 'received:com.au': 0.36; 'useful': 0.36; 'should': 0.36; 'ben': 0.38; 'whatever': 0.38; 'to:addr:python-list': 0.38; 'rather': 0.38; 'to:addr:python.org': 0.39; 'either': 0.39; 'received:org': 0.40; 'how': 0.40; 'simple': 0.61; 'name': 0.63; 'more': 0.64; 'different': 0.65; 'skip:\xe2 10': 0.65; 'truth': 0.81; 'now)': 0.84; 'received:125': 0.84; 'why?': 0.91; '\xe2\x80\x9cthe': 0.91
X-Injected-Via-Gmane	http://gmane.org/
To	python-list@python.org
From	Ben Finney <ben+python@benfinney.id.au>
Subject	Re: Reference
Date	Wed, 05 Mar 2014 17:40:40 +1100
References	<53144e8d$0$2149$426a74cc@news.free.fr> <1d1dfa1b-b715-4d8f-9c12-f0d3dc1a22c9@googlegroups.com> <85ppm3httu.fsf@benfinney.id.au> <lf2sjk$7d4$1@ger.gmane.org> <20140303155112.46e34ff8@bigbox.christie.dr> <mailman.7666.1393884138.18130.python-list@python.org> <87siqy7whs.fsf@elektro.pacujo.net> <53155c15$0$2923$c3e8da3$76491128@news.astraweb.com> <mailman.7693.1393910647.18130.python-list@python.org> <op.xb75g7ap5079vu@gnudebeest> <roy-A9E76C.21091704032014@news.panix.com> <164d209c-ba5e-449f-bc25-c27ebfb1fc0f@googlegroups.com> <8761ntp3ja.fsf@elektro.pacujo.net> <89e7d1ac-af88-4781-b23d-b64e571e811b@googlegroups.com>
Mime-Version	1.0
Content-Type	text/plain; charset=utf-8
Content-Transfer-Encoding	8bit
X-Gmane-NNTP-Posting-Host	vmx15867.hosting24.com.au
X-Public-Key-ID	0xBD41714B
X-Public-Key-Fingerprint	9CFE 12B0 791A 4267 887F 520C B7AC 2E51 BD41 714B
X-Public-Key-URL	http://www.benfinney.id.au/contact/bfinney-gpg.asc
X-Post-From	Ben Finney <bignose+hates-spam@benfinney.id.au>
User-Agent	Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/23.4 (gnu/linux)
Cancel-Lock	sha1:snLEKX3koTO8Bos4bFk42OM7wjo=
X-BeenThere	python-list@python.org
X-Mailman-Version	2.1.15
Precedence	list
List-Id	General discussion list for the Python programming language <python-list.python.org>
List-Unsubscribe	<https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-list>, <mailto:python-list-request@python.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive	<http://mail.python.org/pipermail/python-list/>
List-Post	<mailto:python-list@python.org>
List-Help	<mailto:python-list-request@python.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe	<https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list>, <mailto:python-list-request@python.org?subject=subscribe>
Newsgroups	comp.lang.python
Message-ID	<mailman.7797.1394001653.18130.python-list@python.org> (permalink)
Lines	23
NNTP-Posting-Host	2001:888:2000:d::a6
X-Trace	1394001653 news.xs4all.nl 2829 [2001:888:2000:d::a6]:33137
X-Complaints-To	abuse@xs4all.nl
Xref	csiph.com comp.lang.python:67817

Show key headers only | View raw

Rustom Mody <rustompmody@gmail.com> writes:

> All I am saying is that 'is' should have (be!) a name that is not
> philosophically grandiloquent bullshit but rather a name that more
> accurately conveys 'machine-representation-equivalence'

You haven't made either case.

How is the simple abstraction of object identity characterised as
“philosophically grandiloquent bullshit”?

Why should we discard the useful abstraction of object identity as it
currently is in Python, for some different concept that you prefer
(“machine representation equivalence”, whatever that's supposed to be —
I don't care right now, only that you want something different from what
is now) and have not justified why?

