Re: Light Speed Limit

From	Sergio <invalid@invalid.com>
Newsgroups	sci.physics
Subject	Re: Light Speed Limit
Date	2018-08-18 21:24 -0500
Organization	Aioe.org NNTP Server
Message-ID	<plakde$j1p$1@gioia.aioe.org> (permalink)
References	(16 earlier) <pl7ioo$61o$1@gioia.aioe.org> <pl954k$a1a$1@gioia.aioe.org> <pl9acr$j5p$2@gioia.aioe.org> <pla0a8$1muu$1@gioia.aioe.org> <d4c0c2d5-f2a7-47ec-83a0-e2362f7776bd@googlegroups.com>

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On 8/18/2018 6:47 PM, Edward Prochak wrote:
> On Saturday, August 18, 2018 at 4:41:48 PM UTC-4, benj wrote:
>> On 8/18/2018 10:27 AM, Odd Bodkin wrote:
>>> benj <benj.fake@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> On 8/17/2018 6:38 PM, Odd Bodkin wrote:
>>>>> benj <benj.fake@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>> On 8/17/2018 4:39 PM, Odd Bodkin wrote:
>>>>>>> benj <benj.fake@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>> On 8/17/2018 12:41 PM, Odd Bodkin wrote:
>>>>>>>>> john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> Odd
>>>>>>>>>> “And if it isn’t presented like a comic book illustration
>>>>>>>>>> to John, the way he’d like it, then it is WRONG.
>>>>>>>>>> “
>>>>>>>>>> Present it ANY OTHER way
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> The way that it’s in books is perfect for me and I’m a woodworker. Why
>>>>>>>>> doesn’t that work for you???
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> and have it make sense.
>>>>>>>>>> You can’t because it’s mathematical smoke and mirrors.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Mathematics is a language. You just have to learn it. Calling it smoke and
>>>>>>>>> mirrors to avoid that is just a pathetic excuse.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> And English is a language. Where did you ever get the wacko idea that it
>>>>>>>> is not possible to translate from one language to another? Your ideas
>>>>>>>> are anti-intellectual babble. Suffice it to say, Odd, that even though I
>>>>>>>> am a shit mathematician I speak and understand the language of
>>>>>>>> mathematics FAR more fluently than you do.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Ah good. Then please demonstrate. Please translate Maxwell’s equations into
>>>>>>> language plain enough that John will acquire an accurate understanding of
>>>>>>> their physics content.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I’ll wait here for the delivery of what you assure is straightforward.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> So if I tell you (oh barmaid and carpenter) that if one measures the
>>>>>> magnetic force one finds at every place on some surface in space (say
>>>>>> enclosing a magnet) then the sum total of those forces will always add
>>>>>> up to zero, you somehow think this is not straightforward?
>>>>>
>>>>> This you believe represents the physics content of Maxwell’s equations?????
>>>>>
>>>>> And furthermore you believe that is the accurate statement that captures
>>>>> del*B = 0???
>>>>
>>>> And you believe that the essence includes the rules of mathematics? This
>>>> shows just how far you are removed from science. Sure I can explain the
>>>> rules of math (what vectors are, what fields are, how one takes an
>>>> integral and so one, but that is mathematics. You asked for a
>>>> translation of the essence which I did.
>>>
>>> And you did it very badly. Want to dive in and see why?
>>>
>>> Let’s start with “measures the magnetic force” everywhere on a surface.
>>> Force on what?
>>
>> I take it you have never noticed that magnets produce a force on each 
>> other. It's one of the basic facts of reality. "Badly" is your 
>> understanding of science.
> 
> Ah but you are showing how poorly the english translation works.
> Because to test it I still have to go back to the numbers and do
> summations. Show me have to do that clearly and efficiently
> in only english. Keep just three significant digits, Okay?
> 
> Ed
> 


hi Ed, I have a great book that discusses the problems of using language
to discuss science.  It was lecture notes from a proff back in the 30's
"the nature of physical theory" by Bridgman, Nobel prize winner, a Dover
book.  probably free somewhere on the internet. He talks about math and
relitivity, wave function too

most of the time in this newsgroup, arguments are over language, it is a
poor medium to transfer knowledge. Lawyers Make $$$$ doing just that,
retranslating overlapping laws for their clients.

