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Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022

From olcott <polcott333@gmail.com>
Newsgroups comp.theory, comp.ai.philosophy
Subject Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022
Date 2025-10-28 19:33 -0500
Organization A noiseless patient Spider
Message-ID <10drnch$2igce$1@dont-email.me> (permalink)
References (21 earlier) <20251028150350.260@kylheku.com> <10drg2f$2g5ql$1@dont-email.me> <20251028164839.435@kylheku.com> <10drlh5$2i1h2$1@dont-email.me> <20251028170438.205@kylheku.com>

Cross-posted to 2 groups.

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On 10/28/2025 7:25 PM, Kaz Kylheku wrote:
> On 2025-10-29, olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> wrote:
>> On 10/28/2025 6:52 PM, Kaz Kylheku wrote:
>>> On 2025-10-28, olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> On 10/28/2025 5:14 PM, Kaz Kylheku wrote:
>>>>> On 2025-10-28, dbush <dbush.mobile@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>> On 10/28/2025 4:57 PM, olcott wrote:
>>>>>>> On 10/28/2025 2:37 PM, Kaz Kylheku wrote:
>>>>>>>> On 2025-10-28, olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>> On 10/28/2025 11:35 AM, Kaz Kylheku wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> On 2025-10-28, olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>> Deciders only compute a mapping from their actual
>>>>>>>>>>> inputs. Computing the mapping from non-inputs is
>>>>>>>>>>> outside of the scope of Turing machines.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Calculating the halting of certain inputs is indeed impossible
>>>>>>>>>> for some halting algorithms.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Not just impossible outside of the scope of every Turing machine.
>>>>>>>>> Its the same kind of thing as requiring the purely mental object
>>>>>>>>> of a Turing machine to bake a birthday cake.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> It simply isn't. Inputs that are not correctly solvable by some
>>>>>>>> deciders are decided by some others.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> THIS INPUT IS SOLVABLE
>>>>>>> THE NON-INPUT IS OUT-OF-SCOPE
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Then why do you claim that H(D) must decide on this non input?
>>>>>
>>>>> Because he claims that D is two things; it has two properties:
>>>>> D.input and D.noninput.
>>>>>
>>>>> H(D) is solving D.input (as machines are required) and (believe
>>>>> him when he says) that D.input is nonterminating.
>>>>>
>>>>> What is terminating is D.noninput (he acknowledges).
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Good job.
>>>> Your naming conventions make things very clear.
>>>>
>>>>> If some H_other decider is tested on H_other(D), then the "Olcott
>>>>> reality distortion wave function" (ORDF) collapses, and D.input
>>>>> becomes the same as D.noninput.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> *So we need to clarify*
>>>>     D.input_to_H versus
>>>>     D.non_input_to_H which can be:
>>>>       D.input_to_H1
>>>>       D.executed_from_main
>>>>
>>>> I take Rice's semantic properties of programs and
>>>> clarify that this has always meant the semantic
>>>> properties of finite string machine descriptions.
>>>>
>>>> Then I further divide this into
>>>> (a) semantic properties of INPUT finite strings
>>>> (b) semantic properties of NON_INPUT finite strings
>>>
>>> The problem is that "input" is just a role of some datum in a context,
>>> like a function
>>>
>>> The input versus non-input distinction cannot be found in any
>>> binary digit of the bit string comprising the datum itself.
>>>
>>
>> Unless you bother to pay attention to the fact that
>> the sequence of steps of D simulated by H is a different
>> sequence of steps than D simulated by H1.
> 
> How do we know what is correct?
> 

Because all deciders only report on what their
input specifies H(D)==0 and H1(D)==1 are both correct.

> Suppose I'm given an input D, and two deciders X and Y.
> I know nothing about these.  (But they are simulating deciders,
> producing different executions.)
> 
> X accepts, Y rejects.
> 
> Do I regard both of them as right? Or one of them wrong?
> If so, which one? Or both wrong?
> 
> Suppose I happen to be sure that D halts.  So I know X is correct.
> 

As far as a DOS (denial of service) attack
goes H(D)==0 correctly rejects its input.

