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Groups > comp.lang.c > #100499

Re: Octal

From David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no>
Newsgroups comp.lang.c
Subject Re: Octal
Date 2016-12-29 17:32 +0100
Organization A noiseless patient Spider
Message-ID <o43dnk$7a0$1@dont-email.me> (permalink)
References (23 earlier) <o41d3c$e4u$1@dont-email.me> <o42rrr$85s$1@dont-email.me> <o42u2a$f8e$1@dont-email.me> <o4309h$mk0$1@dont-email.me> <o43bg3$u8t$1@dont-email.me>

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On 29/12/16 16:54, BartC wrote:
> On 29/12/2016 12:42, David Brown wrote:
>> On 29/12/16 13:04, BartC wrote:
> 
>>> I don't care for that vast array of features. I'm only interested in
>>> two:
>>>
>>> * The speed of its generated code
>>> * And that gcc is available everywhere and is stable and well-tested
>>>
>>
>> I, and many others, find a lot of other features of gcc important.  In
>> no particular order, and in addition to your two points, these include:
> 
>> * Powerful inline assembly
> 
> So powerful that it is practically unusable!

I use it, when I need to (I don't write anything in assembler if it can
be done just as well in C).  So do many people.  And the syntax has been
copied by several other compilers.

> 
>> * Supported as /the/ standard compiler by many microcontroller
>> manufacturers
>> * Part of a solid toolchain and development environment
>> * Works on both Linux and Windows
> 
> That should be a given; what exactly is the difference between the two
> for a /compiler/?

There are lots of tools that are not cross-platform.  It is a
requirement for /me/, since I use both Linux and Windows, but a large
proportion of users are happy as long as a tool works on their
particular platform.

> 
>> Different people have different needs from their toolchains.  And if you
>> have very limited needs, it might be annoying to have to "pay" in speed
>> and size for features you don't want.
> 
> Compiling one of my programs from scratch on an early Raspberry Pi takes
> about 5 minutes using gcc -O3. That's about 100 lines per second, on a
> 700MHz processor.

The earliest Raspberry Pi's were very slow, and had particularly slow
"disks".  But so what?  One of gcc's strengths is its flexibility for
cross compiling - people who know how to use their tools and want to
compile large programs for a Raspberry Pi usually do so on a desktop
machine.

> 
> Apart from speed, another property I like is for a tool to be small and
> compact, and be easy (and quick) to build if I should need to. gcc fails
> on all counts.
> 

Yes, well, different people have different needs.  But it gets silly
when you repeatedly condemn gcc as big and slow when you don't actually
understand it and why it is different from a tool like TCC.  If TCC is
better for /your/ needs, then that's great - use TCC.  Just don't
imagine that /your/ needs and priorities apply to anyone else.

