Groups > sci.physics.relativity > #409665

Re: Measuring time and light

From	Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com>
Newsgroups	sci.physics.relativity
Subject	Re: Measuring time and light
Date	2017-02-17 09:24 -0600
Organization	Aioe.org NNTP Server
Message-ID	<o874ig$epp$1@gioia.aioe.org> (permalink)
References	(15 earlier) <9602395e-72e1-41e1-b827-5e6248214e92@googlegroups.com> <o82fcn$1eq4$4@gioia.aioe.org> <928616d3-4fbd-402d-95ac-522a0486deee@googlegroups.com> <o871lu$9ka$4@gioia.aioe.org> <cd9e5437-7083-4bbe-9787-e8bd0b53fb3b@googlegroups.com>

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On 2/17/2017 9:05 AM, Ed Lake wrote:
> On Friday, February 17, 2017 at 8:34:41 AM UTC-6, Odd Bodkin wrote:
>> On 2/16/2017 9:04 AM, Ed Lake wrote:
>>> On Wednesday, February 15, 2017 at 2:58:02 PM UTC-6, Odd Bodkin wrote:
>>>> On 2/15/2017 9:10 AM, Ed Lake wrote:
>>>>> On Tuesday, February 14, 2017 at 3:54:28 PM UTC-6, Odd Bodkin wrote:
>>>>>> On 2/14/2017 3:10 PM, Ed Lake wrote:
>>>>>>> The problem is: for over 110 years many in the physics community have been MISINTERPRETING Einstein's theories
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Ed, here is what Einstein wrote about the subject of light's incoming
>>>>>> speed being independent of the observer. This is from chapter 7 of his
>>>>>> popular book on Relativy, the Special and General Theories:
>>>>>> ====================================================================
>>>>>> Of course we must refer the process of the propagation of light (and
>>>>>> indeed every other process) to a rigid reference-body (co-ordinate
>>>>>> system). As such a system let us again choose our embankment. We shall
>>>>>> imagine the air above it to have been removed. If a ray of light be sent
>>>>>> along the embankment, we see from the above that the tip of the ray will
>>>>>> be transmitted with the velocity c relative to the embankment. Now let
>>>>>> us suppose that our railway carriage is again travelling along the
>>>>>> railway lines with the velocity v, and that its direction is the same as
>>>>>> that of the ray of light, but its velocity of course much less. Let us
>>>>>> inquire about the velocity of propagation of the ray of light relative
>>>>>> to the carriage. It is obvious that we can here apply the consideration
>>>>>> of the previous section, since the ray of light plays the part of the
>>>>>> man walking along relatively to the carriage. The velocity W of the man
>>>>>> relative to the embankment is here replaced by the velocity of light
>>>>>> relative to the embankment. w is the required velocity of light with
>>>>>> respect to the carriage, and we have
>>>>>> w = c - v.
>>>>>> The velocity of propagation of a ray of light relative to the carriage
>>>>>> thus comes out smaller than c.	
>>>>>>    But this result comes into conflict with the principle of relativity
>>>>>> set forth in Section V. For, like every other general law of nature, the
>>>>>> law of the transmission of light in vacuo must, according to the
>>>>>> principle of relativity, be the same for the railway carriage as
>>>>>> reference-body as when the rails are the body of reference.
>>>>>> =================================================================
>>>>>>
>>>>>> In case you found this hard to understand, he is saying that the speed
>>>>>> of the same ray of light is the SAME for the embankment observer as it
>>>>>> is for the carriage observer, even though the *expectation* is that it
>>>>>> will be less for the light coming into the carriage observer w = c - v.
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> No, he is NOT.  He is just laying the groundwork for resolving the "apparent conflict"
>>>>> between "the principle of relativity" and "the law of propagation of light in vacuo."
>>>>> I have a copy of the book in my computer.  On later pages he explains how it can APPEAR
>>>>> from one perspective (or frame of reference) that there is a conflict, but if you truly
>>>>> understand relativity, there is no conflict.  And it all leads into the next chapter:
>>>>> "On the Idea of Time in Physics."
>>>>
>>>> You seem to have difficulty understanding what you are reading.
>>>> What he says above is that the principle of relativity insists that the
>>>> speed of the light ray is c for the carriage observer, and the speed of
>>>> the same light ray is c for the embankment observer. That is, the speed
>>>> of the same light is the SAME regardless of the motion of the observers.
>>>>
>>>> What he also says above is that there APPEARS to be a conflict with what
>>>> this principle insists is true and our expectations that the speed
>>>> should be w=c-v. But, as he promises, this conflict will be resolved. It
>>>> will be resolved, as you will read later, by noting that the way to
>>>> combine the speeds is not by w = c-v at all. In fact, the proper way to
>>>> form the composition of speeds is what's in his 1905 paper, which you
>>>> did not read until I pointed out to you. When I did this, you declared
>>>> that this result BY EINSTEIN looked like garbage-in, garbage-out
>>>> mathematics. And in the same breath you say that you BELIEVE Einstein's
>>>> statements but think they have been misinterpreted. How do you think
>>>> Einstein's result on the composition of velocities is BEING
>>>> MISINTERPRETED, Ed?
