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Re: OT: slightly longer life

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On 2017-05-18 08:28, mrdarrett@gmail.com wrote:
> On Thursday, May 18, 2017 at 7:14:29 AM UTC-7, Joerg wrote:
>> On 2017-05-17 16:50, mrdarrett@gmail.com wrote:
>>> On Wednesday, May 17, 2017 at 4:21:17 PM UTC-7, Joerg wrote:
>>>> On 2017-05-17 16:05, mrdarrett@gmail.com wrote:
>>>>> On Wednesday, May 17, 2017 at 3:42:01 PM UTC-7, Joerg wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> ...
>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Grains (or malt extract) are the main cost factors in
>>>>>>>> beer. I get my stuff in Minnisohtah:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> https://www.midwestsupplies.com/
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Nice!  Buying by the sack saves money also.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I am still a lowly extract brewer though. However, I am
>>>>>> keeping my eyes peeled for two-roller grain crusher. Some
>>>>>> day I want to do BIAB but must figure out a way to use two
>>>>>> bags instead of one, on account of a bad lower back. I
>>>>>> can't lift heavy stuff while bent over. Or rather, I can
>>>>>> but then I will pay for that.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Grain doesn't save a lot of money or often none at all but
>>>>>> allows more mods. I usually brew two batches in a day.
>>>>>> Having only two 1kW electric burners under a tamale steamer
>>>>>> pot it takes time to heat. That means that time-wise I
>>>>>> might be able to do one all-grain and one extract session
>>>>>> if we have dinner a little later.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Huh.  I went with grains precisely because they're cheaper.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Not really. There is no way I can make five gallons of IPA,
>>>> Stout, Pale Ale, Cream Ale or American Wheat for $20 using
>>>> grain. Mostly because hops and all the other stuff adds cost.
>>>
>>>
>>> Ah!  Do you use dried malt extract or syrups?  And your malt is
>>> only $20 for 5 gallons?
>>>
>>
>> I use both LME and DME. For a 5-gallon batch the base beers such as
>> a standard Pale Ale, IPA or Cream Ale cost me $20 including
>> everything, malt, specialty grains (steeped in), hops, yeast and
>> even the corn sugar for bottle carbonation. Plus shipping which
>> adds $6-7 unless I can sneak in a free-ship deal.
>
>
> I am impressed.  I might just try LME and DME next time; the settling
> times for my all-grain methods take a few hours.
>

That would be too much time for me. I figured that BIAB would add about 
1h to the process. In reality 1-1/2h but for beers that need specialty 
grains steeped in which is the case for most of them I'd save that 1/2h. 
This should still allow brewing two beers in one day if the 2nd one use 
an extract process.


> I took a peek at one of my favorite recipes (a Zywiec Polish beer
> clone) and it would cost me $18 in LME, vs $9 for all-grain.  All the
> rest of the flavor malts, yeast, etc. are the same (except for the
> hops; I think the recipe said to use slightly less hops if using
> all-grain).  That's for 5 gallons though, and I usually only make 2
> gallons at a time due to not having gigantic pots and carboys.  So
> I'm looking at saving only $4 or so, dividing everything by two.
>

$9 for all grain? Must be a very light beer. For summer those can be 
great and I am looking at making one soon. Something that only has 4% ABV.

>
>>> I'll consider DME if the economics shake out.  Huh.  Thanks.
>>>
>>> This is a recipe for that RIS I mentioned.
>>> http://www.homebrewtalk.com/showthread.php?t=238807
>>>
>>
>> That is one big beer. My wife wouldn't like it but I sure would.
>
>
> When I make big beers, I make a second light beer with the leftover
> flavor and sugars in the grains :)
>

Good plan! Don't let anything go to waste. In my case any spent grains 
go to chickens that friends have. EDH Brewing in El Dorado Hills makes 
grain crackers from some of them (rest goes to a farm as well) but when 
I tried they just crumbled. Tasted good though.

