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Groups > sci.physics > #560394 > unrolled thread
| Started by | Enes Richard <pies_na_teorie@vp.pl> |
|---|---|
| First post | 2016-03-08 10:15 -0800 |
| Last post | 2016-03-19 07:12 -0700 |
| Articles | 20 on this page of 104 — 14 participants |
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LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. Enes Richard <pies_na_teorie@vp.pl> - 2016-03-08 10:15 -0800
Re: LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. Sam Wormley <swormley1@gmail.com> - 2016-03-08 13:53 -0600
Re: LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. "reber g=emc^2" <herbertglazier0@gmail.com> - 2016-03-08 12:25 -0800
Re: LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. benj <nobody@gmail.com> - 2016-03-08 22:39 -0500
Re: LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. Enes Richard <pies_na_teorie@vp.pl> - 2016-03-08 12:36 -0800
Re: LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-03-08 18:37 -0600
Re: LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. "Y.Porat" <y.y.porat@gmail.com> - 2016-03-09 00:57 -0800
Re: LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. Enes Richard <pies_na_teorie@vp.pl> - 2016-03-09 10:50 -0800
Re: LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-03-09 15:02 -0600
Re: LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. Enes Richard <pies_na_teorie@vp.pl> - 2016-03-09 13:55 -0800
Re: LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-03-09 16:12 -0600
Re: LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. Enes Richard <pies_na_teorie@vp.pl> - 2016-03-09 15:19 -0800
Re: LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-03-10 08:08 -0600
Re: LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. Enes Richard <pies_na_teorie@vp.pl> - 2016-03-10 12:55 -0800
Re: LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-03-10 15:41 -0600
Re: LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. Enes Richard <pies_na_teorie@vp.pl> - 2016-03-10 15:01 -0800
Re: LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. Sam Wormley <swormley1@gmail.com> - 2016-03-10 17:15 -0600
Re: LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. Enes Richard <pies_na_teorie@vp.pl> - 2016-03-12 07:42 -0800
Re: LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-03-10 17:25 -0600
Re: LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. Enes Richard <pies_na_teorie@vp.pl> - 2016-03-11 12:05 -0800
Re: LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-03-11 14:29 -0600
Re: LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. Enes Richard <pies_na_teorie@vp.pl> - 2016-03-11 13:33 -0800
Re: LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-03-11 15:52 -0600
Re: LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. Enes Richard <pies_na_teorie@vp.pl> - 2016-03-12 07:37 -0800
Re: LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. Enes Richard <pies_na_teorie@vp.pl> - 2016-03-14 12:57 -0700
Re: LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-03-14 15:43 -0500
Re: LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2016-03-14 23:10 +0100
Re: LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. Enes Richard <pies_na_teorie@vp.pl> - 2016-03-14 15:12 -0700
Re: LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-03-14 17:34 -0500
Re: LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. Double-A <double-a3@hush.com> - 2016-03-15 14:34 -0700
Re: LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-03-15 16:40 -0500
Re: LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. Enes Richard <pies_na_teorie@vp.pl> - 2016-03-15 15:31 -0700
Re: LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-03-16 08:36 -0500
Re: LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. Enes Richard <pies_na_teorie@vp.pl> - 2016-03-16 14:59 -0700
Re: LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-03-16 17:46 -0500
Re: LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. Enes Richard <pies_na_teorie@vp.pl> - 2016-03-17 15:40 -0700
Re: LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-03-18 08:19 -0500
Re: LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. Enes Richard <pies_na_teorie@vp.pl> - 2016-03-18 14:01 -0700
Re: LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-03-18 16:46 -0500
Re: LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> - 2016-03-18 15:43 -0700
Re: LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. Enes Richard <pies_na_teorie@vp.pl> - 2016-03-18 17:10 -0700
Re: LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> - 2016-03-19 00:15 -0700
Re: LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-03-19 09:37 -0500
Re: LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-03-19 09:31 -0500
Re: LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> - 2016-03-19 07:46 -0700
Re: LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-03-19 09:22 -0500
Re: LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. Enes Richard <pies_na_teorie@vp.pl> - 2016-03-18 15:52 -0700
Re: LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> - 2016-03-18 16:13 -0700
Re: LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-03-19 09:30 -0500
Re: LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. HVAC <mr.hvac@gmail.com> - 2016-03-19 08:09 -0700
Re: LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. benj <none@gmail.com> - 2016-03-19 13:58 -0400
Re: LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. Mahipal <mahipal7638@gmail.com> - 2016-03-19 08:10 -0700
Re: LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. HVAC <mr.hvac@gmail.com> - 2016-03-19 08:39 -0700
Re: LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. Mahipal <mahipal7638@gmail.com> - 2016-03-19 08:56 -0700
Re: LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. HVAC <mr.hvac@gmail.com> - 2016-03-19 09:06 -0700
Re: LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. benj <none@gmail.com> - 2016-03-19 14:13 -0400
Re: LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. Mahipal <mahipal7638@gmail.com> - 2016-03-19 12:18 -0700
Re: LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. benj <none@gmail.com> - 2016-03-20 09:11 -0400
