Re: VFX code quality

From	Bernd Paysan <bernd.paysan@gmx.de>
Newsgroups	comp.lang.forth
Subject	Re: VFX code quality
Date	2012-05-31 20:24 +0200
Organization	1&1 Internet AG
Message-ID	<jq8d15$krd$1@online.de> (permalink)
References	(6 earlier) <I_ednTVqBtYmzibSnZ2dnUVZ_jSdnZ2d@supernews.com> <I_ednTdqBtbfyybSnZ2dnUVZ_jSdnZ2d@supernews.com> <2012May22.112518@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at> <jq643b$iln$1@online.de> <2012May31.170705@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at>

Show all headers | View raw

Anton Ertl wrote:
> Do you have numbers for that?  I.e., how many of the dynamically
> executed calls are late-bound method calls?

All performance-critical loops within MINOS itself (excluding e.g. 
drawing through X11 or OpenGL) are an iterator around a late-bound 
method or two, plus a little bit of processing, like adding points 
together or such.  The called methods do usually very simple stuff, 
because I try to cache everything that otherwise would go to X11 (e.g. 
height and width of a text string - calculated once, and then kept in 
the cache.  The method is there to return the cached value if it's 
available, or otherwise call the X11 function to obtain the values to be 
cached).

There are objects where caching is not possible, some where caching 
needs special care, and some where caching is simply not necessary.  
After all, it's a Forth program, so all methods are rather short, and 
usually call methods of other objects (if anything).

AFAIK, code in other object oriented languages is not fundamentally 
different.  The result is that modern CPU architectures do not work well 
on this code, because the loop+unpredictable indirect call breaks the 
branch predictor, and the small basic blocks make sure it breaks very 
often.  Using non-OOP benchmarks to decide how deep the pipeline is 
(like ARM A15 vs. A9) is a bad idea if your main software base is 
written in OOP style or uses a VM with similar behavior.

-- 
Bernd Paysan
"If you want it done right, you have to do it yourself"
http://bernd-paysan.de/