> Under your system, I don't know whether Y is correct.
> 
> Y could be a broken decider that is wrongly deciding D (and /that/
> is why its execution trace differs from X).
> 
> Or it could be the case that D is a non-input to Y, in which case Y is
> deemed to be correct because D being a non-input to Y means that D
> denotes non-halting semantics to Y (and /that/ is why its execution
> trace differs from X).
> 
> The fact that the execution trace differs doesn't inform.
> 
> We need to know the value of is_input(Y, D): we need to /decide/ whether
> D is non-input or input to Y in order to /decide/ whether its rejection
> is correct.
> 

Whatever is a correct simulation of an input by
a decider is the behavior that must be reported on.

> Do you not see that your concept leaves decision problems?
> 

Yes. It leaves them properly resolved.

> You are not looking at it from the perspective of a /consumer/ of a
> /decider product/ actually trying to use deciders and trust their
> answer.
> 

Whatever is a correct simulation of an input by
a decider is the behavior that must be reported on.

> If you allow halting programs to be decided as non-halting in situations
> in which they are non-inputs, the end user of deciders has to /know/
> when they are looking at that case, and when they are dealing with a
> broken decider.
> 
> That's a decision problem you hae punted to the end user.
> 
> I say that that decision problem you have punted to the end user
> is incomputable!!!
> 
> So even if ostensibly you resolved the halting problem on one level
> by simply /excusing/ some programs from calculating the traditional
> halting value when they are given non-inputs, you've not actually
> solved the real halting problem: that of the end-user simply wanting
> to know whether a given program will terminate or not. The
> end user has no way of knowing whether a program was excused on
> a non-input, or whether it is just fumbling an input.
> 
> It doesn't appear you've improved the situation at all; you've
> just reshuffled how incomputablity fits into the picture.
> 

The definition of a decider requires it to
only report on what its input specifies.

-- 
Copyright 2025 Olcott "Talent hits a target no one else can hit; Genius
hits a target no one else can see." Arthur Schopenhauer