-- 
 \      “The opposite of a correct statement is a false statement. But |
  `\     the opposite of a profound truth may well be another profound |
_o__)                                              truth.” —Niels Bohr |
Ben Finney

Thread

Reference "ast" <nomail@invalid.com> - 2014-03-03 10:42 +0100
  Object identity (was: Reference) Ben Finney <ben+python@benfinney.id.au> - 2014-03-03 21:00 +1100
    Re: Object identity (was: Reference) "ast" <nomail@invalid.com> - 2014-03-03 11:21 +0100
  Re: Reference "Mark H. Harris" <harrismh777@gmail.com> - 2014-03-03 05:09 -0800
  Re: Reference Grant Edwards <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2014-03-03 14:29 +0000
  Re: Reference Rustom Mody <rustompmody@gmail.com> - 2014-03-03 07:52 -0800
    Re: Reference Ben Finney <ben+python@benfinney.id.au> - 2014-03-04 08:10 +1100
    Re: Reference Tim Chase <python.list@tim.thechases.com> - 2014-03-03 15:24 -0600
    Re: Reference Ben Finney <ben+python@benfinney.id.au> - 2014-03-04 08:31 +1100
    Re: Reference Mark Lawrence <breamoreboy@yahoo.co.uk> - 2014-03-03 21:35 +0000
      Re: Reference Marko Rauhamaa <marko@pacujo.net> - 2014-03-04 00:07 +0200
        Re: Reference Ben Finney <ben+python@benfinney.id.au> - 2014-03-04 09:18 +1100
          Re: Reference Alister <alister.ware@ntlworld.com> - 2014-03-04 11:10 +0000
            Re: Reference Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> - 2014-03-04 11:48 +0000
              Re: Reference "Rhodri James" <rhodri@wildebst.org.uk> - 2014-03-05 00:25 +0000
    Re: Reference Tim Chase <python.list@tim.thechases.com> - 2014-03-03 15:51 -0600
    Re: Reference Jerry Hill <malaclypse2@gmail.com> - 2014-03-03 17:02 -0500
      Re: Reference Marko Rauhamaa <marko@pacujo.net> - 2014-03-04 00:22 +0200
        Re: Reference Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-03-04 09:27 +1100
        Re: Reference Ben Finney <ben+python@benfinney.id.au> - 2014-03-04 09:33 +1100
        Re: Reference Steven D'Aprano <steve@pearwood.info> - 2014-03-04 04:52 +0000
          Re: Reference Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-03-04 16:24 +1100
            Re: Reference "Rhodri James" <rhodri@wildebst.org.uk> - 2014-03-05 01:08 +0000
              Re: Reference Roy Smith <roy@panix.com> - 2014-03-04 21:09 -0500
                Re: Reference Rustom Mody <rustompmody@gmail.com> - 2014-03-04 19:36 -0800
                Re: Reference Ian Kelly <ian.g.kelly@gmail.com> - 2014-03-04 21:08 -0700
                Re: Reference Rustom Mody <rustompmody@gmail.com> - 2014-03-04 20:31 -0800
                Re: Reference Ben Finney <ben+python@benfinney.id.au> - 2014-03-05 15:32 +1100
                Re: Reference Rustom Mody <rustompmody@gmail.com> - 2014-03-04 20:47 -0800
                Re: Reference Steven D'Aprano <steve@pearwood.info> - 2014-03-05 05:06 +0000
                Re: Reference Rustom Mody <rustompmody@gmail.com> - 2014-03-04 21:47 -0800
                Re: Reference alex23 <wuwei23@gmail.com> - 2014-03-05 16:01 +1000
                Re: Reference Rustom Mody <rustompmody@gmail.com> - 2014-03-04 22:10 -0800
                Re: Reference Ben Finney <ben+python@benfinney.id.au> - 2014-03-05 17:22 +1100
                Re: Reference alex23 <wuwei23@gmail.com> - 2014-03-05 16:28 +1000
                Re: Reference Mark Lawrence <breamoreboy@yahoo.co.uk> - 2014-03-05 12:24 +0000
                Re: Reference Mark Lawrence <breamoreboy@yahoo.co.uk> - 2014-03-05 12:21 +0000
                Re: Reference Ben Finney <ben+python@benfinney.id.au> - 2014-03-05 17:20 +1100
                Re: Reference Rustom Mody <rustompmody@gmail.com> - 2014-03-05 09:40 -0800
                Re: Reference Tim Chase <python.list@tim.thechases.com> - 2014-03-05 12:12 -0600
                Re: Reference Ben Finney <ben+python@benfinney.id.au> - 2014-03-06 05:33 +1100
                Re: Reference Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> - 2014-03-05 18:19 +0000
                Re: Reference Marko Rauhamaa <marko@pacujo.net> - 2014-03-05 22:23 +0200
                Re: Reference Grant Edwards <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2014-03-05 20:31 +0000
                Re: Reference Marko Rauhamaa <marko@pacujo.net> - 2014-03-05 22:46 +0200
                Re: Reference Ben Finney <ben+python@benfinney.id.au> - 2014-03-06 08:07 +1100