Re: LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. benj <none@gmail.com> - 2016-03-19 14:02 -0400
Re: LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-03-19 15:40 -0500
Re: LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. Sam Wormley <swormley1@gmail.com> - 2016-03-19 08:46 -0500
Re: LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. "Y.Porat" <y.y.porat@gmail.com> - 2016-03-17 01:59 -0700
Re: LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2016-03-14 22:41 +0100
Re: LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-03-14 17:28 -0500
Re: LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2016-03-15 18:24 +0100
Re: LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-03-15 12:33 -0500
Re: LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2016-03-15 22:19 +0100
Re: LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-03-15 16:38 -0500
Re: LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2016-03-16 02:56 +0100
Re: LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-03-16 08:47 -0500
Re: LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. "Y.Porat" <y.y.porat@gmail.com> - 2016-03-09 23:56 -0800
Re: LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. dsr@mail.lns.cornell.edu (Daniel S. Riley) - 2016-03-10 12:35 -0500
Re: LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-03-10 11:47 -0600
Re: LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. Enes Richard <pies_na_teorie@vp.pl> - 2016-03-11 12:13 -0800
Re: LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. "Y.Porat" <y.y.porat@gmail.com> - 2016-03-09 23:50 -0800
Re: LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. "Y.Porat" <y.y.porat@gmail.com> - 2016-03-09 23:47 -0800
Re: LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. "reber g=emc^2" <herbertglazier0@gmail.com> - 2016-03-11 12:13 -0800
Re: LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. Sam Wormley <swormley1@gmail.com> - 2016-03-11 14:17 -0600
Re: LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. "hanson" <hanson@quick.net> - 2016-03-11 12:35 -0800
Re: LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. HVAC <mr.hvac@gmail.com> - 2016-03-12 08:32 -0800
Re: LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. Enes Richard <pies_na_teorie@vp.pl> - 2016-03-14 12:46 -0700
Re: LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. "Y.Porat" <y.y.porat@gmail.com> - 2016-03-17 02:03 -0700
Re: LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> - 2016-03-17 02:25 -0700
Re: LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-03-17 08:52 -0500
Re: LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> - 2016-03-17 07:01 -0700
Re: LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-03-17 09:30 -0500
Re: LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. "Y.Porat" <y.y.porat@gmail.com> - 2016-03-19 07:08 -0700
Re: LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2016-03-17 22:35 +0100
Re: LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-03-17 17:11 -0500
Re: LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2016-03-18 00:32 +0100
Re: LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. Sam Wormley <swormley1@gmail.com> - 2016-03-17 09:04 -0500
Re: LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> - 2016-03-17 07:16 -0700
Re: LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. Sam Wormley <swormley1@gmail.com> - 2016-03-17 09:20 -0500
Re: LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> - 2016-03-17 07:27 -0700
Re: LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. Sam Wormley <swormley1@gmail.com> - 2016-03-17 09:34 -0500
Re: LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> - 2016-03-17 07:37 -0700
Re: LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. Sam Wormley <swormley1@gmail.com> - 2016-03-17 09:49 -0500
Re: LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> - 2016-03-17 07:56 -0700
Re: LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. Sam Wormley <swormley1@gmail.com> - 2016-03-17 10:06 -0500
Re: LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-03-17 10:24 -0500
Re: LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> - 2016-03-17 13:05 -0700
Re: LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-03-17 10:15 -0500
Re: LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. "Y.Porat" <y.y.porat@gmail.com> - 2016-03-19 07:16 -0700
Re: LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. "Y.Porat" <y.y.porat@gmail.com> - 2016-03-19 07:12 -0700
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| From | Enes Richard <pies_na_teorie@vp.pl> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2016-03-08 10:15 -0800 |
| Subject | LHC - new particle inside electron/positron and in every mass ? See, how to find. |
| Message-ID | <faba50f5-fc46-461f-b6a6-c20df4ae7a63@googlegroups.com> |
Here is magnified picture: http://1t2src2grpd01c037d42usfb.wpengine.netdna-cdn.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2015/02/Alicetraces.jpg Assume the beginning of the coordinate system in the lower left corner of the picture. The vertical axis Y in the range of 0.00 to 1.00. The horizontal axis X in the range of 0.00 to 1.00. Here are the most distinct tracks objects: Object 1. Y 0.52 to 0.54 X from 0.32 to 0.39 Object 2. Y 0.52 to 0.54 X from 0.57 to 0.64 Object 3. Y from 0.32 to 0.34 X from 0.54 to 0.57 Intriguing objects / tracks that look like flat spirals / sine wave, because that should be the components of the electron / positron in the electromagnetic field. Maybe it is 1/4 or 1/6 of the mass of the electron, and from -1/4 to 1/4 electron charge ... It would be a complete victory 10 years old theory about the construction of each mass. Is there any other interpretation? Source: hhttp://newscenter.lbl.gov/2015/02/20/what-to-expect-next-from-the-lhc-worlds-largest-particle-accelerator/
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| From | Sam Wormley <swormley1@gmail.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2016-03-08 13:53 -0600 |
| Message-ID | <ZKWdnZTwLdcDsELLnZ2dnUU7-KGdnZ2d@giganews.com> |
| In reply to | #560394 |
Electrons (and positrons) are fundamental particles without
structure. Masses are well defined.