Is most advertizing fake news?  (we are constrained by language)

Thread

Light Speed Limit casagiannoni@optonline.net - 2018-08-16 16:14 -0400
  Re: Light Speed Limit mitchrae3323@gmail.com - 2018-08-16 13:33 -0700
  Re: Light Speed Limit Edward Prochak <edprochak@gmail.com> - 2018-08-16 15:12 -0700
    Re: Light Speed Limit benj <benj.fake@gmail.com> - 2018-08-16 19:47 -0400
      Re: Light Speed Limit casagiannoni@optonline.net - 2018-08-16 20:08 -0400
        Re: Light Speed Limit mitchrae3323@gmail.com - 2018-08-16 17:15 -0700
          Re: Light Speed Limit benj <benj.fake@gmail.com> - 2018-08-16 20:32 -0400
            Re: Light Speed Limit mitchrae3323@gmail.com - 2018-08-17 12:55 -0700
        Re: Light Speed Limit benj <benj.fake@gmail.com> - 2018-08-16 20:28 -0400
          Re: Light Speed Limit casagiannoni@optonline.net - 2018-08-17 08:00 -0400
            Re: Light Speed Limit john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> - 2018-08-17 05:48 -0700
              Re: Light Speed Limit casagiannoni@optonline.net - 2018-08-17 10:42 -0400
                Re: Light Speed Limit Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2018-08-17 15:27 +0000
                Re: Light Speed Limit john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> - 2018-08-17 08:37 -0700
                Re: Light Speed Limit Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2018-08-17 15:47 +0000
                Re: Light Speed Limit john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> - 2018-08-17 09:03 -0700
                Re: Light Speed Limit Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2018-08-17 16:41 +0000
                Re: Light Speed Limit benj <benj.fake@gmail.com> - 2018-08-17 14:19 -0400
                Re: Light Speed Limit Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2018-08-17 20:39 +0000
                Re: Light Speed Limit benj <benj.fake@gmail.com> - 2018-08-17 18:29 -0400
                Re: Light Speed Limit Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2018-08-17 22:38 +0000
                Re: Light Speed Limit benj <benj.fake@gmail.com> - 2018-08-18 08:57 -0400
                Re: Light Speed Limit Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2018-08-18 14:27 +0000
                Re: Light Speed Limit benj <benj.fake@gmail.com> - 2018-08-18 16:41 -0400
                Re: Light Speed Limit Edward Prochak <edprochak@gmail.com> - 2018-08-18 16:47 -0700
                Re: Light Speed Limit Sergio <invalid@invalid.com> - 2018-08-18 21:24 -0500
                Re: Light Speed Limit Edward Prochak <edprochak@gmail.com> - 2018-08-19 20:27 -0700
                Re: Light Speed Limit benj <benj.fake@gmail.com> - 2018-08-20 14:40 -0400
                Re: Light Speed Limit Edward Prochak <edprochak@gmail.com> - 2018-08-21 15:09 -0700
                Re: Light Speed Limit benj <benj.fake@gmail.com> - 2018-08-18 23:03 -0400
                Re: Light Speed Limit Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2018-08-19 18:26 +0000
                Re: Light Speed Limit benj <benj.fake@gmail.com> - 2018-08-20 14:00 -0400
                Re: Light Speed Limit Edward Prochak <edprochak@gmail.com> - 2018-08-19 20:39 -0700
                Re: Light Speed Limit benj <benj.fake@gmail.com> - 2018-08-20 14:50 -0400
                Re: Light Speed Limit Edward Prochak <edprochak@gmail.com> - 2018-08-21 15:24 -0700
                Re: Light Speed Limit Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2018-08-19 01:20 +0000
                Re: Light Speed Limit john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> - 2018-08-18 18:33 -0700
                Re: Light Speed Limit Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2018-08-19 18:26 +0000
                Re: Light Speed Limit john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> - 2018-08-19 12:14 -0700
                Re: Light Speed Limit Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2018-08-19 20:47 +0000
                Re: Light Speed Limit john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> - 2018-08-19 14:33 -0700
                Re: Light Speed Limit Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2018-08-19 21:45 +0000
                Re: Light Speed Limit john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> - 2018-08-19 16:28 -0700
                Re: Light Speed Limit Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2018-08-19 23:50 +0000
                Re: Light Speed Limit john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> - 2018-08-20 05:27 -0700
                Re: Light Speed Limit Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2018-08-20 14:29 +0000
                Re: Light Speed Limit Edward Prochak <edprochak@gmail.com> - 2018-08-19 20:48 -0700
                Re: Light Speed Limit benj <benj.fake@gmail.com> - 2018-08-18 22:07 -0400
                Re: Light Speed Limit Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2018-08-19 18:26 +0000