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> And time dilation is what it is all about.  You see one thing, I see
>>>>> something else, but neither is incorrect.  We just experience time
>>>>> passing at a different rate due to time dilation.  He then goes into
>>>>> "The Relativity of Simulatneity."  And in that he chapter says,
>>>>>
>>>>> "Are two events (e.g. the two strokes of lightning A and B) which are
>>>>> simultaneous with reference to the railway embankment also simultaneous
>>>>> relatively to the train?  We shall show directly that the answer must be in the negative."
>>>>
>>>> Right! And in an earlier conversation you declared that what is
>>>> simultaneous in two one observer must also be simultaneous to other
>>>> observers! And you say that physicists have MISINTERPRETED what Einstein
>>>> said? Who is doing the misinterpretation, Ed? It's YOU!
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> It's all very complicated and Einstein seems to explain it in the most complicated
>>>>> manner imaginable.  But, when simplified, it is exactly what I have been saying.
>>>>
>>>> It's not complicated, Ed. He's explaining it in a way that would be
>>>> understandable to a barmaid.
>>>>
>>>> What he is pointing out is that what is simultaneous in one frame will
>>>> not be simultaneous in another frame. Two clocks that are synchronized
>>>> in one frame will NOT by synchronized in another frame.
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> When you claim that Einstein NEVER SAID that the speed of light relative
>>>>>> to the observer did not vary with the motion of the observer, you are
>>>>>> FLAT WRONG. You just didn't read enough of what Einstein said.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Now that it is clear that the one who is misinterpreting Einstein's
>>>>>> theory is YOU, what now?
>>>>>
>>>>> Now I think it is time for you to try to explain things in your on words
>>>>> instead of referring to books and papers you do not understand and CLAIMING that
>>>>> they somehow support your BELIEFS.
>>>>
>>>> I think what you are starting to come to realize is that you do not
>>>> understand the simple language that Einstein used to explain relativity
>>>> to a barmaid, and you are now appealing to me to explain it to you in a
>>>> way that even you (let alone a barmaid) will understand.
>>>>
>>>> What I'm telling you is that you have overshot and you need to go back
>>>> and learn some BASIC physics, under and prior to relativity. You do not
>>>> even understand the physics of Galileo and Newton from 400 years back.
>>>>
>>>> I don't care that you don't WANT to do that. What I'm telling you is
>>>> that you are obviously having difficulty understanding the basics of
>>>> relativity, and this is because you don't understand the basics PRIOR TO
>>>> relativity, and there is no way to perform a shortcut.
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Ed
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> Odd Bodkin -- maker of fine toys, tools, tables
>>>
>>> Can't you understand English?!?!  I DO NOT CARE ABOUT YOUR OPINIONS AND BELIEFS!
>>> You are just wasting my time by endlessly arguing that I should do things the way
>>> you do them so that I will believe as you believe!
>>
>> I'm not presenting you with opinions and beliefs. I'm presenting you
>> with Einstein's words, which are in DIRECT CONTRADICTION to what you
>> claim he says.
>>
>> You say he says nothing about the speed of light being independent of
>> observer, where in fact in the book Relativity, the Special and General
>> Theories, he clearly does.
>>
>> You say that, according to Einstein, two clocks that are synchronized in
>> one reference frame will still be seen as synchronized in another
>> reference frame; I gave you a quote from his 1905 paper that is in
>> direct contradiction with that, and you confessed you were probably wrong.
>>
>> You say that, according to relativity, the incoming light to a moving
>> observer, if measured, would be approaching at c+v, when in fact
>> Einstein is EXPLICIT in saying the incoming speed would be c in the
>> section on composition of velocities.
>>
>> Now, if you are going to tell me that YOU DO NOT CARE about the
>> differences between what you say Einstein said and what he ACTUALLY
>> said, then I think you will have firmly placed yourself in "crank"
>> status, and you will see how that reflects in the reception your
>> submitted paper receives.
>>
>> It is the hallmark of a crank that, due to lack of reading, he arrives
>> at an obviously erroneous conclusion, and when additional material is
>> brought to him that shows his error, he refuses to acknowledge the error
>> and stands by his mistaken beliefs. The crank has a real problem with
>> acknowledging mistakes. The crank gets offended when someone suggests to
>> him that he should be reading more and talking less. The crank gets
>> offended when it's pointed out that basic physics and mathematical and
>> experimental skills are prerequisite to doing anything interesting in
>> physics.
>>
>>>
>>> Ed
>>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Odd Bodkin -- maker of fine toys, tools, tables
>
> What I'm seeing is that you CLAIM Einstein MEANT something different from what he wrote when he defined
> his Second Postulate to his Special Theory of Relativity.  I.e., you claim to be a mind reader!

