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Groups > comp.lang.c > #138313

Re: _mingw_off_t.h

From David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no>
Newsgroups comp.lang.c
Subject Re: _mingw_off_t.h
Date 2018-11-27 16:55 +0100
Organization A noiseless patient Spider
Message-ID <ptjpdt$em6$1@dont-email.me> (permalink)
References (12 earlier) <9b09c5e5-27e5-4c44-afbe-7c76188a7a35@googlegroups.com> <ptjhee$d31$1@dont-email.me> <b0d97ae3-e02b-4b59-b9e1-b0a5fbacf4e1@googlegroups.com> <ptjkb8$dk0$1@dont-email.me> <6f81479c-fb5a-41ff-a4ee-beaa07908343@googlegroups.com>

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On 27/11/18 15:58, Malcolm McLean wrote:
> On Tuesday, November 27, 2018 at 2:29:05 PM UTC, David Brown wrote:
>> On 27/11/18 14:54, Malcolm McLean wrote:
>>
>> You have worm's eye view.  You see C purely in terms of how /you/ want
>> to use it for /your/ programs on /your/ systems - you fail to see how
>> other people use it for other programs on other systems.  You fail to
>> recognise that maybe other people have different needs or wants than
>> your own.
>>
> I use C for general data processing where high performance is required,
> and I started my career as a games programmer. I then did a PhD on
> the protein folding problem, and I now work as a graphics programmer.
> So general purpose programming, for the point of view of C.

That is like saying "I drive my car to work each day, and to the shops
at the weekend - so general driving" and then thinking that all road
users should use the same vehicle as you do.

Your uses of C cover a tiny, tiny spread of how the language is used by
others.  (So do /my/ uses, but I have no illusions about that.)

It is particularly amusing to hear you argue for fewer integer types
when you claim you need high performance.  People using C for high
performance regularly want very careful control of their types, and use
many different types so that they can get maximal use of features like
SIMD processing, maximal hit rates on their caches, etc.

>>
>> So let me again stress that it is /fine/ for you, Malcolm, to write "/I/
>> only need five types of integers".  It is /not/ fine for you to write
>> "/you/ only need five types of integers", or "/we/ only need five types
>> of integers", or "/C/ only needs five types of integers".
>>
> The machine has only half a dozen or so register types, and half a
> dozen or so store / load formats. That's not specific to me or the
> hardware that I happen to use. 
>  

Modern PC processors have dozens of hardware types.  Most code does not
need them, of course, but the many vector formats of different sizes and
granularity exist.

>>>>
>>>> If five types are enough for you, then use just those five types in your
>>>> programming.  But please do not imagine that your limited usage is
>>>> representative of how others want to use C.
>>>>
>>> I've given you an argument why five types are enough. 
>>
>> You have given a rather vague description about why /you/ don't need
>> more integer sizes and signednesses than the ones you like.  It provides
>> no useful reasoning why anyone would need the types you want, and no
>> useful reasoning why anyone would want additional types /not/ to exist.
>>  I can't see anything in what you wrote that could not be satisfied with
>> just two types - signed 64-bit and unsigned 8-bit (which you state is
>> necessary, without justification).  And there is not the slightest
>> indication of why you don't want other people to have the sizes and
>> types they might want to have.
>>
> In fact I personally need only two types. ssize_t and byte. But I'm not
> giving my own personal needs as those of everybody, I'm aware that 
> there are embedded programmers who need the micro-efficiency of smaller 
> types. The processor normally has instructions for loads / saves of those 
> types, more rarely it has different register widths. 

Oh, so you really thought you were covering all the needs of embedded
programmers and every other C programmer?  Honestly?

>>
>> And all your post is about the size and signedness of basic types.  The
>> discussion, however, was about /other/ integer types - those which in C
>> are derived as aliases of the fundamental types.  There is nothing about
>> why people may or may not want size_t, ptrdiff_t, fpos_t, or whatever else.
>>
>> So no, you haven't given much of an argument about anything.
>>
>>> Now you seem to
>>> believe that "that may be true for you, but don''t try to claim
>>> it's true for anyone else". That's an amazingly common position to
>>> take, and of course it is nonsense.
>>>
>>
>> Are you trying to suggest that you really do speak for the C programming
>> community at large with these posts?  Are you telling me I am talking
>> nonsense when I say I have use for signed and unsigned types from 8-bit
>> up to 64-bit, or when I say I use a variety of other integer types (some
>> standard, some application-specific)?
>>
> I speak to the C community. The sheer proliferation of integer types
> has become a problem.

