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Re: OT vaccines cause heart disease and are mandatory in some places

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On 30/05/2017 03:05, bill.sloman@ieee.org wrote:
> On Tuesday, May 30, 2017 at 10:35:33 AM UTC+10, Jamie M wrote:
>> On 5/29/2017 2:24 PM, John Robertson wrote:

>>> I have been vaccinated and my ex-wife & I vaccinated our
>>> children, and they are vaccinating their child(ren).
>>
>> What do you think about vaccines being mandatory in some places
>> though?
>
> If it forces idiots like you to get vaccinated, and get you kids
> vaccinated, it has to be a good thing. Herd immunity depends on
> having something like 95% of the herd immune (though the exact level
> depends on the mechanics of contagation), and 5% of the population is
> crazy enough to need psychiatric care at some stage.

UK is having serious epidemic problems due to lost herd immunity in the 
teenage cohort now going to university whose parents were spooked by the 
fake MMR vaccine "causes" autism claims. Last bad one in 2013:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-22277186

The vaccine deniers need to be challenged.

It is an ongoing problem but has largely fallen out of the news.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-39419976

>> If there is evidence (like from the linked studies) that they cause
>>  heart disease or other problems.
>
> Then the question is how much heart disease, and by what mechanism.
>>
>> "The risk for acute coronary events decreased significantly with
>> increasing number of childhood contagious diseases (p=0.007)."
>
> Correlation isn't causation. Stronger kids survive childhood
> contagious diseases, weaker kids don't. Perhaps the weaker kids were
> more likely to get heart disease. Or is could be that more of
> vaccinated kids survived to can age when they could get heart
> disease.

Probably the latter. In the days before antibiotics and national 
immunisation programs these childhood diseases were killers.

>> "Protection from infections usually suffered during the childhood
>> before the era of MMR vaccination may predispose the individual to
>> CHD"
>
> That is one way of looking at it. If allowing the patient to survive
> long enough to exhibit coronary heart diseases counts as
> "predisposition" it might even be true, but it's a truly rotten
> argument against vaccination.
>
> Playing Russian Roulete does make it less likely that you will die of
> coronary heart disease, but that doesn't make it a sensible health
> choice.
>

There is a good case for keeping some live smallpox virus for those that 
insist that they do not want to be vaccinated against other nasty 
diseases or advocate homeopathic remedies. Survivors will be free to 
peddle their cranky beliefs the rest will need to be incinerated.

Eliminating polio globally is still being hampered by cranky 
superstitious beliefs much like those of the anti MMR bandwagon.

http://polioeradication.org/polio-today/polio-now/

Trouble is that people have forgotten just how nasty the old diseases of 
childhood really were after a generation spent almost free of them.

