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Lettings question

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  Lettings question Malcolm Loades <devnull@loades.net> - 2026-07-06 15:55 +0100
    Re: Lettings question Jon Ribbens <jon+usenet@unequivocal.eu> - 2026-07-06 16:05 +0000
    Re: Lettings question John <megane.06@gmail.com> - 2026-07-06 21:15 +0100
      Re: Lettings question Roland Perry <roland@perry.uk> - 2026-07-08 10:03 +0100
        Re: Lettings question Roger Hayter <roger@hayter.org> - 2026-07-08 09:22 +0000
          Re: Lettings question Roland Perry <roland@perry.uk> - 2026-07-08 10:40 +0100
            Re: Lettings question Roger Hayter <roger@hayter.org> - 2026-07-08 10:23 +0000
              Re: Lettings question Roland Perry <roland@perry.uk> - 2026-07-09 01:22 +0100
          Re: Lettings question JNugent <JNugent73@mail.com> - 2026-07-08 12:13 +0100
            Re: Lettings question Roland Perry <roland@perry.uk> - 2026-07-09 07:38 +0100
    Re: Lettings question Malcolm Loades <devnull@loades.net> - 2026-07-07 14:05 +0100
      Re: Lettings question Roger Hayter <roger@hayter.org> - 2026-07-08 15:05 +0000
      Re: Lettings question RJH <patchmoney@gmx.com> - 2026-07-09 02:30 +0000
        Re: Lettings question Roland Perry <roland@perry.uk> - 2026-07-09 07:36 +0100
          Re: Lettings question RJH <patchmoney@gmx.com> - 2026-07-09 07:54 +0000
            Re: Lettings question Roland Perry <roland@perry.uk> - 2026-07-09 09:26 +0100
            Re: Lettings question Malcolm Loades <devnull@loades.net> - 2026-07-09 11:52 +0100
              Re: Lettings question Roland Perry <roland@perry.uk> - 2026-07-09 14:37 +0100
                Re: Lettings question JNugent <JNugent73@mail.com> - 2026-07-09 15:28 +0100
                  Re: Lettings question Roland Perry <roland@perry.uk> - 2026-07-10 07:38 +0100
                    Re: Lettings question Malcolm Loades <devnull@loades.net> - 2026-07-10 13:22 +0100
                      Re: Lettings question SH <i.love@spam.com> - 2026-07-11 10:08 +0100
                Re: Lettings question John <megane.06@gmail.com> - 2026-07-10 13:58 +0100
              Re: Lettings question Jon Ribbens <jon+usenet@unequivocal.eu> - 2026-07-09 13:52 +0000
          Re: Lettings question John <megane.06@gmail.com> - 2026-07-10 13:47 +0100
        Re: Lettings question Malcolm Loades <devnull@loades.net> - 2026-07-09 11:18 +0100
      Re: Lettings question John <megane.06@gmail.com> - 2026-07-10 13:42 +0100
        Re: Lettings question Roland Perry <roland@perry.uk> - 2026-07-10 18:18 +0100
        Re: Lettings question Malcolm Loades <devnull@loades.net> - 2026-07-10 14:06 +0100

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#417329 — Lettings question

Last year we decided to let a flat previously occupied by family 
members.  We used a lettings agent who drew up an AST with a "Term 12 
months 0 days from 29/10/2025 to and including 28/10/206"

The tenant has given notice that they will vacate in August 2026, 2 
months before 28/10/2026.

Typing this situation into several AI sites they all say that the tenant 
is liable until 28/10/2026.  However our agent says the law changes made 
in May allow the tenants to give two months notice at any time.  They 
could move in immediately give 2 months notice and walk away 8 weeks later.

If it's true ASTs have been scrapped and it's 2 months notice at any 
time then we'll sell the property.

Which Is correct, our agent or AI?

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#417331

On 2026-07-06, Malcolm Loades <devnull@loades.net> wrote:
> Last year we decided to let a flat previously occupied by family 
> members.  We used a lettings agent who drew up an AST with a "Term 12 
> months 0 days from 29/10/2025 to and including 28/10/206"
>
> The tenant has given notice that they will vacate in August 2026, 2 
> months before 28/10/2026.
>
> Typing this situation into several AI sites they all say that the tenant 
> is liable until 28/10/2026.  However our agent says the law changes made 
> in May allow the tenants to give two months notice at any time.  They 
> could move in immediately give 2 months notice and walk away 8 weeks later.
>
> If it's true ASTs have been scrapped and it's 2 months notice at any 
> time then we'll sell the property.
>
> Which Is correct, our agent or AI?