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Thread

lol. An AI response to Olcott... "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2025-10-18 13:44 -0700
  Re: lol. An AI response to Olcott... dart200 <user7160@newsgrouper.org.invalid> - 2025-10-18 18:03 -0700
    Re: lol. An AI response to Olcott... olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-10-18 20:08 -0500
      Re: lol. An AI response to Olcott... Tristan Wibberley <tristan.wibberley+netnews2@alumni.manchester.ac.uk> - 2025-10-19 16:12 +0100
        Re: lol. An AI response to Olcott... "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2025-10-19 12:27 -0700
          Re: lol. An AI response to Olcott... Mike Terry <news.dead.person.stones@darjeeling.plus.com> - 2025-10-20 04:39 +0100
            Re: lol. An AI response to Olcott... olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-10-19 23:18 -0500
            Re: lol. An AI response to Olcott... "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2025-10-20 13:04 -0700
              Re: lol. An AI response to Olcott... Mike Terry <news.dead.person.stones@darjeeling.plus.com> - 2025-10-21 18:47 +0100
                Re: lol. An AI response to Olcott... "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2025-10-21 14:12 -0700
                Re: lol. An AI response to Olcott... "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2025-10-21 14:15 -0700
                Re: lol. An AI response to Olcott... "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2025-10-21 14:37 -0700
                Re: lol. An AI response to Olcott... "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2025-10-21 15:03 -0700
                Re: lol. An AI response to Olcott... Mike Terry <news.dead.person.stones@darjeeling.plus.com> - 2025-10-22 00:08 +0100
                Re: lol. An AI response to Olcott... "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2025-10-21 16:57 -0700
                Re: lol. An AI response to Olcott... Mike Terry <news.dead.person.stones@darjeeling.plus.com> - 2025-10-22 01:43 +0100
                Re: lol. An AI response to Olcott... Mike Terry <news.dead.person.stones@darjeeling.plus.com> - 2025-10-22 01:48 +0100
                Re: lol. An AI response to Olcott... "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2025-10-21 20:00 -0700
                Re: lol. An AI response to Olcott... "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2025-10-21 20:46 -0700
                Re: lol. An AI response to Olcott... "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2025-10-21 20:49 -0700
                Re: lol. An AI response to Olcott... "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2025-10-22 12:33 -0700
                Re: lol. An AI response to Olcott... "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2025-10-22 13:28 -0700
                Re: lol. An AI response to Olcott... Is Provable Correct olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-10-21 20:43 -0500
                Re: lol. An AI response to Olcott... Is Provable Correct "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2025-10-22 12:18 -0700
          Re: lol. An AI response to Olcott... Tristan Wibberley <tristan.wibberley+netnews2@alumni.manchester.ac.uk> - 2025-10-20 12:30 +0100
            Re: lol. An AI response to Olcott... olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-10-20 10:04 -0500
              Re: lol. An AI response to Olcott... "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2025-10-20 13:07 -0700
    Re: lol. An AI response to Olcott... Mike Terry <news.dead.person.stones@darjeeling.plus.com> - 2025-10-19 04:08 +0100
      Re: lol. An AI response to Olcott... olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-10-18 23:19 -0500
        Re: lol. An AI response to Olcott... Mike Terry <news.dead.person.stones@darjeeling.plus.com> - 2025-10-19 17:05 +0100
          Re: lol. An AI response to Olcott... olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-10-19 11:31 -0500
      Re: lol. An AI response to Olcott... olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-10-18 23:01 -0500
    Re: lol. An AI response to Olcott... Kaz Kylheku <643-408-1753@kylheku.com> - 2025-10-19 19:39 +0000
      Re: lol. An AI response to Olcott... olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-10-20 10:28 -0500
        Re: lol. An AI response to Olcott... Kaz Kylheku <643-408-1753@kylheku.com> - 2025-10-20 18:29 +0000
          Re: lol. An AI response to Olcott... olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-10-20 15:32 -0500
            Re: lol. An AI response to Olcott... Kaz Kylheku <643-408-1753@kylheku.com> - 2025-10-20 21:03 +0000
              Re: lol. An AI response to Olcott... olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-10-20 18:58 -0500
                Re: lol. An AI response to Olcott... Kaz Kylheku <643-408-1753@kylheku.com> - 2025-10-21 01:27 +0000
                Re: lol. An AI response to Olcott... olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-10-20 20:33 -0500
                Re: lol. An AI response to Olcott... Kaz Kylheku <643-408-1753@kylheku.com> - 2025-10-21 02:11 +0000
                Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-10-20 22:00 -0500
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 dbush <dbush.mobile@gmail.com> - 2025-10-20 23:05 -0400
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-10-20 22:13 -0500
