Re: Makefile or not?

From	David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no>
Newsgroups	comp.arch.embedded
Subject	Re: Makefile or not?
Date	2018-12-03 21:31 +0100
Organization	A noiseless patient Spider
Message-ID	<pu43ra$ltk$1@dont-email.me> (permalink)
References	<pu2orv$702$1@dont-email.me> <pu2v7a$8m3$1@dont-email.me> <pu3inf$o79$2@reader1.panix.com> <xVn*Iqvax@news.chiark.greenend.org.uk>

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On 03/12/2018 16:49, Theo Markettos wrote:
> Grant Edwards <invalid@invalid.invalid> wrote:
>> It impossible to overemphasize how important that is.  Somebody should
>> be able to check out the source tree and a few tools and then type a
>> single command to build production firmware.  And you need to be able
>> to _automate_ that process.
> 
> One approach is to put the tools into a VM or a container (eg Docker), so
> that when you want to build you pull the container and you get an identical
> build environment to the last time anyone built it.

That is possible, but often more than necessary.  Set up your build 
sensibly, and it only depends on the one tree for the toolchain, and 
your source code tree.  It should not depend on things like the versions 
of utility programs (make, sed, touch, etc.), environment variables, and 
that kind of thing.

Sometimes, however, you can't avoid that - especially for Windows-based 
toolchains that store stuff in the registry and other odd places.

> Also, your continuous integration system can run builds and tests in
> the same environment as you're developing on.
> 
> Unfortunately vendors have a habit of shipping IDEs for Windows only, which
> makes this harder.

That is thankfully rare these days.  There are exceptions, but most 
major vendors know that is a poor habit.

>  It's not so much of a problem for the actual
> compiler - especially if that's GCC under the hood - but ancillary tools (eg
> configuration tools for peripherals, flash image builders, etc), which are
> sometimes not designed to be scripted.

Yes, these are more likely to be an issue.  Generally they are not 
needed for rebuilding the software - once you have run the wizards and 
similar tools, the job is done and the generated source can be 
preserved.  But it can be an issue if you need to re-use the tools for 
dealing with changes to the setup.

> 
> (AutoIt is my worst enemy here, but it has been the only way to get the job
> done in some cases)
> 
> Decoupling your build from the vagaries of the IDE, even if you can trust
> that you'll always build on a fixed platform, is still a good thing - many
> IDEs still don't play nicely with version control, for example.
> 

Often IDE's have good integration with version control for the source 
files, but can be poor for the project settings and other IDE files. 
Typically that sort of thing is held in hideous XML files with 
thoughtless line breaks, making it very difficult to do comparisons and 
change management.

> Theo
>

Thread

Makefile or not? pozz <pozzugno@gmail.com> - 2018-12-03 09:18 +0100
  Re: Makefile or not? David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2018-12-03 11:06 +0100
    Re: Makefile or not? pozz <pozzugno@gmail.com> - 2018-12-03 12:13 +0100
      Re: Makefile or not? David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2018-12-03 12:57 +0100
        Re: Makefile or not? pozz <pozzugno@gmail.com> - 2018-12-03 23:29 +0100
    Re: Makefile or not? Grant Edwards <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2018-12-03 15:39 +0000
      Re: Makefile or not? Theo Markettos <theom+news@chiark.greenend.org.uk> - 2018-12-03 15:49 +0000
        Re: Makefile or not? Dave Nadler <drn@nadler.com> - 2018-12-03 09:41 -0800
        Re: Makefile or not? David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2018-12-03 21:31 +0100
  Re: Makefile or not? Grant Edwards <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2018-12-03 15:30 +0000
    Re: Makefile or not? DJ Delorie <dj@delorie.com> - 2018-12-03 14:05 -0500
      Re: Makefile or not? Grant Edwards <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2018-12-03 19:36 +0000
        Re: Makefile or not? Clifford Heath <no.spam@please.net> - 2018-12-04 09:30 +1100
          Re: Makefile or not? Grant Edwards <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2018-12-03 23:19 +0000
            Re: Makefile or not? raimond.dragomir@gmail.com - 2018-12-03 22:02 -0800
            Re: Makefile or not? David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2018-12-04 12:18 +0100
              Re: Makefile or not? Grant Edwards <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2018-12-04 15:46 +0000
                Re: Makefile or not? Theo Markettos <theom+news@chiark.greenend.org.uk> - 2018-12-04 20:22 +0000
          Re: Makefile or not? Rob Gaddi <rgaddi@highlandtechnology.invalid> - 2018-12-03 15:38 -0800
        Re: Makefile or not? Phil Hobbs <pcdhSpamMeSenseless@electrooptical.net> - 2018-12-04 21:25 -0500
          Re: Makefile or not? Grant Edwards <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2018-12-05 03:22 +0000
          Re: Makefile or not? David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2018-12-05 09:06 +0100
        Re: Makefile or not? George Neuner <gneuner2@comcast.net> - 2018-12-05 11:37 -0500
        Re: Makefile or not? Phil Hobbs <pcdhSpamMeSenseless@electrooptical.net> - 2018-12-05 15:37 -0500
          Re: Makefile or not? Grant Edwards <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2018-12-05 22:34 +0000
            Re: Makefile or not? Rob Gaddi <rgaddi@highlandtechnology.invalid> - 2018-12-05 14:56 -0800
              Re: Makefile or not? Grant Edwards <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2018-12-05 23:50 +0000
                Re: Makefile or not? Rob Gaddi <rgaddi@highlandtechnology.invalid> - 2018-12-05 16:27 -0800
                Re: Makefile or not? Rob Gaddi <rgaddi@highlandtechnology.invalid> - 2018-12-05 17:47 -0800
                Re: Makefile or not? Theo Markettos <theom+news@chiark.greenend.org.uk> - 2018-12-06 08:12 +0000
                Re: Makefile or not? Rob Gaddi <rgaddi@highlandtechnology.invalid> - 2018-12-06 10:17 -0800
                Re: Makefile or not? gtwrek@sonic.net (gtwrek) - 2018-12-06 18:35 +0000
                Re: Makefile or not? Theo Markettos <theom+news@chiark.greenend.org.uk> - 2018-12-06 18:39 +0000
            Re: Makefile or not? David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2018-12-06 09:22 +0100
            Re: Makefile or not? Theo Markettos <theom+news@chiark.greenend.org.uk> - 2018-12-06 18:46 +0000
              Re: Makefile or not? David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2018-12-06 21:51 +0100
                Re: Makefile or not? Dave Nadler <drn@nadler.com> - 2018-12-06 13:47 -0800
                Re: Makefile or not? David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2018-12-06 22:48 +0100
                Re: Makefile or not? Dave Nadler <drn@nadler.com> - 2018-12-06 14:01 -0800
                Re: Makefile or not? Tauno Voipio <tauno.voipio@notused.fi.invalid> - 2018-12-07 14:54 +0200
    Re: Makefile or not? David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2018-12-03 21:34 +0100
  Re: Makefile or not? Phil Hobbs <pcdhSpamMeSenseless@electrooptical.net> - 2018-12-03 11:06 -0500
    Re: Makefile or not? Jacob Sparre Andersen <jacob@jacob-sparre.dk> - 2018-12-03 22:05 +0100
      Re: Makefile or not? Phil Hobbs <pcdhSpamMeSenseless@electrooptical.net> - 2018-12-04 21:19 -0500
  Re: Makefile or not? queequeg@trust.no1 (Queequeg) - 2018-12-07 13:45 +0000

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