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Octal BartC <bc@freeuk.com> - 2016-12-27 14:08 +0000
  Octal "Rick C. Hodgin" <rick.c.hodgin@gmail.com> - 2016-12-27 06:19 -0800
    Re: Octal BartC <bc@freeuk.com> - 2016-12-27 14:58 +0000
      Re: Octal "Rick C. Hodgin" <rick.c.hodgin@gmail.com> - 2016-12-27 07:07 -0800
        Re: Octal BartC <bc@freeuk.com> - 2016-12-27 15:22 +0000
          Re: Octal "Rick C. Hodgin" <rick.c.hodgin@gmail.com> - 2016-12-27 07:37 -0800
            Re: Octal BartC <bc@freeuk.com> - 2016-12-27 16:24 +0000
              Re: Octal "Rick C. Hodgin" <rick.c.hodgin@gmail.com> - 2016-12-27 08:30 -0800
              Re: Octal supercat@casperkitty.com - 2016-12-27 09:10 -0800
                Re: Octal Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2016-12-27 09:35 -0800
                Re: Octal supercat@casperkitty.com - 2016-12-27 10:47 -0800
                Re: Octal Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2016-12-27 12:03 -0800
                Re: Octal supercat@casperkitty.com - 2016-12-27 12:27 -0800
                Re: Octal Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2016-12-27 12:44 -0800
                Re: Octal supercat@casperkitty.com - 2016-12-27 13:37 -0800
                Re: Octal Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2016-12-27 16:38 -0800
                Re: Octal supercat@casperkitty.com - 2016-12-27 17:53 -0800
                Re: Octal Robert Wessel <robertwessel2@yahoo.com> - 2016-12-27 20:26 -0600
                Re: Octal supercat@casperkitty.com - 2016-12-27 18:48 -0800
                Re: Octal Robert Wessel <robertwessel2@yahoo.com> - 2016-12-27 22:20 -0600
                Re: Octal Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2016-12-27 18:41 -0800
                Re: Octal supercat@casperkitty.com - 2016-12-27 19:19 -0800
                Re: Octal Ian Collins <ian-news@hotmail.com> - 2016-12-29 14:52 +1300
                Re: Octal Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2016-12-28 18:41 -0800
                Re: Octal Tim Rentsch <txr@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2016-12-28 16:54 -0800
                Re: Octal BartC <bc@freeuk.com> - 2016-12-27 17:44 +0000
                Re: Octal Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2016-12-27 12:17 -0800
                Re: Octal BartC <bc@freeuk.com> - 2016-12-27 22:39 +0000
                Re: Octal Ian Collins <ian-news@hotmail.com> - 2016-12-28 11:49 +1300
                Re: Octal BartC <bc@freeuk.com> - 2016-12-27 23:09 +0000
                Re: Octal Ian Collins <ian-news@hotmail.com> - 2016-12-28 12:32 +1300
                Re: Octal BartC <bc@freeuk.com> - 2016-12-28 00:51 +0000
                Re: Octal Ian Collins <ian-news@hotmail.com> - 2016-12-28 14:00 +1300
                Re: Octal BartC <bc@freeuk.com> - 2016-12-28 01:13 +0000
                Re: Octal Robert Wessel <robertwessel2@yahoo.com> - 2016-12-27 20:04 -0600
                Re: Octal supercat@casperkitty.com - 2016-12-27 18:45 -0800
                Re: Octal Tim Rentsch <txr@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2016-12-29 13:35 -0800
                Re: Octal supercat@casperkitty.com - 2016-12-29 14:49 -0800
                Re: Octal Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2016-12-29 15:33 -0800
                Re: Octal supercat@casperkitty.com - 2016-12-30 12:35 -0800
                Re: Octal Tim Rentsch <txr@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2017-01-13 15:19 -0800
                Re: Octal Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2017-01-13 15:32 -0800
                Re: Octal Ian Collins <ian-news@hotmail.com> - 2017-01-14 12:35 +1300
                Re: Octal Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2017-01-13 15:51 -0800
                Re: Octal supercat@casperkitty.com - 2017-01-13 18:25 -0800
                Re: Octal Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2017-01-14 06:21 -0800
                Re: Octal supercat@casperkitty.com - 2017-01-14 14:00 -0800
                Re: Octal Tim Rentsch <txr@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2017-01-15 23:08 -0800
                Re: Octal Tim Rentsch <txr@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2017-01-15 23:02 -0800
                Re: Octal supercat@casperkitty.com - 2017-01-13 18:52 -0800
                Re: Octal Tim Rentsch <txr@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2017-01-15 23:46 -0800
