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Groups > rec.arts.sf.written > #481236 > unrolled thread

"After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming ‘Apocalypse’"

Started byLynn McGuire <lynnmcguire5@gmail.com>
First post2017-11-27 15:58 -0600
Last post2017-11-30 21:30 -0600
Articles 20 on this page of 192 — 29 participants

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Contents

  "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming ‘Apocalypse’" Lynn McGuire <lynnmcguire5@gmail.com> - 2017-11-27 15:58 -0600
    Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming ‘Apocalypse’" Titus G <noone@nowhere.com> - 2017-11-28 16:32 +1300
      Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming ‘Apocalypse’" J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2017-11-27 23:16 -0500
        Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming �Apocalypse�" Titus G <noone@nowhere.com> - 2017-11-28 19:32 +1300
          Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming ?Apocalypse?" Greg Goss <gossg@gossg.org> - 2017-11-27 23:59 -0700
    Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" D B Davis <g@crcomp.net> - 2017-11-28 05:35 +0000
      Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Quadibloc <jsavard@ecn.ab.ca> - 2017-12-01 05:37 -0800
        Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Quadibloc <jsavard@ecn.ab.ca> - 2017-12-01 05:41 -0800
          Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" D B Davis <g@crcomp.net> - 2017-12-01 15:56 +0000
            Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" jgreenfield97@gmail.com - 2018-03-21 21:08 -0700
              Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" D B Davis <g@crcomp.net> - 2018-03-22 16:17 +0000
        Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2017-12-01 16:25 +0000
          Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" D B Davis <g@crcomp.net> - 2017-12-01 16:54 +0000
            Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Quadibloc <jsavard@ecn.ab.ca> - 2017-12-01 09:55 -0800
            Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" William Hyde <wthyde1953@gmail.com> - 2017-12-01 13:40 -0800
              Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy <taustinca@gmail.com> - 2017-12-01 14:29 -0700
                Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Paul Colquhoun <newsposter@andor.dropbear.id.au> - 2017-12-02 14:05 +1100
                  Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy <taustinca@gmail.com> - 2017-12-01 19:51 -0700
                    Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2017-12-04 14:30 +0000
                Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" William Hyde <wthyde1953@gmail.com> - 2017-12-02 13:18 -0800
                  Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" David Johnston <davidjohnston29@yahoo.com> - 2017-12-02 14:31 -0700
                    Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Dimensional Traveler <dtravel@sonic.net> - 2017-12-02 15:28 -0800
                      Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" D B Davis <g@crcomp.net> - 2017-12-03 00:10 +0000
                        Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Dimensional Traveler <dtravel@sonic.net> - 2017-12-02 17:51 -0800
                      Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Robert Carnegie <rja.carnegie@excite.com> - 2017-12-02 16:14 -0800
                        Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Lawrence Watt-Evans <misenchantedpress@gmail.com> - 2017-12-03 00:44 -0500
                          Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2017-12-03 00:55 -0500
                        Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy <taustinca@gmail.com> - 2017-12-02 22:54 -0700
                    Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy <taustinca@gmail.com> - 2017-12-02 22:52 -0700
                    Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" William Hyde <wthyde1953@gmail.com> - 2017-12-03 13:13 -0800
                  Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy <taustinca@gmail.com> - 2017-12-02 22:51 -0700
              Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Quadibloc <jsavard@ecn.ab.ca> - 2017-12-01 15:28 -0800
                Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" David DeLaney <daviddelaney@earthlink.net> - 2017-12-02 00:23 -0600
                Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" William Hyde <wthyde1953@gmail.com> - 2017-12-03 14:07 -0800
            Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Peter Trei <petertrei@gmail.com> - 2017-12-03 00:59 -0800
              Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Peter Trei <petertrei@gmail.com> - 2017-12-03 01:08 -0800
                Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Michael A Terrell <mike.terrell@earthlink.net> - 2017-12-03 07:29 -0500
              Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Quadibloc <jsavard@ecn.ab.ca> - 2017-12-03 08:06 -0800
                Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Greg Goss <gossg@gossg.org> - 2017-12-03 15:18 -0700
              Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" William Hyde <wthyde1953@gmail.com> - 2017-12-03 13:41 -0800
                Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Greg Goss <gossg@gossg.org> - 2017-12-03 15:20 -0700
                  Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" William Hyde <wthyde1953@gmail.com> - 2017-12-03 15:29 -0800
            Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" hamish.laws@gmail.com - 2017-12-03 06:40 -0800
              Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy <taustinca@gmail.com> - 2017-12-03 12:27 -0700
                Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" David DeLaney <daviddelaney@earthlink.net> - 2017-12-05 06:03 -0600
                  Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy <taustinca@gmail.com> - 2017-12-05 08:34 -0700
                  Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" D B Davis <g@crcomp.net> - 2017-12-05 16:47 +0000
                    Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Peter Trei <petertrei@gmail.com> - 2017-12-05 10:41 -0800
                      Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy <taustinca@gmail.com> - 2017-12-05 11:42 -0700
                    Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Quadibloc <jsavard@ecn.ab.ca> - 2017-12-05 11:09 -0800
                      Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Quadibloc <jsavard@ecn.ab.ca> - 2017-12-05 11:22 -0800
                        Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy <taustinca@gmail.com> - 2017-12-05 11:45 -0700
                          Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Lawrence Watt-Evans <misenchantedpress@gmail.com> - 2017-12-05 14:54 -0500
                            Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy <taustinca@gmail.com> - 2017-12-05 13:55 -0700
                              Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Lawrence Watt-Evans <misenchantedpress@gmail.com> - 2017-12-05 17:59 -0500
                                Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy <taustinca@gmail.com> - 2017-12-05 15:46 -0700
                                  Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" David DeLaney <daviddelaney@earthlink.net> - 2017-12-05 17:58 -0600
                                    Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy <taustinca@gmail.com> - 2017-12-05 16:36 -0700
                                      Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Michael A Terrell <mike.terrell@earthlink.net> - 2017-12-06 00:13 -0500
                                        Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Lawrence Watt-Evans <misenchantedpress@gmail.com> - 2017-12-06 02:20 -0500
                                          Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Michael A Terrell <mike.terrell@earthlink.net> - 2017-12-06 02:42 -0500
                                            Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Quadibloc <jsavard@ecn.ab.ca> - 2017-12-05 23:53 -0800
                                              Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Michael A Terrell <mike.terrell@earthlink.net> - 2017-12-06 04:54 -0500
                                                Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Peter Trei <petertrei@gmail.com> - 2017-12-06 06:06 -0800
                                                Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Quadibloc <jsavard@ecn.ab.ca> - 2017-12-06 07:26 -0800
                                                  Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2017-12-06 16:00 +0000
                                                    Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Dimensional Traveler <dtravel@sonic.net> - 2017-12-06 09:31 -0800
                                                      Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy <taustinca@gmail.com> - 2017-12-06 09:55 -0700
                                                Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" David DeLaney <daviddelaney@earthlink.net> - 2017-12-07 03:37 -0600
                                                  Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Michael A Terrell <mike.terrell@earthlink.net> - 2017-12-07 05:47 -0500
                                                    Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Peter Trei <petertrei@gmail.com> - 2017-12-07 06:24 -0800
                                                      Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Michael A Terrell <mike.terrell@earthlink.net> - 2017-12-07 10:35 -0500
                                                      Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Lynn McGuire <lynnmcguire5@gmail.com> - 2017-12-07 16:24 -0600
                                                        Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy <taustinca@gmail.com> - 2017-12-07 14:26 -0700
                                                          Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Lynn McGuire <lynnmcguire5@gmail.com> - 2017-12-07 16:41 -0600
                                                            Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy <taustinca@gmail.com> - 2017-12-07 14:53 -0700
                                                              Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Lynn McGuire <lynnmcguire5@gmail.com> - 2017-12-07 17:27 -0600
                                                                Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" hamish.laws@gmail.com - 2017-12-07 16:09 -0800
                                                                  Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy <taustinca@gmail.com> - 2017-12-07 16:55 -0700
                                                                    Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" hamish.laws@gmail.com - 2017-12-07 19:23 -0800
                                                                      Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy <taustinca@gmail.com> - 2017-12-07 21:04 -0700
                                                                        Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" David DeLaney <daviddelaney@earthlink.net> - 2017-12-08 02:48 -0600
                                                                          Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Lynn McGuire <lynnmcguire5@gmail.com> - 2017-12-08 16:07 -0600
                                                                            Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2017-12-08 23:25 +0000
                                                                            Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Michael A Terrell <mike.terrell@earthlink.net> - 2017-12-08 19:19 -0500
                                                                        Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" D B Davis <g@crcomp.net> - 2017-12-08 17:25 +0000
                                                                          Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy <taustinca@gmail.com> - 2017-12-08 09:38 -0700
                                                                        Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Lynn McGuire <lynnmcguire5@gmail.com> - 2017-12-08 16:15 -0600
                                                                          Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy <taustinca@gmail.com> - 2017-12-08 14:25 -0700
                                                                          Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Dimensional Traveler <dtravel@sonic.net> - 2017-12-08 15:27 -0800
                                                                            Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy <taustinca@gmail.com> - 2017-12-08 15:41 -0700
                                                                            Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Lynn McGuire <lynnmcguire5@gmail.com> - 2017-12-08 18:46 -0600
                                                                          Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Robert Carnegie <rja.carnegie@excite.com> - 2017-12-08 15:45 -0800
                                                                    Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Tom Kratman <tomkratman@gmail.com> - 2017-12-11 09:25 -0800
                                                                      Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy <taustinca@gmail.com> - 2017-12-11 09:46 -0700
                                                        Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Dimensional Traveler <dtravel@sonic.net> - 2017-12-07 15:38 -0800