Thread

I beleive that forth could supplant ruby and perl and python if it wanted to quiet_lad <gavcomedy@gmail.com> - 2012-05-15 23:27 -0700
  Re: I beleive that forth could supplant ruby and perl and python if it wanted to marko <marko@marko.marko> - 2012-05-16 17:50 +1000
  Re: I beleive that forth could supplant ruby and perl and python if it wanted to "Rod Pemberton" <do_not_have@notemailntt.cmm> - 2012-05-16 06:51 -0400
  Re: I beleive that forth could supplant ruby and perl and python if it wanted to BruceMcF <agila61@netscape.net> - 2012-05-16 07:59 -0700
    Re: I beleive that forth could supplant ruby and perl and python if it wanted to Jason Damisch <jasondamisch@yahoo.com> - 2012-05-16 09:28 -0700
      Re: I beleive that forth could supplant ruby and perl and python if it wanted to "Rod Pemberton" <do_not_have@notemailntt.cmm> - 2012-05-17 04:08 -0400
        Re: I beleive that forth could supplant ruby and perl and python if it wanted to "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2012-05-16 22:22 -1000
          Re: I beleive that forth could supplant ruby and perl and python if it wanted to "A. K." <akk@nospam.org> - 2012-05-17 11:43 +0200
          Re: I beleive that forth could supplant ruby and perl and python if it wanted to "Rod Pemberton" <do_not_have@notemailntt.cmm> - 2012-05-17 10:22 -0400
            Re: I beleive that forth could supplant ruby and perl and python if it wanted to "A. K." <akk@nospam.org> - 2012-05-17 17:03 +0200
              Re: I beleive that forth could supplant ruby and perl and python if it wanted to Bernd Paysan <bernd.paysan@gmx.de> - 2012-05-18 01:15 +0200
              Re: I beleive that forth could supplant ruby and perl and python if it wanted to "Rod Pemberton" <do_not_have@notemailntt.cmm> - 2012-05-17 19:19 -0400
                Re: I beleive that forth could supplant ruby and perl and python if it wanted to Albert van der Horst <albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl> - 2012-05-18 12:40 +0000
            Re: I beleive that forth could supplant ruby and perl and python if it wanted to Bernd Paysan <bernd.paysan@gmx.de> - 2012-05-18 00:17 +0200
          Re: I beleive that forth could supplant ruby and perl and python if it wanted to vandys@vsta.org - 2012-05-17 16:02 +0000
            Re: I beleive that forth could supplant ruby and perl and python if it wanted to "A. K." <akk@nospam.org> - 2012-05-17 18:08 +0200
              Re: I beleive that forth could supplant ruby and perl and python if it wanted to vandys@vsta.org - 2012-05-17 16:58 +0000
            Re: I beleive that forth could supplant ruby and perl and python if it   to Nomen Nescio <nobody@dizum.com> - 2012-05-17 19:03 +0200
            Re: I beleive that forth could supplant ruby and perl and python if it wanted to Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2012-05-17 12:27 -0500
              Re: I beleive that forth could supplant ruby and perl and python if it wanted to vandys@vsta.org - 2012-05-17 18:52 +0000
                Re: I beleive that forth could supplant ruby and perl and python if it wanted to Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2012-05-17 18:18 -0500
                Re: I beleive that forth could supplant ruby and perl and python if it wanted to Hugh Aguilar <hughaguilar96@yahoo.com> - 2012-05-18 01:39 -0700
                Re: I beleive that forth could supplant ruby and perl and python if it wanted to Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2012-05-18 04:50 -0500
                Re: I beleive that forth could supplant ruby and perl and python if it wanted to Hugh Aguilar <hughaguilar96@yahoo.com> - 2012-05-18 04:40 -0700
                Re: I beleive that forth could supplant ruby and perl and python if it wanted to humptydumpty <ouatubi@gmail.com> - 2012-05-18 15:15 +0300
                Re: I beleive that forth could supplant ruby and perl and python if it wanted to "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2012-05-18 08:02 -1000
              Re: I beleive that forth could supplant ruby and perl and python if it wanted to Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2012-05-17 12:40 -0700
                Re: I beleive that forth could supplant ruby and perl and python if it wanted to Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2012-05-17 18:32 -0500
                Re: I beleive that forth could supplant ruby and perl and python if it wanted to Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2012-05-18 01:45 -0500
                Re: I beleive that forth could supplant ruby and perl and python if it wanted to Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2012-05-19 11:28 -0700
              Re: I beleive that forth could supplant ruby and perl and python if it wanted to "Peter Knaggs" <pjk@bcs.org.uk> - 2012-05-17 21:38 +0100
                Re: I beleive that forth could supplant ruby and perl and python if it wanted to vandys@vsta.org - 2012-05-17 21:17 +0000
                Re: I beleive that forth could supplant ruby and perl and python if it wanted to stephenXXX@mpeforth.com (Stephen Pelc) - 2012-05-18 09:41 +0000
                Re: I beleive that forth could supplant ruby and perl and python if it wanted to Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2012-05-18 04:55 -0500