What is your justification for this, beyond the sample of you and Bart?
 We know from experience that you have your own way of thinking, your
own way of coding, your own terminology, and your own ideas about what
types are needed (which is fair enough, for your own programming - but
it does not carry over to other people).  We also know that Bart has
enormous difficulties about learning /anything/ related to C, and he
rejects all help, advice and knowledge.

So outside of this, what evidence do you have for the integer types in C
being a problem?  What evidence do you have for suggesting it has
/become/ a problem - that someone everything was fine at some point in
the past, and now it is not?

> It makes it difficult to learn C, it makes C
> programs harder to understand than otherwise, and it complicates the
> interactions between the different components of a large C program -
> the last maybe isn't an issue for you if you write the entire 
> program for a smallish embedded system in one consistent manner, but
> it becomes a problem when integrating C source from more than one
> origin. 
> 

I can certainly agree that mixing types from different places can
complicate things, and that too many different types is unhelpful.  That
applies to all sorts of things - split files into too many bits, have
too many functions in your API, too many buttons on your GUI window.
That does not mean you should not use appropriate types, or that you
should not abstract your types when it makes sense!

One situation where multiple types can be a pain in small embedded
systems is that a fair number of libraries, RTOS'es, etc., are written
for C90 rather than C99.  And these usually need size-specific integer
types - but they can't use the standard C99 <stdint.h> types.  So it is
not uncommon to see libraries with their own U32, or uint32, or U32_t,
types.  That kind of thing is ugly and unnecessary, and /can/ cause
trouble, but nothing insurmountable.

> I am not convinced that you need, in the C standard, a whole list of
> abstract types which are defined in terms of the basic types. 

Let's just take the example from earlier.  How would /you/ define the
return type for clock() ?  Remembering that modern PC users probably
want 1µs or 1ns precision and ranges for years, while 8-bit embedded
systems might want 1ms precision covering days?

> Types
> with units or fixed-precision real types, those are different issues,
> but best handled at a higher level than the core C language.
> Generally if you are writing code which needs integers with characteristics
> other than the range of values they can represent, you know what platform
> you are targeting anyway, so there is no point having all the aliases
> in the standard. 
> 