Particle Chart - Standard Model
open http://www.cpepphysics.org/images/2014-fund-chart.jpg
--
sci.physics is an unmoderated newsgroup dedicated
to the discussion of physics, news from the physics
community, and physics-related social issues.
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| From | "reber g=emc^2" <herbertglazier0@gmail.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2016-03-08 12:25 -0800 |
| Message-ID | <9866db6a-3824-4985-bf2f-64a8797d6e3c@googlegroups.com> |
| In reply to | #560441 |
On Tuesday, March 8, 2016 at 11:53:06 AM UTC-8, Sam Wormley wrote: > Electrons (and positrons) are fundamental particles without > structure. Masses are well defined. > > Particle Chart - Standard Model > open http://www.cpepphysics.org/images/2014-fund-chart.jpg > > -- > > sci.physics is an unmoderated newsgroup dedicated > to the discussion of physics, news from the physics > community, and physics-related social issues. electrons gain weight,and that begs the question What is this weight made off? Tregert
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| From | benj <nobody@gmail.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2016-03-08 22:39 -0500 |
| Message-ID | <56df9af8$0$65402$c3e8da3$e074e489@news.astraweb.com> |
| In reply to | #560464 |
On 03/08/2016 03:25 PM, reber g=emc^2 wrote: > On Tuesday, March 8, 2016 at 11:53:06 AM UTC-8, Sam Wormley wrote: >> Electrons (and positrons) are fundamental particles without >> structure. Masses are well defined. >> >> Particle Chart - Standard Model >> open http://www.cpepphysics.org/images/2014-fund-chart.jpg >> >> -- >> >> sci.physics is an unmoderated newsgroup dedicated >> to the discussion of physics, news from the physics >> community, and physics-related social issues. > electrons gain weight,and that begs the question What is this weight made off? > Tregert > Herb the "spin is in" theory says that Electrons have no weight. They are not only nothing, they are LESS THAN NOTHNG! They only seem to have weight for other reasons.
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| From | Enes Richard <pies_na_teorie@vp.pl> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2016-03-08 12:36 -0800 |
| Message-ID | <0effd4f9-3770-46d3-93f0-f3ef63b3973e@googlegroups.com> |
| In reply to | #560441 |
W dniu wtorek, 8 marca 2016 20:53:06 UTC+1 użytkownik Sam Wormley napisał: > Electrons (and positrons) are fundamental particles without > structure. Masses are well defined. > > Particle Chart - Standard Model > open http://www.cpepphysics.org/images/2014-fund-chart.jpg > Do You think, that "flat spirals" in first picure: http://1t2src2grpd01c037d42usfb.wpengine.netdna-cdn.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2015/02/Alicetraces.jpg are the gluons, predicted here: https://simple.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gluon ???