                Re: Octal supercat@casperkitty.com - 2017-01-16 01:46 -0800
                Re: Octal Tim Rentsch <txr@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2017-01-31 08:33 -0800
                Re: Octal Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2016-12-27 17:19 -0800
                Re: Octal raltbos@xs4all.nl (Richard Bos) - 2016-12-28 09:39 +0000
                Re: Octal BartC <bc@freeuk.com> - 2016-12-28 11:02 +0000
                Re: Octal David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2016-12-28 12:13 +0100
                Re: Octal BartC <bc@freeuk.com> - 2016-12-28 11:41 +0000
                Re: Octal Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2016-12-28 09:31 -0800
                Re: Octal BartC <bc@freeuk.com> - 2016-12-28 17:39 +0000
                Re: Octal David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2016-12-28 22:05 +0100
                Re: Octal Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2016-12-28 12:01 -0800
                Re: Octal BartC <bc@freeuk.com> - 2016-12-28 20:05 +0000
                Re: Octal asetofsymbols@gmail.com - 2016-12-28 11:20 -0800
                Re: Octal Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2016-12-28 12:01 +0000
                Re: Octal BartC <bc@freeuk.com> - 2016-12-28 12:30 +0000
                Re: Octal David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2016-12-28 13:51 +0100
                Re: Octal Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2016-12-28 16:26 +0000
                Re: Octal supercat@casperkitty.com - 2016-12-28 08:40 -0800
                Re: Octal Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2016-12-28 09:41 -0800
                Re: Octal BartC <bc@freeuk.com> - 2016-12-28 18:04 +0000
                Re: Octal Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2016-12-28 19:36 +0000
                Re: Octal BartC <bc@freeuk.com> - 2016-12-28 19:42 +0000
                Re: Octal Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2016-12-29 00:34 +0000
                Re: Octal supercat@casperkitty.com - 2016-12-28 11:04 -0800
                Re: Octal raltbos@xs4all.nl (Richard Bos) - 2016-12-28 12:09 +0000
                Re: Octal Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2016-12-27 16:46 -0800
                Re: Octal BartC <bc@freeuk.com> - 2016-12-28 00:56 +0000
                Re: Octal Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2016-12-27 17:52 -0800
                Re: Octal BartC <bc@freeuk.com> - 2016-12-28 11:27 +0000
                Re: Octal Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2016-12-28 12:09 +0000
                Re: Octal supercat@casperkitty.com - 2016-12-28 08:17 -0800
                Re: Octal BartC <bc@freeuk.com> - 2016-12-28 17:02 +0000
                Re: Octal Ike Naar <ike@iceland.freeshell.org> - 2016-12-28 17:25 +0000
                Re: Octal BartC <bc@freeuk.com> - 2016-12-28 17:45 +0000
                Re: Octal Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2016-12-28 10:21 -0800
                Re: Octal supercat@casperkitty.com - 2016-12-28 09:27 -0800
                Re: Octal Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2016-12-28 10:23 -0800
                Re: Octal supercat@casperkitty.com - 2016-12-28 11:18 -0800
                Re: Octal Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2016-12-28 10:19 -0800
                Re: Octal BartC <bc@freeuk.com> - 2016-12-29 15:54 +0000
                Re: Octal Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2016-12-29 12:57 -0800
                Re: Octal Ian Collins <ian-news@hotmail.com> - 2016-12-30 10:01 +1300
                Re: Octal David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2016-12-30 10:44 +0100
                Re: Octal David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2016-12-29 17:32 +0100
                Re: Octal BartC <bc@freeuk.com> - 2016-12-29 17:03 +0000
                Re: Octal Robert Wessel <robertwessel2@yahoo.com> - 2016-12-29 16:26 -0600
                Re: Octal Ian Collins <ian-news@hotmail.com> - 2016-12-30 11:31 +1300
                Re: Octal Robert Wessel <robertwessel2@yahoo.com> - 2016-12-29 16:58 -0600
                Re: Octal Ian Collins <ian-news@hotmail.com> - 2016-12-30 11:59 +1300
                Re: Octal Ian Collins <ian-news@hotmail.com> - 2016-12-30 09:00 +1300