No, sir. I have taken the two postulates TOGETHER to arrive at that 
conclusion, which is what Einstein CLEARLY does but which you do not 
understand.

>
> You ARGUE that his book "Relativity, the Special and General Theories" somewhere,

I told you EXACTLY where.

> somehow agrees with
> you, when it clearly does NOT.

Then we have a disagreement. Furthermore, other readers of Einstein 
agree with me and disagree with you. I think you have a reading 
comprehension problem, and you are claiming that no one else understands 
what he wrote but you do.

What's interesting is that you say that Einstein presents things in a 
complicated and hard-to-follow fashion, where other people do not seem 
to think it hard. And yet you claim to have the singularly better 
understanding of what he said.

> You cannot explain anything, of course, you just want me to believe as you believe.

I can't help you if you do not understand simple statements intended for 
a barmaid to be able to follow.

>
> All you are doing is making it more clear to me that YOU HAVE NO VALID ARGUMENTS.
> All you can argue is that I must study what you study so that I will believe as you believe.

I certainly say you should study what Einstein ACTUALLY WROTE before 
claiming to interpret what he said correctly. If you think this is a bad 
idea because it will somehow force the conclusions in a particular 
direction, then you are an arrogant fool.

>
> You are wasting my time.
>
> Ed
>


-- 
Odd Bodkin -- maker of fine toys, tools, tables

Thread

Measuring time and light Ed Lake <detect@newsguy.com> - 2017-02-09 09:28 -0800
  Re: Measuring time and light rotchm <rotchm@gmail.com> - 2017-02-09 09:47 -0800
    Re: Measuring time and light rotchm <rotchm@gmail.com> - 2017-02-09 18:28 -0800
  Re: Measuring time and light rotchm <rotchm@gmail.com> - 2017-02-09 09:53 -0800
    Re: Measuring time and light Ed Lake <detect@newsguy.com> - 2017-02-09 12:41 -0800
      Re: Measuring time and light Ed Lake <detect@newsguy.com> - 2017-02-09 13:37 -0800
        Re: Measuring time and light "David (Lord Kronos Prime) Fuller" <fuller.david@hotmail.com> - 2017-02-09 14:40 -0800
        Re: Measuring time and light John Heath <heathjohn2@gmail.com> - 2017-02-09 15:00 -0800
          Re: Measuring time and light Dirk Van de moortel <dirkvandemoortel@hotspam.not> - 2017-02-10 00:30 +0100
          Re: Measuring time and light Ed Lake <detect@newsguy.com> - 2017-02-10 06:44 -0800
            Re: Measuring time and light rotchm <rotchm@gmail.com> - 2017-02-10 11:03 -0800
              Re: Measuring time and light Ed Lake <detect@newsguy.com> - 2017-02-10 12:50 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light rotchm <rotchm@gmail.com> - 2017-02-10 13:51 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light "David (Lord Kronos Prime) Fuller" <fuller.david@hotmail.com> - 2017-02-10 16:09 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Poutnik <poutnik4nntp@gmail.com> - 2017-02-11 08:37 +0100
                Re: Measuring time and light Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-02-11 20:43 -0600
                Re: Measuring time and light Ed Lake <detect@newsguy.com> - 2017-02-12 07:44 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light "David (Lord Kronos Prime) Fuller" <fuller.david@hotmail.com> - 2017-02-12 07:51 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Ed Lake <detect@newsguy.com> - 2017-02-12 08:25 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light "David (Lord Kronos Prime) Fuller" <fuller.david@hotmail.com> - 2017-02-12 08:31 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Ed Lake <detect@newsguy.com> - 2017-02-12 08:39 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light "David (Lord Kronos Prime) Fuller" <fuller.david@hotmail.com> - 2017-02-12 08:45 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-02-12 15:34 -0600
                Re: Measuring time and light Ed Lake <detect@newsguy.com> - 2017-02-13 07:07 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-02-13 09:39 -0600
            Re: Measuring time and light John Heath <heathjohn2@gmail.com> - 2017-02-11 10:22 -0800
              Re: Measuring time and light "David (Lord Kronos Prime) Fuller" <fuller.david@hotmail.com> - 2017-02-11 10:47 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Ed Lake <detect@newsguy.com> - 2017-02-11 12:56 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light "David (Lord Kronos Prime) Fuller" <fuller.david@hotmail.com> - 2017-02-11 13:50 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light "David (Lord Kronos Prime) Fuller" <fuller.david@hotmail.com> - 2017-02-11 13:58 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Ed Lake <detect@newsguy.com> - 2017-02-11 14:03 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light "David (Lord Kronos Prime) Fuller" <fuller.david@hotmail.com> - 2017-02-11 14:26 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light "David (Lord Kronos Prime) Fuller" <fuller.david@hotmail.com> - 2017-02-11 14:27 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light rotchm <rotchm@gmail.com> - 2017-02-11 16:30 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Ed Lake <detect@newsguy.com> - 2017-02-12 07:31 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2017-02-15 06:27 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light rotchm <rotchm@gmail.com> - 2017-02-15 06:31 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Poutnik <poutnik4nntp@gmail.com> - 2017-02-15 16:06 +0100
                Re: Measuring time and light Sanjuanita Peeples <naalu@nwmeela.org> - 2017-02-15 17:48 +0000
                Re: Measuring time and light kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2017-02-15 07:11 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light rotchm <rotchm@gmail.com> - 2017-02-15 07:31 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Poutnik <poutnik4nntp@gmail.com> - 2017-02-12 09:53 +0100