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 dbush <dbush.mobile@gmail.com> - 2025-10-20 23:16 -0400
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-10-20 22:25 -0500
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 dbush <dbush.mobile@gmail.com> - 2025-10-20 23:29 -0400
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 Kaz Kylheku <643-408-1753@kylheku.com> - 2025-10-21 03:20 +0000
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-10-20 22:29 -0500
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-10-22 06:56 -0500
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 dbush <dbush.mobile@gmail.com> - 2025-10-22 08:25 -0400
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-10-22 07:48 -0500
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 dbush <dbush.mobile@gmail.com> - 2025-10-22 09:00 -0400
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-10-22 08:47 -0500
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 dbush <dbush.mobile@gmail.com> - 2025-10-22 09:50 -0400
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-10-22 09:25 -0500
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 joes <noreply@example.org> - 2025-10-22 15:04 +0000
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-10-22 10:08 -0500
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 joes <noreply@example.org> - 2025-10-22 15:38 +0000
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-10-22 10:40 -0500
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 joes <noreply@example.org> - 2025-10-22 15:53 +0000
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-10-22 11:13 -0500
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 joes <noreply@example.org> - 2025-10-22 18:55 +0000
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 dbush <dbush.mobile@gmail.com> - 2025-10-22 13:30 -0400
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 joes <noreply@example.org> - 2025-10-22 13:34 +0000
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-10-22 08:43 -0500
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 dbush <dbush.mobile@gmail.com> - 2025-10-22 09:46 -0400
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 Kaz Kylheku <643-408-1753@kylheku.com> - 2025-10-22 15:40 +0000
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-10-22 10:47 -0500
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 Kaz Kylheku <643-408-1753@kylheku.com> - 2025-10-22 17:07 +0000
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-10-22 12:11 -0500
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 dbush <dbush.mobile@gmail.com> - 2025-10-22 13:38 -0400
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 Kaz Kylheku <643-408-1753@kylheku.com> - 2025-10-22 18:40 +0000
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 André G. Isaak <agisaak@gm.invalid> - 2025-10-22 13:24 -0600
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-10-22 14:30 -0500
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 dbush <dbush.mobile@gmail.com> - 2025-10-22 15:31 -0400
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2025-10-22 20:34 +0100
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 Kaz Kylheku <643-408-1753@kylheku.com> - 2025-10-22 19:52 +0000
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-10-22 15:00 -0500
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 Kaz Kylheku <643-408-1753@kylheku.com> - 2025-10-22 20:20 +0000
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-10-22 15:35 -0500
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 dbush <dbush.mobile@gmail.com> - 2025-10-22 16:43 -0400
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 --- NST olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-10-22 16:12 -0500
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 --- NST "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2025-10-22 14:32 -0700
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 --- NST dbush <dbush.mobile@gmail.com> - 2025-10-22 17:50 -0400
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 --- NST Kaz Kylheku <643-408-1753@kylheku.com> - 2025-10-22 23:01 +0000
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 --- NST olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-10-23 09:55 -0500
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 --- NST Kaz Kylheku <643-408-1753@kylheku.com> - 2025-10-23 16:47 +0000
                "there will still be a nested simulation tower" Kaz olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-10-23 12:22 -0500
                Re: "there will still be a nested simulation tower" Kaz "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2025-10-23 11:50 -0700
                Re: "there will still be a nested simulation tower" Kaz Kaz Kylheku <643-408-1753@kylheku.com> - 2025-10-23 21:11 +0000
                Re: "there will still be a nested simulation tower" Kaz joes <noreply@example.org> - 2025-10-23 21:33 +0000
                Re: "there will still be a nested simulation tower" Kaz olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-10-23 17:14 -0500
                Re: "there will still be a nested simulation tower" Kaz Kaz Kylheku <643-408-1753@kylheku.com> - 2025-10-23 23:41 +0000
                Re: "there will still be a nested simulation tower" Kaz joes <noreply@example.org> - 2025-10-24 07:34 +0000
                Re: "there will still be a nested simulation tower" Kaz olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-10-24 02:47 -0500
                Re: "there will still be a nested simulation tower" Kaz joes <noreply@example.org> - 2025-10-24 12:04 +0000