Haha. A dilemma indeed. Which extremely unreliable source do you choose?

As far as I can see, the answer is that the agents are telling the truth
for once. The Renters' Rights Act 2025 s1 amends the Housing Act 1988
to add s4A, which says "Terms of an assured tenancy are of no effect so
far as they provide ... for a tenancy to be a fixed term tenancy". And
I can't see anything else which provides for fixed terms to continue
in pre-existing tenancies.

https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2025/26/section/1

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#417333

On 06/07/2026 15:55, Malcolm Loades wrote:
> Last year we decided to let a flat previously occupied by family 
> members.  We used a lettings agent who drew up an AST with a "Term 12 
> months 0 days from 29/10/2025 to and including 28/10/206"
> 
> The tenant has given notice that they will vacate in August 2026, 2 
> months before 28/10/2026.
> 
> Typing this situation into several AI sites they all say that the tenant 
> is liable until 28/10/2026.  However our agent says the law changes made 
> in May allow the tenants to give two months notice at any time.  They 
> could move in immediately give 2 months notice and walk away 8 weeks later.
> 
> If it's true ASTs have been scrapped and it's 2 months notice at any 
> time then we'll sell the property.
> 
> Which Is correct, our agent or AI?

Your agent I'm afraid. The law changed in May this year. ukHowever, the 
two months notice has to end on the rent due date.

 From Gov.uk

You must give your notice:

so the tenancy ends on a day when the rent is due or the day before the 
rent is due

So if notice was given on the 6th July, the two months notice is to 6th 
September, so the tenancy must run to the 28th September.  If it was 
given prior to 29th June, it will be 28th August.

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#417341

In message <112h2cn$2ad2l$3@dont-email.me>, at 21:15:18 on Mon, 6 Jul 
2026, John <megane.06@gmail.com> remarked:
>On 06/07/2026 15:55, Malcolm Loades wrote:
>> Last year we decided to let a flat previously occupied by family 
>>members.  We used a lettings agent who drew up an AST with a "Term 12 
>>months 0 days from 29/10/2025 to and including 28/10/206"
>>  The tenant has given notice that they will vacate in August 2026, 2 
>>months before 28/10/2026.
>>  Typing this situation into several AI sites they all say that the 
>>tenant  is liable until 28/10/2026.  However our agent says the law 
>>changes made  in May allow the tenants to give two months notice at 
>>any time.  They  could move in immediately give 2 months notice and 
>>walk away 8 weeks later.
>>  If it's true ASTs have been scrapped and it's 2 months notice at any 
>>time then we'll sell the property.
>>  Which Is correct, our agent or AI?
>
>Your agent I'm afraid. The law changed in May this year. ukHowever, the 
>two months notice has to end on the rent due date.
>
>From Gov.uk
>
>You must give your notice:
>
>so the tenancy ends on a day when the rent is due or the day before the 
>rent is due
>
>So if notice was given on the 6th July, the two months notice is to 6th 
>September, so the tenancy must run to the 28th September.  If it was 
>given prior to 29th June, it will be 28th August.

One of the unintended consequences of this change in the law is a 
looming shortage of student lets, because landlords previously could 
rent for a year, and flip the property between tenants at the start of 
the autumn term. But now they are faced with having up to a three month 
void over the summer vacation, so could decide it's no longer a viable 
business.
-- 
Roland Perry

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#417342

On 8 Jul 2026 at 10:03:58 BST, "Roland Perry" <roland@perry.uk> wrote:

> In message <112h2cn$2ad2l$3@dont-email.me>, at 21:15:18 on Mon, 6 Jul
> 2026, John <megane.06@gmail.com> remarked:
>> On 06/07/2026 15:55, Malcolm Loades wrote:
>>> Last year we decided to let a flat previously occupied by family
>>> members.  We used a lettings agent who drew up an AST with a "Term 12
>>> months 0 days from 29/10/2025 to and including 28/10/206"
>>>  The tenant has given notice that they will vacate in August 2026, 2
>>> months before 28/10/2026.
>>>  Typing this situation into several AI sites they all say that the
>>> tenant  is liable until 28/10/2026.  However our agent says the law
>>> changes made  in May allow the tenants to give two months notice at
>>> any time.  They  could move in immediately give 2 months notice and
>>> walk away 8 weeks later.
>>>  If it's true ASTs have been scrapped and it's 2 months notice at any
>>> time then we'll sell the property.
>>>  Which Is correct, our agent or AI?
>> 
>> Your agent I'm afraid. The law changed in May this year. ukHowever, the
>> two months notice has to end on the rent due date.
>> 
>> From Gov.uk
>> 
>> You must give your notice:
>> 
>> so the tenancy ends on a day when the rent is due or the day before the
>> rent is due
>> 
>> So if notice was given on the 6th July, the two months notice is to 6th
>> September, so the tenancy must run to the 28th September.  If it was
>> given prior to 29th June, it will be 28th August.
> 
> One of the unintended consequences of this change in the law is a
> looming shortage of student lets, because landlords previously could
> rent for a year, and flip the property between tenants at the start of
> the autumn term. But now they are faced with having up to a three month
> void over the summer vacation, so could decide it's no longer a viable
> business.

