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Re: Fat books

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I never read a fiction book
and I certaintly never read 
a science fiction book

That's like giving a 
3 year old LSD.


Who do you think reads
science fiction books? People
who want to go to Mars!

Fiction and
science fiction...
that's a fucking double wammy!!!

Give the kid a half a tab of LSD.


The Starmaker wrote:
> 
> Let's stop with all dis science fiction stuff..
> Mars is not a planet!
> 
> There is no reason to go to Mars because
> Mars is not a planet!
> 
> It's just a rock.
> 
> No different from the Moon.
> 
> Mars is just a balancing system
> to keep the Earth on course..
> and from flying away to some freeway.
> 
> Blaine wrote:
> >
> > The Starmaker wrote:
> > > Peter Moylan wrote:
> > >>
> > >> I've griped about this issue before, but once again I find myself annoyed.
> > >>
> > >> I was reading "Robots and Empire", by Isaac Asimov. This is possibly the
> > >> worst novel Asimov ever wrote. As a story it's mostly well-told, but the
> > >> padding and waffle are enough to irritate the most patient reader.
> > >>
> > >> Let me quote from Chapter 45. "I think you must either get to the point,
> > >> Dr Mandamus, or leave." This is not the only such case. Many of the
> > >> characters in the book are incapable of getting to the point. They take
> > >> half a dozen pages to say something that could be put in one chort
> > >> paragraph. Get to the point, Dr Asimov. It's so bad that even the
> > >> characters in the story are complaining about the padding.
> > >>
> > >> A competent editor could have made this a much better book by cutting it
> > >> to about one third of its length.
> > >>
> > >> I wonder whether this hurt Asimov's reputation. I've certainly seen
> > >> comments that his later (thick) books are not as good as his earlier
> > >> writing.
> > >>
> > >> It's not all his fault. Many other authors are as bad. They're used to
> > >> being paid by the page, and publishers are letting them get away with
> > >> it. Maybe publishers don't employ editors any more, and have given up
> > >> any attempt at quality control. There are some authors that I refuse to
> > >> read because their books are too thick.
> > >>
> > >> But surely, I tell myself, the publishers must have noticed that books
> > >> don't sell as well as they used to. Or do they? Am I the only person to
> > >> complain about this?
> > >>
> > >> --
> > >> Peter Moylan       peter@pmoylan.org    http://www.pmoylan.org
> > >> Newcastle, NSW
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > This is not literary criticism. It is a self-indulgent tantrum from a
> > > reader who confuses personal irritation with objective analysis and then
> > > tries to inflate it into an industry-wide conspiracy.
> > >
> > >      You mistake dialogue for padding and call it proof. Quoting one
> > > character telling another to get to the point does not demonstrate
> > > authorial failure. It demonstrates a character who is frustrated.
> > > Treating in-story dialogue as a meta-confession by Asimov is the
> > > critical equivalent of believing a novel’s villain is the author’s
> > > autobiography.
> >
> > one character may not demonstrate the failure he is referring to, but it
> > struck a chord with me. Try getting very far into the followups in
> > Stephen R. Donaldson's space opera with Angus Thermopyle. It's just like
> > this and of such badness that it reminds one of someone using
> > copy-paste, but with an AI to twist up the words slightly so that it
> > can't be labeled that simply. The reader just doesn't need that many
> > similar brushups on what happened last novel. I set it down before
> > finishing.
> >
> > --
> > Can you strip away so we may start again?
> > "There’s a switch and they don't
> > seem authentic or themselves. It
> > feels like I’m an unnecessary
> > body and it’s a waste of time to
> > even be there." -- Grim, playful Blaine.
> 
> --
> The Starmaker -- To question the unquestionable, ask the unaskable,
> to think the unthinkable, mention the unmentionable, say the unsayable,
> and challenge the unchallengeable.

-- 
The Starmaker -- To question the unquestionable, ask the unaskable,
to think the unthinkable, mention the unmentionable, say the unsayable, 
and challenge the unchallengeable.