                                              Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy <taustinca@gmail.com> - 2017-12-06 08:38 -0700
                                                Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Robert Carnegie <rja.carnegie@excite.com> - 2017-12-06 13:54 -0800
                                                  Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Lawrence Watt-Evans <misenchantedpress@gmail.com> - 2017-12-06 16:58 -0500
                                                    Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy <taustinca@gmail.com> - 2017-12-06 15:40 -0700
                                                  Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy <taustinca@gmail.com> - 2017-12-06 15:36 -0700
                                                Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Quadibloc <jsavard@ecn.ab.ca> - 2017-12-06 14:31 -0800
                                                  Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy <taustinca@gmail.com> - 2017-12-06 15:42 -0700
                                                    Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Quadibloc <jsavard@ecn.ab.ca> - 2017-12-06 22:13 -0800
                                                      Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy <taustinca@gmail.com> - 2017-12-07 09:01 -0700
                                                        Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Quadibloc <jsavard@ecn.ab.ca> - 2017-12-07 11:23 -0800
                                                          Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy <taustinca@gmail.com> - 2017-12-07 11:27 -0700
                                                        Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Quadibloc <jsavard@ecn.ab.ca> - 2017-12-07 11:24 -0800
                                                          Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy <taustinca@gmail.com> - 2017-12-07 11:28 -0700
                                                            Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Quadibloc <jsavard@ecn.ab.ca> - 2017-12-07 11:32 -0800
                                                              Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy <taustinca@gmail.com> - 2017-12-07 12:47 -0700
                                        Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy <taustinca@gmail.com> - 2017-12-06 08:34 -0700
                                  Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Michael A Terrell <mike.terrell@earthlink.net> - 2017-12-06 00:10 -0500
                                    Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Moriarty <blues95@ivillage.com> - 2017-12-05 21:23 -0800
                                    Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Quadibloc <jsavard@ecn.ab.ca> - 2017-12-05 22:00 -0800
                                      Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2017-12-06 21:33 -0500
                                        Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Quadibloc <jsavard@ecn.ab.ca> - 2017-12-06 22:15 -0800
                                        Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy <taustinca@gmail.com> - 2017-12-07 08:59 -0700
                                        Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Kevrob <kevrob@my-deja.com> - 2017-12-07 10:06 -0800
                                          Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Michael A Terrell <mike.terrell@earthlink.net> - 2017-12-07 13:29 -0500
                                            Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Kevrob <kevrob@my-deja.com> - 2017-12-07 10:47 -0800
                                            Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy <taustinca@gmail.com> - 2017-12-07 10:51 -0700
                                              Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Michael A Terrell <mike.terrell@earthlink.net> - 2017-12-07 14:10 -0500
                                            Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2017-12-07 20:14 -0500
                                          Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy <taustinca@gmail.com> - 2017-12-07 10:50 -0700
                                    Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy <taustinca@gmail.com> - 2017-12-05 22:48 -0700
                                      Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Michael A Terrell <mike.terrell@earthlink.net> - 2017-12-06 02:44 -0500
                                        Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" David DeLaney <daviddelaney@earthlink.net> - 2017-12-07 03:40 -0600
                                        Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy <taustinca@gmail.com> - 2017-12-07 09:02 -0700
                                          Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Michael A Terrell <mike.terrell@earthlink.net> - 2017-12-07 13:33 -0500
                                            Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Lawrence Watt-Evans <misenchantedpress@gmail.com> - 2017-12-07 16:47 -0500
                                              Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Siberian Sheep Shipper <taustinca@gmail.com> - 2017-12-07 14:14 -0700
                                                Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Michael A Terrell <mike.terrell@earthlink.net> - 2017-12-07 18:01 -0500
                                              Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Dimensional Traveler <dtravel@sonic.net> - 2017-12-07 14:15 -0800
                                                Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" David DeLaney <daviddelaney@earthlink.net> - 2017-12-08 02:44 -0600
                                                  Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Napenda Jibini <taustinca@gmail.com> - 2017-12-08 08:36 -0700
                                                    Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Dimensional Traveler <dtravel@sonic.net> - 2017-12-08 10:41 -0800
                                                      Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Juho Julkunen <giaotanj@hotmail.com> - 2017-12-08 22:16 +0200
                                                      Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy <taustinca@gmail.com> - 2017-12-08 12:31 -0700
                                                    Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Michael A Terrell <mike.terrell@earthlink.net> - 2017-12-08 16:47 -0500
                                                    Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" D B Davis <g@crcomp.net> - 2017-12-08 23:57 +0000
                                                      Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy <taustinca@gmail.com> - 2017-12-08 16:12 -0700
                                            Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Siberian Sheep Shipper <taustinca@gmail.com> - 2017-12-07 14:13 -0700
                                              Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Michael A Terrell <mike.terrell@earthlink.net> - 2017-12-07 17:57 -0500
                                    Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Greg Goss <gossg@gossg.org> - 2017-12-11 05:19 -0700
                                      Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Dimensional Traveler <dtravel@sonic.net> - 2017-12-11 07:59 -0800
                                      Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2017-12-11 21:20 -0500
                                        Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Cryptoengineer <treifamily@gmail.com> - 2017-12-11 21:17 -0600
                                          Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2017-12-11 22:52 -0500
                                            Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Greg Goss <gossg@gossg.org> - 2017-12-12 08:45 -0700
                                            Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" "Keith F. Lynch" <kfl@KeithLynch.net> - 2017-12-31 22:13 +0000
                                              Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" D B Davis <g@crcomp.net> - 2018-01-01 18:25 +0000
                                                Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Greg Goss <gossg@gossg.org> - 2018-01-02 06:48 -0700
                                                Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" "nuny@bid.nes" <alien8752@gmail.com> - 2018-01-02 13:20 -0800
                                                Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" "Keith F. Lynch" <kfl@KeithLynch.net> - 2018-01-03 02:40 +0000
                                              Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Peter Trei <petertrei@gmail.com> - 2018-01-02 05:59 -0800
                              Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" William Hyde <wthyde1953@gmail.com> - 2017-12-06 11:05 -0800
                                Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy <taustinca@gmail.com> - 2017-12-06 11:16 -0700
                            Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Robert Carnegie <rja.carnegie@excite.com> - 2017-12-05 23:28 -0800
                              Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Michael A Terrell <mike.terrell@earthlink.net> - 2017-12-06 02:46 -0500
                              Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Lawrence Watt-Evans <misenchantedpress@gmail.com> - 2017-12-06 03:09 -0500
                                Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Robert Carnegie <rja.carnegie@excite.com> - 2017-12-06 01:43 -0800
                                  Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy <taustinca@gmail.com> - 2017-12-06 08:35 -0700
                              Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy <taustinca@gmail.com> - 2017-12-06 08:34 -0700
                      Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy <taustinca@gmail.com> - 2017-12-05 11:44 -0700
                    Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy <taustinca@gmail.com> - 2017-12-05 11:40 -0700
                    Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" William Hyde <wthyde1953@gmail.com> - 2017-12-06 13:01 -0800
                      Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Moriarty <blues95@ivillage.com> - 2017-12-06 13:24 -0800
                      Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" D B Davis <g@crcomp.net> - 2017-12-06 23:56 +0000
                        Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" hamish.laws@gmail.com - 2017-12-06 16:40 -0800
                  Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" William Hyde <wthyde1953@gmail.com> - 2017-12-05 11:42 -0800
                Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Quadibloc <jsavard@ecn.ab.ca> - 2017-12-05 11:25 -0800
                  Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse" Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy <taustinca@gmail.com> - 2017-12-05 11:46 -0700
    Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming ‘Apocalypse’" Richard Hershberger <rrhersh@gmail.com> - 2017-11-28 05:54 -0800
    Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming ?Apocalypse?" Juho Julkunen <giaotanj@hotmail.com> - 2017-11-28 17:19 +0200
      Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming ?Apocalypse?" Lynn McGuire <lynnmcguire5@gmail.com> - 2017-11-29 15:23 -0600
        Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming ?Apocalypse?" David Johnston <davidjohnston29@yahoo.com> - 2017-11-29 15:07 -0700
          Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming ?Apocalypse?" Lynn McGuire <lynnmcguire5@gmail.com> - 2017-11-29 17:44 -0600
        Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming ?Apocalypse?" hamish.laws@gmail.com - 2017-11-30 16:37 -0800
          Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming ?Apocalypse?" Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy <taustinca@gmail.com> - 2017-11-30 18:39 -0700
            Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming ?Apocalypse?" Lynn McGuire <lynnmcguire5@gmail.com> - 2017-11-30 21:27 -0600
    Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming ‘Apocalypse’" "nuny@bid.nes" <alien8752@gmail.com> - 2017-11-30 12:57 -0800
      Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming ‘Apocalypse’" Lynn McGuire <lynnmcguire5@gmail.com> - 2017-11-30 17:58 -0600
        Re: Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming ‘Apocalypse’" scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2017-12-01 16:23 +0000
          Re: Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming ‘Apocalypse’" Quadibloc <jsavard@ecn.ab.ca> - 2017-12-01 09:52 -0800
    Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming ‘Apocalypse’" hamish.laws@gmail.com - 2017-11-30 16:36 -0800
      Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming ‘Apocalypse’" J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2017-11-30 20:44 -0500
        Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming ‘Apocalypse’" Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy <taustinca@gmail.com> - 2017-11-30 18:45 -0700
          Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming ‘Apocalypse’" Lynn McGuire <lynnmcguire5@gmail.com> - 2017-12-01 12:53 -0600
        Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming ‘Apocalypse’" hamish.laws@gmail.com - 2017-11-30 18:47 -0800
          Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming ‘Apocalypse’" J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2017-11-30 23:18 -0500
        Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming ‘Apocalypse’" Lynn McGuire <lynnmcguire5@gmail.com> - 2017-11-30 21:30 -0600

