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Re: Panic in Einstein Schizophrenic World

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Pentcho Valev wrote:

> On Sunday, March 20, 2016 at 1:40:55 PM UTC+2, Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn
> wrote:
>> Pentcho Valev wrote:
>> > Einstein did not predict anything about gravitational waves [...]
>> 
>> Einstein, A (1916-06). "Näherungsweise Integration der Feldgleichungen
>> der Gravitation" ("Approximative Integration of the Field Equations of
>> Gravitation"). In: "Sitzungsberichte der Königlich Preussischen Akademie
>> der Wissenschaften Berlin" ("Proceedings of the Royal Prussian Academy of
>> Sciences, Berlin"). part 1: 688-696.
>> <http://echo.mpiwg-berlin.mpg.de/ECHOdocuView?url=/permanent/echo/einstein/sitzungsberichte/BGG54UCY/index.meta>
>> 
>> Einstein, A (1918). "Über Gravitationswellen" ("On Gravitational Waves").
>> In: "Sitzungsberichte der Königlich Preussischen Akademie der
>> Wissenschaften Berlin". part 1: 154-167. (submitted: 1918-01-31).
>> <http://echo.mpiwg-berlin.mpg.de/ECHOdocuView?url=/permanent/echo/einstein/sitzungsberichte/W7ZU8V1E/index.meta>

First of all, nothing that you cited negates the fact that Einstein 
predicted gravitational waves as observed.  *Read* the papers, for a change.

Whether Einstein later revised that view is irrelevant.  The math matched 
the two observations to 5.1σ, IOW the confidence level is 99.99994 %.
 
> http://arxiv.org/abs/1602.04674

Not by a physicist and not even peer-reviewed, and you seriously expect me 
to accept it as science fact?
 
> https://www.quantamagazine.org/20160218-gravitational-waves-kennefick-interview/
>  ""There are no gravitational waves ... " ... "Plane gravitational waves,
>  traveling along the positive X-axis, can therefore be found ... " ... "
>  ... gravitational waves do not exist ... " ... "Do gravitational waves
>  exist?" ... "It turns out that rigorous solutions exist ... " These are
>  the words of Albert Einstein. For 20 years he equivocated about
>  gravitational waves, unsure whether these undulations in the fabric of
>  space and time were predicted or ruled out by his revolutionary 1915
>  theory of general relativity."

So he was unsure.  So what?  Nobody’s perfect.

Better to be unsure than being so deluded to think you possess the absolute 
truth like you science cranks.
 
> http://www.thenational.ae/arts-life/the-review/why-albert-einstein-continues-to-make-waves-as-black-holes-collide#full
>  "Einstein believed in neither gravitational waves nor black holes. (...)

The article does not cite any sources.  However, it concludes:

| […]
| For Dr Kiriushcheva and her colleagues, perhaps the biggest question mark 
| hanging over the Ligo findings is that for any scientific experiment to 
| have full credibility, its results must be independently repeatable – 
                             ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
| clearly impossible when only Ligo and its scientists have access to the 
  ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
| necessary funding and equipment.

So that is a fallacy by the article’s author, probably due to superficial 
research.  It should be an “if”, not a “when”.  For example, the third LIGO 
detector (formerly the second at Hanford) is planned to be moved to India.  
ESA’s LISA Pathfinder has reached its L₁ orbit earlier this year.  The 
Advanced Virgo detector in Italy (an international collaboration) is going 
online later this year.  Another GW detector, KAGRA (of the gravitational 
wave studies group at the Institute for Cosmic Ray Research (ICRR) of the 
University of Tokyo), is under construction in the works in the Kamiokande 
mine in Japan, planned to start operation in 2018.  And so on.  

You can even help LIGO and GEO 600 scientists with the detection by 
participating in distributed computing and running Einstein@home.

Wait and see.

<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gravitational_wave#Detection>

| Prof Shawhan says that “the results have been replicated in some sense;
                          ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ 
| although it may look like one result from the outside … we rely on two
  ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
| independent detectors each observing the same event in a consistent way.
  ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ 
| “We also have found the event using multiple independent data analysis 
   ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
| algorithms executed by different people within our collaboration … this
  ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ 
| gives us the confidence to claim that we have unambiguously detected a 
  ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
| gravitational wave signal."
  ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
| 
| The questions raised by Dr Kiriushcheva and her colleagues are all good 
| ones, he says, and “some continued scepticism is fine. But we have 
                      ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
| presented everything we know about this event and we hope to be able to 
  ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
| report on additional events in the future".
  ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
| Watch that space.
| 
| In the meantime, regardless of where he stood on the issue of 
| gravitational waves, were he still alive today, “continued scepticism" is 
| something Einstein would doubtless have approved of.
| 
| After all, as he once said: “The important thing is to not stop 
| questioning. Curiosity has its own reason for existing."
               ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Only that the article’s author got Einstein completely wrong on that.