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Re: Fat books The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2026-10-17 11:47 -0700
  Re: Fat books Blaine <cactus_DAC@yahoo.com> - 2026-10-17 12:54 -0600
    Re: Fat books Titus G <noone@nowhere.com> - 2026-10-18 09:40 +1300
    Re: Fat books The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2026-10-17 22:33 -0700
      Re: Fat books The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2026-10-17 22:38 -0700
        Re: Fat books BobbieSellers <bliss-sf4ever@dslextreme.invalid> - 2026-10-17 23:07 -0700
          Re: Fat books Titus G <noone@nowhere.com> - 2026-10-18 21:02 +1300
            Re: Fat books BobbieSellers <bliss-sf4ever@dslextreme.invalid> - 2026-10-18 07:42 -0700
              Re: Fat books William Hyde <wthyde1953@gmail.com> - 2026-10-18 16:42 -0400
                Re: Fat books Blaine <cactus_DAC@yahoo.com> - 2026-10-18 14:48 -0600
              Re: Fat books kludge@panix.com (Scott Dorsey) - 2026-10-18 20:48 -0400
                Re: Fat books BobbieSellers <bliss-sf4ever@dslextreme.invalid> - 2026-10-18 18:56 -0700
                Re: Fat books The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2026-10-18 19:53 -0700
                Re: Fat books Tony Cooper <tonycooper214@gmail.com> - 2026-10-18 23:39 -0400
                Re: Fat books BobbieSellers <bliss-sf4ever@dslextreme.invalid> - 2026-10-18 21:51 -0700
          Re: Fat books Hibou <vpaereru-unmonitored@yahoo.com.invalid> - 2026-10-18 11:28 +0100
            Re: Fat books Johann 'Myrkraverk' Oskarsson <johann@myrkraverk.invalid> - 2026-10-18 19:33 +0800
              Re: Fat books Hibou <vpaereru-unmonitored@yahoo.com.invalid> - 2026-10-18 13:45 +0100
                Re: Fat books Johann 'Myrkraverk' Oskarsson <johann@myrkraverk.invalid> - 2026-10-20 20:35 +0800
                Re: Fat books Torbjorn Lindgren <tl@none.invalid> - 2026-10-20 14:19 +0000
            Re: Fat books Dimensional Traveler <dtravel@sonic.net> - 2026-10-18 09:04 -0700
              Re: Fat books The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2026-10-18 13:02 -0700
                Re: Fat books The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2026-10-18 17:25 -0700
            Re: Fat books nospam@de-ster.demon.nl (J. J. Lodder) - 2026-10-18 21:39 +0200
              Re: Fat books The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2026-10-18 17:06 -0700
              Re: Fat books Hibou <vpaereru-unmonitored@yahoo.com.invalid> - 2026-10-19 14:00 +0100
                Re: Fat books Johann 'Myrkraverk' Oskarsson <johann@myrkraverk.invalid> - 2026-10-19 21:04 +0800
                Re: Fat books Aidan Kehoe <kehoea@parhasard.net> - 2026-10-19 18:31 +0100
                Re: Fat books Johann 'Myrkraverk' Oskarsson <johann@myrkraverk.invalid> - 2026-10-20 05:55 +0800
                Re: Fat books Adam Funk <a24061@ducksburg.com> - 2026-10-20 10:37 +0100
                Re: Fat books Steve Hayes <hayesstw@telkomsa.net> - 2026-10-20 05:39 +0200
                Re: Fat books Hibou <vpaereru-unmonitored@yahoo.com.invalid> - 2026-10-20 07:01 +0100
                Re: Fat books Aidan Kehoe <kehoea@parhasard.net> - 2026-10-20 08:57 +0100
                Re: Fat books Adam Funk <a24061@ducksburg.com> - 2026-10-20 10:42 +0100
                Re: Fat books Johann 'Myrkraverk' Oskarsson <johann@myrkraverk.invalid> - 2026-10-20 20:51 +0800
                Re: Fat books nospam@de-ster.demon.nl (J. J. Lodder) - 2026-10-19 21:40 +0200