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| From | Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2016-03-08 18:37 -0600 |
| Message-ID | <nbnr71$jrh$7@gioia.aioe.org> |
| In reply to | #560394 |
On 3/8/2016 12:15 PM, Enes Richard wrote: > Intriguing objects / tracks that look like flat spirals / sine wave, because that should be the > components of the electron / positron in the electromagnetic field. > > Maybe it is 1/4 or 1/6 of the mass of the electron, and from -1/4 to 1/4 electron charge ... > It would be a complete victory 10 years old theory about the construction of each mass. > > Is there any other interpretation? You're joking, right? You do know that charged particles execute helical trajectories in uniform magnetic fields, don't you? -- Odd Bodkin --- maker of fine toys, tools, tables
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| From | "Y.Porat" <y.y.porat@gmail.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2016-03-09 00:57 -0800 |
| Message-ID | <1460b44b-d846-4fb1-b0fa-ec1608bc17ad@googlegroups.com> |
| In reply to | #560572 |
On Wednesday, March 9, 2016 at 2:36:56 AM UTC+2, Odd Bodkin wrote: > On 3/8/2016 12:15 PM, Enes Richard wrote: > > Intriguing objects / tracks that look like flat spirals / sine wave, because that should be the > > components of the electron / positron in the electromagnetic field. > > > > Maybe it is 1/4 or 1/6 of the mass of the electron, and from -1/4 to 1/4 electron charge ... > > It would be a complete victory 10 years old theory about the construction of each mass. > > > > Is there any other interpretation? > > You're joking, right? You do know that charged particles execute helical > trajectories in uniform magnetic fields, don't you? >==================================== the pig Bodkin Paul Drapr is shamelessly stealing again !! it is me who for a long time promote that helix model for photons !! moreover i used it for COMBINING ALL FORCES PLUS COMBINING IT WITH THE PHOTONIC WORLD AS WELL --------- you could see it not long ago in my thread 'A SUGGESTION TO UNIFY ALL FORCES '' -- no one understood it ,but thatis a story for itself !! ------- Y.Porat ======================== > > -- > Odd Bodkin --- maker of fine toys, tools, tables
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| From | Enes Richard <pies_na_teorie@vp.pl> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2016-03-09 10:50 -0800 |
| Message-ID | <62a6445f-2afd-4b67-9413-de4650406524@googlegroups.com> |
| In reply to | #560572 |
W dniu środa, 9 marca 2016 01:36:56 UTC+1 użytkownik Odd Bodkin napisał: > On 3/8/2016 12:15 PM, Enes Richard wrote: > > Intriguing objects / tracks that look like flat spirals / sine wave, because that should be the > > components of the electron / positron in the electromagnetic field. > > > > Maybe it is 1/4 or 1/6 of the mass of the electron, and from -1/4 to 1/4 electron charge ... > > It would be a complete victory 10 years old theory about the construction of each mass. > > > > Is there any other interpretation? > > You're joking, right? You do know that charged particles execute helical > trajectories in uniform magnetic fields, don't you? > > > -- > Odd Bodkin --- maker of fine toys, tools, tables So what it is called the particle that made those tiny spirals?
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| From | Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2016-03-09 15:02 -0600 |
| Message-ID | <nbq30n$2e6$1@gioia.aioe.org> |
| In reply to | #560862 |
On 3/9/2016 12:50 PM, Enes Richard wrote: > W dniu środa, 9 marca 2016 01:36:56 UTC+1 użytkownik Odd Bodkin napisał: >> On 3/8/2016 12:15 PM, Enes Richard wrote: >>> Intriguing objects / tracks that look like flat spirals / sine wave, because that should be the >>> components of the electron / positron in the electromagnetic field. >>> >>> Maybe it is 1/4 or 1/6 of the mass of the electron, and from -1/4 to 1/4 electron charge ... >>> It would be a complete victory 10 years old theory about the construction of each mass. >>> >>> Is there any other interpretation? >> >> You're joking, right? You do know that charged particles execute helical >> trajectories in uniform magnetic fields, don't you? >> >> >> -- >> Odd Bodkin --- maker of fine toys, tools, tables > > So what it is called the particle that made those tiny spirals? > Any charged particle can make those spirals. The radius of curvature of the spiral is directly related to the charge and momentum of the particle: R = P/qB, where P is the momentum, q is the charge, and B is the strength of the applied magnetic field. Those charged particles can be electrons or pions or protons or muons or a few other long-lasting charged particles. The identification of which of these it is, is usually not just by looking at those curved tracks but also the profile of the energy deposit in the calorimeter. -- Odd Bodkin --- maker of fine toys, tools, tables
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| From | Enes Richard <pies_na_teorie@vp.pl> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2016-03-09 13:55 -0800 |
| Message-ID | <2ca72e74-0df4-4554-a149-35111e5fdc58@googlegroups.com> |
| In reply to | #560923 |
W dniu środa, 9 marca 2016 22:02:24 UTC+1 użytkownik Odd Bodkin napisał: > On 3/9/2016 12:50 PM, Enes Richard wrote: > > W dniu środa, 9 marca 2016 01:36:56 UTC+1 użytkownik Odd Bodkin napisał: > >> On 3/8/2016 12:15 PM, Enes Richard wrote: > >>> Intriguing objects / tracks that look like flat spirals / sine wave, because that should be the > >>> components of the electron / positron in the electromagnetic field. > >>> > >>> Maybe it is 1/4 or 1/6 of the mass of the electron, and from -1/4 to 1/4 electron charge ... > >>> It would be a complete victory 10 years old theory about the construction of each mass. > >>> > >>> Is there any other interpretation? > >> > >> You're joking, right? You do know that charged particles execute helical > >> trajectories in uniform magnetic fields, don't you? > >> > Any charged particle can make those spirals. The radius of curvature of > the spiral is directly related to the charge and momentum of the > particle: R = P/qB, where P is the momentum, q is the charge, and B is > the strength of the applied magnetic field. > Is there also an electric field? > Those charged particles can > be electrons or pions or protons or muons or a few other long-lasting > charged particles. The identification of which of these it is, is > usually not just by looking at those curved tracks but also the profile > of the energy deposit in the calorimeter. > What exactly is it? I see a large fragment of a larger spiral (4-6 times higher) than those small. What can you say about the mass and charge in relation to the previous particles?
