Re: (test) ? a:b

Date	2014-10-27 01:40 +0000
From	MRAB <python@mrabarnett.plus.com>
Subject	Re: (test) ? a:b
References	(12 earlier) <mailman.15173.1414269959.18130.python-list@python.org> <544c3bde$0$12988$c3e8da3$5496439d@news.astraweb.com> <mailman.15183.1414285433.18130.python-list@python.org> <544c754b$0$12991$c3e8da3$5496439d@news.astraweb.com> <854muq2vpm.fsf@benfinney.id.au>
Newsgroups	comp.lang.python
Message-ID	<mailman.15215.1414374034.18130.python-list@python.org> (permalink)

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On 2014-10-27 00:38, Ben Finney wrote:
> Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> writes:
>
>> Do you really not see the connection between counting and summing?
>
> Connection? Of course. But I also see a huge distinction. I'm surprised
> you could misunderstand my position to the extent you think such a
> question needs to be asked.
>
> The difference between “sum these values” versus “count these values” is
> important. That's at the root of why I find it confusingly wrong to sum
> True or False values.
>
> Do you really not see the distinction between counting and summing?
>
> The question is just as silly that way.
>
>> If you have three apples, and I have two apples, then in total we have
>> (count the apples: one two three, four five) five apples.
>
> If you have three apples in one basket, and I have two apples in one
> basket, “sum the baskets” is quite a different operation from “count the
> baskets”.
>
>      [3, 2]
>
> What is the sum of those values?
>
> How many values are there?
>
Those are ints. The question is whether you can sum bools.

Python's way is to say that it's counting how many True there are.

Sometimes it's useful; pragmatism beats purity, and all that.

> The distinction between those is why I find it unhelpful to express “how
> many values?” with “sum them”.
>
>> Alas, you missed the bigger bug: I'm counting *blank lines*, not
>> non-blank lines. You need a `not` in there.
>
> Which is, shall we say, not incompatible with the position that the
> “count the matches by summing bools” method is an unclear expression of
> intent :-)
>