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#481236 — "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming ‘Apocalypse’"

FromLynn McGuire <lynnmcguire5@gmail.com>
Date2017-11-27 15:58 -0600
Subject"After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming ‘Apocalypse’"
Message-ID<ovi1pg$1kso$2@gioia.aioe.org>
"After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming 
‘Apocalypse’"
 
http://dailycaller.com/2017/11/25/after-30-years-alarmists-are-still-predicting-a-global-warming-apocalypse/

"Of course, human civilization has not collapsed, despite decades of 
predictions that we only have years left to avert disaster. Ten years 
ago, the U.N. predicted we only had “as little as eight years left to 
avoid a dangerous global average rise of 2C or more.”"

Wake me up when something real happens.

Lynn

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#481273

FromTitus G <noone@nowhere.com>
Date2017-11-28 16:32 +1300
Message-ID<ovim4d$4qg$1@dont-email.me>
In reply to#481236
On 28/11/17 10:58, Lynn McGuire wrote:
> "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming 
> ‘Apocalypse’"
> 
> http://dailycaller.com/2017/11/25/after-30-years-alarmists-are-still-predicting-a-global-warming-apocalypse/ 
> 
> 
> "Of course, human civilization has not collapsed, despite decades of 
> predictions that we only have years left to avert disaster. Ten years 
> ago, the U.N. predicted we only had “as little as eight years left to 
> avoid a dangerous global average rise of 2C or more.”"
> 
> Wake me up when something real happens.

We will certainly try but suspect that your swimming dream in Egypt will 
ensure your nap will continue.

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#481277 — Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming ‘Apocalypse’"

FromJ. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com>
Date2017-11-27 23:16 -0500
SubjectRe: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming ‘Apocalypse’"
Message-ID<6mop1d9h32oamhbfa76hd8al7p6b4pg55n@4ax.com>
In reply to#481273
On Tue, 28 Nov 2017 16:32:17 +1300, Titus G <noone@nowhere.com> wrote:

>On 28/11/17 10:58, Lynn McGuire wrote:
>> "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming 
>> ‘Apocalypse’"
>> 
>> http://dailycaller.com/2017/11/25/after-30-years-alarmists-are-still-predicting-a-global-warming-apocalypse/ 
>> 
>> 
>> "Of course, human civilization has not collapsed, despite decades of 
>> predictions that we only have years left to avert disaster. Ten years 
>> ago, the U.N. predicted we only had “as little as eight years left to 
>> avoid a dangerous global average rise of 2C or more.”"
>> 
>> Wake me up when something real happens.
>
>We will certainly try but suspect that your swimming dream in Egypt will 
>ensure your nap will continue.

Nobody in a position to bring about the drastic reductions in CO2
emissions that the IPCC says are required is interested in doing so.
So if you honestly believe that global warming is going to end the
world then you may as well give up whining about it and go have all
the fun you can before the world ends.

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#481288 — Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming �Apocalypse�"

FromTitus G <noone@nowhere.com>
Date2017-11-28 19:32 +1300
SubjectRe: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming �Apocalypse�"
Message-ID<ovivud$blk$1@dont-email.me>
In reply to#481277
On 28/11/17 17:16, J. Clarke wrote:
> On Tue, 28 Nov 2017 16:32:17 +1300, Titus G <noone@nowhere.com> wrote:
> 
>> On 28/11/17 10:58, Lynn McGuire wrote:
>>> "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming
>>> ‘Apocalypse’"
>>>
>>> http://dailycaller.com/2017/11/25/after-30-years-alarmists-are-still-predicting-a-global-warming-apocalypse/
>>>
>>>
>>> "Of course, human civilization has not collapsed, despite decades of
>>> predictions that we only have years left to avert disaster. Ten years
>>> ago, the U.N. predicted we only had “as little as eight years left to
>>> avoid a dangerous global average rise of 2C or more.”"
>>>
>>> Wake me up when something real happens.
>>
>> We will certainly try but suspect that your swimming dream in Egypt will
>> ensure your nap will continue.
> 
> Nobody in a position to bring about the drastic reductions in CO2
> emissions that the IPCC says are required is interested in doing so.
> So if you honestly believe that global warming is going to end the
> world then you may as well give up whining about it and go have all
> the fun you can before the world ends.