                Re: I beleive that forth could supplant ruby and perl and python if it wanted to stephenXXX@mpeforth.com (Stephen Pelc) - 2012-05-18 13:50 +0000
                Re: I beleive that forth could supplant ruby and perl and python if it wanted to Mark Wills <markrobertwills@yahoo.co.uk> - 2012-05-18 03:24 -0700
                Re: I beleive that forth could supplant ruby and perl and python if it wanted to Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2012-05-18 06:10 -0500
                Re: I beleive that forth could supplant ruby and perl and python if it wanted to "Rod Pemberton" <do_not_have@notemailntt.cmm> - 2012-05-18 08:10 -0400
                Re: I beleive that forth could supplant ruby and perl and python if it wanted to Mark Wills <forthfreak@gmail.com> - 2012-05-18 05:57 -0700
                Re: I beleive that forth could supplant ruby and perl and python if it wanted to "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2012-05-18 08:14 -1000
                Re: I beleive that forth could supplant ruby and perl and python if it wanted to John Passaniti <john.passaniti@gmail.com> - 2012-05-18 10:01 -0700
                VFX code quality (was: I beleive that forth could supplant ...) anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2012-05-18 12:58 +0000
                Re: VFX code quality Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2012-05-18 09:43 -0500
                Re: VFX code quality anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2012-05-19 10:54 +0000
                Re: VFX code quality Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2012-05-19 11:43 -0500
                Re: VFX code quality anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2012-05-22 08:26 +0000
                Re: VFX code quality Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2012-05-22 03:52 -0500
                Re: VFX code quality Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2012-05-22 04:02 -0500
                Re: VFX code quality anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2012-05-22 09:25 +0000
                Re: VFX code quality Bernd Paysan <bernd.paysan@gmx.de> - 2012-05-30 23:39 +0200
                Re: VFX code quality anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2012-05-31 15:07 +0000
                Re: VFX code quality Bernd Paysan <bernd.paysan@gmx.de> - 2012-05-31 20:24 +0200
                Re: VFX code quality (was: I beleive that forth could supplant ...) stephenXXX@mpeforth.com (Stephen Pelc) - 2012-05-18 15:25 +0000
                Re: VFX code quality (was: I beleive that forth could supplant ...) anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2012-05-19 11:31 +0000
                Re: VFX code quality (was: I beleive that forth could supplant ...) Bernd Paysan <bernd.paysan@gmx.de> - 2012-05-20 17:41 +0200
                Re: VFX code quality Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2012-05-20 12:49 -0500
                Re: VFX code quality Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2012-05-20 11:43 -0700
                Re: VFX code quality "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2012-05-20 14:01 -1000
                Re: VFX code quality Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2012-05-20 19:10 -0700
                Re: VFX code quality "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2012-05-20 17:05 -1000
                Re: VFX code quality Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2012-05-20 20:38 -0700
                Re: VFX code quality "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2012-05-20 21:37 -1000
                Re: VFX code quality Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2012-05-21 01:27 -0700
                Re: VFX code quality m.a.m.hendrix@tue.nl - 2012-05-21 01:52 -0700
                Re: VFX code quality Ecki <ecki@intershop.de> - 2012-05-21 11:06 +0200
                Re: VFX code quality mhx@iae.nl (Marcel Hendrix) - 2012-05-21 20:34 +0200
                Re: VFX code quality Ecki <ecki@intershop.de> - 2012-05-22 08:54 +0200
                Re: VFX code quality anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2012-05-21 14:36 +0000
                Re: VFX code quality mhx@iae.nl (Marcel Hendrix) - 2012-05-21 20:33 +0200
                Re: VFX code quality Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2012-05-21 04:29 -0500
                Re: VFX code quality Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2012-05-21 08:39 -0700
                Re: VFX code quality Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2012-05-21 15:22 -0500
                Re: VFX code quality Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2012-05-22 12:47 -0700
                Re: VFX code quality "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2012-05-22 11:25 -1000
                Re: VFX code quality Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2012-05-23 03:19 -0500
                Re: VFX code quality Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2012-05-24 22:51 -0700
                Re: VFX code quality Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2012-05-24 23:16 -0700