>
>>> A 50 pound sack goes for about $45 at Brewmeister, so rounding
>>> that off to $1/lb... that's $17 for the base malt... 4 pounds of
>>> specialty malt at $2/lb is $8... Say $5 for the hops and yeast
>>> (can use for maybe 2 more batches, so $15 for all hops and yeast,
>>> spread out over 3 batches)
>>>
>>> So say $30 for 5 gallons :)
>>>
>>
>> That's ok. The Belgian Tripel costs me $50 even from Midwest but
>> worth every drop.
>>
>
>
> What's the recipe?  I'm curious now.  Is it available online?  :)
>

It's this recipe kit:

https://www.midwestsupplies.com/belgian-tripel-extract-beer-kit

https://www.midwestsupplies.com/downloads/dl/file/id/623/product/7769/belgian_tripel_instructions.pdf

Absolutely requires a sizeable blow-off hose.

>
>> I use carboys for secondary (the blue water cooler bottles). They
>> only offer 5-gal total and are really hard to clean. My primaries
>> are 6-1/2 gallon food grade pails. Even there I now have spots
>> where the beer kind of "etched itself in". PBW can't get it out
>> anymore so there may come a day where I need new pails.
>
>
> Bottle brush?  Sometimes just filling with water and letting it sit
> for a few days helps too.
>

I tried it and the stains are hard to get off. Some beers have to sit in 
secondary for a month and over that time stuff cakes itself in.

>
>>> 1/2 tsp of yeast per gallon... that should be enough :o
>>>
>>
>> So far I haven't quite understood the whole over/underpitched
>> science. I mean, yeast makes lots of offspring so even if you have
>> too little in there it should produced more and more cells.
>
>
> The idea is to give the yeast a head-start vs. the natural bacteria
> and wild yeast.  Of course there is such a thing as too much...
> *boom*
>

Yes, that is always my concern when the lag is too long. So far, 
knocking on wood, none of the beers turned funky.


> But actually I'm interested in one wild yeast: Saccharomyces
> diastaticus.  It gives a bad flavor to the beer but is interesting
> for fuel alcohol production because it has the amylase enzymes
> built-in (the same enzymes which chop up the barley starches into
> sugars when malting at 150 F).
>

Mraz Brewing in El Dorado Hills specializes in sour beers. I am not a 
huge fan of those but some people drive 50 miles just to get a growler 
of one of them.

Risky business. It can contaminate a whole brewery. Supposedly that's 
what shut down Pyramid but others say it was to get out from underneath 
a union.

>
>>>> Right now the Pale Ale and IPA are a bit recalcitrant. The IPA
>>>> is at 29h fermentation lag and hasn't started a bit. The Pale
>>>> Ale is at 24h and shows very tepid yeast activity. Got to shake
>>>> the buckets some more later tonight to kick things into gear.
>>>> With living organisms such as yeast one never knows.
>>>
>>>
>>> Yeast need oxygen for the growth phase.  Did you aerate before
>>> pitching the yeast?  I aerate by hand-pouring two cups at a time
>>> with a sanitized measuring cup from my pot to the fermenter (but
>>> I only use 1-gallon jugs, so they're not so heavy).
>>>
>>
>> After cooling I rack the wort from the brew kettle into the
>> fermenter buckets. I use a 3/4" PVC tee from irrigation pipe where
>> I sawed a slot into the T-part. A plastic clamp slid in with the
>> hose holds the hose upwards at an angle of 20-30 degrees and this
>> causes the wort to splash in. Occasionally I place the tee at
>> another area on the rim of the bucket so it aerates other sections.
>> At the end I usually have several inches of foam on top of the wort
>> in the fermenter. So much that when I use dry yeast I have to push
>> the foam around with a sanitized strainer ladle to be able to
>> sprinkle the yeast onto the form surface and not have it riding on
>> the foam.
>>
>> The IPA has now kicked into gear with healthy air lock activity but
>> the Pale Ale is still tepid (but li'l bubbles are coming). I figure
>> I can always open a pouch of US-05 and pitch it in later but so far
>> I didn't have to do that with any beer.
>
>
> Safale US-05 always works; that's been my experience :)
>

Yes, it seems to be the go-to staple in brewing these days.