I do not recall whining. Given the average age of boring old farts on 
newsgroups, I doubt whether any life here is threatened by climate 
change. Some people may have concerns about their family tree. I do not 
recall whining. I am going to have all the fun I can before I end which 
I believe will be before the world ends and before dear Lynn McGuire 
wakes up unless he ends before I end but I am confident we will both end 
before the world ends.

Titus G Methuselah
Whose Delaney impressionist sig would read: Will live longer for fun.

P.S. Yes, Your Honour, I solemnly swear I dishonestly believe that what 
I said was the truth.

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#481289 — Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming ?Apocalypse?"

FromGreg Goss <gossg@gossg.org>
Date2017-11-27 23:59 -0700
SubjectRe: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming ?Apocalypse?"
Message-ID<f84frkFq5hcU1@mid.individual.net>
In reply to#481288
Titus G <noone@nowhere.com> wrote:

>... before I end but I am confident we will both end 
>before the world ends.

But will it be before this sentence ends
-- 
We are geeks.  Resistance is voltage over current.

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#481284 — Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse"

FromD B Davis <g@crcomp.net>
Date2017-11-28 05:35 +0000
SubjectRe: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse"
Message-ID<20171127a@crcomp.net>
In reply to#481236
Lynn McGuire <lynnmcguire5@gmail.com> wrote:
> "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse"
>
> http://dailycaller.com/2017/11/25/after-30-years-alarmists-are-still-predicting-a-global-warming-apocalypse/
>
> "Of course, human civilization has not collapsed, despite decades of
> predictions that we only have years left to avert disaster. Ten years
> ago, the U.N. predicted we only had "as little as eight years left to
> avoid a dangerous global average rise of 2C or more."
>
> Wake me up when something real happens.

    The thirty years suggested for mass media's promotion of a global
warming apocalypse is erroneous and far too short. Mass media first
promoted a global warming apocalypse at least 143 years ago.

Thank you,

--
Don

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#481397 — Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse"

FromQuadibloc <jsavard@ecn.ab.ca>
Date2017-12-01 05:37 -0800
SubjectRe: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse"
Message-ID<61e72192-1ff1-4907-9d77-0f5c2557d866@googlegroups.com>
In reply to#481284
On Monday, November 27, 2017 at 10:35:07 PM UTC-7, D B Davis wrote:
> Mass media first
> promoted a global warming apocalypse at least 143 years ago.

That would have been in 1874.

John Savard

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#481398 — Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse"

FromQuadibloc <jsavard@ecn.ab.ca>
Date2017-12-01 05:41 -0800
SubjectRe: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse"
Message-ID<8c58e8fd-0d1c-492c-b724-94f86704b73f@googlegroups.com>
In reply to#481397
On Friday, December 1, 2017 at 6:37:41 AM UTC-7, Quadibloc wrote:
> On Monday, November 27, 2017 at 10:35:07 PM UTC-7, D B Davis wrote:
> > Mass media first
> > promoted a global warming apocalypse at least 143 years ago.

> That would have been in 1874.

Ah, here we are:

http://hoaxes.org/archive/permalink/the_global_warming_hoax_of_1874

https://www.realclearscience.com/lists/6_great_science_hoaxes/global_warming_hoax_of_1874.html

John Savard

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#481401 — Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse"

FromD B Davis <g@crcomp.net>
Date2017-12-01 15:56 +0000
SubjectRe: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse"
Message-ID<20171201a@crcomp.net>
In reply to#481398
Quadibloc <jsavard@ecn.ab.ca> wrote:
> On Friday, December 1, 2017 at 6:37:41 AM UTC-7, Quadibloc wrote:
>> On Monday, November 27, 2017 at 10:35:07 PM UTC-7, D B Davis wrote:
>> > Mass media first
>> > promoted a global warming apocalypse at least 143 years ago.
>
>> That would have been in 1874.
>
> Ah, here we are:
>
> http://hoaxes.org/archive/permalink/the_global_warming_hoax_of_1874
>
> https://www.realclearscience.com/lists/6_great_science_hoaxes/global_warming_hoax_of_1874.html

    Your first link is more informative than the second. My favorite
part of the 1874 Anthropogenic Global Warming theory is the Velikovsky
celestial mechanics suggested by the science of the day.

Thank you,

--
Don

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#488851 — Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse"

Fromjgreenfield97@gmail.com
Date2018-03-21 21:08 -0700
SubjectRe: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse"
Message-ID<4ef25124-e762-4631-8d0e-43e2e73741eb@googlegroups.com>
In reply to#481401
On Saturday, December 2, 2017 at 2:26:46 AM UTC+10:30, D B Davis wrote:
> Quadibloc <jsavard@ecn.ab.ca> wrote:
> > On Friday, December 1, 2017 at 6:37:41 AM UTC-7, Quadibloc wrote:
> >> On Monday, November 27, 2017 at 10:35:07 PM UTC-7, D B Davis wrote:
> >> > Mass media first
> >> > promoted a global warming apocalypse at least 143 years ago.
> >
> >> That would have been in 1874.
> >
> > Ah, here we are:
> >
> > http://hoaxes.org/archive/permalink/the_global_warming_hoax_of_1874
> >
> > https://www.realclearscience.com/lists/6_great_science_hoaxes/global_warming_hoax_of_1874.html
> 
>     Your first link is more informative than the second. My favorite
> part of the 1874 Anthropogenic Global Warming theory is the Velikovsky
> celestial mechanics suggested by the science of the day.
> 
> Thank you,
> 
> --
> Don
 
An entire colony of Adellie penguins recently starved in Antarctica because the ice cap was too WIDE for the parents to return from the sea.

A propaganda global warming rag in Italy predicts the demise of Emperor penguins because the have to go so far from shore to feed......but "whoops"!
in the same article they claim that the Antarctic upwelling which nurtures them has actually moved south... which would BENEFIT
Double "whoops".....a photo from space just discovered a previously unknown colony of 1.5 million.
Does this sound like looming extinction?

A large coral reef off the Arabian Peninsula has completely died, because the water has become too COLD! it is now smothered in kelp (which thrives in cold water)
In the adjacent Indian ocean, whales abound which would be expected to be in Antarctic waters, because of the abundance of krill (cold water species)

When global warmers logically study ALL evidence and data, they may be worthy of a hearing. 
Meanwhile I await hell freezing!

JG

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#488857 — Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse"

FromD B Davis <g@crcomp.net>
Date2018-03-22 16:17 +0000
SubjectRe: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse"
Message-ID<20180322a@crcomp.net>
In reply to#488851
jgreenfield97@gmail.com wrote:
> On Saturday, December 2, 2017 at 2:26:46 AM UTC+10:30, D B Davis wrote:
>> Quadibloc <jsavard@ecn.ab.ca> wrote:
>> > On Friday, December 1, 2017 at 6:37:41 AM UTC-7, Quadibloc wrote:
>> >> On Monday, November 27, 2017 at 10:35:07 PM UTC-7, D B Davis wrote:
>> >> > Mass media first
>> >> > promoted a global warming apocalypse at least 143 years ago.
>> >
>> >> That would have been in 1874.
>> >
>> > Ah, here we are:
>> >
>> > http://hoaxes.org/archive/permalink/the_global_warming_hoax_of_1874
>> >
>> > https://www.realclearscience.com/lists/6_great_science_hoaxes/global_warming_hoax_of_1874.html
>>
>>     Your first link is more informative than the second. My favorite
>> part of the 1874 Anthropogenic Global Warming theory is the Velikovsky
>> celestial mechanics suggested by the science of the day.
>
>
> An entire colony of Adellie penguins recently starved in Antarctica because
> the ice cap was too WIDE for the parents to return from the sea.
>
> A propaganda global warming rag in Italy predicts the demise of Emperor
> penguins because the have to go so far from shore to feed......but "whoops"!
> in the same article they claim that the Antarctic upwelling which nurtures
> them has actually moved south... which would BENEFIT
> Double "whoops".....a photo from space just discovered a previously unknown
> cony of 1.5 million.
> Does this sound like looming extinction?
>
> A large coral reef off the Arabian Peninsula has completely died, because
> the water has become too COLD! it is now smothered in kelp (which thrives
> in cold water)
> In the adjacent Indian ocean, whales abound which would be expected to be
> in Antarctic waters, because of the abundance of krill (cold water species)
>
> When global warmers logically study ALL evidence and data, they may be
> worthy of a hearing.
> Meanwhile I await hell freezing!