                Re: Octal David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2016-12-30 10:21 +0100
                Re: Octal asetofsymbols@gmail.com - 2016-12-30 01:29 -0800
                Re: Octal asetofsymbols@gmail.com - 2016-12-30 01:29 -0800
                Re: Octal asetofsymbols@gmail.com - 2016-12-30 01:36 -0800
                Re: Octal BartC <bc@freeuk.com> - 2016-12-29 11:52 +0000
                Re: Octal BartC <bc@freeuk.com> - 2016-12-29 17:10 +0000
                Re: Octal supercat@casperkitty.com - 2016-12-29 05:52 -0800
                Re: Octal Robert Wessel <robertwessel2@yahoo.com> - 2016-12-28 19:51 -0600
                Re: Octal BartC <bc@freeuk.com> - 2016-12-29 21:09 +0000
                Re: Octal Ian Collins <ian-news@hotmail.com> - 2016-12-30 10:15 +1300
                Re: Octal Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2016-12-29 13:53 -0800
                Re: Octal David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2016-12-30 12:07 +0100
                Re: Octal BartC <bc@freeuk.com> - 2016-12-30 13:04 +0000
                Re: Octal Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2016-12-30 05:31 -0800
                Re: Octal David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2016-12-30 15:00 +0100
                Re: Octal BartC <bc@freeuk.com> - 2016-12-30 15:55 +0000
                Re: Octal David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2017-01-01 16:00 +0100
                Re: Octal Ian Collins <ian-news@hotmail.com> - 2017-01-02 08:33 +1300
                Re: Octal Ian Collins <ian-news@hotmail.com> - 2017-01-02 09:02 +1300
                Re: Octal Ian Collins <ian-news@hotmail.com> - 2017-01-02 09:38 +1300
                Re: Octal Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2017-01-01 13:59 -0800
                Re: Octal Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2017-01-01 14:24 -0800
                Re: Octal supercat@casperkitty.com - 2017-01-01 15:51 -0800
                Re: Octal Ian Collins <ian-news@hotmail.com> - 2017-01-02 13:09 +1300
                Re: Octal supercat@casperkitty.com - 2017-01-01 16:50 -0800
                Re: Octal Ian Collins <ian-news@hotmail.com> - 2017-01-02 14:24 +1300
                Re: Octal David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2017-01-02 01:53 +0100
                Re: Octal Ian Collins <ian-news@hotmail.com> - 2017-01-02 14:15 +1300
                Re: Octal Tim Rentsch <txr@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2017-01-02 02:28 -0800
                Re: Octal Ian Collins <ian-news@hotmail.com> - 2016-12-31 06:24 +1300
                Re: Octal BartC <bc@freeuk.com> - 2016-12-30 17:53 +0000
                Re: Octal luser droog <luser.droog@gmail.com> - 2016-12-30 10:01 -0800
                Re: Octal Ian Collins <ian-news@hotmail.com> - 2016-12-31 09:57 +1300
                Re: Octal supercat@casperkitty.com - 2016-12-30 13:50 -0800
                Re: Octal Ian Collins <ian-news@hotmail.com> - 2016-12-31 11:09 +1300
                Re: Octal supercat@casperkitty.com - 2016-12-30 14:46 -0800
                Re: Octal Ian Collins <ian-news@hotmail.com> - 2016-12-31 12:28 +1300
                Re: Octal supercat@casperkitty.com - 2016-12-30 16:01 -0800
                Re: Octal Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2016-12-30 14:48 -0800
                Re: Octal BartC <bc@freeuk.com> - 2016-12-30 22:51 +0000
                Re: Octal supercat@casperkitty.com - 2016-12-30 15:20 -0800
                Re: Octal Ian Collins <ian-news@hotmail.com> - 2016-12-31 12:34 +1300
                Re: Octal BartC <bc@freeuk.com> - 2016-12-30 23:40 +0000
                Re: Octal BartC <bc@freeuk.com> - 2016-12-30 22:12 +0000
                Re: Octal raltbos@xs4all.nl (Richard Bos) - 2016-12-28 21:38 +0000
                Re: Octal BartC <bc@freeuk.com> - 2016-12-29 12:04 +0000
                Re: Octal David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2016-12-29 13:42 +0100
                Re: Octal Ian Collins <ian-news@hotmail.com> - 2016-12-30 08:59 +1300
                Re: Octal supercat@casperkitty.com - 2016-12-29 12:23 -0800
                Re: Octal David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2016-12-30 10:56 +0100
                Re: Octal BartC <bc@freeuk.com> - 2016-12-28 22:09 +0000
                Re: Octal David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2016-12-29 12:27 +0100
                Re: Octal BartC <bc@freeuk.com> - 2016-12-28 21:18 +0000