                Re: "there will still be a nested simulation tower" Kaz olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-10-24 09:54 -0500
                Re: "there will still be a nested simulation tower" Kaz Mikko <mikko.levanto@iki.fi> - 2025-10-25 15:36 +0300
                Re: "there will still be a nested simulation tower" Kaz olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-10-25 15:30 -0500
                Re: "there will still be a nested simulation tower" Kaz "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2025-10-25 13:34 -0700
                Re: "there will still be a nested simulation tower" Kaz Mikko <mikko.levanto@iki.fi> - 2025-10-26 14:03 +0200
                Re: "there will still be a nested simulation tower" Kaz joes <noreply@example.org> - 2025-10-28 15:39 +0000
                D simulated by H cannot possibly reach past its own first line olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-10-28 11:40 -0500
                "there will still be a nested simulation tower" Kaz olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-10-23 17:08 -0500
                Re: "there will still be a nested simulation tower" Kaz "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2025-10-23 15:21 -0700
                Re: "there will still be a nested simulation tower" Kaz "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2025-10-23 15:26 -0700
                Re: "there will still be a nested simulation tower" Kaz dbush <dbush.mobile@gmail.com> - 2025-10-23 18:40 -0400
                Re: "there will still be a nested simulation tower" Kaz olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-10-23 17:48 -0500
                Re: "there will still be a nested simulation tower" Kaz dbush <dbush.mobile@gmail.com> - 2025-10-23 19:09 -0400
                Re: "there will still be a nested simulation tower" Kaz Kaz Kylheku <643-408-1753@kylheku.com> - 2025-10-23 23:55 +0000
                Re: "there will still be a nested simulation tower" Kaz olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-10-23 19:00 -0500
                Re: "there will still be a nested simulation tower" Kaz Kaz Kylheku <643-408-1753@kylheku.com> - 2025-10-23 23:45 +0000
                Re: "there will still be a nested simulation tower" Kaz olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-10-23 18:51 -0500
                Re: "there will still be a nested simulation tower" Kaz dbush <dbush.mobile@gmail.com> - 2025-10-23 20:14 -0400
                "there will still be a nested simulation tower" Kaz olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-10-22 17:14 -0500
                Re: "there will still be a nested simulation tower" Kaz dbush <dbush.mobile@gmail.com> - 2025-10-22 18:33 -0400
                Re: "there will still be a nested simulation tower" Kaz Kaz Kylheku <643-408-1753@kylheku.com> - 2025-10-22 23:15 +0000
                Re: "there will still be a nested simulation tower" Kaz olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-10-22 18:24 -0500
                Re: "there will still be a nested simulation tower" Kaz dbush <dbush.mobile@gmail.com> - 2025-10-22 20:14 -0400
                Re: "there will still be a nested simulation tower" Kaz Kaz Kylheku <643-408-1753@kylheku.com> - 2025-10-23 01:22 +0000
                Re: "there will still be a nested simulation tower" Kaz olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-10-22 20:47 -0500
                Re: "there will still be a nested simulation tower" Kaz dbush <dbush.mobile@gmail.com> - 2025-10-22 22:13 -0400
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 Julio Di Egidio <julio@diegidio.name> - 2025-10-23 08:02 +0200
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-10-23 09:51 -0500
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-10-22 14:55 -0500
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 dbush <dbush.mobile@gmail.com> - 2025-10-22 16:24 -0400
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 Kaz Kylheku <643-408-1753@kylheku.com> - 2025-10-22 21:55 +0000
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 joes <noreply@example.org> - 2025-10-22 18:54 +0000
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-10-22 14:00 -0500
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 joes <noreply@example.org> - 2025-10-22 19:27 +0000
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-10-22 14:31 -0500
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 dbush <dbush.mobile@gmail.com> - 2025-10-22 15:32 -0400
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 joes <noreply@example.org> - 2025-10-22 19:37 +0000
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-10-22 14:45 -0500
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 dbush <dbush.mobile@gmail.com> - 2025-10-22 15:45 -0400
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 Kaz Kylheku <643-408-1753@kylheku.com> - 2025-10-22 19:56 +0000
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-10-22 15:04 -0500
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 Kaz Kylheku <643-408-1753@kylheku.com> - 2025-10-22 22:02 +0000
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-10-22 17:07 -0500
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 Kaz Kylheku <643-408-1753@kylheku.com> - 2025-10-22 23:12 +0000
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-10-22 19:46 -0500