                Re: VFX code quality Fritz Wuehler <fritz@spamexpire-201205.rodent.frell.theremailer.net> - 2012-05-23 17:36 +0200
                Re: VFX code quality Doug Hoffman <glidedog@gmail.com> - 2012-05-21 12:57 -0400
                Re: VFX code quality "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2012-05-21 08:42 -1000
                Re: VFX code quality Doug Hoffman <glidedog@gmail.com> - 2012-05-21 19:41 -0400
                Re: VFX code quality Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2012-05-21 21:53 -0700
                Re: VFX code quality Doug Hoffman <glidedog@gmail.com> - 2012-05-22 07:10 -0400
                Re: VFX code quality "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2012-05-21 08:36 -1000
                Re: VFX code quality Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2012-05-21 21:46 -0700
                Re: VFX code quality "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2012-05-21 20:30 -1000
                Re: VFX code quality David Kuehling <dvdkhlng@gmx.de> - 2012-05-22 14:06 +0200
                Re: VFX code quality Doug Hoffman <glidedog@gmail.com> - 2012-05-22 08:59 -0400
                FP locals (was: VFX code quality) anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2012-05-22 13:39 +0000
                Re: FP locals Doug Hoffman <glidedog@gmail.com> - 2012-05-22 14:03 -0400
                Re: FP locals (was: VFX code quality) C G Montgomery <cgm@physics.utoledo.edu> - 2012-05-22 18:09 -0400
                Re: FP locals (was: VFX code quality) Krishna Myneni <krishna.myneni@ccreweb.org> - 2012-05-23 03:47 -0700
                Re: FP locals (was: VFX code quality) "Ed" <invalid@nospam.com> - 2012-05-26 21:03 +1000
                Re: FP locals (was: VFX code quality) Krishna Myneni <krishna.myneni@ccreweb.org> - 2012-05-26 04:40 -0700
                Re: FP locals (was: VFX code quality) mhx@iae.nl (Marcel Hendrix) - 2012-05-26 18:27 +0200
                Re: FP locals (was: VFX code quality) Krishna Myneni <krishna.myneni@ccreweb.org> - 2012-05-26 12:55 -0700
                Re: FP locals (was: VFX code quality) BruceMcF <agila61@netscape.net> - 2012-05-26 14:54 -0700
                Re: FP locals (was: VFX code quality) Krishna Myneni <krishna.myneni@ccreweb.org> - 2012-05-26 22:02 -0700
                Re: FP locals (was: VFX code quality) mhx@iae.nl (Marcel Hendrix) - 2012-05-27 08:50 +0200
                Re: FP locals (was: VFX code quality) Krishna Myneni <krishna.myneni@ccreweb.org> - 2012-05-27 05:26 -0700
                Re: VFX code quality BruceMcF <agila61@netscape.net> - 2012-05-22 09:04 -0700
                Re: VFX code quality "A. K." <akk@nospam.org> - 2012-05-21 09:55 +0200
                Re: VFX code quality Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2012-05-21 01:22 -0700
                Re: VFX code quality "A. K." <akk@nospam.org> - 2012-05-21 14:19 +0200
                Re: VFX code quality Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2012-05-22 12:33 -0700
                Re: VFX code quality "A. K." <akk@nospam.org> - 2012-05-22 23:14 +0200
                Re: VFX code quality mhx@iae.nl (Marcel Hendrix) - 2012-05-21 20:31 +0200
                Re: VFX code quality Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2012-05-21 15:17 -0500
                Re: VFX code quality BruceMcF <agila61@netscape.net> - 2012-05-21 13:50 -0700
                Re: VFX code quality BruceMcF <agila61@netscape.net> - 2012-05-21 16:47 -0700
                Re: VFX code quality "Harry Vaderchi" <admin@127.0.0.1> - 2012-05-22 09:57 +0100
                Re: VFX code quality BruceMcF <agila61@netscape.net> - 2012-05-22 04:39 -0700
                Re: VFX code quality mhx@iae.nl (Marcel Hendrix) - 2012-05-23 20:25 +0200
                Re: VFX code quality BruceMcF <agila61@netscape.net> - 2012-05-23 13:47 -0700
                Re: VFX code quality humptydumpty <ouatubi@gmail.com> - 2012-05-21 20:23 +0000
                Re: VFX code quality BruceMcF <agila61@netscape.net> - 2012-05-20 20:22 -0700
                Re: VFX code quality Albert van der Horst <albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl> - 2012-05-21 10:57 +0000
                Re: VFX code quality Bernd Paysan <bernd.paysan@gmx.de> - 2012-05-21 01:35 +0200
                Re: VFX code quality Hugh Aguilar <hughaguilar96@yahoo.com> - 2012-05-20 22:44 -0700
                Re: VFX code quality Hugh Aguilar <hughaguilar96@yahoo.com> - 2012-05-20 22:53 -0700
                Re: VFX code quality Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2012-05-21 04:32 -0500
                Re: VFX code quality "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2012-05-21 08:44 -1000
                Re: I beleive that forth could supplant ruby and perl and python if it wanted to Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2012-05-20 00:58 -0700
                Re: I beleive that forth could supplant ruby and perl and python if it wanted to stephenXXX@mpeforth.com (Stephen Pelc) - 2012-05-20 15:09 +0000
                Re: I beleive that forth could supplant ruby and perl and python if it wanted to "Rod Pemberton" <do_not_have@notemailntt.cmm> - 2012-05-18 07:20 -0400