                Re: Measuring time and light John Heath <heathjohn2@gmail.com> - 2017-02-11 15:12 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2017-02-12 06:43 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Ed Lake <detect@newsguy.com> - 2017-02-12 07:56 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light "David (Lord Kronos Prime) Fuller" <fuller.david@hotmail.com> - 2017-02-12 08:06 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Ed Lake <detect@newsguy.com> - 2017-02-12 08:27 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light "David (Lord Kronos Prime) Fuller" <fuller.david@hotmail.com> - 2017-02-12 08:43 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Ed Lake <detect@newsguy.com> - 2017-02-12 07:17 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light "David (Lord Kronos Prime) Fuller" <fuller.david@hotmail.com> - 2017-02-12 07:35 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light "David (Lord Kronos Prime) Fuller" <fuller.david@hotmail.com> - 2017-02-12 07:45 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Ed Lake <detect@newsguy.com> - 2017-02-12 08:18 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light "David (Lord Kronos Prime) Fuller" <fuller.david@hotmail.com> - 2017-02-12 08:27 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Ed Lake <detect@newsguy.com> - 2017-02-12 08:29 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light "David (Lord Kronos Prime) Fuller" <fuller.david@hotmail.com> - 2017-02-12 08:35 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Ed Lake <detect@newsguy.com> - 2017-02-14 08:55 -0800
              Re: Measuring time and light Ed Lake <detect@newsguy.com> - 2017-02-11 12:36 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Poutnik <poutnik4nntp@gmail.com> - 2017-02-11 21:57 +0100
                Re: Measuring time and light Ed Lake <detect@newsguy.com> - 2017-02-11 13:03 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Poutnik <poutnik4nntp@gmail.com> - 2017-02-11 22:36 +0100
            Re: Measuring time and light Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-02-11 15:38 -0600
              Re: Measuring time and light Ed Lake <detect@newsguy.com> - 2017-02-11 13:56 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-02-12 15:37 -0600
                Re: Measuring time and light Ed Lake <detect@newsguy.com> - 2017-02-13 07:43 -0800
            Re: Measuring time and light Robert Winn <rbwinn3@gmail.com> - 2017-02-13 07:58 -0800
              Re: Measuring time and light Ed Lake <detect@newsguy.com> - 2017-02-13 08:10 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Ed Lake <detect@newsguy.com> - 2017-02-13 08:34 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Ed Lake <detect@newsguy.com> - 2017-02-13 09:22 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Robert Winn <rbwinn3@gmail.com> - 2017-02-16 07:11 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Ed Lake <detect@newsguy.com> - 2017-02-16 07:44 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light "David (Lord Kronos Prime) Fuller" <fuller.david@hotmail.com> - 2017-02-16 07:49 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Robert Winn <rbwinn3@gmail.com> - 2017-02-16 11:37 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Poutnik <poutnik4nntp@gmail.com> - 2017-02-16 21:17 +0100
                Re: Measuring time and light Ed Lake <detect@newsguy.com> - 2017-02-16 13:11 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Poutnik <poutnik4nntp@gmail.com> - 2017-02-16 22:28 +0100
                Re: Measuring time and light Robert Winn <rbwinn3@gmail.com> - 2017-02-16 14:47 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Poutnik <poutnik4nntp@gmail.com> - 2017-02-16 23:59 +0100
                Re: Measuring time and light Ed Lake <detect@newsguy.com> - 2017-02-17 06:56 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Robert Winn <rbwinn3@gmail.com> - 2017-02-16 13:17 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Python <python@python.invalid> - 2017-02-16 22:23 +0100
                Re: Measuring time and light Robert Winn <rbwinn3@gmail.com> - 2017-02-16 14:55 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Poutnik <poutnik4nntp@gmail.com> - 2017-02-16 22:35 +0100
        Re: Measuring time and light rotchm <rotchm@gmail.com> - 2017-02-09 18:39 -0800
          Re: Measuring time and light mlwozniak@wp.pl - 2017-02-09 23:35 -0800
            Re: Measuring time and light Poutnik <poutnik4nntp@gmail.com> - 2017-02-10 11:45 +0100
              Re: Measuring time and light Emmaline Coots <ealoa@loealoioa.los> - 2017-02-10 11:57 +0000
              Re: Measuring time and light mlwozniak@wp.pl - 2017-02-10 04:04 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Emmaline Coots <ealoa@loealoioa.los> - 2017-02-10 12:13 +0000
      Re: Measuring time and light rotchm <rotchm@gmail.com> - 2017-02-09 18:33 -0800
      Re: Measuring time and light Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-02-11 15:38 -0600
        Re: Measuring time and light Ed Lake <detect@newsguy.com> - 2017-02-11 13:47 -0800
          Re: Measuring time and light rotchm <rotchm@gmail.com> - 2017-02-11 16:24 -0800
            Re: Measuring time and light Ed Lake <detect@newsguy.com> - 2017-02-12 07:26 -0800
              Re: Measuring time and light Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-02-12 15:43 -0600
                Re: Measuring time and light Ed Lake <detect@newsguy.com> - 2017-02-13 07:56 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Ed Lake <detect@newsguy.com> - 2017-02-13 09:57 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-02-14 06:43 -0600
                Re: Measuring time and light Ed Lake <detect@newsguy.com> - 2017-02-14 06:48 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light "David (Lord Kronos Prime) Fuller" <fuller.david@hotmail.com> - 2017-02-14 07:04 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Ed Lake <detect@newsguy.com> - 2017-02-14 07:42 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light "David (Lord Kronos Prime) Fuller" <fuller.david@hotmail.com> - 2017-02-14 07:57 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light rotchm <rotchm@gmail.com> - 2017-02-14 07:46 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light mlwozniak@wp.pl - 2017-02-14 08:28 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light paparios <paparios@gmail.com> - 2017-02-14 08:46 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Ed Lake <detect@newsguy.com> - 2017-02-14 09:22 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light "David (Lord Kronos Prime) Fuller" <fuller.david@hotmail.com> - 2017-02-14 09:37 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Ed Lake <detect@newsguy.com> - 2017-02-14 09:52 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light "David (Lord Kronos Prime) Fuller" <fuller.david@hotmail.com> - 2017-02-14 11:10 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Ed Lake <detect@newsguy.com> - 2017-02-14 12:47 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-02-14 15:05 -0600