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Thread

_mingw_off_t.h bart4858@gmail.com - 2018-11-25 14:38 -0800
  Re: _mingw_off_t.h Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2018-11-26 03:19 -0800
    Re: _mingw_off_t.h David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2018-11-26 12:48 +0100
    Re: _mingw_off_t.h Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2018-11-26 13:29 +0000
      Re: _mingw_off_t.h Reinhardt Behm <rbehm@hushmail.com> - 2018-11-26 22:02 +0800
        Re: _mingw_off_t.h Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2018-11-26 16:09 +0000
        Re: _mingw_off_t.h bart4858@gmail.com - 2018-11-26 09:11 -0800
      Re: _mingw_off_t.h bart4858@gmail.com - 2018-11-26 06:34 -0800
      Re: _mingw_off_t.h Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2018-11-26 06:39 -0800
        Re: _mingw_off_t.h Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2018-11-26 16:06 +0000
          Re: _mingw_off_t.h Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2018-11-26 09:01 -0800
            Re: _mingw_off_t.h scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2018-11-26 17:04 +0000
              Re: _mingw_off_t.h Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2018-11-26 09:19 -0800
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2018-11-26 22:19 +0100
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2018-11-26 14:11 -0800
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2018-11-27 00:29 +0000
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h gazelle@shell.xmission.com (Kenny McCormack) - 2018-11-27 09:44 +0000
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h "Rick C. Hodgin" <rick.c.hodgin@gmail.com> - 2018-11-27 01:49 -0800
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2018-11-27 04:21 -0800
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h "Rick C. Hodgin" <rick.c.hodgin@gmail.com> - 2018-11-27 04:25 -0800
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h bart4858@gmail.com - 2018-11-27 04:51 -0800
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h gazelle@shell.xmission.com (Kenny McCormack) - 2018-11-27 13:19 +0000
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2018-11-26 17:26 -0800
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2018-11-27 08:16 +0100
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h bart4858@gmail.com - 2018-11-27 04:18 -0800
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2018-11-27 04:48 -0800
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h bart4858@gmail.com - 2018-11-27 05:09 -0800
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2018-11-27 14:39 +0100
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2018-11-27 05:54 -0800
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2018-11-27 15:28 +0100
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2018-11-27 06:58 -0800
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2018-11-27 15:03 +0000
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2018-11-27 07:13 -0800
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2018-11-27 16:55 +0100
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2018-11-27 09:02 -0800
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2018-11-27 17:11 +0000
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2018-11-27 09:17 -0800
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2018-11-27 17:48 +0000
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h Bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2018-11-27 20:35 +0000
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h Ian Collins <ian-news@hotmail.com> - 2018-11-28 15:42 +1300
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2018-11-28 02:44 -0800
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h Ian Collins <ian-news@hotmail.com> - 2018-11-28 23:52 +1300
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2018-11-28 03:42 -0800
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h Anton Shepelev <anton.txt@g{oogle}mail.com> - 2018-11-28 15:48 +0300
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2018-11-28 05:24 -0800
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h Anton Shepelev <anton.txt@g{oogle}mail.com> - 2018-11-28 17:30 +0300
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2018-11-28 13:59 +0100
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2018-11-28 05:33 -0800
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2018-11-28 14:31 +0000
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2018-11-28 23:19 +0100
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2018-11-29 01:35 -0800
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2018-11-29 13:25 +0100
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2018-11-28 14:28 +0000
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h Anton Shepelev <anton.txt@g{oogle}mail.com> - 2018-11-28 17:33 +0300
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2018-11-28 06:56 -0800
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h Bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2018-11-28 11:53 +0000
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h Bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2018-11-28 12:09 +0000
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2018-11-28 01:26 -0800
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h mark.bluemel@gmail.com - 2018-11-28 02:57 -0800
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h jameskuyper@alumni.caltech.edu - 2018-11-27 09:49 -0800
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2018-11-27 11:31 -0800
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2018-11-27 20:34 +0000
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2018-11-27 22:45 +0100
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2018-11-27 14:12 +0000
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2018-11-27 11:32 -0800
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2018-11-27 14:36 +0100
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h Bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2018-11-27 14:45 +0000
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2018-11-27 15:02 +0000
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2018-11-27 16:29 +0100
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2018-11-27 15:51 +0000
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h Bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2018-11-27 16:00 +0000
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2018-11-27 23:40 +0100
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h Bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2018-11-28 01:22 +0000
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h Ian Collins <ian-news@hotmail.com> - 2018-11-28 15:57 +1300
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2018-11-28 08:29 +0100
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h Bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2018-11-28 11:38 +0000
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h Anton Shepelev <anton.txt@g{oogle}mail.com> - 2018-11-28 16:02 +0300
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h Bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2018-11-28 13:35 +0000
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h Robert Wessel <robertwessel2@yahoo.com> - 2018-11-28 08:14 -0600
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2018-11-28 13:33 +0000
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h Bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2018-11-28 14:25 +0000
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2018-11-28 15:25 +0100
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h Bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2018-11-28 15:06 +0000
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2018-11-28 07:43 -0800
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2018-11-28 15:49 +0000
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h jameskuyper@alumni.caltech.edu - 2018-11-28 08:16 -0800
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h Bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2018-11-28 17:56 +0000
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2018-11-28 23:27 +0100
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2018-11-28 20:12 +0000
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h Tim Rentsch <txr@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2018-11-29 09:58 -0800
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2018-11-29 13:04 +0100
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h Bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2018-11-29 12:41 +0000
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h Richard Damon <Richard@Damon-Family.org> - 2018-11-29 08:19 -0500
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h Bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2018-11-29 14:28 +0000
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h Richard Damon <Richard@Damon-Family.org> - 2018-11-29 22:25 -0500
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h Bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2018-11-30 11:59 +0000