-- 
Regards,
Martin Brown

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OT vaccines cause heart disease and are mandatory in some places Jamie M <jmorken@shaw.ca> - 2017-05-29 09:05 -0700
  Re: OT vaccines cause heart disease and are mandatory in some places Lasse Langwadt Christensen <langwadt@fonz.dk> - 2017-05-29 09:24 -0700
    Re: OT vaccines cause heart disease and are mandatory in some places Jamie M <jmorken@shaw.ca> - 2017-05-29 12:56 -0700
      Re: OT vaccines cause heart disease and are mandatory in some places "dcaster@krl.org" <dcaster@krl.org> - 2017-05-29 14:22 -0700
        Re: OT vaccines cause heart disease and are mandatory in some places Jamie M <jmorken@shaw.ca> - 2017-05-29 17:32 -0700
          Re: OT vaccines cause heart disease and are mandatory in some places bill.sloman@ieee.org - 2017-05-29 18:25 -0700
      Re: OT vaccines cause heart disease and are mandatory in some places John Robertson <spam@flippers.com> - 2017-05-29 14:24 -0700
        Re: OT vaccines cause heart disease and are mandatory in some places Jamie M <jmorken@shaw.ca> - 2017-05-29 17:35 -0700
          Re: OT vaccines cause heart disease and are mandatory in some places bill.sloman@ieee.org - 2017-05-29 19:05 -0700
            Re: OT vaccines cause heart disease and are mandatory in some places John Robertson <spam@flippers.com> - 2017-05-30 12:43 -0700
              Re: OT vaccines cause heart disease and are mandatory in some places Jamie M <jmorken@shaw.ca> - 2017-05-30 13:16 -0700
                Re: OT vaccines cause heart disease and are mandatory in some places John Robertson <spam@flippers.com> - 2017-05-30 14:35 -0700
                Re: OT vaccines cause heart disease and are mandatory in some places bill.sloman@ieee.org - 2017-05-30 19:19 -0700
            Re: OT vaccines cause heart disease and are mandatory in some places Martin Brown <'''newspam'''@nezumi.demon.co.uk> - 2017-05-31 13:35 +0100
      Re: OT vaccines cause heart disease and are mandatory in some places bill.sloman@ieee.org - 2017-05-29 18:13 -0700
  Re: OT vaccines cause heart disease and are mandatory in some places bill.sloman@ieee.org - 2017-05-29 18:09 -0700
  Re: OT vaccines cause heart disease and are mandatory in some places bloggs.fredbloggs.fred@gmail.com - 2017-05-30 11:35 -0700
    Re: OT vaccines cause heart disease and are mandatory in some places Jamie M <jmorken@shaw.ca> - 2017-05-30 12:11 -0700
      Re: OT vaccines cause heart disease and are mandatory in some places bill.sloman@ieee.org - 2017-05-30 19:19 -0700
      Re: OT vaccines cause heart disease and are mandatory in some places bloggs.fredbloggs.fred@gmail.com - 2017-05-31 07:14 -0700
        Re: OT vaccines cause heart disease and are mandatory in some places Jamie M <jmorken@shaw.ca> - 2017-05-31 21:31 -0700
          Re: OT vaccines cause heart disease and are mandatory in some places bloggs.fredbloggs.fred@gmail.com - 2017-06-02 09:32 -0700
            Re: OT vaccines cause heart disease and are mandatory in some places Jamie M <jmorken@shaw.ca> - 2017-06-02 10:49 -0700
              Re: OT vaccines cause heart disease and are mandatory in some places Martin Brown <'''newspam'''@nezumi.demon.co.uk> - 2017-06-02 22:08 +0100
                Re: OT vaccines cause heart disease and are mandatory in some places Jamie M <jmorken@shaw.ca> - 2017-06-05 13:45 -0700
                Re: OT vaccines cause heart disease and are mandatory in some places bill.sloman@ieee.org - 2017-06-05 19:24 -0700
              Re: OT vaccines cause heart disease and are mandatory in some places bill.sloman@ieee.org - 2017-06-02 18:46 -0700
  Re: OT vaccines cause heart disease and are mandatory in some places Sylvia Else <sylvia@not.at.this.address> - 2017-05-31 12:47 +1000
    Re: OT vaccines cause heart disease and are mandatory in some places Jamie M <jmorken@shaw.ca> - 2017-05-31 21:50 -0700
      Re: OT vaccines cause heart disease and are mandatory in some places Sylvia Else <sylvia@not.at.this.address> - 2017-06-01 15:01 +1000
        Re: OT vaccines cause heart disease and are mandatory in some places Jamie M <jmorken@shaw.ca> - 2017-06-02 10:59 -0700
          Re: OT vaccines cause heart disease and are mandatory in some places bill.sloman@ieee.org - 2017-06-02 18:40 -0700
      Re: OT vaccines cause heart disease and are mandatory in some places Reinhardt Behm <rbehm@hushmail.com> - 2017-06-01 13:10 +0800
      Re: OT vaccines cause heart disease and are mandatory in some places bill.sloman@ieee.org - 2017-06-01 01:07 -0700

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