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| From | Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2016-03-09 16:12 -0600 |
| Message-ID | <nbq73a$9v0$1@gioia.aioe.org> |
| In reply to | #560940 |
On 3/9/2016 3:55 PM, Enes Richard wrote: > W dniu środa, 9 marca 2016 22:02:24 UTC+1 użytkownik Odd Bodkin napisał: >> On 3/9/2016 12:50 PM, Enes Richard wrote: >>> W dniu środa, 9 marca 2016 01:36:56 UTC+1 użytkownik Odd Bodkin napisał: >>>> On 3/8/2016 12:15 PM, Enes Richard wrote: >>>>> Intriguing objects / tracks that look like flat spirals / sine wave, because that should be the >>>>> components of the electron / positron in the electromagnetic field. >>>>> >>>>> Maybe it is 1/4 or 1/6 of the mass of the electron, and from -1/4 to 1/4 electron charge ... >>>>> It would be a complete victory 10 years old theory about the construction of each mass. >>>>> >>>>> Is there any other interpretation? >>>> >>>> You're joking, right? You do know that charged particles execute helical >>>> trajectories in uniform magnetic fields, don't you? >>>> > >> Any charged particle can make those spirals. The radius of curvature of >> the spiral is directly related to the charge and momentum of the >> particle: R = P/qB, where P is the momentum, q is the charge, and B is >> the strength of the applied magnetic field. >> > Is there also an electric field? Not in the volume you're looking at. There are other sub-detectors where there is an electric field internally confined. You can look up drift chambers, for example. > > >> Those charged particles can >> be electrons or pions or protons or muons or a few other long-lasting >> charged particles. The identification of which of these it is, is >> usually not just by looking at those curved tracks but also the profile >> of the energy deposit in the calorimeter. >> > What exactly is it? Don't have enough information from that picture to tell. However, there are OTHER data recorded for that event that will be able to identify what that particle is. It's just not shown in the picture. > > > I see a large fragment of a larger spiral (4-6 times higher) than those small. > What can you say about the mass and charge in relation to the previous particles? > You can't. What you can say is that the momentum is larger for that particle. But that could be a heavier particle, or a particle going faster, or both. You'll notice some tracks that are only bent a little bit or are visually almost straight. Those are particles with much higher momentum than the ones you're looking at, and so they have such a large radius of curvature that you're only seeing a tiny part of the arc of their curved path. It turns out that these particles with higher momentum are in fact the more interesting ones physically. If you want to read a book about particle physics, particle detectors and how to interpret what you're seeing there in the pictures, I can give you a recommendation. Only thing is, they're not typically written for laymen. -- Odd Bodkin --- maker of fine toys, tools, tables
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| From | Enes Richard <pies_na_teorie@vp.pl> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2016-03-09 15:19 -0800 |
| Message-ID | <8edcf229-e3c1-4fd4-b7b4-73a8a80c0305@googlegroups.com> |
| In reply to | #560946 |
W dniu środa, 9 marca 2016 23:12:03 UTC+1 użytkownik Odd Bodkin napisał: > Not in the volume you're looking at. There are other sub-detectors where > there is an electric field internally confined. You can look up drift > chambers, for example. > How do you know that ? > >> Those charged particles can > >> be electrons or pions or protons or muons or a few other long-lasting > >> charged particles. The identification of which of these it is, is > >> usually not just by looking at those curved tracks but also the profile > >> of the energy deposit in the calorimeter. > >> > > What exactly is it? > > Don't have enough information from that picture to tell. However, there > are OTHER data recorded for that event that will be able to identify > what that particle is. It's just not shown in the picture. > So it does not know more? > > I see a large fragment of a larger spiral (4-6 times higher) > > than those small. > > What can you say about the mass and charge in relation to > > the previous particles? > > > > You can't. > Ok. > What you can say is that the momentum is larger for that > particle. But that could be a heavier particle, or a particle going > faster, or both. > Variously can be. For example, the momentum may be the same, and charge accordingly smaller, etc ... > You'll notice some tracks that are only bent a little bit or are > visually almost straight. Those are particles with much higher momentum > than the ones you're looking at, and so they have such a large radius of > curvature that you're only seeing a tiny part of the arc of their curved > path. It turns out that these particles with higher momentum are in fact > the more interesting ones physically. > I have some reservations, but that may be in the next post. > If you want to read a book about particle physics, particle detectors > and how to interpret what you're seeing there in the pictures, I can > give you a recommendation. Only thing is, they're not typically written > for laymen. > Thank you, but I deal with the study of nature in a "top-down" and not vice versa.
