Re: Makefile or not?

From	David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no>
Newsgroups	comp.arch.embedded
Subject	Re: Makefile or not?
Date	2018-12-05 09:06 +0100
Organization	A noiseless patient Spider
Message-ID	<pu80u0$hap$1@dont-email.me> (permalink)
References	<pu2orv$702$1@dont-email.me> <pu3i71$o79$1@reader1.panix.com> <xn5zwal9bv.fsf@delorie.com> <pu40ki$iis$1@reader1.panix.com> <7uOdnbhND4C1qprBnZ2dnUU7-dnNnZ2d@supernews.com>

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On 05/12/18 03:25, Phil Hobbs wrote:
> On 12/3/18 2:36 PM, Grant Edwards wrote:
>> On 2018-12-03, DJ Delorie <dj@delorie.com> wrote:
>>> Grant Edwards <invalid@invalid.invalid> writes:
>>>> I use Emacs, makefiles, and meld.
>>>
>>> +1 on those.  My memory isn't good enough any more to remember all
>>> the byzantine steps through an IDE to re-complete all the tasks my
>>> projects require.
>>>
>>> Especially since each MCU seems to have a *different* IDE with
>>> *different* procedures to forget...
>>>
>>> And that's assuming they run on Linux in the first place ;-)
>>
>> The most important rule to remember is:
>>
>> Never, ever, use any software written or provided by the silicon
>> vendor.  Everytime I've failed to obey that rule, I've regretted it.
>>
>> I've heard rumors that Intel at one time wrote a pretty good C
>> compiler for x86.
> 
> I've used it, circa 2006-7, and for my application (highly multithreaded
> 3D electromagnetic simulation on a SMP) it was amazing--it blew the
> doors off both Visual C++ and gcc under cygwin.  (For sufficiently
> permissive values of 'amazing', that is, i.e. 1.5-1.8x on the same
> hardware.) ;)

Intel's C (and C++) compiler is still very much a major choice for the
x86 platform, with good support for the latest standards and a fair
degree of gcc compatibility (inline assembly format, attributes, etc.).
 It is generally considered to be the best choice for automatic vector
SIMD code generation, and has support for parallelising code using
multiple threads.  But it is also well known for making code that is
particularly poor on non-Intel x86 processors.

> 
>>
>> However, having used other development software from Intel, I find
>> that impossible to believe.  [Acually, Intel MDS-800 "blue boxes"
>> weren't bad as long as you ran CP/M on them insteaod of, ISIS.]
>>
>> And don't get me started on compilers and tools from TI, Motorola, or
>> various others either...
>>
>> Some of them have put some effort into getting good Gnu GCC and
>> binutils support for their processors, and that seems to produce good
>> results.  If only they had realized that's all they really needed to
>> do in the _first_ place...
> 
> In defence of Eclipse, it does do a much better job of humanizing gdb
> than the other things I've used, such as ddd.
> 

Agreed - Eclipse + gdb is a perfectly solid debugger.  It is not always
perfect, but no debugger I have ever used is always reliable or works as
you expect.  Certainly it is fine for most debugging purposes.

In the past, I have used both ddd and gvd (which later became part of
gps, the GNAT Programming Studio) as front ends.  There are plenty of
other gdb front-ends available - those with a strong sense of irony
might like to try using MS Visual Studio.