They could show a bit of initiative and do what the universities do; compete
for conference accommodation over the summer.

-- 

Roger Hayter

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#417343

In message <0257130181.2be97c19@uninhabited.net>, at 09:22:51 on Wed, 8
Jul 2026, Roger Hayter <roger@hayter.org> remarked:
>On 8 Jul 2026 at 10:03:58 BST, "Roland Perry" <roland@perry.uk> wrote:
>
>> In message <112h2cn$2ad2l$3@dont-email.me>, at 21:15:18 on Mon, 6 Jul
>> 2026, John <megane.06@gmail.com> remarked:
>>> On 06/07/2026 15:55, Malcolm Loades wrote:
>>>> Last year we decided to let a flat previously occupied by family
>>>> members.  We used a lettings agent who drew up an AST with a "Term 12
>>>> months 0 days from 29/10/2025 to and including 28/10/206"
>>>>  The tenant has given notice that they will vacate in August 2026, 2
>>>> months before 28/10/2026.
>>>>  Typing this situation into several AI sites they all say that the
>>>> tenant  is liable until 28/10/2026.  However our agent says the law
>>>> changes made  in May allow the tenants to give two months notice at
>>>> any time.  They  could move in immediately give 2 months notice and
>>>> walk away 8 weeks later.
>>>>  If it's true ASTs have been scrapped and it's 2 months notice at any
>>>> time then we'll sell the property.
>>>>  Which Is correct, our agent or AI?
>>>
>>> Your agent I'm afraid. The law changed in May this year. ukHowever, the
>>> two months notice has to end on the rent due date.
>>>
>>> From Gov.uk
>>>
>>> You must give your notice:
>>>
>>> so the tenancy ends on a day when the rent is due or the day before the
>>> rent is due
>>>
>>> So if notice was given on the 6th July, the two months notice is to 6th
>>> September, so the tenancy must run to the 28th September.  If it was
>>> given prior to 29th June, it will be 28th August.
>>
>> One of the unintended consequences of this change in the law is a
>> looming shortage of student lets, because landlords previously could
>> rent for a year, and flip the property between tenants at the start of
>> the autumn term. But now they are faced with having up to a three month
>> void over the summer vacation, so could decide it's no longer a viable
>> business.
>
>They could show a bit of initiative and do what the universities do; compete
>for conference accommodation over the summer.

The properties in question are not suitable for conference guests, who
also expect beds to be made, breakfast to be cooked for them, and so on.
With someone on site to meet and greet.

Quite a lot of the accommodation is not particularly close to the
Universities themselves, where the conferences take place - I'd guess an
average of a 15 minute cycle ride in the provinces, or up to half an
hour on the tube in London. And a lot it is in pretty poor condition,
rarely with en-suite facilities.

Even if the rooms were free, few conference guests would touch them with
a bargepole.

[I speak from personal experience, with my two children renting
 privately not that long ago, for a total of eight years between
 them - with only the first year in university accommodation]
-- 
Roland Perry

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#417344

On 8 Jul 2026 at 10:40:06 BST, "Roland Perry" <roland@perry.uk> wrote:

> In message <0257130181.2be97c19@uninhabited.net>, at 09:22:51 on Wed, 8
> Jul 2026, Roger Hayter <roger@hayter.org> remarked:
>> On 8 Jul 2026 at 10:03:58 BST, "Roland Perry" <roland@perry.uk> wrote:
>> 
>>> In message <112h2cn$2ad2l$3@dont-email.me>, at 21:15:18 on Mon, 6 Jul
>>> 2026, John <megane.06@gmail.com> remarked:
>>>> On 06/07/2026 15:55, Malcolm Loades wrote:
>>>>> Last year we decided to let a flat previously occupied by family
>>>>> members.  We used a lettings agent who drew up an AST with a "Term 12
>>>>> months 0 days from 29/10/2025 to and including 28/10/206"
>>>>>  The tenant has given notice that they will vacate in August 2026, 2
>>>>> months before 28/10/2026.
>>>>>  Typing this situation into several AI sites they all say that the
>>>>> tenant  is liable until 28/10/2026.  However our agent says the law
>>>>> changes made  in May allow the tenants to give two months notice at
>>>>> any time.  They  could move in immediately give 2 months notice and
>>>>> walk away 8 weeks later.
>>>>>  If it's true ASTs have been scrapped and it's 2 months notice at any
>>>>> time then we'll sell the property.
>>>>>  Which Is correct, our agent or AI?
>>>> 
>>>> Your agent I'm afraid. The law changed in May this year. ukHowever, the
>>>> two months notice has to end on the rent due date.
>>>> 
>>>> From Gov.uk
>>>> 
>>>> You must give your notice:
>>>> 
>>>> so the tenancy ends on a day when the rent is due or the day before the
>>>> rent is due
>>>> 
>>>> So if notice was given on the 6th July, the two months notice is to 6th
>>>> September, so the tenancy must run to the 28th September.  If it was
>>>> given prior to 29th June, it will be 28th August.
>>> 
>>> One of the unintended consequences of this change in the law is a
>>> looming shortage of student lets, because landlords previously could
>>> rent for a year, and flip the property between tenants at the start of
>>> the autumn term. But now they are faced with having up to a three month
>>> void over the summer vacation, so could decide it's no longer a viable
>>> business.
>> 
>> They could show a bit of initiative and do what the universities do; compete
>> for conference accommodation over the summer.
> 
> The properties in question are not suitable for conference guests, who
> also expect beds to be made, breakfast to be cooked for them, and so on.
> With someone on site to meet and greet.
> 
> Quite a lot of the accommodation is not particularly close to the
> Universities themselves, where the conferences take place - I'd guess an
> average of a 15 minute cycle ride in the provinces, or up to half an
> hour on the tube in London. And a lot it is in pretty poor condition,
> rarely with en-suite facilities.
> 
> Even if the rooms were free, few conference guests would touch them with
> a bargepole.
> 
> [I speak from personal experience, with my two children renting
>  privately not that long ago, for a total of eight years between
>  them - with only the first year in university accommodation]

Perhaps the landlords don't deserve to get much money then?  Although, market
forces being what they are, are doubt if they will get any less money for
renting out their properties for nine months than they currently do for twelve
months. They just have to increase their monthly rent. The students will still
have to pay the going rate as there is not a magic source of new accommodation
and they still need somewhere to stay.  With the bonus of a few students
paying *more* to stay there in the summer.


-- 

Roger Hayter

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#417351

In message <0622811031.36180aef@uninhabited.net>, at 10:23:48 on Wed, 8 
Jul 2026, Roger Hayter <roger@hayter.org> remarked:
>On 8 Jul 2026 at 10:40:06 BST, "Roland Perry" <roland@perry.uk> wrote:
>
>> In message <0257130181.2be97c19@uninhabited.net>, at 09:22:51 on Wed, 8
>> Jul 2026, Roger Hayter <roger@hayter.org> remarked:
>>> On 8 Jul 2026 at 10:03:58 BST, "Roland Perry" <roland@perry.uk> wrote:
>>>
>>>> In message <112h2cn$2ad2l$3@dont-email.me>, at 21:15:18 on Mon, 6 Jul
>>>> 2026, John <megane.06@gmail.com> remarked:
>>>>> On 06/07/2026 15:55, Malcolm Loades wrote:
>>>>>> Last year we decided to let a flat previously occupied by family
>>>>>> members.  We used a lettings agent who drew up an AST with a "Term 12
>>>>>> months 0 days from 29/10/2025 to and including 28/10/206"
>>>>>>  The tenant has given notice that they will vacate in August 2026, 2
>>>>>> months before 28/10/2026.
>>>>>>  Typing this situation into several AI sites they all say that the
>>>>>> tenant  is liable until 28/10/2026.  However our agent says the law
>>>>>> changes made  in May allow the tenants to give two months notice at
>>>>>> any time.  They  could move in immediately give 2 months notice and
>>>>>> walk away 8 weeks later.
>>>>>>  If it's true ASTs have been scrapped and it's 2 months notice at any
>>>>>> time then we'll sell the property.
>>>>>>  Which Is correct, our agent or AI?
>>>>>
>>>>> Your agent I'm afraid. The law changed in May this year. ukHowever, the
>>>>> two months notice has to end on the rent due date.
>>>>>
>>>>> From Gov.uk
>>>>>
>>>>> You must give your notice:
>>>>>
>>>>> so the tenancy ends on a day when the rent is due or the day before the
>>>>> rent is due
>>>>>
>>>>> So if notice was given on the 6th July, the two months notice is to 6th
>>>>> September, so the tenancy must run to the 28th September.  If it was
>>>>> given prior to 29th June, it will be 28th August.
>>>>
>>>> One of the unintended consequences of this change in the law is a
>>>> looming shortage of student lets, because landlords previously could
>>>> rent for a year, and flip the property between tenants at the start of
>>>> the autumn term. But now they are faced with having up to a three month
>>>> void over the summer vacation, so could decide it's no longer a viable
>>>> business.
>>>
>>> They could show a bit of initiative and do what the universities do; compete
>>> for conference accommodation over the summer.
>>
>> The properties in question are not suitable for conference guests, who
>> also expect beds to be made, breakfast to be cooked for them, and so on.
>> With someone on site to meet and greet.
>>
>> Quite a lot of the accommodation is not particularly close to the
>> Universities themselves, where the conferences take place - I'd guess an
>> average of a 15 minute cycle ride in the provinces, or up to half an
>> hour on the tube in London. And a lot it is in pretty poor condition,
>> rarely with en-suite facilities.
>>
>> Even if the rooms were free, few conference guests would touch them with
>> a bargepole.
>>
>> [I speak from personal experience, with my two children renting
>>  privately not that long ago, for a total of eight years between
>>  them - with only the first year in university accommodation]
>
>Perhaps the landlords don't deserve to get much money then?