                Re: Octal BartC <bc@freeuk.com> - 2016-12-28 20:46 +0000
                Re: Octal raltbos@xs4all.nl (Richard Bos) - 2016-12-28 20:55 +0000
                Re: Octal Robert Wessel <robertwessel2@yahoo.com> - 2016-12-28 14:54 -0600
                Re: Octal BartC <bc@freeuk.com> - 2016-12-29 15:44 +0000
                Re: Octal BartC <bc@freeuk.com> - 2016-12-28 19:39 +0000
                Re: Octal Robert Wessel <robertwessel2@yahoo.com> - 2016-12-28 15:04 -0600
                Re: Octal raltbos@xs4all.nl (Richard Bos) - 2016-12-28 19:52 +0000
                Re: Octal Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2016-12-29 09:36 -0800
                Re: Octal BartC <bc@freeuk.com> - 2016-12-29 18:02 +0000
                Re: Octal BartC <bc@freeuk.com> - 2016-12-30 16:17 +0000
                Re: Octal David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2017-01-01 16:09 +0100
                Re: Octal BartC <bc@freeuk.com> - 2016-12-28 20:02 +0000
                Re: Octal Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2016-12-28 12:32 -0800
                Re: Octal Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2016-12-29 13:45 +0000
                Re: Octal Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2016-12-28 17:16 +0000
                Re: Octal Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2016-12-28 10:04 -0800
                Re: Octal Tim Rentsch <txr@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2017-01-02 02:26 -0800
                Re: Octal Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2017-01-02 12:35 -0800
                Re: Octal Tim Rentsch <txr@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2017-01-12 23:22 -0800
                Re: Octal Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2017-01-13 10:04 -0800
                Re: Octal Tim Rentsch <txr@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2017-01-14 00:45 -0800
                Re: Octal Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2016-12-28 09:59 -0800
                Re: Octal "Rick C. Hodgin" <rick.c.hodgin@gmail.com> - 2016-12-27 09:45 -0800
        Re: Octal David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2016-12-27 17:14 +0100
          Re: Octal "Rick C. Hodgin" <rick.c.hodgin@gmail.com> - 2016-12-27 08:23 -0800
            Re: Octal David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2016-12-28 10:37 +0100
              Re: Octal "Rick C. Hodgin" <rick.c.hodgin@gmail.com> - 2016-12-28 03:07 -0800
                Re: Octal David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2016-12-28 12:25 +0100
                Re: Octal Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2016-12-28 11:58 +0000
                Re: Octal "Rick C. Hodgin" <rick.c.hodgin@gmail.com> - 2016-12-28 04:35 -0800
                Re: Octal Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2016-12-28 17:31 +0000
                Re: Octal "Rick C. Hodgin" <rick.c.hodgin@gmail.com> - 2016-12-28 09:38 -0800
                Re: Octal Robert Wessel <robertwessel2@yahoo.com> - 2016-12-28 15:12 -0600
                Re: Octal Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2016-12-28 12:01 -0800
              Re: Octal Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2016-12-28 09:20 -0800
                Re: Octal Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2016-12-28 13:39 -0800
                Re: Octal David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2016-12-29 12:29 +0100
                Re: Octal David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2016-12-28 22:20 +0100
      Re: Octal Noob <root@127.0.0.1> - 2016-12-28 13:02 +0100
        Re: Octal David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2016-12-28 13:30 +0100
        Re: Octal BartC <bc@freeuk.com> - 2016-12-28 13:25 +0000
  Re: Octal Manfred <noname@invalid.add> - 2016-12-27 15:19 +0100
    Re: Octal Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2016-12-27 08:37 -0800
      Re: Octal Manfred <noname@invalid.add> - 2016-12-27 18:43 +0100
        Re: Octal Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2016-12-27 12:07 -0800
    Re: Octal Manfred <noname@invalid.add> - 2016-12-27 18:21 +0100
  Re: Octal David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2016-12-27 15:28 +0100
  Re: Octal BGB <cr88192@hotmail.com> - 2016-12-27 11:42 -0600

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