                Re: Light Speed Limit benj <benj.fake@gmail.com> - 2018-08-20 14:09 -0400
                Re: Light Speed Limit Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2018-08-20 19:50 +0000
                Re: Light Speed Limit benj <benj.fake@gmail.com> - 2018-08-20 18:06 -0400
                Re: Light Speed Limit Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2018-08-20 22:22 +0000
                Re: Light Speed Limit Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2018-08-20 22:45 +0000
                Re: Light Speed Limit mitchrae3323@gmail.com - 2018-08-20 17:54 -0700
                Re: Light Speed Limit Sergio <invalid@invalid.com> - 2018-08-20 21:03 -0500
                Re: Light Speed Limit Edward Prochak <edprochak@gmail.com> - 2018-08-21 15:28 -0700
                Re: Light Speed Limit john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> - 2018-08-23 06:19 -0700
                Re: Light Speed Limit Sergio <invalid@invalid.com> - 2018-08-18 16:48 -0500
                Re: Light Speed Limit Edward Prochak <edprochak@gmail.com> - 2018-08-18 16:21 -0700
                Re: Light Speed Limit benj <benj.fake@gmail.com> - 2018-08-17 13:32 -0400
                Re: Light Speed Limit Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2018-08-17 20:26 +0000
                Re: Light Speed Limit benj <benj.fake@gmail.com> - 2018-08-17 18:20 -0400
                Re: Light Speed Limit Edward Prochak <edprochak@gmail.com> - 2018-08-18 15:52 -0700
                Re: Light Speed Limit benj <benj.fake@gmail.com> - 2018-08-18 21:59 -0400
            Re: Light Speed Limit benj <benj.fake@gmail.com> - 2018-08-17 13:21 -0400
          Re: Light Speed Limit Edward Prochak <edprochak@gmail.com> - 2018-08-17 10:27 -0700
            Re: Light Speed Limit benj <benj.fake@gmail.com> - 2018-08-17 18:16 -0400
              Re: Light Speed Limit Edward Prochak <edprochak@gmail.com> - 2018-08-18 16:39 -0700
                Re: Light Speed Limit "reber G=emc^2" <herbertglazier0@gmail.com> - 2018-08-19 10:35 -0700
      Re: Light Speed Limit Edward Prochak <edprochak@gmail.com> - 2018-08-17 10:01 -0700
        Re: Light Speed Limit john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> - 2018-08-17 10:16 -0700
        Re: Light Speed Limit benj <benj.fake@gmail.com> - 2018-08-17 13:59 -0400
          Re: Light Speed Limit Edward Prochak <edprochak@gmail.com> - 2018-08-18 16:12 -0700
            Re: Light Speed Limit john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> - 2018-08-18 17:04 -0700
              Re: Light Speed Limit Edward Prochak <edprochak@gmail.com> - 2018-08-19 20:18 -0700
                Re: Light Speed Limit benj <benj.fake@gmail.com> - 2018-08-20 14:27 -0400
    Re: Light Speed Limit casagiannoni@optonline.net - 2018-08-16 19:50 -0400
      Re: Light Speed Limit Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2018-08-17 00:59 +0000
        Re: Light Speed Limit benj <benj.fake@gmail.com> - 2018-08-17 06:36 -0400
        Re: Light Speed Limit casagiannoni@optonline.net - 2018-08-17 07:47 -0400
          Re: Light Speed Limit Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2018-08-17 13:22 +0000
            Re: Light Speed Limit casagiannoni@optonline.net - 2018-08-17 10:27 -0400
              Re: Light Speed Limit john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> - 2018-08-17 08:10 -0700
                Re: Light Speed Limit Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2018-08-17 15:35 +0000
                Re: Light Speed Limit john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> - 2018-08-17 08:51 -0700
                Re: Light Speed Limit Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2018-08-18 14:27 +0000
              Re: Light Speed Limit Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2018-08-17 15:19 +0000
                Re: Light Speed Limit benj <benj.fake@gmail.com> - 2018-08-17 13:28 -0400
              Re: Light Speed Limit Edward Prochak <edprochak@gmail.com> - 2018-08-17 10:45 -0700
            Re: Light Speed Limit benj <benj.fake@gmail.com> - 2018-08-17 13:27 -0400
      Re: Light Speed Limit Edward Prochak <edprochak@gmail.com> - 2018-08-17 10:18 -0700
        Re: Light Speed Limit casagiannoni@optonline.net - 2018-08-17 13:49 -0400
          Re: Light Speed Limit Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2018-08-17 20:39 +0000
            Re: Light Speed Limit casagiannoni@optonline.net - 2018-08-17 16:47 -0400
              Re: Light Speed Limit Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2018-08-17 20:58 +0000
                Re: Light Speed Limit john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> - 2018-08-17 15:12 -0700
                Re: Light Speed Limit Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2018-08-17 22:33 +0000
          Re: Light Speed Limit Edward Prochak <edprochak@gmail.com> - 2018-08-18 15:57 -0700

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