                Re: Measuring time and light kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2017-02-15 06:37 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light "David (Lord Kronos Prime) Fuller" <fuller.david@hotmail.com> - 2017-02-14 13:07 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light paparios <paparios@gmail.com> - 2017-02-14 11:22 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Ed Lake <detect@newsguy.com> - 2017-02-14 13:10 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-02-14 15:54 -0600
                Re: Measuring time and light Ed Lake <detect@newsguy.com> - 2017-02-15 07:10 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-02-15 14:58 -0600
                Re: Measuring time and light Ed Lake <detect@newsguy.com> - 2017-02-16 07:04 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light "David (Lord Kronos Prime) Fuller" <fuller.david@hotmail.com> - 2017-02-16 07:26 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light paparios <paparios@gmail.com> - 2017-02-16 07:32 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-02-17 08:34 -0600
                Re: Measuring time and light kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2017-02-17 06:56 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-02-17 09:11 -0600
                Re: Measuring time and light kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2017-02-17 14:48 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-02-18 11:10 -0600
                Re: Measuring time and light kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2017-02-18 13:05 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-02-18 15:08 -0600
                Re: Measuring time and light Ed Lake <detect@newsguy.com> - 2017-02-17 07:05 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-02-17 09:24 -0600
                Re: Measuring time and light Ed Lake <detect@newsguy.com> - 2017-02-17 08:57 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Poutnik <poutnik4nntp@gmail.com> - 2017-02-17 18:23 +0100
                Re: Measuring time and light Ed Lake <detect@newsguy.com> - 2017-02-17 12:47 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light rotchm <rotchm@gmail.com> - 2017-02-17 13:34 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Ed Lake <detect@newsguy.com> - 2017-02-17 13:45 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light "Paul B. Andersen" <relativity@paulba.no> - 2017-02-18 14:48 +0100
                Re: Measuring time and light mlwozniak@wp.pl - 2017-02-18 06:06 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Sanjuanita Peeples <naalu@nwmeela.org> - 2017-02-18 14:10 +0000
                Re: Measuring time and light Ed Lake <detect@newsguy.com> - 2017-02-18 07:51 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Sanjuanita Peeples <naalu@nwmeela.org> - 2017-02-18 18:00 +0000
                Re: Measuring time and light Ed Lake <detect@newsguy.com> - 2017-02-18 10:12 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-02-18 12:19 -0600
                Re: Measuring time and light Sanjuanita Peeples <naalu@nwmeela.org> - 2017-02-18 19:55 +0000
                Re: Measuring time and light Ed Lake <detect@newsguy.com> - 2017-02-18 12:57 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-02-18 15:07 -0600
                Re: Measuring time and light mlwozniak@wp.pl - 2017-02-18 15:07 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light rotchm <rotchm@gmail.com> - 2017-02-18 15:52 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Sanjuanita Peeples <naalu@nwmeela.org> - 2017-02-19 09:15 +0000
                Re: Measuring time and light rotchm <rotchm@gmail.com> - 2017-02-19 06:28 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light "David (Lord Kronos Prime) Fuller" <fuller.david@hotmail.com> - 2017-02-19 08:16 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Ed Lake <detect@newsguy.com> - 2017-02-18 07:42 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light "Kevin Aylward" <kevinRemoveandReplaceATkevinaylward.co.uk> - 2017-02-19 16:54 +0000
                Re: Measuring time and light Ed Lake <detect@newsguy.com> - 2017-02-19 09:03 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Poutnik <poutnik4nntp@gmail.com> - 2017-02-19 18:16 +0100
                Re: Measuring time and light Ed Lake <detect@newsguy.com> - 2017-02-19 09:39 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Poutnik <poutnik4nntp@gmail.com> - 2017-02-19 18:52 +0100
                Re: Measuring time and light Ed Lake <detect@newsguy.com> - 2017-02-19 10:17 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Poutnik <poutnik4nntp@gmail.com> - 2017-02-19 19:43 +0100
                Re: Measuring time and light Poutnik <poutnik4nntp@gmail.com> - 2017-02-19 19:51 +0100
                Re: Measuring time and light Ed Lake <detect@newsguy.com> - 2017-02-19 10:55 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light rotchm <rotchm@gmail.com> - 2017-02-19 11:05 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Ed Lake <detect@newsguy.com> - 2017-02-19 13:11 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-02-19 15:17 -0600
                Re: Measuring time and light rotchm <rotchm@gmail.com> - 2017-02-19 16:10 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Poutnik <poutnik4nntp@gmail.com> - 2017-02-20 07:34 +0100
