Re: Cursor while booting

From	William Unruh <unruh@invalid.ca>
Newsgroups	comp.os.linux.misc
Subject	Re: Cursor while booting
Date	2016-03-17 15:04 +0000
Organization	A noiseless patient Spider
Message-ID	<nceh22$ogr$1@dont-email.me> (permalink)
References	(4 earlier) <nc92sg$948$1@news.xmission.com> <xcqdnZcb6MJYs3XLnZ2dnUU7-aPNnZ2d@giganews.com> <nccbc6$cmr$1@saria.nerim.net> <ol5prcxops.ln2@goaway.wombat.san-francisco.ca.us> <nce82e$vlh$1@saria.nerim.net>

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On 2016-03-17, Pascal Hambourg <boite-a-spam@plouf.fr.eu.org> wrote:
> Keith Keller a ?crit :
>> On 2016-03-16, Pascal Hambourg <boite-a-spam@plouf.fr.eu.org> wrote:
>>> Indeed. You can even fry a PS/2 port or device if you plug or unplug it
>>> while the power is on.
>> 
>> I know this is true in theory, but I have plugged/unplugged PS/2 devices
>> with the power on probably hundreds of times over the past 20 years, and
>> have had one device and one port fry in that time (in unrelated separate
>> incidents).
>
> I expected this kind or reply. Every time you warn about something
> dangerous, someone comes out and says "I did it and nothing bad
> happened". Sure, people drove drunk and did not cause an accident,
> people touched the mains live wire and did not die, people had unsafe
> sex and did not get infected. It does not mean it is not dangerous.
> Someone reported me that he unplugged a PCI extension card from the
> motherboard while the power was on, and there was no damage. Would you
> do it ?

No. That was a request for you to tell us why, give us a scenario,
plugging in a pci device could fry the harware. What is it about
plugging in the device that makes it dangerous.
Otherwise I could claim that if you think about elephants while you open
Libreoffice it can crash and wipe out the whole operating system. When you tell me 
you have often thought of elephants while opening libreoffice, I give a
rant like yours above. 
I want an explanation of how unplugging or plugging in a PCI mouse or
keyboard could fry the hardware in the computer. keyboards and mice do
NOT have large inductors in them, so that theory of transient voltage
spikes from rapid inductor charging seems pretty far fetched to me. So
give me a theory. 

The second part was the claim that PCI keyboards and mice are not
hotpluggable. Since it worked as a hot pluggable device for me, one
counterexample is sufficient to disprove a universal theorem. 
>
> The electrical and mechanical characteristics of the PS/2 port are not
> design for hot-plugging. Electronical devices can be destroyed when you
> apply a (even low) voltage to a signal pin while the power or ground pin
> is not connected. Hot-plug connector are designed so that this cannot
> happen.
No idea what this means. With no grounds, no current can flow.