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| From | Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2016-03-10 08:08 -0600 |
| Message-ID | <nbrv4h$l97$1@gioia.aioe.org> |
| In reply to | #560958 |
On 3/9/2016 5:19 PM, Enes Richard wrote: > W dniu środa, 9 marca 2016 23:12:03 UTC+1 użytkownik Odd Bodkin napisał: > >> Not in the volume you're looking at. There are other sub-detectors where >> there is an electric field internally confined. You can look up drift >> chambers, for example. >> > How do you know that ? Because I've read about the ALICE detector. > > >>>> Those charged particles can >>>> be electrons or pions or protons or muons or a few other long-lasting >>>> charged particles. The identification of which of these it is, is >>>> usually not just by looking at those curved tracks but also the profile >>>> of the energy deposit in the calorimeter. >>>> >>> What exactly is it? >> >> Don't have enough information from that picture to tell. However, there >> are OTHER data recorded for that event that will be able to identify >> what that particle is. It's just not shown in the picture. >> > So it does not know more? The picture doesn't. The experimenters do, because they have more information than what's in the picture. > > >>> I see a large fragment of a larger spiral (4-6 times higher) >>> than those small. >>> What can you say about the mass and charge in relation to >>> the previous particles? >>> >> >> You can't. >> > Ok. > >> What you can say is that the momentum is larger for that >> particle. But that could be a heavier particle, or a particle going >> faster, or both. >> > Variously can be. For example, the momentum may be the same, and charge accordingly smaller, etc ... Most charged particles have a charge of either +e or -e. > >> You'll notice some tracks that are only bent a little bit or are >> visually almost straight. Those are particles with much higher momentum >> than the ones you're looking at, and so they have such a large radius of >> curvature that you're only seeing a tiny part of the arc of their curved >> path. It turns out that these particles with higher momentum are in fact >> the more interesting ones physically. >> > I have some reservations, but that may be in the next post. > >> If you want to read a book about particle physics, particle detectors >> and how to interpret what you're seeing there in the pictures, I can >> give you a recommendation. Only thing is, they're not typically written >> for laymen. >> > Thank you, but I deal with the study of nature in a "top-down" and not vice versa. I've heard this said before. It's the excuse of the lazy. There's no short-cut to physics. > -- Odd Bodkin --- maker of fine toys, tools, tables
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| From | Enes Richard <pies_na_teorie@vp.pl> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2016-03-10 12:55 -0800 |
| Message-ID | <adcb118e-5528-4816-9c00-ceb5e341e12d@googlegroups.com> |
| In reply to | #561123 |
W dniu czwartek, 10 marca 2016 15:08:24 UTC+1 użytkownik Odd Bodkin napisał: > On 3/9/2016 5:19 PM, Enes Richard wrote: ... > >>>> Those charged particles can > >>>> be electrons or pions or protons or muons or a few other long-lasting > >>>> charged particles. The identification of which of these it is, is > >>>> usually not just by looking at those curved tracks but also the profile > >>>> of the energy deposit in the calorimeter. > >>>> > >>> What exactly is it? > >> > >> Don't have enough information from that picture to tell. However, there > >> are OTHER data recorded for that event that will be able to identify > >> what that particle is. It's just not shown in the picture. > >> > > So it does not know more? > > The picture doesn't. The experimenters do, because they have more > information than what's in the picture. > So, let them to complement ... ... > > Most charged particles have a charge of either +e or -e. > This is a very good range, but is it only electrons and positrons? Can it be something in between (mass and electric charge e / p)? ... > > Thank you, but I deal with the study of nature in a "top-down" > > and not vice versa. > > I've heard this said before. It's the excuse of the lazy. There's no > short-cut to physics. > And I've heard that the impossible can be done only by those who do not know that it was ... Of course, that there is no shortcut in the general level of knowledge to the narrow specialization of modern physics ... but maybe is a shortcut directly to Nature. In physics there are two different theoretical worlds (micro and macro), exclusive. In Nature there is only one. Real.