                Re: Fat books Johann 'Myrkraverk' Oskarsson <johann@myrkraverk.invalid> - 2026-10-20 05:58 +0800
                Re: Fat books nospam@de-ster.demon.nl (J. J. Lodder) - 2026-10-20 13:09 +0200
                Re: Fat books Charles Hope <clh@candehope.me.uk> - 2026-10-20 14:00 +0000
                Re: Fat books Johann 'Myrkraverk' Oskarsson <johann@myrkraverk.invalid> - 2026-10-20 22:06 +0800
                Re: Fat books Nuno Silva <nunojsilva@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-21 01:01 +0100
                Re: Fat books Johann 'Myrkraverk' Oskarsson <johann@myrkraverk.invalid> - 2026-10-21 10:38 +0800
                Re: Fat books Ross Finlayson <ross.a.finlayson@gmail.com> - 2026-10-20 07:18 -0700
                Re: Fat books Johann 'Myrkraverk' Oskarsson <johann@myrkraverk.invalid> - 2026-10-20 23:02 +0800
                Re: Fat books Adam Funk <a24061@ducksburg.com> - 2026-10-20 15:15 +0100
                Re: Fat books Ross Finlayson <ross.a.finlayson@gmail.com> - 2026-10-20 08:05 -0700
                Re: Fat books Ross Finlayson <ross.a.finlayson@gmail.com> - 2026-10-20 08:28 -0700
                Re: Fat books kludge@panix.com (Scott Dorsey) - 2026-10-20 12:14 -0400
                Re: Fat books Charles Hope <clh@candehope.me.uk> - 2026-10-20 19:15 +0000
                Re: Fat books Bobbie Sellers <bliss-sf4ever@dslextreme.com> - 2026-10-20 12:43 -0700
                Re: Fat books Ross Finlayson <ross.a.finlayson@gmail.com> - 2026-10-20 15:29 -0700
                Re: Fat books Bobbie Sellers <bliss-sf4ever@dslextreme.com> - 2026-10-20 18:32 -0700
                Re: Fat books Titus G <noone@nowhere.com> - 2026-10-22 12:02 +1300
                Re: Fat books The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2026-10-21 20:35 -0700
                Re: Fat books Ross Finlayson <ross.a.finlayson@gmail.com> - 2026-10-21 10:28 -0700
                Re: Fat books Ross Finlayson <ross.a.finlayson@gmail.com> - 2026-10-21 10:44 -0700
                Re: Fat books Johann 'Myrkraverk' Oskarsson <johann@myrkraverk.invalid> - 2026-10-22 01:49 +0800
                Re: Fat books Ross Finlayson <ross.a.finlayson@gmail.com> - 2026-10-21 10:59 -0700
                Re: Fat books kludge@panix.com (Scott Dorsey) - 2026-10-20 12:13 -0400
                Re: Fat books Dimensional Traveler <dtravel@sonic.net> - 2026-10-20 09:13 -0700
                Re: Fat books Bobbie Sellers <bliss-sf4ever@dslextreme.com> - 2026-10-20 09:53 -0700
          Re: Fat books The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2026-10-18 19:50 -0700
        Re: Fat books The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2026-10-29 20:06 -0700
  Re: Fat books BobbieSellers <bliss-sf4ever@dslextreme.invalid> - 2026-10-17 18:59 -0700
    Re: Fat books Johann 'Myrkraverk' Oskarsson <johann@myrkraverk.invalid> - 2026-10-18 19:46 +0800
      Re: Fat books William Hyde <wthyde1953@gmail.com> - 2026-10-18 16:57 -0400
        Re: Fat books The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2026-10-18 16:48 -0700
        Re: Fat books The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2026-10-18 16:57 -0700
        Re: Fat books Johann 'Myrkraverk' Oskarsson <johann@myrkraverk.invalid> - 2026-10-20 21:04 +0800
          Re: Fat books William Hyde <wthyde1953@gmail.com> - 2026-10-20 15:09 -0400

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