They aren't getting conference B&B rates (which about £100/night).

>Although, market forces being what they are, are doubt if they will get 
>any less money for renting out their properties for nine months than 
>they currently do for twelve months. They just have to increase their 
>monthly rent.

That's quite difficult to do, not just from a regulatory point of view, 
but students don't have a bottomless pit of money.

>The students will still have to pay the going rate as there is not a 
>magic source of new accommodation and they still need somewhere to 
>stay.  With the bonus of a few students paying *more* to stay there in 
>the summer.

These mythical summer-only students?
-- 
Roland Perry

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#417347

On 08/07/2026 10:22 AM, Roger Hayter wrote:

> On "Roland Perry" <roland@perry.uk> wrote:
>> John <megane.06@gmail.com> remarked:
>>>  Malcolm Loades wrote:

>>>> Last year we decided to let a flat previously occupied by family
>>>> members.  We used a lettings agent who drew up an AST with a "Term 12
>>>> months 0 days from 29/10/2025 to and including 28/10/206"
>>>>   The tenant has given notice that they will vacate in August 2026, 2
>>>> months before 28/10/2026.
>>>>   Typing this situation into several AI sites they all say that the
>>>> tenant  is liable until 28/10/2026.  However our agent says the law
>>>> changes made  in May allow the tenants to give two months notice at
>>>> any time.  They  could move in immediately give 2 months notice and
>>>> walk away 8 weeks later.
>>>>   If it's true ASTs have been scrapped and it's 2 months notice at any
>>>> time then we'll sell the property.
>>>>   Which Is correct, our agent or AI?
>>>
>>> Your agent I'm afraid. The law changed in May this year. ukHowever, the
>>> two months notice has to end on the rent due date.
>>>
>>>  From Gov.uk
>>> You must give your notice:
>>> so the tenancy ends on a day when the rent is due or the day before the
>>> rent is due
>>> So if notice was given on the 6th July, the two months notice is to 6th
>>> September, so the tenancy must run to the 28th September.  If it was
>>> given prior to 29th June, it will be 28th August.
>
>> One of the unintended consequences of this change in the law is a
>> looming shortage of student lets, because landlords previously could
>> rent for a year, and flip the property between tenants at the start of
>> the autumn term. But now they are faced with having up to a three month
>> void over the summer vacation, so could decide it's no longer a viable
>> business.
>
> They could show a bit of initiative and do what the universities do; compete
> for conference accommodation over the summer.

Who'd want to stay in a bedsit with a shared bathroom (often of 
questionable cleanliness), sometimes some distance from the venue, for a 
conference?

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#417353

In message <nb6pmrFl6thU1@mid.individual.net>, at 12:13:31 on Wed, 8 Jul 
2026, JNugent <JNugent73@mail.com> remarked:

>> They could show a bit of initiative and do what the universities do; compete
>> for conference accommodation over the summer.
>
>Who'd want to stay in a bedsit with a shared bathroom (often of 
>questionable cleanliness), sometimes some distance from the venue, for 
>a conference?