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 Kaz Kylheku <643-408-1753@kylheku.com> - 2025-10-23 02:47 +0000
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-10-22 22:12 -0500
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2025-10-23 13:09 -0700
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-10-22 14:41 -0500
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 dbush <dbush.mobile@gmail.com> - 2025-10-22 15:44 -0400
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-10-22 14:45 -0500
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 dbush <dbush.mobile@gmail.com> - 2025-10-22 15:46 -0400
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 dbush <dbush.mobile@gmail.com> - 2025-10-22 15:28 -0400
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 Kaz Kylheku <643-408-1753@kylheku.com> - 2025-10-22 19:55 +0000
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-10-22 15:01 -0500
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 Kaz Kylheku <643-408-1753@kylheku.com> - 2025-10-22 21:56 +0000
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-10-22 17:00 -0500
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 Kaz Kylheku <643-408-1753@kylheku.com> - 2025-10-22 23:04 +0000
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-10-22 14:25 -0500
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 dbush <dbush.mobile@gmail.com> - 2025-10-22 15:29 -0400
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 joes <noreply@example.org> - 2025-10-22 19:30 +0000
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-10-22 14:43 -0500
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 dbush <dbush.mobile@gmail.com> - 2025-10-22 15:45 -0400
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 Kaz Kylheku <643-408-1753@kylheku.com> - 2025-10-22 20:17 +0000
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-10-22 15:32 -0500
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2025-10-22 14:38 -0700
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2025-10-22 13:10 -0700
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 Kaz Kylheku <643-408-1753@kylheku.com> - 2025-10-22 20:15 +0000
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-10-22 15:30 -0500
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 dbush <dbush.mobile@gmail.com> - 2025-10-22 13:36 -0400
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 joes <noreply@example.org> - 2025-10-28 08:35 +0000
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-10-28 09:36 -0500
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 Kaz Kylheku <643-408-1753@kylheku.com> - 2025-10-28 16:33 +0000
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-10-28 11:49 -0500
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 dbush <dbush.mobile@gmail.com> - 2025-10-28 14:23 -0400
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 Kaz Kylheku <643-408-1753@kylheku.com> - 2025-10-28 19:04 +0000
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2025-10-28 12:19 -0700
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 dbush <dbush.mobile@gmail.com> - 2025-10-28 16:01 -0400
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2025-10-28 17:50 -0700
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-10-28 15:51 -0500
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 dbush <dbush.mobile@gmail.com> - 2025-10-28 17:58 -0400
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2025-10-29 03:16 +0000
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-10-28 22:26 -0500
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 dbush <dbush.mobile@gmail.com> - 2025-10-28 23:34 -0400
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 Kaz Kylheku <643-408-1753@kylheku.com> - 2025-10-29 05:45 +0000
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 Richard Damon <Richard@Damon-Family.org> - 2025-10-29 07:32 -0400
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2025-10-29 13:31 -0700
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 Kaz Kylheku <643-408-1753@kylheku.com> - 2025-10-28 16:35 +0000
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-10-28 12:13 -0500
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 joes <noreply@example.org> - 2025-10-28 18:32 +0000
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-10-28 13:46 -0500
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 joes <noreply@example.org> - 2025-10-28 19:28 +0000
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-10-28 15:53 -0500
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 joes <noreply@example.org> - 2025-10-28 21:06 +0000
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-10-28 16:14 -0500
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2025-10-29 14:31 -0700
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 Kaz Kylheku <643-408-1753@kylheku.com> - 2025-10-28 19:37 +0000
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-10-28 15:57 -0500
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 joes <noreply@example.org> - 2025-10-28 21:09 +0000
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-10-28 16:22 -0500
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 Kaz Kylheku <643-408-1753@kylheku.com> - 2025-10-28 21:43 +0000
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-10-28 16:53 -0500
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 Kaz Kylheku <643-408-1753@kylheku.com> - 2025-10-28 22:03 +0000
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-10-28 17:08 -0500
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 Kaz Kylheku <643-408-1753@kylheku.com> - 2025-10-28 22:18 +0000