                Re: Measuring time and light Ed Lake <detect@newsguy.com> - 2017-02-20 07:17 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light "David (Lord Kronos Prime) Fuller" <fuller.david@hotmail.com> - 2017-02-20 07:37 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light rotchm <rotchm@gmail.com> - 2017-02-20 08:04 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Ed Lake <detect@newsguy.com> - 2017-02-20 09:05 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Poutnik <poutnik4nntp@gmail.com> - 2017-02-20 18:13 +0100
                Re: Measuring time and light Ed Lake <detect@newsguy.com> - 2017-02-20 09:24 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Poutnik <poutnik4nntp@gmail.com> - 2017-02-20 19:05 +0100
                Re: Measuring time and light Ed Lake <detect@newsguy.com> - 2017-02-20 13:27 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-02-20 16:08 -0600
                Re: Measuring time and light "David (Lord Kronos Prime) Fuller" <fuller.david@hotmail.com> - 2017-02-20 14:57 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Poutnik <poutnik4nntp@gmail.com> - 2017-02-21 08:09 +0100
                Re: Measuring time and light "David (Lord Kronos Prime) Fuller" <fuller.david@hotmail.com> - 2017-02-20 11:13 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light rotchm <rotchm@gmail.com> - 2017-02-20 09:38 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Poutnik <poutnik4nntp@gmail.com> - 2017-02-20 17:47 +0100
                Re: Measuring time and light Bret Noss <osotr@rwtropsws.org> - 2017-02-20 16:52 +0000
                Re: Measuring time and light Poutnik <poutnik4nntp@gmail.com> - 2017-02-20 18:02 +0100
                Re: Measuring time and light Bret Noss <osotr@rwtropsws.org> - 2017-02-20 17:13 +0000
                Re: Measuring time and light Ed Lake <detect@newsguy.com> - 2017-02-20 09:33 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Bret Noss <osotr@rwtropsws.org> - 2017-02-20 17:35 +0000
                Re: Measuring time and light Ed Lake <detect@newsguy.com> - 2017-02-20 09:45 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Bret Noss <osotr@rwtropsws.org> - 2017-02-20 17:49 +0000
                Re: Measuring time and light Ed Lake <detect@newsguy.com> - 2017-02-20 09:56 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light rotchm <rotchm@gmail.com> - 2017-02-20 11:09 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Ed Lake <detect@newsguy.com> - 2017-02-20 13:59 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light rotchm <rotchm@gmail.com> - 2017-02-20 19:31 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Ed Lake <detect@newsguy.com> - 2017-02-21 07:05 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light rotchm <rotchm@gmail.com> - 2017-02-21 07:58 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Bret Noss <osotr@rwtropsws.org> - 2017-02-21 16:31 +0000
                Re: Measuring time and light Ed Lake <detect@newsguy.com> - 2017-02-21 08:35 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Bret Noss <osotr@rwtropsws.org> - 2017-02-21 16:45 +0000
                Re: Measuring time and light Ed Lake <detect@newsguy.com> - 2017-02-21 08:32 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light rotchm <rotchm@gmail.com> - 2017-02-21 11:58 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Ed Lake <detect@newsguy.com> - 2017-02-21 13:43 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light mlwozniak@wp.pl - 2017-02-20 23:05 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Ed Lake <detect@newsguy.com> - 2017-02-21 07:22 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-02-21 10:51 -0600
                Re: Measuring time and light Bret Noss <osotr@rwtropsws.org> - 2017-02-21 17:07 +0000
                Re: Measuring time and light "David (Lord Kronos Prime) Fuller" <fuller.david@hotmail.com> - 2017-02-21 10:11 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light mlwozniak@wp.pl - 2017-02-20 10:19 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-02-20 11:53 -0600
                Re: Measuring time and light mlwozniak@wp.pl - 2017-02-20 10:20 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-02-20 11:54 -0600
                Re: Measuring time and light Poutnik <poutnik4nntp@gmail.com> - 2017-02-19 20:13 +0100
                Re: Measuring time and light Ed Lake <detect@newsguy.com> - 2017-02-19 13:21 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light "David (Lord Kronos Prime) Fuller" <fuller.david@hotmail.com> - 2017-02-19 13:29 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light "David (Lord Kronos Prime) Fuller" <fuller.david@hotmail.com> - 2017-02-19 13:58 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-02-19 15:30 -0600
                Re: Measuring time and light Dirk Van de moortel <dirkvandemoortel@hotspam.not> - 2017-02-19 23:19 +0100
                Re: Measuring time and light Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-02-20 11:57 -0600
                Re: Measuring time and light Poutnik <poutnik4nntp@gmail.com> - 2017-02-19 23:11 +0100
                Re: Measuring time and light Ed Lake <detect@newsguy.com> - 2017-02-19 13:41 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Poutnik <poutnik4nntp@gmail.com> - 2017-02-20 08:55 +0100
                Re: Measuring time and light mlwozniak@wp.pl - 2017-02-20 00:01 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Ed Lake <detect@newsguy.com> - 2017-02-20 07:37 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light "David (Lord Kronos Prime) Fuller" <fuller.david@hotmail.com> - 2017-02-20 08:05 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Poutnik <poutnik4nntp@gmail.com> - 2017-02-20 17:48 +0100
                Re: Measuring time and light Bret Noss <osotr@rwtropsws.org> - 2017-02-20 16:56 +0000
                Re: Measuring time and light Ed Lake <detect@newsguy.com> - 2017-02-19 14:03 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light "David (Lord Kronos Prime) Fuller" <fuller.david@hotmail.com> - 2017-02-19 14:07 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Poutnik <poutnik4nntp@gmail.com> - 2017-02-19 23:19 +0100
                Re: Measuring time and light mlwozniak@wp.pl - 2017-02-19 23:58 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light mlwozniak@wp.pl - 2017-02-19 23:56 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light rotchm <rotchm@gmail.com> - 2017-02-19 10:09 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light "Kevin Aylward" <kevinRemovAT@kevinaylward.co.uk> - 2017-02-19 21:26 +0000