Also, typical student lets are a shared house with 5-6 tenants, at least 
one of which might still be in occupation over the summer.
-- 
Roland Perry

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#417345

On 06/07/2026 15:55, Malcolm Loades wrote:
> Last year we decided to let a flat previously occupied by family
> members.  We used a lettings agent who drew up an AST with a "Term 12
> months 0 days from 29/10/2025 to and including 28/10/206"
> 
> The tenant has given notice that they will vacate in August 2026, 2
> months before 28/10/2026.
> 
> Typing this situation into several AI sites they all say that the tenant
> is liable until 28/10/2026.  However our agent says the law changes made
> in May allow the tenants to give two months notice at any time.  They
> could move in immediately give 2 months notice and walk away 8 weeks later.
> 
> If it's true ASTs have been scrapped and it's 2 months notice at any
> time then we'll sell the property.
> 
> Which Is correct, our agent or AI?
> 
Thanks guys for the confirmation which I didn't really want to hear.

The apartment had previously been used sequentially by each of three 
offspring after they left uni and before they sought their own places. 
So this was our first and now last experience of letting.  We'll sell it.

The potential risk of tenants giving 2 months notice at any time is too 
great a risk to take.  The agents charges to seek a new tenant, draw up 
whatever agreement is now needed, deposit scheme charge, inventory 
charge etc would cost 20% of the annual rental income if this happened 
only twice in a 12 month period.  And that's on top of the 10% monthly 
charge.

Another home lost to someone who can't afford to buy.

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#417348

On 7 Jul 2026 at 14:05:12 BST, "Malcolm Loades" <devnull@loades.net> wrote:

> On 06/07/2026 15:55, Malcolm Loades wrote:
>> Last year we decided to let a flat previously occupied by family
>> members.  We used a lettings agent who drew up an AST with a "Term 12
>> months 0 days from 29/10/2025 to and including 28/10/206"
>> 
>> The tenant has given notice that they will vacate in August 2026, 2
>> months before 28/10/2026.
>> 
>> Typing this situation into several AI sites they all say that the tenant
>> is liable until 28/10/2026.  However our agent says the law changes made
>> in May allow the tenants to give two months notice at any time.  They
>> could move in immediately give 2 months notice and walk away 8 weeks later.
>> 
>> If it's true ASTs have been scrapped and it's 2 months notice at any
>> time then we'll sell the property.
>> 
>> Which Is correct, our agent or AI?
>> 
> Thanks guys for the confirmation which I didn't really want to hear.
> 
> The apartment had previously been used sequentially by each of three
> offspring after they left uni and before they sought their own places.
> So this was our first and now last experience of letting.  We'll sell it.
> 
> The potential risk of tenants giving 2 months notice at any time is too
> great a risk to take.  The agents charges to seek a new tenant, draw up
> whatever agreement is now needed, deposit scheme charge, inventory
> charge etc would cost 20% of the annual rental income if this happened
> only twice in a 12 month period.  And that's on top of the 10% monthly
> charge.
> 
> Another home lost to someone who can't afford to buy.

Doesn't that rather depend on who buys it and what they do with it?

-- 

Roger Hayter

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#417350

On 7 Jul 2026 at 14:05:12 BST, Malcolm Loades wrote:

> On 06/07/2026 15:55, Malcolm Loades wrote:
>> Last year we decided to let a flat previously occupied by family
>> members.  We used a lettings agent who drew up an AST with a "Term 12
>> months 0 days from 29/10/2025 to and including 28/10/206"
>> 
>> The tenant has given notice that they will vacate in August 2026, 2
>> months before 28/10/2026.
>> 
>> Typing this situation into several AI sites they all say that the tenant
>> is liable until 28/10/2026.  However our agent says the law changes made
>> in May allow the tenants to give two months notice at any time.  They
>> could move in immediately give 2 months notice and walk away 8 weeks later.
>> 
>> If it's true ASTs have been scrapped and it's 2 months notice at any
>> time then we'll sell the property.
>> 
>> Which Is correct, our agent or AI?
>> 
> Thanks guys for the confirmation which I didn't really want to hear.
> 
> The apartment had previously been used sequentially by each of three
> offspring after they left uni and before they sought their own places.
> So this was our first and now last experience of letting.  We'll sell it.
> 
> The potential risk of tenants giving 2 months notice at any time is too
> great a risk to take.  The agents charges to seek a new tenant, draw up
> whatever agreement is now needed, deposit scheme charge, inventory
> charge etc would cost 20% of the annual rental income if this happened
> only twice in a 12 month period.  And that's on top of the 10% monthly
> charge.
> 

Capital appreciation doesn't figure in your investment decisions?

> Another home lost to someone who can't afford to buy.

No reason why a tenant wouldn't stay far longer if the rent was fair and the
property decent.