But it is unsurprising that such a biased article would be published on a 
Web site of a state-owned daily newspaper in a federal hereditary monarchy 
like the UAE.  You really should check your sources sometime.


PointedEars
-- 
Q: What did the nuclear physicist post on the laboratory door
   when he went camping?  
A: 'Gone fission'.
(from: WolframAlpha)

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Panic in Einstein Schizophrenic World Pentcho Valev <pvalev@yahoo.com> - 2016-03-19 13:02 -0700
  Re: Panic in Einstein Schizophrenic World cryptoclearance <cryptoclearance@cryptoclearance.net> - 2016-03-19 20:35 +0000
  Re: Panic in Einstein Schizophrenic World Gary Harnagel <hitlong@yahoo.com> - 2016-03-19 14:20 -0700
  Re: Panic in Einstein Schizophrenic World JanPB <filmart@gmail.com> - 2016-03-19 17:27 -0700
    Re: Panic in Einstein Schizophrenic World "Ross A. Finlayson" <ross.finlayson@gmail.com> - 2016-03-20 00:13 -0700
      Re: Panic in Einstein Schizophrenic World "Ross A. Finlayson" <ross.finlayson@gmail.com> - 2016-03-20 00:16 -0700
      Re: Panic in Einstein Schizophrenic World Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2016-03-20 09:50 +0100
        Re: Panic in Einstein Schizophrenic World "Ross A. Finlayson" <ross.finlayson@gmail.com> - 2016-03-20 15:00 -0700
          Re: Panic in Einstein Schizophrenic World Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2016-03-21 00:55 +0100
            Re: Panic in Einstein Schizophrenic World "Ross A. Finlayson" <ross.finlayson@gmail.com> - 2016-03-20 20:50 -0700
              Re: Panic in Einstein Schizophrenic World "Ross A. Finlayson" <ross.finlayson@gmail.com> - 2016-03-20 21:01 -0700
              Re: Panic in Einstein Schizophrenic World Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2016-03-21 17:38 +0100
                Re: Panic in Einstein Schizophrenic World bear making dust <bear@bearmakingdust.net> - 2016-03-21 16:43 +0000
                Re: Panic in Einstein Schizophrenic World Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2016-03-21 17:54 +0100
                Re: Panic in Einstein Schizophrenic World "Ross A. Finlayson" <ross.finlayson@gmail.com> - 2016-03-21 18:59 -0700
                Re: Panic in Einstein Schizophrenic World "Ross A. Finlayson" <ross.finlayson@gmail.com> - 2016-03-21 19:12 -0700
                Re: Panic in Einstein Schizophrenic World Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-03-22 07:23 -0500
                Re: Panic in Einstein Schizophrenic World mlwozniak@wp.pl - 2016-03-22 05:30 -0700
                Re: Panic in Einstein Schizophrenic World Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2016-03-22 19:59 +0100
                Re: Panic in Einstein Schizophrenic World "Ross A. Finlayson" <ross.finlayson@gmail.com> - 2016-03-22 19:42 -0700
                Re: Panic in Einstein Schizophrenic World "Ross A. Finlayson" <ross.finlayson@gmail.com> - 2016-03-22 20:21 -0700
                Re: Panic in Einstein Schizophrenic World Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2016-03-22 08:42 +0100
  Re: Panic in Einstein Schizophrenic World Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2016-03-20 09:26 +0100
    Re: Panic in Einstein Schizophrenic World Pentcho Valev <pvalev@yahoo.com> - 2016-03-20 02:47 -0700
      Re: Panic in Einstein Schizophrenic World JanPB <filmart@gmail.com> - 2016-03-20 03:21 -0700
      Re: Panic in Einstein Schizophrenic World Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2016-03-20 12:40 +0100
        Re: Panic in Einstein Schizophrenic World Pentcho Valev <pvalev@yahoo.com> - 2016-03-20 04:54 -0700
          Re: Panic in Einstein Schizophrenic World Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2016-03-20 13:47 +0100
          Re: Panic in Einstein Schizophrenic World cryptoclearance <cryptoclearance@cryptoclearance.net> - 2016-03-20 14:10 +0000
  Re: Panic in Einstein Schizophrenic World Pentcho Valev <pvalev@yahoo.com> - 2016-03-20 04:07 -0700
    Re: Panic in Einstein Schizophrenic World cryptoclearance <cryptoclearance@cryptoclearance.net> - 2016-03-20 11:46 +0000
      Re: Panic in Einstein Schizophrenic World Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2016-03-23 06:52 +0100

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