                Re: Measuring time and light "Paul B. Andersen" <relativity@paulba.no> - 2017-02-19 21:54 +0100
                Re: Measuring time and light Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-02-19 15:18 -0600
                Re: Measuring time and light Sanjuanita Peeples <naalu@nwmeela.org> - 2017-02-17 22:22 +0000
                Re: Measuring time and light Poutnik <poutnik4nntp@gmail.com> - 2017-02-17 22:58 +0100
                Re: Measuring time and light "David (Lord Kronos Prime) Fuller" <fuller.david@hotmail.com> - 2017-02-17 14:29 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Sanjuanita Peeples <naalu@nwmeela.org> - 2017-02-17 22:36 +0000
                Re: Measuring time and light Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-02-17 12:20 -0600
                Re: Measuring time and light Ed Lake <detect@newsguy.com> - 2017-02-17 13:32 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light rotchm <rotchm@gmail.com> - 2017-02-17 13:58 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Ed Lake <detect@newsguy.com> - 2017-02-17 14:24 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Poutnik <poutnik4nntp@gmail.com> - 2017-02-17 23:54 +0100
                Re: Measuring time and light rotchm <rotchm@gmail.com> - 2017-02-17 15:02 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Dirk Van de moortel <dirkvandemoortel@hotspam.not> - 2017-02-18 00:22 +0100
                Re: Measuring time and light rotchm <rotchm@gmail.com> - 2017-02-17 18:59 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Robert Winn <rbwinn3@gmail.com> - 2017-02-17 21:13 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Poutnik <poutnik4nntp@gmail.com> - 2017-02-18 08:50 +0100
                Re: Measuring time and light Poutnik <poutnik4nntp@gmail.com> - 2017-02-18 09:15 +0100
                Re: Measuring time and light Poutnik <poutnik4nntp@gmail.com> - 2017-02-18 10:04 +0100
                Re: Measuring time and light rotchm <rotchm@gmail.com> - 2017-02-18 07:25 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Poutnik <poutnik4nntp@gmail.com> - 2017-02-18 16:56 +0100
                Re: Measuring time and light Ed Lake <detect@newsguy.com> - 2017-02-18 07:13 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light "David (Lord Kronos Prime) Fuller" <fuller.david@hotmail.com> - 2017-02-18 07:17 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light "David (Lord Kronos Prime) Fuller" <fuller.david@hotmail.com> - 2017-02-18 07:24 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Poutnik <poutnik4nntp@gmail.com> - 2017-02-18 16:27 +0100
                Re: Measuring time and light rotchm <rotchm@gmail.com> - 2017-02-18 07:59 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Ed Lake <detect@newsguy.com> - 2017-02-18 08:37 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light rotchm <rotchm@gmail.com> - 2017-02-18 09:25 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light mlwozniak@wp.pl - 2017-02-18 12:03 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-02-18 10:57 -0600
                Re: Measuring time and light Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-02-18 10:57 -0600
                Re: Measuring time and light Ed Lake <detect@newsguy.com> - 2017-02-18 09:39 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-02-18 11:46 -0600
                Re: Measuring time and light Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-02-18 10:57 -0600
                Re: Measuring time and light Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-02-18 11:10 -0600
                Re: Measuring time and light "Kevin Aylward" <kevinRemovAT@kevinaylward.co.uk> - 2017-02-18 20:30 +0000
                Re: Measuring time and light Ed Lake <detect@newsguy.com> - 2017-02-19 08:25 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light "Kevin Aylward" <kevinRemovAT@kevinaylward.co.uk> - 2017-02-19 21:22 +0000
                Re: Measuring time and light Dirk Van de moortel <dirkvandemoortel@hotspam.not> - 2017-02-17 20:25 +0100
                Re: Measuring time and light Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-02-18 10:57 -0600
                Re: Measuring time and light Ed Lake <detect@newsguy.com> - 2017-02-18 09:20 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-02-18 11:38 -0600
                Re: Measuring time and light Ed Lake <detect@newsguy.com> - 2017-02-18 09:52 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-02-18 12:01 -0600
                Re: Measuring time and light Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-02-18 11:54 -0600
                Re: Measuring time and light Ed Lake <detect@newsguy.com> - 2017-02-18 10:08 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-02-18 12:17 -0600
                Re: Measuring time and light Ed Lake <detect@newsguy.com> - 2017-02-18 10:31 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-02-18 13:20 -0600
                Re: Measuring time and light Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-02-18 14:39 -0600
                Re: Measuring time and light xxein1x1@gmail.com - 2017-02-18 15:24 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light "David (Lord Kronos Prime) Fuller" <fuller.david@hotmail.com> - 2017-02-18 15:35 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light xxein1x1@gmail.com - 2017-02-18 15:44 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light "David (Lord Kronos Prime) Fuller" <fuller.david@hotmail.com> - 2017-02-18 16:02 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light xxein1x1@gmail.com - 2017-02-18 16:16 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light "David (Lord Kronos Prime) Fuller" <fuller.david@hotmail.com> - 2017-02-18 16:59 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Ed Lake <detect@newsguy.com> - 2017-02-19 08:38 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light "David (Lord Kronos Prime) Fuller" <fuller.david@hotmail.com> - 2017-02-19 09:43 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Ed Lake <detect@newsguy.com> - 2017-02-19 09:57 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light "David (Lord Kronos Prime) Fuller" <fuller.david@hotmail.com> - 2017-02-19 10:06 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light "David (Lord Kronos Prime) Fuller" <fuller.david@hotmail.com> - 2017-02-19 10:17 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light "David (Lord Kronos Prime) Fuller" <fuller.david@hotmail.com> - 2017-02-19 10:01 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light rotchm <rotchm@gmail.com> - 2017-02-18 16:10 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light "David (Lord Kronos Prime) Fuller" <fuller.david@hotmail.com> - 2017-02-18 16:15 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Ed Lake <detect@newsguy.com> - 2017-02-19 08:31 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-02-18 12:10 -0600