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| From | Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2016-03-10 15:41 -0600 |
| Message-ID | <nbspn6$3n6$1@gioia.aioe.org> |
| In reply to | #561256 |
On 3/10/2016 2:55 PM, Enes Richard wrote: > W dniu czwartek, 10 marca 2016 15:08:24 UTC+1 użytkownik Odd Bodkin napisał: >> On 3/9/2016 5:19 PM, Enes Richard wrote: > ... >>>>>> Those charged particles can >>>>>> be electrons or pions or protons or muons or a few other long-lasting >>>>>> charged particles. The identification of which of these it is, is >>>>>> usually not just by looking at those curved tracks but also the profile >>>>>> of the energy deposit in the calorimeter. >>>>>> >>>>> What exactly is it? >>>> >>>> Don't have enough information from that picture to tell. However, there >>>> are OTHER data recorded for that event that will be able to identify >>>> what that particle is. It's just not shown in the picture. >>>> >>> So it does not know more? >> >> The picture doesn't. The experimenters do, because they have more >> information than what's in the picture. >> > So, let them to complement ... Have you read any of the published papers from the ALICE collaboration? Do you know how to find that in scholar.google.com? > > ... >> >> Most charged particles have a charge of either +e or -e. >> > This is a very good range, but is it only electrons and positrons? Can it > be something in between (mass and electric charge e / p)? Electrons and positrons have exactly equal mass. They also have exactly equal charge, just opposite sign. So when you say something in between.... > > ... >>> Thank you, but I deal with the study of nature in a "top-down" >>> and not vice versa. >> >> I've heard this said before. It's the excuse of the lazy. There's no >> short-cut to physics. >> > And I've heard that the impossible can be done only by those who do > not know that it was ... And then there are those who jump off cliffs holding fistfuls of feathers in an attempt to fly, because no one has told them that flying while holding fistfuls of feathers won't work. > > Of course, that there is no shortcut in the general level of knowledge > to the narrow specialization of modern physics ... but maybe is a > shortcut directly to Nature. I think that's a foolish venture. > > In physics there are two different theoretical worlds (micro and macro), > exclusive. In Nature there is only one. Real. > They are not exclusive at all. There is in fact an important thing you can look up, called the Correspondence Principle, which shows that micro world blends smoothly and completely consistently with the macro world. I have no idea where you ever got the idea the two theoretical worlds were incompatible with each other. -- Odd Bodkin --- maker of fine toys, tools, tables
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| From | Enes Richard <pies_na_teorie@vp.pl> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2016-03-10 15:01 -0800 |
| Message-ID | <091bf89e-3581-42ce-9e90-07c7c02f0d8b@googlegroups.com> |
| In reply to | #561276 |
W dniu czwartek, 10 marca 2016 22:42:02 UTC+1 użytkownik Odd Bodkin napisał: > On 3/10/2016 2:55 PM, Enes Richard wrote: [...] here are more and more intriguing topics for discussion, but we must, however, focus on what is essential: > >> Most charged particles have a charge of either +e or -e. > >> > > This is a very good range, but is it only electrons and positrons? Can it > > be something in between (mass and electric charge e / p)? > > Electrons and positrons have exactly equal mass. They also have exactly > equal charge, just opposite sign. So when you say something in between.... > Looking further evidence that the electron is made up of particles of components (like any weight). Predictions are that the electron and positron can be two forms of the same particle in the reverse orientation of spatial components. Preferably it is 4 or 6 of the particles in electron / positron (but may also be a multiple of). Is it therefore possible or conceivable that their marks are in the topic picture ??? ...
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| From | Sam Wormley <swormley1@gmail.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2016-03-10 17:15 -0600 |
| Message-ID | <DK2dnaMHOOe0nX_LnZ2dnUU7-eudnZ2d@giganews.com> |
| In reply to | #561301 |
On 3/10/16 5:01 PM, Enes Richard wrote: > Looking further evidence that the electron is made up of particles of components (like any weight). Predictions are that the electron and positron can be two forms of the same particle in the reverse orientation of spatial components. Preferably it is 4 or 6 of the particles in electron / positron (but may also be a multiple of). That'll be the day. > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sO_wJEGmfQE -- sci.physics is an unmoderated newsgroup dedicated to the discussion of physics, news from the physics community, and physics-related social issues.