-- 
Cheers, Rob
Sheffield, UK

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#417352

In message <112n14k$30fn$1@dont-email.me>, at 02:30:45 on Thu, 9 Jul 
2026, RJH <patchmoney@gmx.com> remarked:
>> Thanks guys for the confirmation which I didn't really want to hear.
>>
>> The apartment had previously been used sequentially by each of three
>> offspring after they left uni and before they sought their own places.
>> So this was our first and now last experience of letting.  We'll sell it.
>>
>> The potential risk of tenants giving 2 months notice at any time is too
>> great a risk to take.  The agents charges to seek a new tenant, draw up
>> whatever agreement is now needed, deposit scheme charge, inventory
>> charge etc would cost 20% of the annual rental income if this happened
>> only twice in a 12 month period.  And that's on top of the 10% monthly
>> charge.
>
>Capital appreciation doesn't figure in your investment decisions?

The sales market has been flat for several years.

>> Another home lost to someone who can't afford to buy.
>
>No reason why a tenant wouldn't stay far longer if the rent was fair and the
>property decent.

If someone is giving their 2months notice 'early' it's because their 
circumstances/plans have changed and wouldn't want to stay longer.
-- 
Roland Perry

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#417354

On 9 Jul 2026 at 07:36:41 BST, Roland Perry wrote:

> In message <112n14k$30fn$1@dont-email.me>, at 02:30:45 on Thu, 9 Jul
> 2026, RJH <patchmoney@gmx.com> remarked:
>>> Thanks guys for the confirmation which I didn't really want to hear.
>>> 
>>> The apartment had previously been used sequentially by each of three
>>> offspring after they left uni and before they sought their own places.
>>> So this was our first and now last experience of letting.  We'll sell it.
>>> 
>>> The potential risk of tenants giving 2 months notice at any time is too
>>> great a risk to take.  The agents charges to seek a new tenant, draw up
>>> whatever agreement is now needed, deposit scheme charge, inventory
>>> charge etc would cost 20% of the annual rental income if this happened
>>> only twice in a 12 month period.  And that's on top of the 10% monthly
>>> charge.
>> 
>> Capital appreciation doesn't figure in your investment decisions?
> 
> The sales market has been flat for several years.

True - in fact flats have lost a lot over the past 10 years - 25% in real
terms. Even houses have barely kept up. But /historically/ capital
appreciation has been a key variable informing residential investment. As the
OP demonstrates - otherwise the hassle and costs hardly make it worthwhile.

So there may be a few years of above inflation increases coming up.

> 
>>> Another home lost to someone who can't afford to buy.
>> 
>> No reason why a tenant wouldn't stay far longer if the rent was fair and the
>> property decent.
> 
> If someone is giving their 2months notice 'early' it's because their
> circumstances/plans have changed and wouldn't want to stay longer.

Agreed. But a decent property and landlord with a fair rent wouldn't do any
harm, and likely add to moving/change inertia in many cases.

-- 
Cheers, Rob
Sheffield, UK

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#417355

In message <112nk2o$7q0n$1@dont-email.me>, at 07:54:00 on Thu, 9 Jul 
2026, RJH <patchmoney@gmx.com> remarked:

>> If someone is giving their 2months notice 'early' it's because their
>> circumstances/plans have changed and wouldn't want to stay longer.
>
>Agreed. But a decent property and landlord with a fair rent wouldn't do any
>harm, and likely add to moving/change inertia in many cases.

Unfortunately, what most tenants would self-identify as a "fair rent" 
means the landlord is making a loss. Especially when all the overheads 
mentioned earlier (which tenants have little visibility of) are 
included.

Plus of course, cost of repairs. A visit from a plumber is going to cost 
about two week's rent, and a friend recently had a new shower cubicle 
fitted (owner occupier, not rental) which cost over ten grand [yes, she 
got multiple quotes].
-- 
Roland Perry