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 dbush <dbush.mobile@gmail.com> - 2025-10-28 17:59 -0400
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 Kaz Kylheku <643-408-1753@kylheku.com> - 2025-10-28 22:14 +0000
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-10-28 17:28 -0500
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 Kaz Kylheku <643-408-1753@kylheku.com> - 2025-10-28 23:52 +0000
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-10-28 19:01 -0500
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 Kaz Kylheku <643-408-1753@kylheku.com> - 2025-10-29 00:25 +0000
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-10-28 19:33 -0500
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2025-10-28 17:56 -0700
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2025-10-28 17:57 -0700
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 Kaz Kylheku <643-408-1753@kylheku.com> - 2025-10-29 02:19 +0000
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-10-28 21:43 -0500
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 Richard Damon <Richard@Damon-Family.org> - 2025-10-28 23:07 -0400
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 Kaz Kylheku <643-408-1753@kylheku.com> - 2025-10-29 05:36 +0000
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-10-29 11:12 -0500
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 Kaz Kylheku <643-408-1753@kylheku.com> - 2025-10-29 17:21 +0000
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-10-29 14:38 -0500
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2025-10-29 15:16 -0700
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 Kaz Kylheku <643-408-1753@kylheku.com> - 2025-10-29 18:21 +0000
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-10-29 14:13 -0500
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2025-10-29 15:13 -0700
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 joes <noreply@example.org> - 2025-11-03 14:12 +0000
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-11-03 10:20 -0600
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 joes <noreply@example.org> - 2025-11-03 17:06 +0000
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-11-03 11:22 -0600
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 joes <noreply@example.org> - 2025-11-03 17:26 +0000
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-11-03 11:55 -0600
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 Mr Flibble <flibble@red-dwarf.jmc.corp> - 2025-11-03 17:57 +0000
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 Kaz Kylheku <643-408-1753@kylheku.com> - 2025-11-03 20:29 +0000
                Addressing duffer-speak olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-11-03 14:46 -0600
                Re: Addressing duffer-speak Kaz Kylheku <643-408-1753@kylheku.com> - 2025-11-03 20:59 +0000
                Re: Addressing duffer-speak olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-11-03 15:03 -0600
                Re: Addressing duffer-speak "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2025-11-03 13:00 -0800
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 joes <noreply@example.org> - 2025-10-29 09:47 +0000
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-10-29 08:40 -0500
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 joes <noreply@example.org> - 2025-10-29 14:12 +0000
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-10-29 11:15 -0500
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 joes <noreply@example.org> - 2025-10-29 16:37 +0000
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-10-29 11:54 -0500
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 joes <noreply@example.org> - 2025-10-29 17:24 +0000
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-10-29 12:37 -0500
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 dbush <dbush.mobile@gmail.com> - 2025-10-29 13:44 -0400
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-10-29 12:55 -0500
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 dbush <dbush.mobile@gmail.com> - 2025-10-29 15:42 -0400
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 joes <noreply@example.org> - 2025-10-29 17:49 +0000
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-10-29 13:00 -0500
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2025-10-29 14:15 -0700
                fuck chris dart200 <user7160@newsgrouper.org.invalid> - 2025-10-29 14:17 -0700
                Re: fuck chris olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-10-29 16:44 -0500
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2025-10-29 14:53 -0500
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2025-10-29 14:14 -0700
                fuck chris dart200 <user7160@newsgrouper.org.invalid> - 2025-10-29 14:16 -0700
                Re: fuck chris "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2025-10-29 14:40 -0700
                Re: fuck chris dart200 <user7160@newsgrouper.org.invalid> - 2025-10-29 14:42 -0700
                Re: fuck chris "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2025-10-29 15:22 -0700
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2025-10-29 14:11 -0700
                Re: Never any actual rebuttal to HHH(DD)==0 Since 10/13/2022 "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2025-10-29 14:29 -0700
  Re: lol. An AI response to Olcott... "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2025-11-14 22:02 -0800

csiph-web