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| From | Enes Richard <pies_na_teorie@vp.pl> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2016-03-12 07:42 -0800 |
| Message-ID | <643c51e7-ab07-4a92-88b1-b989d9f9c171@googlegroups.com> |
| In reply to | #561309 |
W dniu piątek, 11 marca 2016 00:15:57 UTC+1 użytkownik Sam Wormley napisał: > On 3/10/16 5:01 PM, Enes Richard wrote: > > Looking further evidence that the electron is made up of particles of components (like any weight). Predictions are that the electron and positron can be two forms of the same particle in the reverse orientation of spatial components. Preferably it is 4 or 6 of the particles in electron / positron (but may also be a multiple of). > > > That'll be the day. > > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sO_wJEGmfQE > Over the waves (nomen omen ;) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7WjvJwtPLyg
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| From | Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2016-03-10 17:25 -0600 |
| Message-ID | <nbsvpg$cod$1@gioia.aioe.org> |
| In reply to | #561301 |
On 3/10/2016 5:01 PM, Enes Richard wrote: > W dniu czwartek, 10 marca 2016 22:42:02 UTC+1 użytkownik Odd Bodkin napisał: >> On 3/10/2016 2:55 PM, Enes Richard wrote: > [...] > here are more and more intriguing topics for discussion, but we must, however, > focus on what is essential: > >>>> Most charged particles have a charge of either +e or -e. >>>> >>> This is a very good range, but is it only electrons and positrons? Can it >>> be something in between (mass and electric charge e / p)? >> >> Electrons and positrons have exactly equal mass. They also have exactly >> equal charge, just opposite sign. So when you say something in between.... >> > Looking further evidence that the electron is made up of particles of components > (like any weight). Predictions are that the electron and positron can be two forms > of the same particle in the reverse orientation of spatial components. Preferably > it is 4 or 6 of the particles in electron / positron (but may also be a multiple of). > > Is it therefore possible or conceivable that their marks are in the topic picture ??? > ... > Electrons being composites would have distinctive signatures in electron-electron scattering experiments or electron-positron scattering experiments, such as those done at LEP or SLAC. This is the same method that has been used to determine that protons and neutrons were composites in the 1960's, a method called deep inelastic scattering. These searches for electron and positron compositeness have already been done by experiments at those facilities and other lepton colliders. The only way you'd be able to tell from an experiment like Alice whether you have a track due to a particle with a fractional charge is to measure the AMOUNT of energy the particle has, as given by the calorimeter. You can then compare that with the ratio of the momentum to the charge as measured in the tracking chamber. It's best to do this with the rather stiff particles (the ones with nearly straight tracks), not the ones that are tightly curled. You won't be able to glean this from any picture, but only from the measured VALUES of energy and momentum/charge. To do this, you'd have to have direct access to the data, or to someone in the ALICE collaboration that would have direct access to the data. I'm pretty sure, though, that just about anyone on that experiment would refer to previous searches for electron structure as mentioned in the paragraph above, and tell you that's already been ruled out. -- Odd Bodkin --- maker of fine toys, tools, tables
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| From | Enes Richard <pies_na_teorie@vp.pl> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2016-03-11 12:05 -0800 |
| Message-ID | <141dc717-934a-495c-923a-5098b3f05cf2@googlegroups.com> |
| In reply to | #561312 |
W dniu piątek, 11 marca 2016 00:25:42 UTC+1 użytkownik Odd Bodkin napisał: > On 3/10/2016 5:01 PM, Enes Richard wrote: > > W dniu czwartek, 10 marca 2016 22:42:02 UTC+1 użytkownik Odd Bodkin napisał: > >> On 3/10/2016 2:55 PM, Enes Richard wrote: > > [...] > > here are more and more intriguing topics for discussion, but we must, however, > > focus on what is essential: > > > >>>> Most charged particles have a charge of either +e or -e. > >>>> > >>> This is a very good range, but is it only electrons and positrons? Can it > >>> be something in between (mass and electric charge e / p)? > >> > >> Electrons and positrons have exactly equal mass. They also have exactly > >> equal charge, just opposite sign. So when you say something in between.... > >> > > Looking further evidence that the electron is made up of particles of components > > (like any weight). Predictions are that the electron and positron can be two forms > > of the same particle in the reverse orientation of spatial components. Preferably > > it is 4 or 6 of the particles in electron / positron (but may also be a multiple of). > > > > Is it therefore possible or conceivable that their marks are in the topic picture ??? > > ... > > > > Electrons being composites would have distinctive signatures in > electron-electron scattering experiments or electron-positron scattering > experiments, such as those done at LEP or SLAC. This is the same method > that has been used to determine that protons and neutrons were > composites in the 1960's, a method called deep inelastic scattering. > These searches for electron and positron compositeness have already been > done by experiments at those facilities and other lepton colliders. > > The only way you'd be able to tell from an experiment like Alice whether > you have a track due to a particle with a fractional charge is to > measure the AMOUNT of energy the particle has, as given by the > calorimeter. You can then compare that with the ratio of the momentum to > the charge as measured in the tracking chamber. It's best to do this > with the rather stiff particles (the ones with nearly straight tracks), > not the ones that are tightly curled. You won't be able to glean this > from any picture, but only from the measured VALUES of energy and > momentum/charge. To do this, you'd have to have direct access to the > data, or to someone in the ALICE collaboration that would have direct > access to the data. I'm pretty sure, though, that just about anyone on > that experiment would refer to previous searches for electron structure > as mentioned in the paragraph above, and tell you that's already been > ruled out. > > > -- > Odd Bodkin --- maker of fine toys, tools, tables Tested model of the electron has a component with a mass of 1/4e and total electric charge equel 0. Very simple is example of a coin, which has on one side 1/4e, and on the reverse - 1/4e. Coins arranged on the tetrahedron walls may simulate an electron, arranged inversely may give a positron. How to detect in this picture, or somewhere else: mass = 1/4 e, electric charge = 1 / 4e - 1 / 4e = 0 ???
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