The ninth circle of hell is already frozen. At least according to
_Inferno_ (Dante). [1]
    My home's in the high desert. The Earth's oceans and large lakes
are not in my bailiwick.
    That said, _The Shipping Man_ (McCleery) is a fictional story that
seems to realistically depict the world's shipping industry. The story
opens when a laid-off Yalie bankster decides that owning and operating a
tramp steamer is the right proper ploy to better his classmates at
reunions.
    The Yalie and his non-nautical readers learn a lot about shipping
along the way. It's uncanny how much the shipping business, as depicted
in the novel, resembles the cab business, in real life. (Yellow Cab once
employed me as a cabby during my student days.)

Note.

1. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inferno_(Dante)#Centre_of_Hell

Thank you,

--
Don

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#481403 — Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse"

Fromscott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal)
Date2017-12-01 16:25 +0000
SubjectRe: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse"
Message-ID<0ofUB.3598$bx.3585@fx42.iad>
In reply to#481397
Quadibloc <jsavard@ecn.ab.ca> writes:
>On Monday, November 27, 2017 at 10:35:07 PM UTC-7, D B Davis wrote:
>> Mass media first
>> promoted a global warming apocalypse at least 143 years ago.
>
>That would have been in 1874.

Well, 1896 anyway <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Svante_Arrhenius>

>

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#481404 — Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse"

FromD B Davis <g@crcomp.net>
Date2017-12-01 16:54 +0000
SubjectRe: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse"
Message-ID<20171201b@crcomp.net>
In reply to#481403
Scott Lurndal <scott@slp53.sl.home> wrote:
> Quadibloc <jsavard@ecn.ab.ca> writes:
>>On Monday, November 27, 2017 at 10:35:07 PM UTC-7, D B Davis wrote:
>>> Mass media first
>>> promoted a global warming apocalypse at least 143 years ago.
>>
>>That would have been in 1874.
>
> Well, 1896 anyway <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Svante_Arrhenius>
>

"Science is the belief in the ignorance of experts" - Richard Feynman

    Almost 40 years ago, Bryson stood before the American Association
    for the Advancement of Science and presented a paper saying human
    activity could alter climate.

    "I was laughed off the platform for saying that," he told
    Wisconsin Energy Cooperative News.

    In the 1960s, Bryson's idea was widely considered a radical
    proposition. But nowadays things have turned almost in the
    opposite direction: Hardly a day passes without some authority
    figure claiming that whatever the climate happens to be doing,
    human activity must be part of the explanation. And once again,
    Bryson is challenging the conventional wisdom. ...

    Q: Could you rank the things that have the most significant impact
       and where would you put carbon dioxide on the list?

    A: Well let me give you one fact first. In the first 30 feet of
       the atmosphere, on the average, outward radiation from the
       Earth, which is what CO2 is supposed to affect, how much [of
       the reflected energy] is absorbed by water vapor? In the first
       30 feet, 80 percent, okay?

    Q: Eighty percent of the heat radiated back from the surface is
       absorbed in the first 30 feet by water vapor...

    A: And how much is absorbed by carbon dioxide? Eight hundredths
       of one percent. One one-thousandth as important as water vapor.
       You can go outside and spit and have the same effect as
       doubling carbon dioxide.

    This begs questions about the widely publicized mathematical
    models researchers run through supercomputers to generate climate
    scenarios 50 or 100 years in the future. Bryson says the data fed
    into the computers overemphasizes carbon dioxide and accounts
    poorly for the effects of clouds - water vapor. Asked to evaluate
    the models' long-range predictive ability, he answers with another
    question: "Do you believe a five-day forecast?"

https://web.archive.org/web/20070508023151/http://wecnmagazine.com/2007issues/may/may07.html

Thank you,

--
Don

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#481406 — Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse"

FromQuadibloc <jsavard@ecn.ab.ca>
Date2017-12-01 09:55 -0800
SubjectRe: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse"
Message-ID<e35bf90d-0367-42f2-a927-9140aca6b607@googlegroups.com>
In reply to#481404
At least one global warming heretic isn't paid by the oil companies. This is one 
of the few dissenting voices that I am willing to take seriously.

Of course, the last time that I looked, the Earth's atmosphere extends for more 
than 30 feet from the Earth's surface.

John Savard

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#481410 — Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse"

FromWilliam Hyde <wthyde1953@gmail.com>
Date2017-12-01 13:40 -0800
SubjectRe: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse"
Message-ID<83bb1f5d-6386-44c1-bd84-7ba4d6a68301@googlegroups.com>
In reply to#481404
On Friday, December 1, 2017 at 11:54:04 AM UTC-5, D B Davis wrote:
> Scott Lurndal <scott@slp53.sl.home> wrote:
> > Quadibloc <jsavard@ecn.ab.ca> writes:
> >>On Monday, November 27, 2017 at 10:35:07 PM UTC-7, D B Davis wrote:
> >>> Mass media first
> >>> promoted a global warming apocalypse at least 143 years ago.
> >>
> >>That would have been in 1874.
> >
> > Well, 1896 anyway <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Svante_Arrhenius>
> >
> 
> "Science is the belief in the ignorance of experts" - Richard Feynman
> 
>     Almost 40 years ago, Bryson 

First, show a little respect. This is Reid Bryson, professor of meteorology and old-school climatologist at U of Wisconsin.

Seriously, it's not Bill Bryson.

stood before the American Association
>     for the Advancement of Science and presented a paper saying human
>     activity could alter climate.

>     "I was laughed off the platform for saying that," he told
>     Wisconsin Energy Cooperative News.

This would be about 1968.  As Manabe had already (1965) published the first modern estimates of global warming due to a doubling of CO2 I don't think he was laughed at for that.  As Manabe recalled it:

"In the early 1960's, we developed a radiative-convective model of the atmosphere, and explored the role of greenhouse gases such as water vapor, carbon dioxide and ozone in maintaining and changing the thermal structure of the atmosphere. This was the beginning of the long-term research on global warming..."

Bryson, with many achievements to his credit, did have a tendency to spout "facts" which were a bit dubious, as seen below.  A few of those before the wrong audience, and yes, he might be laughed at.


>     In the 1960s, Bryson's idea was widely considered a radical
>     proposition.

The facts show otherwise.

 But nowadays things have turned almost in the
>     opposite direction: Hardly a day passes without some authority
>     figure claiming that whatever the climate happens to be doing,
>     human activity must be part of the explanation. And once again,
>     Bryson is challenging the conventional wisdom. ...
> 
>     Q: Could you rank the things that have the most significant impact
>        and where would you put carbon dioxide on the list?
> 
>     A: Well let me give you one fact first. In the first 30 feet of
>        the atmosphere, on the average, outward radiation from the
>        Earth, which is what CO2 is supposed to affect, how much [of
>        the reflected energy] is absorbed by water vapor? In the first
>        30 feet, 80 percent, okay?
> 
>     Q: Eighty percent of the heat radiated back from the surface is
>        absorbed in the first 30 feet by water vapor...

And here we have the first "fact".  A highly prized quote, it's all over the internet.  It' also quite irrelevant.  (I also suspect it's just plain wrong, but as nobody ever gives a source for it it's hard to check).