-- 
Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/

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OT: slightly longer life mrdarrett@gmail.com - 2017-05-17 11:54 -0700
  Re: OT: slightly longer life Don Y <blockedofcourse@foo.invalid> - 2017-05-17 12:06 -0700
    Re: OT: slightly longer life mrdarrett@gmail.com - 2017-05-17 12:39 -0700
      Re: OT: slightly longer life Don Y <blockedofcourse@foo.invalid> - 2017-05-17 13:23 -0700
        Re: OT: slightly longer life mrdarrett@gmail.com - 2017-05-17 13:50 -0700
      Re: OT: slightly longer life krw@notreal.com - 2017-05-17 19:47 -0400
      Re: OT: slightly longer life rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2017-05-17 19:52 -0400
        Re: OT: slightly longer life krw@notreal.com - 2017-05-17 20:16 -0400
  Re: OT: slightly longer life Joerg <news@analogconsultants.com> - 2017-05-17 12:13 -0700
    Re: OT: slightly longer life mrdarrett@gmail.com - 2017-05-17 12:41 -0700
      Re: OT: slightly longer life Joerg <news@analogconsultants.com> - 2017-05-17 13:49 -0700
        Re: OT: slightly longer life mrdarrett@gmail.com - 2017-05-17 13:54 -0700
          Re: OT: slightly longer life Joerg <news@analogconsultants.com> - 2017-05-17 14:29 -0700
            Re: OT: slightly longer life mrdarrett@gmail.com - 2017-05-17 15:10 -0700
              Re: OT: slightly longer life Joerg <news@analogconsultants.com> - 2017-05-17 15:42 -0700
                Re: OT: slightly longer life mrdarrett@gmail.com - 2017-05-17 16:05 -0700
                Re: OT: slightly longer life Joerg <news@analogconsultants.com> - 2017-05-17 16:21 -0700
                Re: OT: slightly longer life mrdarrett@gmail.com - 2017-05-17 16:50 -0700
                Re: OT: slightly longer life Joerg <news@analogconsultants.com> - 2017-05-18 07:14 -0700
                Re: OT: slightly longer life mrdarrett@gmail.com - 2017-05-18 08:28 -0700
                Re: OT: slightly longer life Joerg <news@analogconsultants.com> - 2017-05-18 10:33 -0700
                Re: OT: slightly longer life mrdarrett@gmail.com - 2017-05-18 08:38 -0700
                Re: OT: slightly longer life Joerg <news@analogconsultants.com> - 2017-05-18 10:36 -0700
                Re: OT: slightly longer life mrdarrett@gmail.com - 2017-05-19 08:32 -0700
                Re: OT: slightly longer life Joerg <news@analogconsultants.com> - 2017-05-19 11:17 -0700
        Re: OT: slightly longer life mrdarrett@gmail.com - 2017-05-17 14:03 -0700
          Re: OT: slightly longer life rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2017-05-18 10:27 -0400
        Re: OT: slightly longer life John Larkin <jjlarkin@highland_snip_technology.com> - 2017-05-17 14:57 -0700
          Re: OT: slightly longer life mrdarrett@gmail.com - 2017-05-17 15:11 -0700
            Re: OT: slightly longer life John Larkin <jjlarkin@highland_snip_technology.com> - 2017-05-17 15:24 -0700
              Re: OT: slightly longer life rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2017-05-18 10:28 -0400
                Re: OT: slightly longer life krw@notreal.com - 2017-05-18 12:45 -0400
          Re: slightly longer life "Kevin Aylward" <kevinRemovAT@kevinaylward.co.uk> - 2017-05-20 08:17 +0100
        Re: OT: slightly longer life krw@notreal.com - 2017-05-17 19:50 -0400
          Re: OT: slightly longer life mrdarrett@gmail.com - 2017-05-18 08:20 -0700
    Re: OT: slightly longer life Clifford Heath <no.spam@please.net> - 2017-05-18 06:52 +1000
      Re: OT: slightly longer life Joerg <news@analogconsultants.com> - 2017-05-18 07:32 -0700
    Re: OT: slightly longer life John Larkin <jjlarkin@highland_snip_technology.com> - 2017-05-17 14:55 -0700
  Re: OT: slightly longer life John Larkin <jjlarkin@highland_snip_technology.com> - 2017-05-17 14:54 -0700
    Re: OT: slightly longer life bill.sloman@ieee.org - 2017-05-18 19:06 -0700
    Re: slightly longer life "Kevin Aylward" <kevinRemovAT@kevinaylward.co.uk> - 2017-05-20 08:25 +0100

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