                Re: Measuring time and light Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-02-14 13:54 -0600
                Re: Measuring time and light Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-02-14 13:35 -0600
                Re: Measuring time and light Ed Lake <detect@newsguy.com> - 2017-02-14 13:32 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-02-14 15:39 -0600
                Re: Measuring time and light Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-02-14 15:47 -0600
                Re: Measuring time and light rotchm <rotchm@gmail.com> - 2017-02-14 18:11 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Robert Winn <rbwinn3@gmail.com> - 2017-02-16 08:13 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Ed Lake <detect@newsguy.com> - 2017-02-16 09:43 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Poutnik <poutnik4nntp@gmail.com> - 2017-02-16 19:21 +0100
                Re: Measuring time and light Ed Lake <detect@newsguy.com> - 2017-02-16 12:45 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Poutnik <poutnik4nntp@gmail.com> - 2017-02-16 21:58 +0100
                Re: Measuring time and light Poutnik <poutnik4nntp@gmail.com> - 2017-02-16 22:03 +0100
                Re: Measuring time and light mlwozniak@wp.pl - 2017-02-16 23:13 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Robert Winn <rbwinn3@gmail.com> - 2017-02-16 14:16 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Ed Lake <detect@newsguy.com> - 2017-02-16 14:34 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Poutnik <poutnik4nntp@gmail.com> - 2017-02-16 23:41 +0100
                Re: Measuring time and light mlwozniak@wp.pl - 2017-02-16 23:11 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Robert Winn <rbwinn3@gmail.com> - 2017-02-16 12:00 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Ed Lake <detect@newsguy.com> - 2017-02-16 13:24 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Poutnik <poutnik4nntp@gmail.com> - 2017-02-16 22:41 +0100
                Re: Measuring time and light Ed Lake <detect@newsguy.com> - 2017-02-16 14:12 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Poutnik <poutnik4nntp@gmail.com> - 2017-02-16 23:28 +0100
                Re: Measuring time and light Robert Winn <rbwinn3@gmail.com> - 2017-02-16 15:05 -0800
                Re: Measuring time and light Robert Winn <rbwinn3@gmail.com> - 2017-02-16 15:09 -0800
              Re: Measuring time and light rotchm <rotchm@gmail.com> - 2017-02-12 16:19 -0800
          Re: Measuring time and light Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-02-12 15:39 -0600
            Re: Measuring time and light Ed Lake <detect@newsguy.com> - 2017-02-13 07:46 -0800
              Re: Measuring time and light Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-02-14 14:42 -0600
  Re: Measuring time and light Ed Lake <detect@newsguy.com> - 2017-02-09 12:34 -0800
  Re: Measuring time and light numbernumber1964@gmail.com - 2017-02-11 11:24 -0800
  Re: Measuring time and light numbernumber1964@gmail.com - 2017-02-11 13:01 -0800
  Re: Measuring time and light numbernumber1964@gmail.com - 2017-02-11 13:05 -0800
  Re: Measuring time and light Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-02-11 15:38 -0600
    Re: Measuring time and light Ed Lake <detect@newsguy.com> - 2017-02-11 13:46 -0800
      Re: Measuring time and light Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-02-12 15:30 -0600
        Re: Measuring time and light Ed Lake <detect@newsguy.com> - 2017-02-13 06:46 -0800
          Re: Measuring time and light Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-02-13 08:56 -0600
  Re: Measuring time and light numbernumber1964@gmail.com - 2017-02-11 13:56 -0800
  Re: Measuring time and light numbernumber1964@gmail.com - 2017-02-11 14:03 -0800
  Re: Measuring time and light numbernumber1964@gmail.com - 2017-02-11 14:59 -0800
  Re: Measuring time and light Robert Winn <rbwinn3@gmail.com> - 2017-02-13 07:52 -0800
    Re: Measuring time and light Ed Lake <detect@newsguy.com> - 2017-02-13 08:08 -0800
      Re: Measuring time and light Robert Winn <rbwinn3@gmail.com> - 2017-02-16 06:55 -0800
      Re: Measuring time and light Robert Winn <rbwinn3@gmail.com> - 2017-02-16 07:05 -0800
        Re: Measuring time and light Ed Lake <detect@newsguy.com> - 2017-02-16 07:31 -0800
          Re: Measuring time and light Robert Winn <rbwinn3@gmail.com> - 2017-02-16 11:18 -0800
            Re: Measuring time and light Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-02-17 07:52 -0600
          Re: Measuring time and light Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-02-17 08:34 -0600
        Re: Measuring time and light Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-02-17 08:07 -0600
  Measuring time and light "David (Lord Kronos Prime) Fuller" <fuller.david@hotmail.com> - 2017-02-16 13:43 -0800
    Re: Measuring time and light Ed Lake <detect@newsguy.com> - 2017-02-16 14:17 -0800
      Re: Measuring time and light "David (Lord Kronos Prime) Fuller" <fuller.david@hotmail.com> - 2017-02-16 15:32 -0800
        Re: Measuring time and light Robert Winn <rbwinn3@gmail.com> - 2017-02-16 16:16 -0800
          Re: Measuring time and light benj <benj@nobody.net> - 2017-02-16 20:00 -0500

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