                Re: Reference Ben Finney <ben+python@benfinney.id.au> - 2014-03-06 08:10 +1100
                Re: Reference Mark Lawrence <breamoreboy@yahoo.co.uk> - 2014-03-05 21:34 +0000
                Re: Reference Terry Reedy <tjreedy@udel.edu> - 2014-03-05 18:00 -0500
                Re: Reference Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> - 2014-03-06 03:01 +0000
                Re: Reference Rustom Mody <rustompmody@gmail.com> - 2014-03-04 22:03 -0800
                Re: Reference Ben Finney <ben+python@benfinney.id.au> - 2014-03-05 17:26 +1100
                Re: Reference Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-03-05 17:32 +1100
                Re: Reference Tim Chase <python.list@tim.thechases.com> - 2014-03-05 08:24 -0600
                Re: Reference Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> - 2014-03-05 18:29 +0000
                Re: Reference Marko Rauhamaa <marko@pacujo.net> - 2014-03-05 22:34 +0200
                Re: Reference Ben Finney <ben+python@benfinney.id.au> - 2014-03-06 08:01 +1100
                Re: Reference Marko Rauhamaa <marko@pacujo.net> - 2014-03-05 23:14 +0200
                Re: Reference Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-03-06 08:26 +1100
                Re: Reference Marko Rauhamaa <marko@pacujo.net> - 2014-03-05 23:50 +0200
                Re: Reference Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> - 2014-03-06 00:35 +0000
                Re: Reference Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-03-06 11:50 +1100
                Re: Reference Mark Lawrence <breamoreboy@yahoo.co.uk> - 2014-03-06 17:46 +0000
                Re: Reference Tim Chase <python.list@tim.thechases.com> - 2014-03-05 15:33 -0600
                Re: Reference Ben Finney <ben+python@benfinney.id.au> - 2014-03-06 08:37 +1100
                Re: Reference Marko Rauhamaa <marko@pacujo.net> - 2014-03-06 02:52 +0200
                Re: Reference Ben Finney <ben+python@benfinney.id.au> - 2014-03-06 12:05 +1100
                Re: Reference alex23 <wuwei23@gmail.com> - 2014-03-06 12:12 +1000
                Re: Reference Mark Lawrence <breamoreboy@yahoo.co.uk> - 2014-03-05 21:46 +0000
                Re: Reference Marko Rauhamaa <marko@pacujo.net> - 2014-03-05 08:23 +0200
                Re: Reference Rustom Mody <rustompmody@gmail.com> - 2014-03-04 22:33 -0800
                Re: Reference Ben Finney <ben+python@benfinney.id.au> - 2014-03-05 17:40 +1100
                Re: Reference Mark Lawrence <breamoreboy@yahoo.co.uk> - 2014-03-05 12:35 +0000
                Re: Reference Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-03-05 23:45 +1100
          Re: Reference Jerry Hill <malaclypse2@gmail.com> - 2014-03-04 10:19 -0500
            Re: Reference Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> - 2014-03-04 15:42 +0000
              Re: Reference Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-03-05 03:02 +1100
                Re: Reference Roy Smith <roy@panix.com> - 2014-03-04 11:14 -0500
              Re: Reference MRAB <python@mrabarnett.plus.com> - 2014-03-04 17:12 +0000
            Re: Reference Rustom Mody <rustompmody@gmail.com> - 2014-03-04 08:24 -0800
          Re: Reference Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-03-05 02:25 +1100
          Re: Reference Antoon Pardon <antoon.pardon@rece.vub.ac.be> - 2014-03-05 14:37 +0100
      Re: Reference Steven D'Aprano <steve@pearwood.info> - 2014-03-04 03:59 +0000
    Re: Reference Ben Finney <ben+python@benfinney.id.au> - 2014-03-04 09:17 +1100
      Re: Reference Roy Smith <roy@panix.com> - 2014-03-03 18:02 -0500
        Re: Reference Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-03-04 10:09 +1100
        Re: Reference Steven D'Aprano <steve@pearwood.info> - 2014-03-04 04:38 +0000
  Re: Reference Terry Reedy <tjreedy@udel.edu> - 2014-03-03 13:48 -0500
    Re: Reference Steven D'Aprano <steve@pearwood.info> - 2014-03-04 03:45 +0000
    Re: Reference Alexander Blinne <news@blinne.net> - 2014-03-04 13:55 +0100
      Re: Reference Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-03-05 01:06 +1100
        Re: Reference Alexander Blinne <news@blinne.net> - 2014-03-04 22:53 +0100
          Re: Reference Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-03-05 09:01 +1100

csiph-web