As I've explained before, saturation simply does not matter.  The mean free path of the photon does.  Shorten that, and the insulating effect increases.

And as Gilbert Plass showed in the 1950s (without being laughed off any podium) the upper atmosphere, whence our IR escapes to space, is very far from saturated, and increasing CO2 there can warm the planet, even without the water-vapor feedback effect.

(For the technically able: how big a problem is IR absorption for infrared cameras?  If 80% of the signal was absorbed - and re-emitted - within 30 feet I'd expect problems, but I've no idea how far these things can see in the lower atmosphere.)

>     A: And how much is absorbed by carbon dioxide? Eight hundredths
>        of one percent. One one-thousandth as important as water vapor.

Our second "fact".  Again, not true or relevant, again because the atmosphere is not well characterized by its bottom 30 feet.

>        You can go outside and spit and have the same effect as
>        doubling carbon dioxide.

Third "fact", also untrue.  And shows a strange, for a meteorologist, ignorance of the different physical properties of CO2 and H2O.  The latter undergoes a number of phase transitions in the atmosphere, and excess is removed quickly, while CO2 is removed by a far slower process, with much of it hanging around for centuries. CO2 accumulates in  the atmosphere, H2O does not.

> 
>     This begs questions

First, that's not what question-begging means. The previously high standards of the Wisconsin Cooperative Energy News seem to be slipping.

 about the widely publicized mathematical
>     models researchers run through supercomputers

Well, first we create them.  And what we put into them is also well known, available for criticism by the community.  The passage of IR through the atmosphere is calculated via equations that have been known for over a century.  The same equations used everywhere in our wireless world.  Maybe that's why you get those dropped calls? The Global Warming Conspiracy has the telephone companies using it's Fake Equations!

 to generate climate
>     scenarios 50 or 100 years in the future. Bryson says the data fed
>     into the computers overemphasizes carbon dioxide 

Let's be kind and say that it was the reporter's incompetence here, not Bryson's.

and accounts
>     poorly for the effects of clouds - water vapor. Asked to evaluate
>     the models' long-range predictive ability, he answers with another
>     question: "Do you believe a five-day forecast?"

Actually, seven day forecasts around here are now pretty good.

But Bryson, weirdly, fails to note the difference between climate and weather.  The latter is chaotic, the former not.  The accuracy or otherwise of longer range weather forecasting has nothing to do with the accuracy of climate models.

I attended one of Bryson's seminars long ago. It was quite reasonable (though I doubt one of the facts he used, especially now).  This exploitative interview with a very old Bryson did him no favours.

William Hyde


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#481412 — Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse"

FromGutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy <taustinca@gmail.com>
Date2017-12-01 14:29 -0700
SubjectRe: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse"
Message-ID<XnsA83E9364F1CE4taustingmail@69.16.179.43>
In reply to#481410
William Hyde <wthyde1953@gmail.com> wrote in
news:83bb1f5d-6386-44c1-bd84-7ba4d6a68301@googlegroups.com: 

> On Friday, December 1, 2017 at 11:54:04 AM UTC-5, D B Davis
> wrote: 
>> Scott Lurndal <scott@slp53.sl.home> wrote:
>> > Quadibloc <jsavard@ecn.ab.ca> writes:
>> >>On Monday, November 27, 2017 at 10:35:07 PM UTC-7, D B Davis
>> >>wrote: 
>> >>> Mass media first
>> >>> promoted a global warming apocalypse at least 143 years
>> >>> ago. 
>> >>
>> >>That would have been in 1874.
>> >
>> > Well, 1896 anyway
>> > <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Svante_Arrhenius> 
>> >
>> 
>> "Science is the belief in the ignorance of experts" - Richard
>> Feynman 
>> 
>>     Almost 40 years ago, Bryson 
> 
> First, show a little respect. This is Reid Bryson, professor of
> meteorology and old-school climatologist at U of Wisconsin. 
> 
> Seriously, it's not Bill Bryson.
> 
> stood before the American Association
>>     for the Advancement of Science and presented a paper saying
>>     human activity could alter climate.
> 
>>     "I was laughed off the platform for saying that," he told
>>     Wisconsin Energy Cooperative News.
> 
> This would be about 1968.  As Manabe had already (1965)
> published the first modern estimates of global warming due to a
> doubling of CO2 I don't think he was laughed at for that.  As
> Manabe recalled it: 
> 
> "In the early 1960's, we developed a radiative-convective model
> of the atmosphere, and explored the role of greenhouse gases
> such as water vapor, carbon dioxide and ozone in maintaining and
> changing the thermal structure of the atmosphere. This was the
> beginning of the long-term research on global warming..." 
> 
> Bryson, with many achievements to his credit, did have a
> tendency to spout "facts" which were a bit dubious, as seen
> below.  A few of those before the wrong audience, and yes, he
> might be laughed at. 
> 
> 
>>     In the 1960s, Bryson's idea was widely considered a radical
>>     proposition.
> 
> The facts show otherwise.
> 
>  But nowadays things have turned almost in the
>>     opposite direction: Hardly a day passes without some
>>     authority figure claiming that whatever the climate happens
>>     to be doing, human activity must be part of the
>>     explanation. And once again, Bryson is challenging the
>>     conventional wisdom. ... 
>> 
>>     Q: Could you rank the things that have the most significant
>>     impact 
>>        and where would you put carbon dioxide on the list?
>> 
>>     A: Well let me give you one fact first. In the first 30
>>     feet of 
>>        the atmosphere, on the average, outward radiation from
>>        the Earth, which is what CO2 is supposed to affect, how
>>        much [of the reflected energy] is absorbed by water
>>        vapor? In the first 30 feet, 80 percent, okay?
>> 
>>     Q: Eighty percent of the heat radiated back from the
>>     surface is 
>>        absorbed in the first 30 feet by water vapor...
> 
> And here we have the first "fact".  A highly prized quote, it's
> all over the internet.  It' also quite irrelevant.  (I also
> suspect it's just plain wrong, but as nobody ever gives a source
> for it it's hard to check). 
> 
> As I've explained before, saturation simply does not matter. 
> The mean free path of the photon does.  Shorten that, and the
> insulating effect increases. 
> 
> And as Gilbert Plass showed in the 1950s (without being laughed
> off any podium) the upper atmosphere, whence our IR escapes to
> space, is very far from saturated, and increasing CO2 there can
> warm the planet, even without the water-vapor feedback effect. 
> 
> (For the technically able: how big a problem is IR absorption
> for infrared cameras?  If 80% of the signal was absorbed - and
> re-emitted - within 30 feet I'd expect problems, but I've no
> idea how far these things can see in the lower atmosphere.) 
> 
>>     A: And how much is absorbed by carbon dioxide? Eight
>>     hundredths 
>>        of one percent. One one-thousandth as important as water
>>        vapor. 
> 
> Our second "fact".  Again, not true or relevant, again because
> the atmosphere is not well characterized by its bottom 30 feet. 
> 
>>        You can go outside and spit and have the same effect as
>>        doubling carbon dioxide.
> 
> Third "fact", also untrue.  And shows a strange, for a
> meteorologist, ignorance of the different physical properties of
> CO2 and H2O.  The latter undergoes a number of phase transitions
> in the atmosphere, and excess is removed quickly, while CO2 is
> removed by a far slower process, with much of it hanging around
> for centuries. CO2 accumulates in  the atmosphere, H2O does not. 
> 
>> 
>>     This begs questions
> 
> First, that's not what question-begging means. The previously
> high standards of the Wisconsin Cooperative Energy News seem to
> be slipping. 
> 
>  about the widely publicized mathematical
>>     models researchers run through supercomputers
> 
> Well, first we create them.  And what we put into them is also
> well known, available for criticism by the community.  The
> passage of IR through the atmosphere is calculated via equations
> that have been known for over a century.  The same equations
> used everywhere in our wireless world.  Maybe that's why you get
> those dropped calls? The Global Warming Conspiracy has the
> telephone companies using it's Fake Equations! 
> 
>  to generate climate
>>     scenarios 50 or 100 years in the future. Bryson says the
>>     data fed into the computers overemphasizes carbon dioxide 
> 
> Let's be kind and say that it was the reporter's incompetence
> here, not Bryson's. 
> 
> and accounts
>>     poorly for the effects of clouds - water vapor. Asked to
>>     evaluate the models' long-range predictive ability, he
>>     answers with another question: "Do you believe a five-day
>>     forecast?" 
> 
> Actually, seven day forecasts around here are now pretty good.
> 
> But Bryson, weirdly, fails to note the difference between
> climate and weather.  The latter is chaotic, the former not. 
> The accuracy or otherwise of longer range weather forecasting
> has nothing to do with the accuracy of climate models. 
> 
> I attended one of Bryson's seminars long ago. It was quite
> reasonable (though I doubt one of the facts he used, especially
> now).  This exploitative interview with a very old Bryson did
> him no favours. 
> 
I am curious as to your thoughts on the retreating glaciers 
uncovering remains of old ruins going back hundreds, if not 
thousands, of years, suggesting that glaciers have retreated 
before, possibly more than once, long before the industrial age. 
Not a climate question, as such, but one dependent on climate 
change.