Thread

Makefile or not? pozz <pozzugno@gmail.com> - 2018-12-03 09:18 +0100
  Re: Makefile or not? David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2018-12-03 11:06 +0100
    Re: Makefile or not? pozz <pozzugno@gmail.com> - 2018-12-03 12:13 +0100
      Re: Makefile or not? David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2018-12-03 12:57 +0100
        Re: Makefile or not? pozz <pozzugno@gmail.com> - 2018-12-03 23:29 +0100
    Re: Makefile or not? Grant Edwards <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2018-12-03 15:39 +0000
      Re: Makefile or not? Theo Markettos <theom+news@chiark.greenend.org.uk> - 2018-12-03 15:49 +0000
        Re: Makefile or not? Dave Nadler <drn@nadler.com> - 2018-12-03 09:41 -0800
        Re: Makefile or not? David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2018-12-03 21:31 +0100
  Re: Makefile or not? Grant Edwards <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2018-12-03 15:30 +0000
    Re: Makefile or not? DJ Delorie <dj@delorie.com> - 2018-12-03 14:05 -0500
      Re: Makefile or not? Grant Edwards <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2018-12-03 19:36 +0000
        Re: Makefile or not? Clifford Heath <no.spam@please.net> - 2018-12-04 09:30 +1100
          Re: Makefile or not? Grant Edwards <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2018-12-03 23:19 +0000
            Re: Makefile or not? raimond.dragomir@gmail.com - 2018-12-03 22:02 -0800
            Re: Makefile or not? David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2018-12-04 12:18 +0100
              Re: Makefile or not? Grant Edwards <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2018-12-04 15:46 +0000
                Re: Makefile or not? Theo Markettos <theom+news@chiark.greenend.org.uk> - 2018-12-04 20:22 +0000
          Re: Makefile or not? Rob Gaddi <rgaddi@highlandtechnology.invalid> - 2018-12-03 15:38 -0800
        Re: Makefile or not? Phil Hobbs <pcdhSpamMeSenseless@electrooptical.net> - 2018-12-04 21:25 -0500
          Re: Makefile or not? Grant Edwards <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2018-12-05 03:22 +0000
          Re: Makefile or not? David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2018-12-05 09:06 +0100
        Re: Makefile or not? George Neuner <gneuner2@comcast.net> - 2018-12-05 11:37 -0500
        Re: Makefile or not? Phil Hobbs <pcdhSpamMeSenseless@electrooptical.net> - 2018-12-05 15:37 -0500
          Re: Makefile or not? Grant Edwards <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2018-12-05 22:34 +0000
            Re: Makefile or not? Rob Gaddi <rgaddi@highlandtechnology.invalid> - 2018-12-05 14:56 -0800
              Re: Makefile or not? Grant Edwards <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2018-12-05 23:50 +0000
                Re: Makefile or not? Rob Gaddi <rgaddi@highlandtechnology.invalid> - 2018-12-05 16:27 -0800
                Re: Makefile or not? Rob Gaddi <rgaddi@highlandtechnology.invalid> - 2018-12-05 17:47 -0800
                Re: Makefile or not? Theo Markettos <theom+news@chiark.greenend.org.uk> - 2018-12-06 08:12 +0000
                Re: Makefile or not? Rob Gaddi <rgaddi@highlandtechnology.invalid> - 2018-12-06 10:17 -0800
                Re: Makefile or not? gtwrek@sonic.net (gtwrek) - 2018-12-06 18:35 +0000
                Re: Makefile or not? Theo Markettos <theom+news@chiark.greenend.org.uk> - 2018-12-06 18:39 +0000
            Re: Makefile or not? David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2018-12-06 09:22 +0100
            Re: Makefile or not? Theo Markettos <theom+news@chiark.greenend.org.uk> - 2018-12-06 18:46 +0000
              Re: Makefile or not? David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2018-12-06 21:51 +0100
                Re: Makefile or not? Dave Nadler <drn@nadler.com> - 2018-12-06 13:47 -0800
                Re: Makefile or not? David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2018-12-06 22:48 +0100
                Re: Makefile or not? Dave Nadler <drn@nadler.com> - 2018-12-06 14:01 -0800
                Re: Makefile or not? Tauno Voipio <tauno.voipio@notused.fi.invalid> - 2018-12-07 14:54 +0200
    Re: Makefile or not? David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2018-12-03 21:34 +0100
  Re: Makefile or not? Phil Hobbs <pcdhSpamMeSenseless@electrooptical.net> - 2018-12-03 11:06 -0500
    Re: Makefile or not? Jacob Sparre Andersen <jacob@jacob-sparre.dk> - 2018-12-03 22:05 +0100
      Re: Makefile or not? Phil Hobbs <pcdhSpamMeSenseless@electrooptical.net> - 2018-12-04 21:19 -0500
  Re: Makefile or not? queequeg@trust.no1 (Queequeg) - 2018-12-07 13:45 +0000

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