Thread

(test) ? a:b "ast" <nomail@invalid.com> - 2014-10-22 10:29 +0200
  Re: (test) ? a:b buscacio@gmail.com - 2014-10-22 02:05 -0700
    Re: (test) ? a:b "ast" <nomail@invalid.com> - 2014-10-22 11:14 +0200
      Re: (test) ? a:b Mark Lawrence <breamoreboy@yahoo.co.uk> - 2014-10-22 12:45 +0100
        Re: (test) ? a:b "ast" <nomail@invalid.com> - 2014-10-27 09:01 +0100
      Re: (test) ? a:b Michael Torrie <torriem@gmail.com> - 2014-10-22 11:16 -0600
        Re: (test) ? a:b Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> - 2014-10-23 11:44 +1100
    Re: (test) ? a:b Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-10-22 20:15 +1100
    Re: (test) ? a:b Mark Lawrence <breamoreboy@yahoo.co.uk> - 2014-10-22 10:16 +0100
    Re: (test) ? a:b Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-10-22 20:27 +1100
      Re: (test) ? a:b Gregory Ewing <greg.ewing@canterbury.ac.nz> - 2014-10-23 16:46 +1300
        Re: (test) ? a:b MRAB <python@mrabarnett.plus.com> - 2014-10-23 11:12 +0100
          Re: (test) ? a:b "ast" <nomail@invalid.com> - 2014-10-24 08:38 +0200
        Re: (test) ? a:b Michael Torrie <torriem@gmail.com> - 2014-10-25 19:04 -0600
          Re: (test) ? a:b Gregory Ewing <greg.ewing@canterbury.ac.nz> - 2014-10-27 22:04 +1300
        Re: (test) ? a:b Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-10-26 12:20 +1100
        Re: (test) ? a:b Michael Torrie <torriem@gmail.com> - 2014-10-25 21:05 -0600
    Re: (test) ? a:b Ned Batchelder <ned@nedbatchelder.com> - 2014-10-22 07:30 -0400
      Re: (test) ? a:b Marko Rauhamaa <marko@pacujo.net> - 2014-10-22 14:41 +0300
      Re: (test) ? a:b Rustom Mody <rustompmody@gmail.com> - 2014-10-22 06:16 -0700
        Re: (test) ? a:b "BartC" <bc@freeuk.com> - 2014-10-22 19:08 +0100
          Re: (test) ? a:b Dennis Lee Bieber <wlfraed@ix.netcom.com> - 2014-10-22 19:55 -0400
            Re: (test) ? a:b "BartC" <bc@freeuk.com> - 2014-10-23 11:50 +0100
              Re: (test) ? a:b Marko Rauhamaa <marko@pacujo.net> - 2014-10-23 16:44 +0300
                Re: (test) ? a:b Ian Kelly <ian.g.kelly@gmail.com> - 2014-10-23 08:24 -0600
                Re: (test) ? a:b Alain Ketterlin <alain@dpt-info.u-strasbg.fr> - 2014-10-23 16:41 +0200
                Re: (test) ? a:b Marko Rauhamaa <marko@pacujo.net> - 2014-10-23 19:20 +0300
                Re: (test) ? a:b Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> - 2014-10-24 19:38 +1100
                Re: (test) ? a:b Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-10-24 19:45 +1100
                Re: (test) ? a:b Marko Rauhamaa <marko@pacujo.net> - 2014-10-24 12:37 +0300
                Re: (test) ? a:b Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> - 2014-10-25 00:07 +1100
                Re: (test) ? a:b Ian Kelly <ian.g.kelly@gmail.com> - 2014-10-24 12:22 -0600
                Re: (test) ? a:b Marko Rauhamaa <marko@pacujo.net> - 2014-10-24 21:46 +0300
                Re: (test) ? a:b Dan Stromberg <drsalists@gmail.com> - 2014-10-24 10:20 -0700
                Re: (test) ? a:b alister <alister.nospam.ware@ntlworld.com> - 2014-10-24 20:58 +0000
                Re: (test) ? a:b Marko Rauhamaa <marko@pacujo.net> - 2014-10-25 00:02 +0300
                Re: (test) ? a:b Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> - 2014-10-25 16:03 +1100
                Re: (test) ? a:b Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-10-25 16:25 +1100
                Re: (test) ? a:b Ned Batchelder <ned@nedbatchelder.com> - 2014-10-25 07:58 -0400
                Re: (test) ? a:b Ian Kelly <ian.g.kelly@gmail.com> - 2014-10-25 07:53 -0600
                Re: (test) ? a:b Dennis Lee Bieber <wlfraed@ix.netcom.com> - 2014-10-25 14:11 -0400
                Re: (test) ? a:b alister <alister.nospam.ware@ntlworld.com> - 2014-10-25 19:49 +0000
                Re: (test) ? a:b Ben Finney <ben+python@benfinney.id.au> - 2014-10-26 07:45 +1100
                Re: (test) ? a:b Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> - 2014-10-26 11:10 +1100
                Re: (test) ? a:b Ben Finney <ben+python@benfinney.id.au> - 2014-10-26 12:03 +1100
                Re: (test) ? a:b Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> - 2014-10-26 15:15 +1100
                Re: (test) ? a:b Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-10-26 15:34 +1100
                Re: (test) ? a:b Terry Reedy <tjreedy@udel.edu> - 2014-10-26 17:12 -0400
                Re: (test) ? a:b Ben Finney <ben+python@benfinney.id.au> - 2014-10-27 11:38 +1100
                Re: (test) ? a:b MRAB <python@mrabarnett.plus.com> - 2014-10-27 01:40 +0000
                Re: (test) ? a:b Rustom Mody <rustompmody@gmail.com> - 2014-10-26 19:19 -0700
                Re: (test) ? a:b Ben Finney <ben+python@benfinney.id.au> - 2014-10-26 12:10 +1100
                Re: (test) ? a:b Joshua Landau <joshua@landau.ws> - 2014-10-27 01:55 +0000
                Re: (test) ? a:b Ben Finney <ben+python@benfinney.id.au> - 2014-10-27 13:28 +1100
                Re: (test) ? a:b Rustom Mody <rustompmody@gmail.com> - 2014-10-26 19:38 -0700
                Re: (test) ? a:b Joshua Landau <joshua@landau.ws> - 2014-10-27 02:43 +0000
                Re: (test) ? a:b Ben Finney <ben+python@benfinney.id.au> - 2014-10-27 13:56 +1100
                Re: (test) ? a:b Dan Stromberg <drsalists@gmail.com> - 2014-10-25 15:34 -0700
                Re: (test) ? a:b Ben Finney <ben+python@benfinney.id.au> - 2014-10-26 10:53 +1100
                Re: (test) ? a:b Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-10-26 11:01 +1100
                Re: (test) ? a:b Mark Lawrence <breamoreboy@yahoo.co.uk> - 2014-10-26 01:09 +0100
                Re: (test) ? a:b Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-10-26 11:13 +1100
          Re: (test) ? a:b Vito De Tullio <vito.detullio@gmail.com> - 2014-10-23 06:55 +0200
      Re: (test) ? a:b Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> - 2014-10-23 03:28 +1100
        Re: (test) ? a:b Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-10-23 03:40 +1100
        Re: (test) ? a:b alister <alister.nospam.ware@ntlworld.com> - 2014-10-22 18:03 +0000
        Re: (test) ? a:b Matthew Ruffalo <mmr15@case.edu> - 2014-10-22 14:27 -0400
        Re: (test) ? a:b Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-10-23 05:30 +1100
        Re: (test) ? a:b Ned Batchelder <ned@nedbatchelder.com> - 2014-10-22 16:11 -0400
    Re: (test) ? a:b Mark Lawrence <breamoreboy@yahoo.co.uk> - 2014-10-22 12:41 +0100
      Re: (test) ? a:b alister <alister.nospam.ware@ntlworld.com> - 2014-10-22 15:12 +0000
        Re: (test) ? a:b Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-10-23 02:18 +1100
          Re: (test) ? a:b alister <alister.nospam.ware@ntlworld.com> - 2014-10-22 15:24 +0000
    Re: (test) ? a:b Dan Stromberg <drsalists@gmail.com> - 2014-10-22 09:09 -0700
  Re: (test) ? a:b Tobiah <toby@tobiah.org> - 2014-10-24 10:23 -0700
    Re: (test) ? a:b Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-10-25 04:27 +1100
      Re: (test) ? a:b Tobiah <toby@tobiah.org> - 2014-10-24 11:31 -0700

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