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Groups > comp.lang.python > #67799
| From | Ben Finney <ben+python@benfinney.id.au> |
|---|---|
| Subject | Re: Reference |
| Date | 2014-03-05 15:32 +1100 |
| References | (7 earlier) <53155c15$0$2923$c3e8da3$76491128@news.astraweb.com> <mailman.7693.1393910647.18130.python-list@python.org> <op.xb75g7ap5079vu@gnudebeest> <roy-A9E76C.21091704032014@news.panix.com> <164d209c-ba5e-449f-bc25-c27ebfb1fc0f@googlegroups.com> |
| Newsgroups | comp.lang.python |
| Message-ID | <mailman.7791.1393993951.18130.python-list@python.org> (permalink) |
Rustom Mody <rustompmody@gmail.com> writes: > * ... which summarizes my objection in this thread: Your long post references many things. Which is the “which” to which you refer? What is it you're referring to that summarises your position? > Python's 'is' leaks the machine abstraction. No, it does not. The ‘is’ operator compares object identity, which is itself an abstraction. What is leaking? Note that the “location of the object in memory” is not a guarantee made by either Python's object identity nor the ‘id’ function. There's no need to treat “object location in memory” as equal to “object identity”, and code which makes that assumption is buggy. The documentation doesn't promise they will be the same. So, the fact that some Python implementations happen to present ‘id(foo)’ values that coincide with a representation of memory location, does not constitute a leaky abstraction: there is no need for any Python programmer to care about what the memory location is. So if that's the basis of your objection, I don't consider that objection to be legitimate. > 'id' does it legitimately (somewhat), 'is' does it illegitimately What would, in your view, be a legitimate way for Python to present object identity to the programmer? How would it differ substantially from Python's existing abstraction of object identity? -- \ “That's all very good in practice, but how does it work in | `\ *theory*?” —anonymous | _o__) | Ben Finney
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Reference "ast" <nomail@invalid.com> - 2014-03-03 10:42 +0100
Object identity (was: Reference) Ben Finney <ben+python@benfinney.id.au> - 2014-03-03 21:00 +1100
Re: Object identity (was: Reference) "ast" <nomail@invalid.com> - 2014-03-03 11:21 +0100
Re: Reference "Mark H. Harris" <harrismh777@gmail.com> - 2014-03-03 05:09 -0800
Re: Reference Grant Edwards <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2014-03-03 14:29 +0000
Re: Reference Rustom Mody <rustompmody@gmail.com> - 2014-03-03 07:52 -0800
Re: Reference Ben Finney <ben+python@benfinney.id.au> - 2014-03-04 08:10 +1100
Re: Reference Tim Chase <python.list@tim.thechases.com> - 2014-03-03 15:24 -0600
Re: Reference Ben Finney <ben+python@benfinney.id.au> - 2014-03-04 08:31 +1100
Re: Reference Mark Lawrence <breamoreboy@yahoo.co.uk> - 2014-03-03 21:35 +0000
Re: Reference Marko Rauhamaa <marko@pacujo.net> - 2014-03-04 00:07 +0200
Re: Reference Ben Finney <ben+python@benfinney.id.au> - 2014-03-04 09:18 +1100
Re: Reference Alister <alister.ware@ntlworld.com> - 2014-03-04 11:10 +0000
Re: Reference Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> - 2014-03-04 11:48 +0000
Re: Reference "Rhodri James" <rhodri@wildebst.org.uk> - 2014-03-05 00:25 +0000
Re: Reference Tim Chase <python.list@tim.thechases.com> - 2014-03-03 15:51 -0600
Re: Reference Jerry Hill <malaclypse2@gmail.com> - 2014-03-03 17:02 -0500
Re: Reference Marko Rauhamaa <marko@pacujo.net> - 2014-03-04 00:22 +0200
Re: Reference Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-03-04 09:27 +1100
Re: Reference Ben Finney <ben+python@benfinney.id.au> - 2014-03-04 09:33 +1100
Re: Reference Steven D'Aprano <steve@pearwood.info> - 2014-03-04 04:52 +0000
Re: Reference Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-03-04 16:24 +1100
Re: Reference "Rhodri James" <rhodri@wildebst.org.uk> - 2014-03-05 01:08 +0000
Re: Reference Roy Smith <roy@panix.com> - 2014-03-04 21:09 -0500
Re: Reference Rustom Mody <rustompmody@gmail.com> - 2014-03-04 19:36 -0800
Re: Reference Ian Kelly <ian.g.kelly@gmail.com> - 2014-03-04 21:08 -0700
Re: Reference Rustom Mody <rustompmody@gmail.com> - 2014-03-04 20:31 -0800
Re: Reference Ben Finney <ben+python@benfinney.id.au> - 2014-03-05 15:32 +1100
Re: Reference Rustom Mody <rustompmody@gmail.com> - 2014-03-04 20:47 -0800
Re: Reference Steven D'Aprano <steve@pearwood.info> - 2014-03-05 05:06 +0000
Re: Reference Rustom Mody <rustompmody@gmail.com> - 2014-03-04 21:47 -0800
Re: Reference alex23 <wuwei23@gmail.com> - 2014-03-05 16:01 +1000
Re: Reference Rustom Mody <rustompmody@gmail.com> - 2014-03-04 22:10 -0800
Re: Reference Ben Finney <ben+python@benfinney.id.au> - 2014-03-05 17:22 +1100