                Re: I beleive that forth could supplant ruby and perl and python if it wanted to Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2012-05-18 10:22 -0500
                Re: I beleive that forth could supplant ruby and perl and python if it wanted to "Rod Pemberton" <do_not_have@notemailntt.cmm> - 2012-05-18 22:09 -0400
                Re: I beleive that forth could supplant ruby and perl and python if it wanted to Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2012-05-19 04:20 -0500
                Re: I beleive that forth could supplant ruby and perl and python if it wanted to Albert van der Horst <albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl> - 2012-05-19 13:19 +0000
                Re: I beleive that forth could supplant ruby and perl and python if it wanted to Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2012-05-17 18:33 -0500
                Re: I beleive that forth could supplant ruby and perl and python if it wanted to Hugh Aguilar <hughaguilar96@yahoo.com> - 2012-05-18 01:49 -0700
                Re: I beleive that forth could supplant ruby and perl and python if it wanted to Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2012-05-18 07:59 -0700
                Re: I beleive that forth could supplant ruby and perl and python if it wanted to Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2012-05-18 10:32 -0500
                Re: I beleive that forth could supplant ruby and perl and python if it wanted to Bernd Paysan <bernd.paysan@gmx.de> - 2012-05-20 17:24 +0200
                Re: I beleive that forth could supplant ruby and perl and python if it wanted to Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2012-05-20 15:43 -0700
                Re: I beleive that forth could supplant ruby and perl and python if it wanted to BruceMcF <agila61@netscape.net> - 2012-05-20 16:03 -0700
                Re: I beleive that forth could supplant ruby and perl and python if it wanted to Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2012-05-20 16:34 -0700
                Re: I beleive that forth could supplant ruby and perl and python if it wanted to BruceMcF <agila61@netscape.net> - 2012-05-20 17:02 -0700
                Re: I beleive that forth could supplant ruby and perl and python if it wanted to Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2012-05-21 04:46 -0500
                Re: I beleive that forth could supplant ruby and perl and python if it wanted to Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2012-05-21 08:33 -0700
                Re: I beleive that forth could supplant ruby and perl and python if it wanted to BruceMcF <agila61@netscape.net> - 2012-05-21 12:10 -0700
                Re: I beleive that forth could supplant ruby and perl and python if it wanted to Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2012-05-21 04:40 -0500
                address units (was: I beleive that forth could supplant ...) anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2012-05-21 14:40 +0000
                Re: address units Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2012-05-21 10:07 -0500
                Re: I beleive that forth could supplant ruby and perl and python if it wanted to Albert van der Horst <albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl> - 2012-05-21 10:59 +0000
                Re: I beleive that forth could supplant ruby and perl and python if it wanted to anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2012-05-21 14:22 +0000
              Re: I beleive that forth could supplant ruby and perl and python if it wanted to Bernd Paysan <bernd.paysan@gmx.de> - 2012-05-18 00:43 +0200
                Re: I beleive that forth could supplant ruby and perl and python if it wanted to vandys@vsta.org - 2012-05-17 23:10 +0000
                Re: I beleive that forth could supplant ruby and perl and python if it wanted to Doug Hoffman <glidedog@gmail.com> - 2012-05-17 19:24 -0400
                Re: I beleive that forth could supplant ruby and perl and python if it wanted to Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2012-05-17 18:38 -0500
            Re: I beleive that forth could supplant ruby and perl and python if it wanted to Albert van der Horst <albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl> - 2012-05-17 22:30 +0000
        Re: I beleive that forth could supplant ruby and perl and python if it wanted to BruceMcF <agila61@netscape.net> - 2012-05-17 10:59 -0700
          Re: I beleive that forth could supplant ruby and perl and python if it wanted to Jan Coombs <jan_2011-02@murray-microft.co.uk> - 2012-05-20 13:14 +0100
  Re: I beleive that forth could supplant ruby and perl and python if it wanted to marko <marko@marko.marko> - 2012-05-18 11:46 +1000
    Re: I beleive that forth could supplant ruby and perl and python if it wanted to "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2012-05-17 20:10 -1000
    Re: I beleive that forth could supplant ruby and perl and python if it wanted to Arnold Doray <invalid@invalid.com> - 2012-05-18 10:32 +0000
      Re: I beleive that forth could supplant ruby and perl and python if it wanted to marko <marko@marko.marko> - 2012-05-18 21:27 +1000
  Re: I beleive that forth could supplant ruby and perl and python if it wanted to Hugh Aguilar <hughaguilar96@yahoo.com> - 2012-05-18 22:58 -0700

csiph-web