Thread

Cursor while booting Helge <w4hw4h.hh@gmail.com> - 2016-03-12 02:54 -0800
  Re: Cursor while booting Andreas Kohlbach <march.10.ankman@spamgourmet.net> - 2016-03-12 15:08 -0500
  Re: Cursor while booting w4hw4h.hh@gmail.com - 2016-03-13 00:26 -0800
    Re: Cursor while booting William Unruh <unruh@invalid.ca> - 2016-03-13 16:26 +0000
    Re: Cursor while booting Andreas Kohlbach <march.10.ankman@spamgourmet.net> - 2016-03-13 17:05 -0400
      Re: Cursor while booting w4hw4h.hh@gmail.com - 2016-03-15 02:48 -0700
        Re: Cursor while booting Robert Heller <heller@deepsoft.com> - 2016-03-15 06:25 -0500
          Re: Cursor while booting gazelle@shell.xmission.com (Kenny McCormack) - 2016-03-15 13:32 +0000
            Re: Cursor while booting Reinhardt Behm <rbehm@hushmail.com> - 2016-03-15 22:12 +0800
            Re: Cursor while booting Robert Heller <heller@deepsoft.com> - 2016-03-15 10:48 -0500
              Re: Cursor while booting gazelle@shell.xmission.com (Kenny McCormack) - 2016-03-16 09:20 +0000
              Re: Cursor while booting Pascal Hambourg <boite-a-spam@plouf.fr.eu.org> - 2016-03-16 20:15 +0100
                Re: Cursor while booting Keith Keller <kkeller-usenet@wombat.san-francisco.ca.us> - 2016-03-16 16:09 -0700
                Hot-swap-ability of PS/2 devices (Was: Cursor while booting) gazelle@shell.xmission.com (Kenny McCormack) - 2016-03-17 00:31 +0000
                Re: Hot-swap-ability of PS/2 devices (Was: Cursor while booting) Robert Riches <spamtrap42@jacob21819.net> - 2016-03-17 01:10 +0000
                Re: Hot-swap-ability of PS/2 devices (Was: Cursor while booting) William Unruh <unruh@invalid.ca> - 2016-03-17 05:11 +0000
                Re: Hot-swap-ability of PS/2 devices (Was: Cursor while booting) Robert Heller <heller@deepsoft.com> - 2016-03-16 20:54 -0500
                Re: Hot-swap-ability of PS/2 devices (Was: Cursor while booting) William Unruh <unruh@invalid.ca> - 2016-03-17 05:13 +0000
                Re: Hot-swap-ability of PS/2 devices (Was: Cursor while booting) Keith Keller <kkeller-usenet@wombat.san-francisco.ca.us> - 2016-03-17 09:37 -0700
                Re: Hot-swap-ability of PS/2 devices (Was: Cursor while booting) William Unruh <unruh@invalid.ca> - 2016-03-17 16:42 +0000
                Re: Hot-swap-ability of PS/2 devices (Was: Cursor while booting) Bobbie Sellers <bliss-sf4ever@dslextreme.com> - 2016-03-17 10:02 -0700
                Re: Hot-swap-ability of PS/2 devices (Was: Cursor while booting) "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@invalid.es> - 2016-03-17 20:11 +0100
                Re: Hot-swap-ability of PS/2 devices (Was: Cursor while booting) William Unruh <unruh@invalid.ca> - 2016-03-18 01:55 +0000
                Re: Hot-swap-ability of PS/2 devices (Was: Cursor while booting) Robert Riches <spamtrap42@jacob21819.net> - 2016-03-18 03:21 +0000
                Re: Hot-swap-ability of PS/2 devices (Was: Cursor while booting) The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2016-03-18 12:10 +0000
                Re: Hot-swap-ability of PS/2 devices (Was: Cursor while booting) William Unruh <unruh@invalid.ca> - 2016-03-18 15:33 +0000
                Re: Hot-swap-ability of PS/2 devices (Was: Cursor while booting) "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@invalid.es> - 2016-03-18 20:21 +0100
                Re: Hot-swap-ability of PS/2 devices (Was: Cursor while booting) William Unruh <unruh@invalid.ca> - 2016-03-17 19:14 +0000
                Re: Hot-swap-ability of PS/2 devices (Was: Cursor while booting) Bobbie Sellers <bliss-sf4ever@dslextreme.com> - 2016-03-17 13:03 -0700
                Re: Hot-swap-ability of PS/2 devices (Was: Cursor while booting) William Unruh <unruh@invalid.ca> - 2016-03-18 01:57 +0000
                Re: Hot-swap-ability of PS/2 devices (Was: Cursor while booting) Bobbie Sellers <bliss-sf4ever@dslextreme.com> - 2016-03-17 19:11 -0700
                Re: Hot-swap-ability of PS/2 devices (Was: Cursor while booting) Robert Heller <heller@deepsoft.com> - 2016-03-17 14:30 -0500
                Re: Hot-swap-ability of PS/2 devices (Was: Cursor while booting) Keith Keller <kkeller-usenet@wombat.san-francisco.ca.us> - 2016-03-17 14:59 -0700
                Re: Hot-swap-ability of PS/2 devices (Was: Cursor while booting) Robert Heller <heller@deepsoft.com> - 2016-03-17 18:16 -0500
                Re: Hot-swap-ability of PS/2 devices (Was: Cursor while booting) Keith Keller <kkeller-usenet@wombat.san-francisco.ca.us> - 2016-03-18 11:07 -0700
                Re: Hot-swap-ability of PS/2 devices (Was: Cursor while booting) Robert Heller <heller@deepsoft.com> - 2016-03-18 13:49 -0500
                Re: Hot-swap-ability of PS/2 devices (Was: Cursor while booting) Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2016-03-18 22:13 +0000
                Re: Hot-swap-ability of PS/2 devices (Was: Cursor while booting) William Unruh <unruh@invalid.ca> - 2016-03-18 19:55 +0000
                Re: Hot-swap-ability of PS/2 devices (Was: Cursor while booting) Robert Heller <heller@deepsoft.com> - 2016-03-18 15:13 -0500
                Re: Hot-swap-ability of PS/2 devices Andreas Kohlbach <march.10.ankman@spamgourmet.net> - 2016-03-18 14:35 -0400
                Re: Cursor while booting Pascal Hambourg <boite-a-spam@plouf.fr.eu.org> - 2016-03-17 13:31 +0100
                Re: Cursor while booting William Unruh <unruh@invalid.ca> - 2016-03-17 15:04 +0000
                Hot-swap-ability of PS/2 devices (Was: Cursor while booting) gazelle@shell.xmission.com (Kenny McCormack) - 2016-03-17 00:33 +0000
                Re: Hot-swap-ability of PS/2 devices (Was: Cursor while booting) William Unruh <unruh@invalid.ca> - 2016-03-17 05:09 +0000
                Re: Hot-swap-ability of PS/2 devices (Was: Cursor while booting) Aragorn <thorongil@telenet.be.invalid> - 2016-03-17 14:15 +0100
                Re: Hot-swap-ability of PS/2 devices (Was: Cursor while booting) Pascal Hambourg <boite-a-spam@plouf.fr.eu.org> - 2016-03-17 15:05 +0100
      Re: Cursor while booting w4hw4h.hh@gmail.com - 2016-03-15 02:49 -0700
        Re: Cursor while booting w4hw4h.hh@gmail.com - 2016-03-15 02:57 -0700
  Re: Cursor while booting Teemu Likonen <tlikonen@iki.fi> - 2016-03-13 11:36 +0200
    Re: Cursor while booting w4hw4h.hh@gmail.com - 2016-03-15 02:47 -0700
      Re: Cursor while booting William Unruh <unruh@invalid.ca> - 2016-03-15 19:45 +0000
    Re: Cursor while booting w4hw4h.hh@gmail.com - 2016-03-15 02:53 -0700
      Re: Cursor while booting The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2016-03-15 10:02 +0000
  Re: Cursor while booting Chick Tower <c.tower@deadspam.com> - 2016-03-15 16:52 +0000

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