Re: Reference alex23 <wuwei23@gmail.com> - 2014-03-05 16:28 +1000
Re: Reference Mark Lawrence <breamoreboy@yahoo.co.uk> - 2014-03-05 12:24 +0000
Re: Reference Mark Lawrence <breamoreboy@yahoo.co.uk> - 2014-03-05 12:21 +0000
Re: Reference Ben Finney <ben+python@benfinney.id.au> - 2014-03-05 17:20 +1100
Re: Reference Rustom Mody <rustompmody@gmail.com> - 2014-03-05 09:40 -0800
Re: Reference Tim Chase <python.list@tim.thechases.com> - 2014-03-05 12:12 -0600
Re: Reference Ben Finney <ben+python@benfinney.id.au> - 2014-03-06 05:33 +1100
Re: Reference Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> - 2014-03-05 18:19 +0000
Re: Reference Marko Rauhamaa <marko@pacujo.net> - 2014-03-05 22:23 +0200
Re: Reference Grant Edwards <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2014-03-05 20:31 +0000
Re: Reference Marko Rauhamaa <marko@pacujo.net> - 2014-03-05 22:46 +0200
Re: Reference Ben Finney <ben+python@benfinney.id.au> - 2014-03-06 08:07 +1100
Re: Reference Ben Finney <ben+python@benfinney.id.au> - 2014-03-06 08:10 +1100
Re: Reference Mark Lawrence <breamoreboy@yahoo.co.uk> - 2014-03-05 21:34 +0000
Re: Reference Terry Reedy <tjreedy@udel.edu> - 2014-03-05 18:00 -0500
Re: Reference Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> - 2014-03-06 03:01 +0000
Re: Reference Rustom Mody <rustompmody@gmail.com> - 2014-03-04 22:03 -0800
Re: Reference Ben Finney <ben+python@benfinney.id.au> - 2014-03-05 17:26 +1100
Re: Reference Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-03-05 17:32 +1100
Re: Reference Tim Chase <python.list@tim.thechases.com> - 2014-03-05 08:24 -0600
Re: Reference Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> - 2014-03-05 18:29 +0000
Re: Reference Marko Rauhamaa <marko@pacujo.net> - 2014-03-05 22:34 +0200
Re: Reference Ben Finney <ben+python@benfinney.id.au> - 2014-03-06 08:01 +1100
Re: Reference Marko Rauhamaa <marko@pacujo.net> - 2014-03-05 23:14 +0200
Re: Reference Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-03-06 08:26 +1100
Re: Reference Marko Rauhamaa <marko@pacujo.net> - 2014-03-05 23:50 +0200
Re: Reference Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> - 2014-03-06 00:35 +0000
Re: Reference Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-03-06 11:50 +1100
Re: Reference Mark Lawrence <breamoreboy@yahoo.co.uk> - 2014-03-06 17:46 +0000
Re: Reference Tim Chase <python.list@tim.thechases.com> - 2014-03-05 15:33 -0600
Re: Reference Ben Finney <ben+python@benfinney.id.au> - 2014-03-06 08:37 +1100
Re: Reference Marko Rauhamaa <marko@pacujo.net> - 2014-03-06 02:52 +0200
Re: Reference Ben Finney <ben+python@benfinney.id.au> - 2014-03-06 12:05 +1100
Re: Reference alex23 <wuwei23@gmail.com> - 2014-03-06 12:12 +1000
Re: Reference Mark Lawrence <breamoreboy@yahoo.co.uk> - 2014-03-05 21:46 +0000
Re: Reference Marko Rauhamaa <marko@pacujo.net> - 2014-03-05 08:23 +0200
Re: Reference Rustom Mody <rustompmody@gmail.com> - 2014-03-04 22:33 -0800
Re: Reference Ben Finney <ben+python@benfinney.id.au> - 2014-03-05 17:40 +1100
Re: Reference Mark Lawrence <breamoreboy@yahoo.co.uk> - 2014-03-05 12:35 +0000
Re: Reference Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-03-05 23:45 +1100
Re: Reference Jerry Hill <malaclypse2@gmail.com> - 2014-03-04 10:19 -0500
Re: Reference Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> - 2014-03-04 15:42 +0000
Re: Reference Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-03-05 03:02 +1100
Re: Reference Roy Smith <roy@panix.com> - 2014-03-04 11:14 -0500
Re: Reference MRAB <python@mrabarnett.plus.com> - 2014-03-04 17:12 +0000
Re: Reference Rustom Mody <rustompmody@gmail.com> - 2014-03-04 08:24 -0800
Re: Reference Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-03-05 02:25 +1100
Re: Reference Antoon Pardon <antoon.pardon@rece.vub.ac.be> - 2014-03-05 14:37 +0100
Re: Reference Steven D'Aprano <steve@pearwood.info> - 2014-03-04 03:59 +0000
Re: Reference Ben Finney <ben+python@benfinney.id.au> - 2014-03-04 09:17 +1100
Re: Reference Roy Smith <roy@panix.com> - 2014-03-03 18:02 -0500
Re: Reference Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-03-04 10:09 +1100
Re: Reference Steven D'Aprano <steve@pearwood.info> - 2014-03-04 04:38 +0000
Re: Reference Terry Reedy <tjreedy@udel.edu> - 2014-03-03 13:48 -0500
Re: Reference Steven D'Aprano <steve@pearwood.info> - 2014-03-04 03:45 +0000
Re: Reference Alexander Blinne <news@blinne.net> - 2014-03-04 13:55 +0100
Re: Reference Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-03-05 01:06 +1100
Re: Reference Alexander Blinne <news@blinne.net> - 2014-03-04 22:53 +0100
Re: Reference Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-03-05 09:01 +1100
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