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h Richard Damon <Richard@Damon-Family.org> - 2018-11-30 08:02 -0500
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h Bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2018-11-30 14:09 +0000
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h Richard Damon <Richard@Damon-Family.org> - 2018-11-30 10:30 -0500
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2018-11-30 16:02 +0000
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h Jorgen Grahn <grahn+nntp@snipabacken.se> - 2018-11-30 16:40 +0000
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2018-11-30 17:23 +0000
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h Tim Rentsch <txr@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2018-12-01 07:47 -0800
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h Richard Damon <Richard@Damon-Family.org> - 2018-12-01 13:46 -0500
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2018-12-01 12:08 -0800
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2018-12-02 12:57 +0100
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2018-12-02 16:21 +0000
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2018-12-02 20:42 +0100
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2018-12-02 22:04 +0000
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2018-12-02 23:49 +0100
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h Anton Shepelev <anton.txt@g{oogle}mail.com> - 2018-11-30 16:35 +0300
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h Bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2018-11-30 14:19 +0000
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2018-11-30 14:58 +0000
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h Richard Damon <Richard@Damon-Family.org> - 2018-11-30 10:33 -0500
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2018-11-30 15:45 +0100
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2018-11-30 14:22 +0000
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h Bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2018-11-30 15:20 +0000
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2018-11-29 14:54 +0100
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2018-11-29 06:03 -0800
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2018-11-29 16:09 +0100
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h Bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2018-11-29 16:44 +0000
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2018-11-29 22:08 +0100
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h Bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2018-11-29 22:29 +0000
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2018-11-30 10:27 +0100
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2018-11-30 01:49 -0800
                "real" programming langauges? (Was: _mingw_off_t.h) gazelle@shell.xmission.com (Kenny McCormack) - 2018-12-01 08:18 +0000
                Re: "real" programming langauges? (Was: _mingw_off_t.h) David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2018-12-01 18:02 +0100
                That time back in 1987... (Was: "real" programming langauges? (Was: _mingw_off_t.h)) gazelle@shell.xmission.com (Kenny McCormack) - 2018-12-01 17:31 +0000
                Re: That time back in 1987... (Was: "real" programming langauges? (Was: _mingw_off_t.h)) David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2018-12-02 13:03 +0100
                Re: That time back in 1987... (Was: "real" programming langauges? (Was: _mingw_off_t.h)) James Kuyper <jameskuyper@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2018-12-02 23:05 -0500
                Re: That time back in 1987... (Was: "real" programming langauges? (Was: _mingw_off_t.h)) David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2018-12-03 11:38 +0100
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2018-11-30 02:00 -0800
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h Ian Collins <ian-news@hotmail.com> - 2018-11-30 08:16 +1300
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h Bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2018-11-29 20:49 +0000
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h Ian Collins <ian-news@hotmail.com> - 2018-11-30 19:39 +1300
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h gazelle@shell.xmission.com (Kenny McCormack) - 2018-11-30 10:37 +0000
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h Bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2018-11-30 20:21 +0000
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2018-11-30 20:23 +0000
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h Ian Collins <ian-news@hotmail.com> - 2018-12-01 10:13 +1300
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h Bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2018-11-30 22:14 +0000
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h Ian Collins <ian-news@hotmail.com> - 2018-12-01 11:29 +1300
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h Richard Damon <Richard@Damon-Family.org> - 2018-11-30 18:32 -0500
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2018-11-30 23:47 +0000
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2018-12-01 18:05 +0100
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h Richard Damon <Richard@Damon-Family.org> - 2018-12-01 13:29 -0500
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h Tim Rentsch <txr@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2018-12-01 07:28 -0800
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h Bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2018-12-01 16:49 +0000
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h Ian Collins <ian-news@hotmail.com> - 2018-11-29 08:53 +1300
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2018-11-28 20:01 +0000
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h Bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2018-11-28 21:15 +0000
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2018-11-28 21:26 +0000
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h Bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2018-11-29 00:22 +0000
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2018-11-29 14:14 +0000
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h Bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2018-11-29 14:54 +0000
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2018-11-28 14:19 +0000
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h Robert Wessel <robertwessel2@yahoo.com> - 2018-11-27 16:44 -0600
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h Ike Naar <ike@iceland.freeshell.org> - 2018-11-29 22:58 +0000
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h Bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2018-11-30 00:58 +0000
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2018-11-27 14:11 +0000
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2018-11-27 06:28 -0800
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h Bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2018-11-27 15:14 +0000
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2018-11-27 07:41 -0800
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h Bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2018-11-27 16:11 +0000
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h Tim Rentsch <txr@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2018-11-29 10:00 -0800
            Re: _mingw_off_t.h Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2018-11-26 17:24 +0000
              Re: _mingw_off_t.h Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2018-11-26 10:57 -0800
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2018-11-26 19:06 +0000
                Re: _mingw_off_t.h bart4858@gmail.com - 2018-11-26 12:16 -0800
  Re: _mingw_off_t.h David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2018-11-26 12:52 +0100
    Re: _mingw_off_t.h bart4858@gmail.com - 2018-11-26 04:17 -0800
      Re: _mingw_off_t.h David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2018-11-26 14:40 +0100
    What is wrong with this sentence? (Was: _mingw_off_t.h) gazelle@shell.xmission.com (Kenny McCormack) - 2018-11-26 13:34 +0000
      Re: What is wrong with this sentence? (Was: _mingw_off_t.h) Anton Shepelev <anton.txt@g{oogle}mail.com> - 2018-11-26 16:39 +0300
        Re: What is wrong with this sentence? (Was: _mingw_off_t.h) bart4858@gmail.com - 2018-11-26 06:13 -0800
          Re: What is wrong with this sentence? (Was: _mingw_off_t.h) David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2018-11-26 16:13 +0100
      Re: What is wrong with this sentence? (Was: _mingw_off_t.h) David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2018-11-26 14:42 +0100
    Re: _mingw_off_t.h Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2018-11-26 13:02 -0800
      Re: _mingw_off_t.h David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2018-11-26 22:24 +0100
  Re: _mingw_off_t.h scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2018-11-26 14:38 +0000

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