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#417357

On 09/07/2026 08:54, RJH wrote:
> On 9 Jul 2026 at 07:36:41 BST, Roland Perry wrote:
> 
>> In message <112n14k$30fn$1@dont-email.me>, at 02:30:45 on Thu, 9 Jul
>> 2026, RJH <patchmoney@gmx.com> remarked:
>>>> Thanks guys for the confirmation which I didn't really want to hear.
>>>>
>>>> The apartment had previously been used sequentially by each of three
>>>> offspring after they left uni and before they sought their own places.
>>>> So this was our first and now last experience of letting.  We'll sell it.
>>>>
>>>> The potential risk of tenants giving 2 months notice at any time is too
>>>> great a risk to take.  The agents charges to seek a new tenant, draw up
>>>> whatever agreement is now needed, deposit scheme charge, inventory
>>>> charge etc would cost 20% of the annual rental income if this happened
>>>> only twice in a 12 month period.  And that's on top of the 10% monthly
>>>> charge.
>>>
>>> Capital appreciation doesn't figure in your investment decisions?
>>
>> The sales market has been flat for several years.
> 
> True - in fact flats have lost a lot over the past 10 years - 25% in real
> terms. Even houses have barely kept up. But /historically/ capital
> appreciation has been a key variable informing residential investment. As the
> OP demonstrates - otherwise the hassle and costs hardly make it worthwhile.
> 
> So there may be a few years of above inflation increases coming up.
> 
>>
>>>> Another home lost to someone who can't afford to buy.
>>>
>>> No reason why a tenant wouldn't stay far longer if the rent was fair and the
>>> property decent.
>>
>> If someone is giving their 2months notice 'early' it's because their
>> circumstances/plans have changed and wouldn't want to stay longer.
> 
> Agreed. But a decent property and landlord with a fair rent wouldn't do any
> harm, and likely add to moving/change inertia in many cases.
> 
See my earlier response giving multiple reasons why from the renter's 
point of view they may wish to terminate however nice the property and 
landlord are plus a very reasonable rent.  I think tenancies as verging 
into airbnb territory now that a tenant can give 2 months notice at any 
time..

I've calculated my daily rate letting the property on a tenancy as £49 
per night.  An airbnb of a very similar property in the same area is 
currently £190 per night.

Thus if a renter wants a place for more than 16 nights it's better 
financially to enter into a tenancy and then immediately give notice!

I'm reconsidering my immediate decision to sell and considering 
operating it as an airbnb.  I know that places a workload on me and my 
wife but being retired and living within 1km of the property it may be 
an alternative to selling.  If I'd not passed 75 I certainly would have 
sold it put the lot into my pension pot but the tax advantage 
disappeared on my 75th birthday.

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#417361

In message <nb9crdFo3tgU2@mid.individual.net>, at 11:52:29 on Thu, 9 Jul 
2026, Malcolm Loades <devnull@loades.net> remarked:

>I think tenancies as verging into airbnb territory now that a tenant 
>can give 2 months notice at any time..
>
>I've calculated my daily rate letting the property on a tenancy as £49 
>per night.  An airbnb of a very similar property in the same area is 
>currently £190 per night.

But I bet you don't cook people breakfast every day (the second B in 
B&B).
-- 
Roland Perry

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#417368

On 09/07/2026 02:37 PM, Roland Perry wrote:

> Malcolm Loades <devnull@loades.net> remarked:
>
>> I think tenancies as verging into airbnb territory now that a tenant
>> can give 2 months notice at any time..
>
>> I've calculated my daily rate letting the property on a tenancy as £49
>> per night.  An airbnb of a very similar property in the same area is
>> currently £190 per night.
>
> But I bet you don't cook people breakfast every day (the second B in B&B).

AirBNB are not B'n'Bs. I've stayed in a few in the USA and NEVER had 
breakfast provided. There is usually a pack detailing local facilities 
such as restaurants. The AirBNB in NY (10th Avenue) recommended the 
well-known Galaxie Diner on 9th Avenue.

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#417380

In message <nb9pfkF53slU1@mid.individual.net>, at 15:28:04 on Thu, 9 Jul 
2026, JNugent <JNugent73@mail.com> remarked:
>On 09/07/2026 02:37 PM, Roland Perry wrote:
>
>> Malcolm Loades <devnull@loades.net> remarked:
>>
>>> I think tenancies as verging into airbnb territory now that a tenant
>>> can give 2 months notice at any time..
>>
>>> I've calculated my daily rate letting the property on a tenancy as £49
>>> per night.  An airbnb of a very similar property in the same area is
>>> currently £190 per night.
>>
>> But I bet you don't cook people breakfast every day (the second B in B&B).
>
>AirBNB are not B'n'Bs. I've stayed in a few in the USA and NEVER had 
>breakfast provided. There is usually a pack detailing local facilities 
>such as restaurants. The AirBNB in NY (10th Avenue) recommended the 
>well-known Galaxie Diner on 9th Avenue.

Every overnight accommodation I've bought via the site known as AirBnB 
came with breakfast provided by the property's owner, who also lived in 
the building.

I'm prepared to accept that other accommodations available by that 
booking site do not come with that facility. But am aware that if the 
kitchen which is part of the deal isn't provided with at least enough 
staple items to make oneself a DIY breakfast, it'll get bad reviews.
-- 
Roland Perry

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