-- 
Terry Austin

Vacation photos from Iceland: 
https://plus.google.com/u/0/collection/QaXQkB

"Terry Austin: like the polio vaccine, only with more asshole."
    -- David Bilek

Jesus forgives sinners, not criminals.

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#481416 — Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse"

FromPaul Colquhoun <newsposter@andor.dropbear.id.au>
Date2017-12-02 14:05 +1100
SubjectRe: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse"
Message-ID<slrnp2463c.810.newsposter@andor.dropbear.id.au>
In reply to#481412
On Fri, 01 Dec 2017 14:29:21 -0700, Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy <taustinca@gmail.com> wrote:

| I am curious as to your thoughts on the retreating glaciers 
| uncovering remains of old ruins going back hundreds, if not 
| thousands, of years, suggesting that glaciers have retreated 
| before, possibly more than once, long before the industrial age. 
| Not a climate question, as such, but one dependent on climate 
| change.


I can't recall hearing about this at all, but it sounds interesting.
Do you remember where this happened?

My google search has found reports of forests being uncovered in
Switzerland and Alaska, and lots of artifacts & bodies that presumably
fell down crevases, but no ruins. (Well, there was one page about
4000 year old ruins in Antarctica, but other reference in the
article point to it being an April Fools gag.)


-- 
Reverend Paul Colquhoun, ULC.     http://andor.dropbear.id.au/
  Asking for technical help in newsgroups?  Read this first:
     http://catb.org/~esr/faqs/smart-questions.html#intro

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#481418 — Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse"

FromGutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy <taustinca@gmail.com>
Date2017-12-01 19:51 -0700
SubjectRe: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse"
Message-ID<XnsA83ECA0A995D2taustingmail@69.16.179.42>
In reply to#481416
Paul Colquhoun <newsposter@andor.dropbear.id.au> wrote in
news:slrnp2463c.810.newsposter@andor.dropbear.id.au: 

> On Fri, 01 Dec 2017 14:29:21 -0700, Gutless Umbrella Carrying
> Sissy <taustinca@gmail.com> wrote: 
> 
>| I am curious as to your thoughts on the retreating glaciers 
>| uncovering remains of old ruins going back hundreds, if not 
>| thousands, of years, suggesting that glaciers have retreated 
>| before, possibly more than once, long before the industrial
>| age. Not a climate question, as such, but one dependent on
>| climate change.
> 
> 
> I can't recall hearing about this at all, but it sounds
> interesting. Do you remember where this happened?

It was mentioned in one of the articles linked to in this thread. 
Not in any great detail.

https://web.archive.org/web/20070508023151/http://wecnmagazine.com/
2007issues/may/may07.html

https://tinyurl.com/ycsz654u

Here's the meat of it:

"Bryson mentions the retreat of Alpine glaciers, common grist for 
current headlines. “What do they find when the ice sheets retreat, 
in the Alps?”

"We recall the two-year-old report saying a mature forest and 
agricultural water-management structures had been discovered 
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
emerging from the ice, seeing sunlight for the first time in 
thousands of years. Bryson interrupts excitedly.

"“A silver mine! The guys had stacked up their tools because they 
were going to be back the next spring to mine more silver, only the 
snow never went,” he says. “There used to be less ice than now. 
It’s just getting back to normal.”"

There's also a well documented history of the first few centuries 
of human habitation of Greenland, also mentioned.

> My google search has found reports of forests being uncovered in
> Switzerland and Alaska, 

That, too, suggests that glaciers have advanced and retreated in 
the past, well before the industrial age.


-- 
Terry Austin

Vacation photos from Iceland: 
https://plus.google.com/u/0/collection/QaXQkB

"Terry Austin: like the polio vaccine, only with more asshole."
    -- David Bilek

Jesus forgives sinners, not criminals.

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]


#481517 — Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse"

Fromscott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal)
Date2017-12-04 14:30 +0000
SubjectRe: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse"
Message-ID<SZcVB.20342$MS7.9203@fx11.iad>
In reply to#481418
Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy <taustinca@gmail.com> writes:
>Paul Colquhoun <newsposter@andor.dropbear.id.au> wrote in
>news:slrnp2463c.810.newsposter@andor.dropbear.id.au: 
>
>> On Fri, 01 Dec 2017 14:29:21 -0700, Gutless Umbrella Carrying
>> Sissy <taustinca@gmail.com> wrote: 
>> 
>>| I am curious as to your thoughts on the retreating glaciers 
>>| uncovering remains of old ruins going back hundreds, if not 
>>| thousands, of years, suggesting that glaciers have retreated 
>>| before, possibly more than once, long before the industrial
>>| age. Not a climate question, as such, but one dependent on
>>| climate change.
>> 
>> 
>> I can't recall hearing about this at all, but it sounds
>> interesting. Do you remember where this happened?
>
>It was mentioned in one of the articles linked to in this thread. 
>Not in any great detail.
>
>https://web.archive.org/web/20070508023151/http://wecnmagazine.com/
>2007issues/may/may07.html
>
>https://tinyurl.com/ycsz654u
>
>Here's the meat of it:
>
>"Bryson mentions the retreat of Alpine glaciers, common grist for 
>current headlines. “What do they find when the ice sheets retreat, 
>in the Alps?”

It's understood that the Alpine glaciers retreated
during the MWP and advanced again during the LIA.

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#481448 — Re: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse"

FromWilliam Hyde <wthyde1953@gmail.com>
Date2017-12-02 13:18 -0800
SubjectRe: "After 30 Years, Alarmists Are Still Predicting A Global Warming "Apocalypse"
Message-ID<e4bb1712-95af-4acb-98c0-15f7cff964f1@googlegroups.com>
In reply to#481412
On Friday, December 1, 2017 at 5:29:26 PM UTC-5, Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy wrote:
> William Hyde <wthyde1953@gmail.com> wrote in
> news:83bb1f5d-6386-44c1-bd84-7ba4d6a68301@googlegroups.com: 
> 
> > On Friday, December 1, 2017 at 11:54:04 AM UTC-5, D B Davis
> > wrote: 
> >> Scott Lurndal <scott@slp53.sl.home> wrote:
> >> > Quadibloc <jsavard@ecn.ab.ca> writes:
> >> >>On Monday, November 27, 2017 at 10:35:07 PM UTC-7, D B Davis
> >> >>wrote: 
> >> >>> Mass media first
> >> >>> promoted a global warming apocalypse at least 143 years
> >> >>> ago. 
> >> >>
> >> >>That would have been in 1874.
> >> >
> >> > Well, 1896 anyway
> >> > <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Svante_Arrhenius> 
> >> >
> >> 
> >> "Science is the belief in the ignorance of experts" - Richard
> >> Feynman 
> >> 
> >>     Almost 40 years ago, Bryson 
> > 
> > First, show a little respect. This is Reid Bryson, professor of
> > meteorology and old-school climatologist at U of Wisconsin. 
> > 
> > Seriously, it's not Bill Bryson.
> > 
> > stood before the American Association
> >>     for the Advancement of Science and presented a paper saying
> >>     human activity could alter climate.
> > 
> >>     "I was laughed off the platform for saying that," he told
> >>     Wisconsin Energy Cooperative News.
> > 
> > This would be about 1968.  As Manabe had already (1965)
> > published the first modern estimates of global warming due to a
> > doubling of CO2 I don't think he was laughed at for that.  As
> > Manabe recalled it: 
> > 
> > "In the early 1960's, we developed a radiative-convective model
> > of the atmosphere, and explored the role of greenhouse gases
> > such as water vapor, carbon dioxide and ozone in maintaining and
> > changing the thermal structure of the atmosphere. This was the
> > beginning of the long-term research on global warming..." 
> > 
> > Bryson, with many achievements to his credit, did have a
> > tendency to spout "facts" which were a bit dubious, as seen
> > below.  A few of those before the wrong audience, and yes, he
> > might be laughed at. 
> > 
> > 
> >>     In the 1960s, Bryson's idea was widely considered a radical
> >>     proposition.
> > 
> > The facts show otherwise.
> > 
> >  But nowadays things have turned almost in the
> >>     opposite direction: Hardly a day passes without some
> >>     authority figure claiming that whatever the climate happens
> >>     to be doing, human activity must be part of the
> >>     explanation. And once again, Bryson is challenging the
> >>     conventional wisdom. ... 
> >> 
> >>     Q: Could you rank the things that have the most significant
> >>     impact 
> >>        and where would you put carbon dioxide on the list?
> >> 
> >>     A: Well let me give you one fact first. In the first 30
> >>     feet of 
> >>        the atmosphere, on the average, outward radiation from
> >>        the Earth, which is what CO2 is supposed to affect, how
> >>        much [of the reflected energy] is absorbed by water
> >>        vapor? In the first 30 feet, 80 percent, okay?
> >> 
> >>     Q: Eighty percent of the heat radiated back from the
> >>     surface is 
> >>        absorbed in the first 30 feet by water vapor...
> > 
> > And here we have the first "fact".  A highly prized quote, it's
> > all over the internet.  It' also quite irrelevant.  (I also
> > suspect it's just plain wrong, but as nobody ever gives a source
> > for it it's hard to check). 
> > 
> > As I've explained before, saturation simply does not matter. 
> > The mean free path of the photon does.  Shorten that, and the
> > insulating effect increases. 
> > 
> > And as Gilbert Plass showed in the 1950s (without being laughed
> > off any podium) the upper atmosphere, whence our IR escapes to
> > space, is very far from saturated, and increasing CO2 there can
> > warm the planet, even without the water-vapor feedback effect. 
> > 
> > (For the technically able: how big a problem is IR absorption
> > for infrared cameras?  If 80% of the signal was absorbed - and
> > re-emitted - within 30 feet I'd expect problems, but I've no
> > idea how far these things can see in the lower atmosphere.) 
> > 
> >>     A: And how much is absorbed by carbon dioxide? Eight
> >>     hundredths 
> >>        of one percent. One one-thousandth as important as water
> >>        vapor. 
> > 
> > Our second "fact".  Again, not true or relevant, again because
> > the atmosphere is not well characterized by its bottom 30 feet. 
> > 
> >>        You can go outside and spit and have the same effect as
> >>        doubling carbon dioxide.
> > 
> > Third "fact", also untrue.  And shows a strange, for a
> > meteorologist, ignorance of the different physical properties of
> > CO2 and H2O.  The latter undergoes a number of phase transitions
> > in the atmosphere, and excess is removed quickly, while CO2 is
> > removed by a far slower process, with much of it hanging around
> > for centuries. CO2 accumulates in  the atmosphere, H2O does not. 
> > 
> >> 
> >>     This begs questions
> > 
> > First, that's not what question-begging means. The previously
> > high standards of the Wisconsin Cooperative Energy News seem to
> > be slipping. 
> > 
> >  about the widely publicized mathematical
> >>     models researchers run through supercomputers
> > 
> > Well, first we create them.  And what we put into them is also
> > well known, available for criticism by the community.  The
> > passage of IR through the atmosphere is calculated via equations
> > that have been known for over a century.  The same equations
> > used everywhere in our wireless world.  Maybe that's why you get
> > those dropped calls? The Global Warming Conspiracy has the
> > telephone companies using it's Fake Equations! 
> > 
> >  to generate climate
> >>     scenarios 50 or 100 years in the future. Bryson says the
> >>     data fed into the computers overemphasizes carbon dioxide 
> > 
> > Let's be kind and say that it was the reporter's incompetence
> > here, not Bryson's. 
> > 
> > and accounts
> >>     poorly for the effects of clouds - water vapor. Asked to
> >>     evaluate the models' long-range predictive ability, he
> >>     answers with another question: "Do you believe a five-day
> >>     forecast?" 
> > 
> > Actually, seven day forecasts around here are now pretty good.
> > 
> > But Bryson, weirdly, fails to note the difference between
> > climate and weather.  The latter is chaotic, the former not. 
> > The accuracy or otherwise of longer range weather forecasting
> > has nothing to do with the accuracy of climate models. 
> > 
> > I attended one of Bryson's seminars long ago. It was quite
> > reasonable (though I doubt one of the facts he used, especially
> > now).  This exploitative interview with a very old Bryson did
> > him no favours. 
> > 
> I am curious as to your thoughts on the retreating glaciers 
> uncovering remains of old ruins going back hundreds, if not 
> thousands, of years, suggesting that glaciers have retreated 
> before, possibly more than once, long before the industrial age.

There is no doubt, of course, that the climate does fluctuate without human interference, the little ice age being the most recent example.  And as copper mining in Europe goes back, IIRC to at least 6600 BP there have been several such glacial advances in this time.

Many reconstructions of this advance/retreat history will be found via google.  Mostly on skeptical sites, which feel this aids their case, but the source is often reliable and usually cited.

Plant matter uncovered by retreating glaciers is routinely dated.  Some years ago a date of 5500 BP was found by Lonnie Thompson for Quelccaya in the Andes.  He's found six  thousand year old ice melting in Tibet. There are reports 4000 year old wood being found in the Swiss alps, recently uncovered by glacial melting, which seems reasonable to me.

The world cooled  - but not uniformly in time or space - from the Holocene Maximum about six thousand  years ago.  We'd expect glaciers to have expanded, covering high altitude valleys which were previously ice free - or even inhabited.

There was a lesser warm period in Roman times, even warmer than in  the Medieval Climate Optimum (probably, anyway).  As the Romans were usually desperate for precious metals, I've no doubt their alpine mines went as close to the glaciers as possible, so that when the world cooled, they'd have rapidly been covered with ice and remained so to the present day.  Or uncovered and re-glaciated in Medieval/LIA times.

One of the controversies surrounding the establishment of an ice age chronology involved advances and retreats in the Swiss Alps.  The evidence of the great glacial advances going back millions of years is mixed up with smaller, more recent advances and retreats. Evidence of a recent advance was confused with the ice age cycle proper, until further work discovered Roman tools in the "ice age" sediments.

Whereupon the Great Global Warming Conspiracy hushed the whole thing up.  I'm letting you in on it now because my November cheque did not arrive.

All of this is fascinating, but I like real sources, and I'm afraid that an interview with Professor Bryson isn't one.

William Hyde

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